2023 NBA Draft: Wem! Ban! Thank You Yam!

nattysez

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I wonder if the Spurs have been talking to Josh Primo. He'd be a nice piece to add back to their team if he has his head screwed on straight.
 

Auger34

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Givony’s mock has Dereck Lively lasting until 25..if that happens, I would love to see Brad try and move up 10 spots. Lively has a lot of TimeLord in him
 

osori

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I live about a 40-minute drive away from San Antonio, so go to Spurs games from time to time. Excited for Wembanyama!
 

TripleOT

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Givony’s mock has Dereck Lively lasting until 25..if that happens, I would love to see Brad try and move up 10 spots. Lively has a lot of TimeLord in him
I’m not familiar with him. Is he a big with a lively body?
 

Auger34

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Am I crazy or is there something to a Raptors-Blazers trade involving the 3 pick and Pascal Siakam as the principles?
 

nighthob

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Am I crazy or is there something to a Raptors-Blazers trade involving the 3 pick and Pascal Siakam as the principles?
Probably more than Siakim given his age and the fact that he's strictly a running mate.
 

SoxFanInPdx

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I’d probably get shot in this city for saying this, but the Blazers getting the 3rd pick makes me think that they should be listening to those Lillard calls now. Fantastic season aside, he’s 33 and wants to win now.

None of these rookies are going to turn the tables and make Portland a title contender. Get a haul from someone and build around Sharpe, Simons and whoever falls to them, along with the metric ton of assets from the deal. Scoot would be perfect.

Won’t happen knowing this organization, but they should absolutely be hunting for young talent. Rip the band-aid off now and do a legit rebuild.
 

benhogan

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I’d probably get shot in this city for saying this, but the Blazers getting the 3rd pick makes me think that they should be listening to those Lillard calls now. Fantastic season aside, he’s 33 and wants to win now.

None of these rookies are going to turn the tables and make Portland a title contender. Get a haul from someone and build around Sharpe, Simons and whoever falls to them, along with the metric ton of assets from the deal. Scoot would be perfect.

Won’t happen knowing this organization, but they should absolutely be hunting for young talent. Rip the band-aid off now and do a legit rebuild.
100% agree. Move Nurkic also. There will be teams lining up around the corner on Dame.

They should also engineer a Peyton Pritchard homecoming. The fans would eat up those 30pt PP games while they rebuild.
 

Auger34

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I’d probably get shot in this city for saying this, but the Blazers getting the 3rd pick makes me think that they should be listening to those Lillard calls now. Fantastic season aside, he’s 33 and wants to win now.

None of these rookies are going to turn the tables and make Portland a title contender. Get a haul from someone and build around Sharpe, Simons and whoever falls to them, along with the metric ton of assets from the deal. Scoot would be perfect.

Won’t happen knowing this organization, but they should absolutely be hunting for young talent. Rip the band-aid off now and do a legit rebuild.
IMO, really depends on what they can get for the 3rd pick. If they can get a legitimate top 25-30 player and another asset, while keeping Sharpe (who’s really the long-term keeper there, I don’t think a ton of Simons) I think you do it and compete for the West, which suddenly looks pretty open.

it there’s not a great market for 3 then I think you but the bullet and trade Dame. Getting Maxey plus all of picks back from Philly seems like an attractive offer (although Maxey and Simons together defensively will be a horror film)

EDIT: I think Nurk, Simons and 3 for Siakam and OG is very interesting for both teams.

Portland could roll out Lillard, OG, Siakam, Grant and a C (to be acquired later) and have Sharpe as the 6th man. It’s basically the perfect Lillard team. A bunch of long wings around him to protect him defensively. A little bit deficient in shot creation outside of him but the other 3 starters can do a little on their own

Raptors effectively build around Scottie Barnes and Brandon Miller.
 
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benhogan

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IMO, really depends on what they can get for the 3rd pick. If they can get a legitimate top 25-30 player and another asset, while keeping Sharpe (who’s really the long-term keeper there, I don’t think a ton of Simons) I think you do it and compete for the West, which suddenly looks pretty open.

it there’s not a great market for 3 then I think you but the bullet and trade Dame. Getting Maxey plus all of picks back from Philly seems like an attractive offer (although Maxey and Simons together defensively will be a horror film)

EDIT: I think Nurk, Simons and 3 for Siakam and OG is very interesting for both teams.

Portland could roll out Lillard, OG, Siakam, Grant and a C (to be acquired later) and have Sharpe as the 6th man. It’s basically the perfect Lillard team. A bunch of long wings around him to protect him defensively. A little bit deficient in shot creation outside of him but the other 3 starters can do a little on their own

Raptors effectively build around Scottie Barnes and Brandon Miller.
Philly lacks tradeable draft capital (for a superstar like Dame)

https://www.prosportstransactions.com/basketball/DraftTrades/Future/76ers.htm
 

Justthetippett

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There will unlikely be a better time to move Dame. You can distract the fanbase with the potential of the picks and his value will only decrease from here. Maybe some kind of three team deal with Houston and Philly. Or one of the LA teams or Mia will pull something out of their ass. I'd bet it's better than 50% he moves, and he should.
 

Auger34

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Philly lacks tradeable draft capital (for a superstar like Dame)

https://www.prosportstransactions.com/basketball/DraftTrades/Future/76ers.htm
I didn’t realize the pick cupboard was completely bare…

Who has the ammo to get Dame?
NYK still has the package that came in 2nd for Mitchell. I think for the Blazers to take that deal, they have to think A LOT of RJ Barrett. Personally, I don’t see it.

Miami will always be mentioned. Their offer depends on how the FO thinks of Tyler Herro. Again, I don’t see it there either.

I guess Brooklyn could go after him using Bridges and picks but is that team even close to Finals contention with Lillard, Cam Johnson, DFS and Claxton?

Something that could be really interesting and ironic….maybe New Orleans gives them CJ McCollum, Kira Lewis, Dyson Daniels, and a boatload of picks? Portland gets some nostalgia back with McCollum, a really interesting former lottery pick in Daniels, and an assload of picks. Probably not enough but I would take that over NYK and MIA (personally)
 

InstaFace

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He's good friends with Jaylen iirc, and his deal with the Cavs only has 2 years left on it. Would be a perfect fit then.
He's good friends with all of Tatum, Brown and Smart, because they all (plus Kemba) were on the 2019 USA Basketball FIBA World Cup team together and basically spent two months practicing and hanging out (and of course, playing for Ime Udoka, whose praises they started singing as soon as they got back).

I got some former coworkers that I like, but there's one I'm always going to have a special friendship with because he pulled together a trip to go hike the Inca Trail for us and our families, and we all did that together.

So I have no doubt they're all friends, but that's personal, and a trade (that would probably see him replace Smart) is strictly business. Not sure we can read anything into him showing up for his friends' playoff games.
 
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benhogan

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I didn’t realize the pick cupboard was completely bare…

Who has the ammo to get Dame?
NYK still has the package that came in 2nd for Mitchell. I think for the Blazers to take that deal, they have to think A LOT of RJ Barrett. Personally, I don’t see it.

Miami will always be mentioned. Their offer depends on how the FO thinks of Tyler Herro. Again, I don’t see it there either.

I guess Brooklyn could go after him using Bridges and picks but is that team even close to Finals contention with Lillard, Cam Johnson, DFS and Claxton?

Something that could be really interesting and ironic….maybe New Orleans gives them CJ McCollum, Kira Lewis, Dyson Daniels, and a boatload of picks? Portland gets some nostalgia back with McCollum, a really interesting former lottery pick in Daniels, and an assload of picks. Probably not enough but I would take that over NYK and MIA (personally)
Philly being Asset-Light just adds to the grave dancing we are all engaging in...

I suspect PDX would need a boatload of picks to move on from Dame.

So a team that owns picks, needs a +++ PG, on a team wanting to take a step? Lack of draft capital disqualifies a lot of teams like Philly, Lakers, Milwaukee, Clippers, Wolves, Suns, Hawks, Cavs

I agree with Miami, Brooklyn, NOLA and would add Toronto, OKC (SGA/Dame pairing), Chicago, and Orlando (I'm probably too bullish on Wagner/Banchero) as longshots
 

Cellar-Door

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Beyond the infeasibility of it.... why would anyone watch yet another Mitchell team get absolutely worked by a lower seed yet again, and think "yeah need to to add that guy"
 

lovegtm

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Beyond the infeasibility of it.... why would anyone watch yet another Mitchell team get absolutely worked by a lower seed yet again, and think "yeah need to to add that guy"
Because he's really good, and if you could pair him with Tatum and Brown you'd have a team that was much, much better than the prior teams he's been on?

Edit: he's also one of the best bets of young guys out there to want to team up with Brown and Tatum once his deal is up, and there are paths via S&T.
 

Saints Rest

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The post-lottery article in The Athletic this morning opined that a bunch of the lottery teams might be looking to move their pick -- seems like the potential for a lot more draft trades than most years. They list the following as looking to deal:
  • Portland (3)
  • Houston (4)
  • Detroit (5)
  • Indiana (7 -- but possibly wanting to move up)
  • Dallas (10)
  • New Orleans (14)
 

Smokey Joe

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He's good friends with all of Tatum, Brown and Smart, because they all (plus Kemba) were on the 2019 USA Basketball FIBA World Cup team together and basically spent two months practicing and hanging out (and of course, playing for Ime Udoka, whose praises they started singing as soon as they got back).

I got some former coworkers that I like, but there's one I'm always going to have a special friendship with because he pulled together a trip to go hike the Inca Trail for us and our families, and we all did that together.

So I have no doubt they're all friends, but that's personal, and a trade (that would probably see him replace Smart) is strictly business. Not sure we can read anything into him showing up for his friends' playoff games.
Derrick White was on that team as well. The other member of that team of interest was Myles Turner. One year afterwards, Ainge was trying to move Gordon Hayward to Indiana but was adamant about not taking Turner back in exchange. I’ve often wondered if the J’s, Smart and Kemba had something to do with that.
 

InstaFace

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Looking at Tankathon's mock draft, 14 of the top 20 are all one-and-done college freshmen. It's the exceptions that are kinda interesting stories to me:

- Only one "International", Wembanyama, although #21 Rayan Rupert is French (and plays in NZ in the Australian NBL), as well as 4 others in the rest of the 2 projected rounds.
- Two playing for G League Ignite, the pro pathway / college alternative for draft-level prospects, which includes Scoot Henderson ($1M on a 2-year contract, not a bad proposition vs college) and Ontario-raised Leonard Miller. A third igniter, Sidy Cissoko, is mocked at #32.
- One non-freshman college player, sophomore Jordan Hawkins of UConn, whose stock rose tremendously with their run to the NCAA title. #s 21-30 also have 5 non-freshmen in it, in the "just get me a high-floor rotation player" portion of the draft.
- Two playing for Overtime Elite, which is just a fascinating venture in its own right, a league for future-pro players aged 16-20 that offers health and disability insurance, minimum $100k salary, college scholarship if they don't go pro, etc. This includes the projected #4 and #6 picks, the Thompson twins - but nobody else in the 2-round mock. Are they exceptions, or the start of a trend?

It's very interesting to me the two new non-college, non-international pathways to the top of the draft and a likely NBA starter - both the NBA's in-house one (G League Ignite) and the Overtime Elite venture which just kinda sits on top of the whole AAU Club structure. You almost wonder where they've been hiding out since David Stern implemented one-and-done / minimum age 19 back in 2006, like, what took them so long? Maybe it's just that the G League wasn't at a level above D-1 college for a long time, and now it is.
 
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NomarsFool

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Because he's really good, and if you could pair him with Tatum and Brown you'd have a team that was much, much better than the prior teams he's been on?

Edit: he's also one of the best bets of young guys out there to want to team up with Brown and Tatum once his deal is up, and there are paths via S&T.
I think the new CBA makes it impossible to have three big contracts on one team.
 

InstaFace

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Derrick White was on that team as well. The other member of that team of interest was Myles Turner. One year afterwards, Ainge was trying to move Gordon Hayward to Indiana but was adamant about not taking Turner back in exchange. I’ve often wondered if the J’s, Smart and Kemba had something to do with that.
Solid points. That 2019 World Cup team really shaped a lot of developments in the NBA all by itself.

I'm very excited for the next one, coming this August / September. France is going to be a handful yet again.
 

Cellar-Door

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Because he's really good, and if you could pair him with Tatum and Brown you'd have a team that was much, much better than the prior teams he's been on?

Edit: he's also one of the best bets of young guys out there to want to team up with Brown and Tatum once his deal is up, and there are paths via S&T.
It's basically a cap death sentence, but beyond that... I think he's really good at some things, and really not good at others, and the things he's good at are less valuable when you have 2 other guys who do them as well or better, and the things he does poorly are backbreakers because on a team with Tatum and Brown where he's not going to be your ball-dominant #1 scorer he's losing offensive value and his D remains not good. He'd become basically a super-premium Brogdon, and you don't want a 3rd max used on that, especially in the new CBA.
 

nighthob

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This guys career is really weird, man. Is he the most broken by covid lockdown athlete?
I don't think it was covid, he was just older coming out of college and his skill set was rather sparse. I think he's done about as well as you could expect, but he still needs at least one guy to play off of. A primary scorer he ain't.
 

luckiestman

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I don't think it was covid, he was just older coming out of college and his skill set was rather sparse. I think he's done about as well as you could expect, but he still needs at least one guy to play off of. A primary scorer he ain't.

Jackie Mac said something about him falling apart during the lockdown but I'm not remembering what the deal was.
 

nighthob

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The post-lottery article in The Athletic this morning opined that a bunch of the lottery teams might be looking to move their pick -- seems like the potential for a lot more draft trades than most years. They list the following as looking to deal:
  • Portland (3)
  • Houston (4)
  • Detroit (5)
  • Indiana (7 -- but possibly wanting to move up)
  • Dallas (10)
  • New Orleans (14)
Houston doesn't really have a choice, they're the island of misfit toys and they landed #4 in a two player scrum (I'm not wild about Henderson as I'm over the whole "Smurfy Scoring 1 Guard!" thing). They can't really afford to add another developmental project, they have too many as is. Green might be salvageable if they could get rid of Porter. Smith and Eason are good prospects, but, again, they have to get rid of the inmate poisoning the asylum (KPJ).
 

DeadlySplitter

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nighthob

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Jackie Mac said something about him falling apart during the lockdown but I'm not remembering what the deal was.
Maybe she thought he could magically turn himself into JT? He was a 22 year college sophomore entering the NBA. He was athletic and tried hard on defense, but had no offensive game at all. As a rookie he was mostly just an offensive garbageman. He's turned himself into a capable finisher that can hit threes if there's an offensive gravity well to absorb the attention. That's really about as much as you can expect from someone like Siakim.
 

jezza1918

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Jackie Mac said something about him falling apart during the lockdown but I'm not remembering what the deal was.
Here is the relevant article, and I recall her discussing it on a Simmons pod...
Opposing players and coaches who have since left the bubble noted privately that Siakam seemed particularly out of sorts in Orlando, both on and off the floor.

"He wasn't right," Nurse conceded. "I just think he lost his bounce. He didn't look as athletic or as strong or as fast. He was in tip-top condition in March, but the lack of playing for three or four months hurt him. He couldn't get it going, and he never did get back to where he was conditioningwise.

"So, the layoff made a difference for him. But look, the Lakers and Miami had the layoff too, and they didn't let that stop them. That's why they're still playing."
 

Smokey Joe

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The post-lottery article in The Athletic this morning opined that a bunch of the lottery teams might be looking to move their pick -- seems like the potential for a lot more draft trades than most years. They list the following as looking to deal:
  • Portland (3)
  • Houston (4)
  • Detroit (5)
  • Indiana (7 -- but possibly wanting to move up)
  • Dallas (10)
  • New Orleans (14)
Can I just say that if you pick 3rd in a two player draft and Charlotte is picking ahead of you, consider holding on to the pick.
 

Swedgin

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Houston doesn't really have a choice, they're the island of misfit toys and they landed #4 in a two player scrum (I'm not wild about Henderson as I'm over the whole "Smurfy Scoring 1 Guard!" thing). They can't really afford to add another developmental project, they have too many as is. Green might be salvageable if they could get rid of Porter. Smith and Eason are good prospects, but, again, they have to get rid of the inmate poisoning the asylum (KPJ).
Fully on board with Houston jettisoning KPJ. However, I would not necessarily trade the pick. They do not have a long term answer at PG, and Amen Thompson is No. 4 on most draft folks big boards. In the short term, bring in a veteran point guard to run the show, mentor Amen and develop Green/Smith. Dramatically overpay FVV in FA, check in the Suns on Chris Paul etc.
 

Auger34

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The post-lottery article in The Athletic this morning opined that a bunch of the lottery teams might be looking to move their pick -- seems like the potential for a lot more draft trades than most years. They list the following as looking to deal:
  • Portland (3)
  • Houston (4)
  • Detroit (5)
  • Indiana (7 -- but possibly wanting to move up)
  • Dallas (10)
  • New Orleans (14)
There is also talk of Orlando trading 6 and 11 to move up. I assume their target would be Brandon Miller
 

nighthob

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There is also talk of Orlando trading 6 and 11 to move up. I assume their target would be Brandon Miller
I’m fairly certain that Charlotte grabs Miller, I doubt they swap #2 for two lower picks. But trading with Portland to grab Henderson is probably doable and the most Orlando thing ever.
 

Auger34

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I’m fairly certain that Charlotte grabs Miller, I doubt they swap #2 for two lower picks. But trading with Portland to grab Henderson is probably doable and the most Orlando thing ever.
I don’t know. I actually think Charlotte takes Scoot. He pairs well with LaMelo. He’s also much more exciting than Miller and has way more (positive) hype. That matters when there will be a new owner/potential owner
 

nighthob

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I don’t know. I actually think Charlotte takes Scoot. He pairs well with LaMelo. He’s also much more exciting than Miller and has way more (positive) hype. That matters when there will be a new owner/potential owner
He doesn’t pair with LaMelo at all. Miller has Tatumesque upside. Scoot does not.
 

Auger34

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He doesn’t pair with LaMelo at all. Miller has Tatumesque upside. Scoot does not.
I saw you call Scoot a smurf PG earlier…he has a 6’9 wingspan.

From Sam Vecenie at The Athletic in his mock draft:
“I love the idea of putting Henderson in the backcourt with LaMelo Ball. It would create one of the most exciting, up-tempo attacks in the NBA with how good both players are at pushing pace. But more importantly, they complement each other well. Both have the ability to blend scoring and playmaking together, but Henderson tends to think more about the scoring side of the things, and Ball thrives as a creative decision-maker who can make high-level passing reads from any angle. Henderson’s elite midrange game would complement Ball’s 3s and layups approach.”

I disagree on Miller having that type of upside as well. You think Miller could be a realistic MVP candidate?
 

nighthob

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6’9” wingspan aside, he’s 6’2” in shoes. Other teams are going to hunt him when the playoffs arrive. Scoot Henderson could win MVP if the top 25 players in the league all get injured one year. Aside from that he doesn’t have a chance. Miller is sort of like Tatum, has the potential to be an elite defender while providing scoring.