Report: A-Rod banned through 2014?

[mikeot]

All seriousness aside; from "Derek Jeter's Dairy" at Grantland:
 
Tuesday, July 30: at Los Angeles Dodgers
A strange thing happens at the hotel this morning. I'm standing on my patio overlooking the infinity pool when a very large crow lands on the railing beside me. I notice something tied to its leg.
A tiny scroll.
So I open it. There's a message written in elegant calligraphy:

Dear Captain,
We have found him.
It won't be long now.
Respectfully Yours,
A.H. Selig
Commissioner of the Base-Ball

I pick up the phone and consider calling Alex.
But then I put the phone down.
It's probably too late.
Sometimes you just have to let history take its course.
I nod to the crow and it disappears into the sky.

 

[steveluck7]

That's not correct.

You are correct. I had heard (earlier this week) that a lifetime "Bud-Ban" that was outside of the drug agreement could not be appealed but it looks like it can be. 
 
edit: but to answer the original question. If he is suspended under the CBA (not the drug agreement, he would be ineligible to play until that appeal is heard.
 
http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/mlb/2013/07/31/alex-rodriguez-suspended-lifetime-suspension-biogenesis/2606319/
An appeal would be heard by arbitrator Fredric Horowitz and would likely not occur until September. Should MLB suspend Rodriguez under the CBA, he would be ineligible to play until Horowitz's decision.

 

[opes]

You are correct. I had heard (earlier this week) that a lifetime "Bud-Ban" that was outside of the drug agreement could not be appealed but it looks like it can be. 

 
 
but will they play him is the question.

 

[steveluck7]

 
 
but will they play him is the question.

i just edited my post to add the answer. In short, no they won't until the appeal is heard

 

[Lose Remerswaal]

George would have had him killed.  Cashman can't even find someone to spike his gatorade.

 

[Snodgrass'Muff]

Sure, but investigations don't always turn up everything you wanted to know about.  The Sox spent a ton of time and effort investigating Carl Crawford.  You'd have thought they might have some idea that his stint in Boston would go so poorly... but they didn't.  I'm in no way tying Crawford to PED's, just pointing out that we can't assume they knew about it, and we especially can't just take it as fact that they knew they were getting one of the dirtiest players in the game when they extended him (either time), never mind that they should be punished for it by paying his salary while he's either suspended or banned.
 
Remember, the Red Sox wanted him just as badly in 2003.

 

[glennhoffmania]

He remains adamant that he is innocent of the drug charges, insisting that he has not used performance-enhancing drugs since 2003 when he was with the Texas Rangers.
 
"I have never failed a test, paid people, or done the things they're accusing me of," Rodriguez told USA TODAY Sports in a July interview. "Nobody is hiding anything. It's weird."
 

Link
 
I would put the odds that he's telling the truth at about .01%, but just imagine if he is.  Otherwise he's one extremely disturbed individual.

 

[canderson]

So if this doesn't happen tomorrow, I'll be pissed. I'm tired of this news and it's just dragging baseball down along with it. Suspend these guys and move on already.

 

[Average Reds]

 
Why?  If it isn't counted then a Qualifying Offer is going to be worth less.

 
A Yankee team that is unconstrained by the burden of A-Rod's contract will promote a robust market for free agents. 

 

[Rovin Romine]

Looks like the "lifetime ban" story is getting more legs as the unofficial announcement deadline gets closer.   Which makes A-Rod's "vow to appeal" all the more odd.
 
I'm not sure if the H.O.F. means anything to Rodriguez, but if PED users get into the Hall at some point in the future, he won't be eligible if he's serving a lifetime ban/suspension.  So that's one factor to consider in the "Deal v. Fight" equation.
 
Another is milestone attainment.  I haven't looked at his numbers recently - are there any milestones he could realistically break with a couple more years of playing?  He is 38 after all.  If he appeals outside of MLB and wins, he's going to lose a season anyway - I can't see this being litigated in a hurry.
 
The last factor is $.  If he accepts a limited ban, he won't get paid for a period of time.  But he has the following $ due him: 26 mil in '14, 22 mil in '15, 21 in '16 and 21 in '17.  If he fights outside of MLB and wins, he may get the money - but if he loses and is banned for life, he loses it all.  (Correct?)
 
Perhaps the best he can hope for is a buyout/retirement deal.  He admits culpability, announces retirement, and gets paid some of the money in a settlement. 
 
I just don't see Selig doing something that allows him to return when he's 40. . .

 

[E5 Yaz]

Link
 
Otherwise he's one extremely disturbed individual.

 
Otherwise?

 

[chrisfont9]

George would have had him killed.  Cashman can't even find someone to spike his gatorade.

No, George would have been busted by the FBI for hiring a goon to kill him before the deed could be done, then gone to jail and kicked out of baseball, only to be freed in 10 years and reinstated by Commissioner Anthony Weiner.

 

[DJnVa]

Buck Showalter: If Yankees recoup Arod's contract, Matt Wieters will be playing in the Bronx in 2 years.
 
http://espn.go.com/new-york/mlb/story/_/id/9527967/buck-showalter-guarantees-new-york-yankees-sign-matt-wieters-alex-rodriguez-suspended-2014-season
 

"If Bud lets them get away with that, they're under the luxury tax," the Orioles manager told USA Today. "If they can reset, they can spend again, and I guarantee you in two years Matt Wieters is in New York."
 

 

[AlNipper49]

This is the part I'm curious about. The Yankees would invest $275M in a guy and not do a little investigative work about what he was putting into his body? I guess anything is possible but I find it hard to believe that teams and their doctors don't have at least some idea of what's going on. I mean, the Sox had a pretty good idea about Gagne and Donnelly, to name a few, right?


In my dream world, the Yankees get convicted of screwing with his tests for the purposes of ultimately voiding his contract. How awesome would that be?

 

[MakeMineMoxie]

In my dream world, the Yankees get convicted of screwing with his tests for the purposes of ultimately voiding his contract. How awesome would that be?

:fap:

 

[Bob420]

In my dream world, the Yankees get convicted of screwing with his tests for the purposes of ultimately voiding his contract. How awesome would that be?

If they did, they messed that up as he has never tested positive.  Kramer might have spilled some suspect non-fat frozen yogurt in the sample.

 

[phrenile]

Another is milestone attainment.  I haven't looked at his numbers recently - are there any milestones he could realistically break with a couple more years of playing?  He is 38 after all.  If he appeals outside of MLB and wins, he's going to lose a season anyway - I can't see this being litigated in a hurry.

He's at 647 HR. He gets $6M for reaching each of 660, 714, 755, 762, and 763. The first of those (Mays) is still well within reach.

 

[Lowrielicious]

Looks like the "lifetime ban" story is getting more legs as the unofficial announcement deadline gets closer.   Which makes A-Rod's "vow to appeal" all the more odd.
 
I'm not sure if the H.O.F. means anything to Rodriguez, but if PED users get into the Hall at some point in the future, he won't be eligible if he's serving a lifetime ban/suspension.  So that's one factor to consider in the "Deal v. Fight" equation.
 
Another is milestone attainment.  I haven't looked at his numbers recently - are there any milestones he could realistically break with a couple more years of playing?  He is 38 after all.  If he appeals outside of MLB and wins, he's going to lose a season anyway - I can't see this being litigated in a hurry.
 
The last factor is $.  If he accepts a limited ban, he won't get paid for a period of time.  But he has the following $ due him: 26 mil in '14, 22 mil in '15, 21 in '16 and 21 in '17.  If he fights outside of MLB and wins, he may get the money - but if he loses and is banned for life, he loses it all.  (Correct?)
 
Perhaps the best he can hope for is a buyout/retirement deal.  He admits culpability, announces retirement, and gets paid some of the money in a settlement. 
 
I just don't see Selig doing something that allows him to return when he's 40. . .

 
From COTS: $6M each for reaching 660, 714, 755 and tying and breaking major league HR record.
He currently sits on 647. So an extra 6 mill is just 13 HRs away. The others are a little further out of reach.

EDIT: what he said ^

 

[Van Everyman]

Buck Showalter: If Yankees recoup Arod's contract, Matt Wieters will be playing in the Bronx in 2 years.

http://espn.go.com/new-york/mlb/story/_/id/9527967/buck-showalter-guarantees-new-york-yankees-sign-matt-wieters-alex-rodriguez-suspended-2014-season


And so it was that I began to officially like Buck Showalter.

 

[Sampo Gida]

It occurs to me that Bud has always had the power to suspend players for steroids under the best interests of baseball clause /CBA, even before the JDA and testing.  Why has he not used it before?  Technically, the use of steroids without a prescription has always been against MLB rules since its against Federal laws.   Why didn't he use it against Barry Bonds?.  

Anyways, it seems to me that MLB needs the Yankees to maintain their revenues since they are the biggest revenue sharer even with the rebates.  If the Yankees revenues drop because they are not competitive, that hurts all the teams.   I thought the Yankees have chosen not to spend due to the revenue sharing rebates, but then again, maybe they are trying to force MLB's hand to get them financial relief by throwing this season.
 
Meanwhile, the MLBPA wants the Yankees back in the FA market, and see the 100 million dollar savings for Arod being earmarked to some other player (eg guys like Weiters), so they won't support Arod.  Arod has no friends in this and will be thrown under the bus by MLBPA
 
MLB is also setting a precedent on voiding guaranteed contracts that will benefit all teams at the expense of players who dare underperform after signing a big deal, or who are unfortunate that the team they are on underperforms and wants to downsize their payroll to account for the reduced revenue.
 
MLB and teams looked the other way when steroids were boosting revenues, and perhaps are still doing so.  Now they see a way to use steroids to go after players who are underperforming their contracts and/or who play for underperforming teams.  Bud was one of the owners who was caught up in the collusion against players case in the 80's, so pretty sure he would not be bound by ethics here.
 
Not a lawyer, but if Bud goes for a lifetime ban, and if a court is willing to take the case, I like Arods chances (esp if the only evidence is what we have heard).  Not sure I trust any arbitration hearing after the last guy got canned for ruling against MLB,   I might even use the race card given the fact most of the players caught up in Biogenesis seem to be of Latino descent.  Not saying MLB is racist, just that it plays well in court cases.

 

[Van Everyman]

Olney with a good take on why Selig should use restraint and play upon the Union's dislike of ARod:

http://m.espn.go.com/general/blogs/blogpost?blogname=buster-olney&id=2689&src=desktop

Even if he did take it, Selig would probably fuck it up anyway.

 

[SemperFidelisSox]

Miami Herald now reporting that a federal criminal probe into Biogenisis is underway.

 

[Sampo Gida]

Feds now involved.  How it affects Arods case, if at all, I have no idea
 
http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/story/_/id/9529801/jeff-novitzky-investigating-whether-tony-bosch-biogenesis-gave-peds-high-school-students-sources-confirm
 

The federal interest could complicate Major League Baseball's investigation of players related to the clinic. When Bosch agreed to cooperate with MLB last month, one condition was that they help mitigate any potential criminal investigation, as "Outside the Lines" reported. Bosch's attorneys met with federal prosecutors in Miami before signing an agreement with MLB, seeking assurances that Bosch would not face federal criminal charges.

 

[Van Everyman]

Only a matter of time before ARod ends up on death row with Aaron Hernandez.

 

[HriniakPosterChild]

When does he get his picture on the cover of the Rolling Stone? (Wanna send five copies to my mother...)

 

[Bob420]

Wieters is overrated. Yanks won't be looking at him.

 

[Brianish]

Wieters is overrated. Yanks won't be looking at him.

 
Even if one were to concede the first, the second doesn't necessarily follow. 

 

[Bob420]

Maybe but if the yankees have anything in terms of decent position prospects, it is catchers. They most likely will use money to fill the hole at every other position on the field.

 

[jon abbey]

Joel Sherman ‏@Joelsherman1 
 
Told tonight that plan by A-Rod camp is not to settle, but rather to fight any MLB suspension through appeal process.
 
Always caution there is posturing, but this is posturing at 11th hour. MLB leaning toward suspension announcements tmrw.
 
Belief earlier in day by outside observers was new law firm hired by A-Rod was to help with best settlement possible, maybe it's to fight on
 
MLB has indicated if A-Rod doesn't take deal will be banned for life. If he appeals, then will be fascinating if Selig invokes best (cont)
 
best interest of baseball clause from CBA to keep him from playing until arbitrator rules.

 

[jon abbey]

And another take on the latest:
 
"Negotiations between Alex Rodriguez and Major League Baseball are apparently stuck on Rodriguez's desire to make sure he can cash in on at least some of the remaining $100 million owed under his contract, and there's also a wide gap between the suspension he is willing to accept and the one MLB would like to issue, two sources familiar with the talks told ESPN's "Outside the Lines.""
 
http://espn.go.com/new-york/mlb/story/_/id/9530007/sources-mlb-alex-rodriguez-far-apart-suspension-settlement

 

[Oil Can Dan]

I suspect we'll have news late tomorrow one way or the other. Always best to issue bad news late on a Friday.

 

[Sampo Gida]

If I am Arod I go the court route, forget the arbitration.  Play the race card if necessary. If he wins,  not only does get paid for what is due on his entire contract, he may ask for and get awarded damages for emotional distress, lost opportunities for future employment and sponsors, etc that could far exceed this amount.  MLB needs to tread carefully unless their evidence is really airtight with "credible" witnesses to back it up.

 

[soxhop411]

for once I actually agree w/ Jose Canseco. MLB should set something up where a suspended players salery goes towards charity and not just go away. Would be a good way to help the community
 
 
Jose Canseco ‏@JoseCanseco15m
Selig bans @arod not for good of game but for good of Yankees. gives them $25m year gift. Yankees should have to eat it
 
Jose Canseco ‏@JoseCanseco2m
hey bud @mlb ban @arod with no cap relief for NY. donate the $100m left to ny city schools. chance to doing something right

 

[opes]

what the fuck does the race card have to do with anything?

 

[MakMan44]

As much as I hate to say this, I disagree. The Yankees are paying 25 million for a service which they now won't be receiving. 

 

[Sampo Gida]

what the fuck does the race card have to do with anything?

 
up thread about 4 posts, read

 

[glennhoffmania]

And another take on the latest:
 
"Negotiations between Alex Rodriguez and Major League Baseball are apparently stuck on Rodriguez's desire to make sure he can cash in on at least some of the remaining $100 million owed under his contract, and there's also a wide gap between the suspension he is willing to accept and the one MLB would like to issue, two sources familiar with the talks told ESPN's "Outside the Lines.""
 
http://espn.go.com/new-york/mlb/story/_/id/9530007/sources-mlb-alex-rodriguez-far-apart-suspension-settlement

I just read this on Yahoo and I'm confused.  If they reach a deal then I assume it wouldn't be a lifetime ban, so he'd come back at some point and collect on part of his contract.  Under what scenario would ARod and MLB reach a settlement that doesn't involve him coming back before his contract would expire?

 

[PrometheusWakefield]

Joel Sherman ‏@Joelsherman1 
 
Told tonight that plan by A-Rod camp is not to settle, but rather to fight any MLB suspension through appeal process.
 
Always caution there is posturing, but this is posturing at 11th hour. MLB leaning toward suspension announcements tmrw.
 
Belief earlier in day by outside observers was new law firm hired by A-Rod was to help with best settlement possible, maybe it's to fight on
 
MLB has indicated if A-Rod doesn't take deal will be banned for life. If he appeals, then will be fascinating if Selig invokes best (cont)
 
best interest of baseball clause from CBA to keep him from playing until arbitrator rules.

I just think this is total bullshit.  Basically, MLB is asserting the right to aggressively interpret a good of the game clause to mean whatever the fuck they want (could they ban a guy for drunk driving?) hoping that the threat will coerce ARod into submission. F that.  MLB wants this to go away as quickly as possible and if ARod's smart he'll realize that gives him leverage.
 
The players union would be fools to let this slide because they don't personally like ARod.  What good is a union that doesn't protect it's assholes.   

 

[Orel Miraculous]

If I am Arod I go the court route, forget the arbitration.  Play the race card if necessary. If he wins,  not only does get paid for what is due on his entire contract, he may ask for and get awarded damages for emotional distress, lost opportunities for future employment and sponsors, etc that could far exceed this amount.  MLB needs to tread carefully unless their evidence is really airtight with "credible" witnesses to back it up.

 
He can't just "forget the arbitration" if he feels like it.  When you work in an industry that is governed by a CBA, then that CBA is the law, and it is enforced through arbitration.  It is very, very difficult for individual union members (or management, for that matter) to take disputes out of arbitration.

 

[Murderer's Crow]

I don't think leverage matters at this point. They've obviously both shown their cards to each other. Marchand mentioned something during an ESPN interview that the MLB is hoping for at least 150 games. I'm not sure if that means that Arod got them to move down from the 1 year + offer which was previously reported.

 

[jon abbey]

My impression from all of these reports is that the minimum MLB wants is the rest of this year and all of 2014, and A-Rod hasn't agreed to that yet, hence the lifetime threats.

 

[Murderer's Crow]

My impression from all of these reports is that the minimum MLB wants is the rest of this year and all of 2014, and A-Rod hasn't agreed to that yet, hence the lifetime threats.

 
Agreed. That interview (which is the playable link on the ESPN story) is the only mention I've heard of 150.

 

[glennhoffmania]

My impression from all of these reports is that the minimum MLB wants is the rest of this year and all of 2014, and A-Rod hasn't agreed to that yet, hence the lifetime threats.

Right, which means he'd still collect his salary in 2015, 2016 and 2017, correct?  This is why that ESPN report made no sense to me.

 

[StuckOnYouk]

If he takes the 150 thats the rest of this year and just into the 2nd half of next year. I'm surprised he wouldn't take that unless he's holding out for 100 games and not a game more.
 
Stay strong A-Rod. Stay strong.

 

[Harry Hooper]

My impression from all of these reports is that the minimum MLB wants is the rest of this year and all of 2014, and A-Rod hasn't agreed to that yet, hence the lifetime threats.

 
My WAG is that Rodriguez will in no way accept a 3-digit game suspension or longer. He's not going to agree to be turned into the freak sin eater for all of baseball's PED woes. He might accept something a tad worse than Braun's, but in that same neighborhood. So, about 75 games.

 

[mauidano]

Nothing would make me happier to see A-Rod sit out a substantial amount of games and then come back and play the remaining years of his contract.   A considerably less ball player pushing 40 embarrassing the shit out of the Yankee organization.  Sorry dude, no more HGH this time.

 

[EvilEmpire]

Not a lawyer, but if Bud goes for a lifetime ban, and if a court is willing to take the case, I like Arods chances (esp if the only evidence is what we have heard).  Not sure I trust any arbitration hearing after the last guy got canned for ruling against MLB,   I might even use the race card given the fact most of the players caught up in Biogenesis seem to be of Latino descent.  Not saying MLB is racist, just that it plays well in court cases.

 
Is that you, cousin Yuri?

 

[EvilEmpire]

If MLB bans him, and ARod appeals, does anyone know how the arbitrator hearing would work?  Would ARod have to testify to make his case to the arbitrator?  Would failure to testify make his chances of winning in arbitration more difficult?  Would he be under oath?
 
I'd love to see ARod testify under oath about all of this.  But I have no idea how an arbitration hearing over this kind of thing would work.

 

[Orel Miraculous]

Arbitration is just like a mini trial, but the rules are a little more relaxed.  He can present evidence and he can testify, and it would be under oath.  Unlike a trial, though, its entirely private, so you, unfortunately, won't get to watch.

 

[bankshot1]

Nothing would make me happier to see A-Rod sit out a substantial amount of games and then come back and play the remaining years of his contract.   A considerably less ball player pushing 40 embarrassing the shit out of the Yankee organization.  Sorry dude, no more HGH this time.

This is where I'm at. So I hope they can negotiate a 150-ish game suspension (maybe back-dated to Braun) which get him back by post '14 ASG. Then the MFY will be faced with the limboish position of supporting and paying a player they detest.  IMO this is probably why MLB appears adamant about ARod sitting the entire '14 season. (and hopoing he will be cooked)