2022 Patriots free agency period

Jungleland

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Given that the Packers, Chiefs, and Bills are the reported teams in on Landry, I don't really see how he could end up here. At 30 he's not worth the $ it will take to beat out that level of contender.
 

Jungleland

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Trollin Volin. The market seems overheated, Pats don't have a huge amount of space. It's not rocket surgery.


What do we think Bourne would get in this market? More than 3/$15M that's for sure.
Feel like Wilson for Miami is the closest, and he got a decent bit more at 3/22.8 (12.75 guaranteed):

Bourne 2020 (4th year in NFL, age 25 season): 49 for 667, 9 yards per target on a 66% catch rate
Wilson 2021 (3rd year in NFL, age 26 season): 45 for 602, 9.9 yards per target on a 73% catch rate

Too early to say if it was a missed opportunity, but not a bad value signing by the Dolphins at all (albeit at a higher value than Bourne).

If there's one thing to be happy about as a Pats fan today, Bourne and Henry look like really good signings, and we're MVS actually getting 12 million a year from someone away from even Agholor being less frustrating.
 

Toe Nash

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Robinson is my #1 target. Obviously any real #1 receiver would help Mac but someone who wins contested catches would add a huge element to the offense. While the receivers were overall fine, Mac really didn't have anyone he could rely on on third downs to win a 50/50 ball, so it felt like a lot of drives stalled if they couldn't get separation and/or their play didn't work perfectly. Mac isn't the type of QB to extend the play for very long but he can put it in a spot to give his guy a chance to make the grab. And obviously Robinson would attract attention and give everyone else a better matchup.
 

Toe Nash

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OK? Are you suggesting Harry will be that guy and the Patriots shouldn't pursue Robinson? Or just complaining? I think everyone is disappointed with Harry but it's been well-covered.
 

BaseballJones

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OK? Are you suggesting Harry will be that guy and the Patriots shouldn't pursue Robinson? Or just complaining? I think everyone is disappointed with Harry but it's been well-covered.
Eh, maybe a little of both. Harry has been that guy at times - certainly in college he was, and he's had those moments in the NFL - so I kinda feel like giving him one more shot this year at being that guy for real. But definitely I'm disappointed and venting just a little, because he should already BE that guy, and I don't like the thought of having to spend a ton of money to find the guy that Harry should already be.
 

j44thor

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With Robinson the questions are will you have to pay for his 2019-2020 near elite production or his 2021 WR3/4 production and can he bounce back from his 2021 season? Big bodied WRs tend to hit a steeper cliff than smaller WRs. After 8 yrs in the NFL it is quite possible Robinson is headed over that cliff. Can't blame his 2021 all on the QB situation either as Darnell Mooney went over 1K yards in just 4 more GS than Arob. I don't think Arob is worth the risk because someone is likely to pay him for his past performance not what he likely is now.
 

tims4wins

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Jul 15, 2005
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While White has been around forever, it's kind of crazy to me that he only just turned 30. By comparison, Kevin Faulk had 4 very productive years for the Pats at ages 30-33 in 2006 through 2009, before getting hurt in 2010 (and opening the door to the Woodhead era). I'm optimistic White can do the same.
 

SMU_Sox

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Eh, maybe a little of both. Harry has been that guy at times - certainly in college he was, and he's had those moments in the NFL - so I kinda feel like giving him one more shot this year at being that guy for real. But definitely I'm disappointed and venting just a little, because he should already BE that guy, and I don't like the thought of having to spend a ton of money to find the guy that Harry should already be.
Harry is sadly a sunk cost. With a bigger X like him you can’t just be a contested catch guy. Lots of A-Rob’s receptions are uncontested. Bigger X’s should be decent route runners and be able to separate more at the catch point and Harry hasn’t shown that. It stinks they missed but they need to upgrade X at least for 2023. 2022 they can get by with Agholor if they choose to keep him.
 

Mugsy's Jock

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Wonder if bringing White back closes the book on Brandon Bolden? I know we've said that before, and Bolden was surprisingly excellent in 2021, but with Harris established, Rhamondre emerging, and White on board, it seems like there are numerous other areas of need to prioritize.

Or does moving on from JJ Taylor suffice?
 

BigSoxFan

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Wonder if bringing White back closes the book on Brandon Bolden? I know we've said that before, and Bolden was surprisingly excellent in 2021, but with Harris established, Rhamondre emerging, and White on board, it seems like there are numerous other areas of need to prioritize.

Or does moving on from JJ Taylor suffice?
White is coming back from a hip injury so can’t imagine that would be 100% reliant on his return, especially at his age. Really hope he can get back to close to where he was. But if he can’t, I’m glad he’s getting some more Pats money.
 

snowmanny

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Eh, maybe a little of both. Harry has been that guy at times - certainly in college he was, and he's had those moments in the NFL - so I kinda feel like giving him one more shot this year at being that guy for real. But definitely I'm disappointed and venting just a little, because he should already BE that guy, and I don't like the thought of having to spend a ton of money to find the guy that Harry should already be.
Totally off topic and I apologize but I was pretty psyched when I read this article after the Pats drafted Harry

https://www.google.com/amp/s/arizonasports.com/story/1922285/michael-lombardi-idiot-to-draft-metcalf-over-nkeal-harry/amp/
 

Jinhocho

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Totally off topic and I apologize but I was pretty psyched when I read this article after the Pats drafted Harry

https://www.google.com/amp/s/arizonasports.com/story/1922285/michael-lombardi-idiot-to-draft-metcalf-over-nkeal-harry/amp/
I remember being excited that they drafted Harry. I knew less about him, but what I read seemed to suggest he was just what the team needed. I always think back to that KC game where that play got called back. I wonder if Brady frustration with the receivers hurt him as well, but he has seemed to go backward rather than forward during his time year. It is hard for me to fathom giving him another year on the roster.
 

Morgan's Magic Snowplow

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The number of holes the team is facing right now, with fairly little cap space to work with, is pretty worrying. Better hope some rookies are good I guess.

We're looking at >100m in cap space in 2023 though, so that's nice.
 

BaseballJones

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We have to be willing to be fully engaged in the team building process. If the Pats “only” win 9-10 games next year but draft well and add young talent and then have tons of cap space to add in order to make a huge run in 2023, so be it. By then Mac will either be the Man or he won’t be. I’m guessing he will be. That’ll be the first real shot at a SB since Brady was here.
 

Mystic Merlin

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The number of holes the team is facing right now, with fairly little cap space to work with, is pretty worrying. Better hope some rookies are good I guess.

We're looking at >100m in cap space in 2023 though, so that's nice.
I’m more worried about the fact they’ll have all that cap space largely because they had so many drafts from ‘16 through ‘19 where they failed to draft many players worth meaningful contracts. They’re in catch-up mode, but hopefully nearer to the end of that cycle than the start.

Fortunately, several good drafts in a row - and they may be in the midst of having found several foundation players in ‘20-‘21 - and some good acquisitions through FA/trade can change your roster outlook pretty quickly.
 

Swedgin

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N'Keal Harry is supposed to be the "wins on contested catches" guy. Look at the scouting reports on him coming out of college. He was ELITE at that.

(look at his two catches - one that didn't count but you still see the talent - at 1:18 and then 0:58)

This is what Harry is supposed to be.
Cant' recall who said it, but one of those tidbits of wisdom I heard on a podcast that stuck - you don't draft a guy based on the ability to "win contested catches" in college. If a guy is going to be a NFL caliber receiver than his primary skill against college DB's should not be "winning contest catches." He should be getting separation from all but the best college DB's, whether through speed, route running or some combination thereof. You project success on 50/50 balls based on physical attributes and how he performed against the handful of corners who will be early round picks.
 

54thMA

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We have to be willing to be fully engaged in the team building process. If the Pats “only” win 9-10 games next year but draft well and add young talent and then have tons of cap space to add in order to make a huge run in 2023, so be it. By then Mac will either be the Man or he won’t be. I’m guessing he will be. That’ll be the first real shot at a SB since Brady was here.
This is where I'm at.

We had give or take nearly a 20 year run of 12 plus wins, winning the division, first round bye, trip to the AFCCG.

Since he left, it's painfully obvious Brady covered up/made up for the flaws this team had.

He's gone and we need a reset/rebuild/retool in order to be competitive year in and year out again.

They've got their QB, now they need time and resources to fill in a competitive team around him.

I'm ok with "only" 9-10 wins next year as well if that is how things shake out.

I love this team and this sport, so I'm in regardless of the final outcome in 2022.
 

67YAZ

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With Robinson the questions are will you have to pay for his 2019-2020 near elite production or his 2021 WR3/4 production and can he bounce back from his 2021 season? Big bodied WRs tend to hit a steeper cliff than smaller WRs. After 8 yrs in the NFL it is quite possible Robinson is headed over that cliff. Can't blame his 2021 all on the QB situation either as Darnell Mooney went over 1K yards in just 4 more GS than Arob. I don't think Arob is worth the risk because someone is likely to pay him for his past performance not what he likely is now.
Last year, Robinson was derailed by a cocktail of injuries, shitty QB play, even shittier coaching, and it appeared to be some level of mentally checking out. If you’re interested in Robinson, you really have to sit down with him and review last season to develop a plan to rebound - before signing him. He’s got lots of skills that would age well - hands, route running, technique - but he’s got to adjust his approach and role as he ages.

I’d let the market settle a bit and see if he’d bite on a 1yr prove it deal. He’s already bet on himself a couple times, so he might be up for another gamble.
 

Cellar-Door

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Toe Nash

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Maybe we were spoiled by Edelman and Amendola as returners but I thought Olszewski was really unimpressive last year even as a returner. ST was not as good as usual overall but very rarely did he make anything happen.
 

BaseballJones

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Maybe we were spoiled by Edelman and Amendola as returners but I thought Olszewski was really unimpressive last year even as a returner. ST was not as good as usual overall but very rarely did he make anything happen.
True but he was incredible the year before so clearly he has return ability. The whole special teams outside of Folk was a complete disaster last year. No idea why.
 

JokersWildJIMED

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True but he was incredible the year before so clearly he has return ability. The whole special teams outside of Folk was a complete disaster last year. No idea why.
Gunner was ok as a punt returner last year, but an abject disaster as a kickoff returner.
 

BaseballJones

ivanvamp
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Gunner was ok as a punt returner last year, but an abject disaster as a kickoff returner.
He was first team All Pro. Dude was phenomenal, not just “ok”.

Oh wait, are you talking about this past year or 2020? I’m referring to 2020 when he was ridiculously good.
 

JokersWildJIMED

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He was first team All Pro. Dude was phenomenal, not just “ok”.

Oh wait, are you talking about this past year or 2020? I’m referring to 2020 when he was ridiculously good.
Last year= 2021. Gunner was good in 2020 as a PR, but I disagree with the “phenomenal”. He was sorta All-Pro by default as there was virtually no competition in competent punt returners that year.
 

BaseballJones

ivanvamp
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Last year= 2021. Gunner was good in 2020 as a PR, but I disagree with the “phenomenal”. He was sorta All-Pro by default as there was virtually no competition in competent punt returners that year.
In 2020 he averaged 17.3 yards per PUNT return. That’s a ridiculously huge number for a punt returner. He was unbelievably good that year returning punts. In the Super Bowl era, only one guy has ever had a better average than Gunner: Leodis McKelvin of the Bills in 2012 at 18.7.

So Gunner’s PR average in 2020 was better than anyone but one guy in the last 59 years in the NFL.

All pro “by default”? Dude was historically great that year.