Alex Speier @alexspeier 56s56 seconds ago
Sox announce they've claimed Juan Francisco on waivers from Blue Jays
Sox announce they've claimed Juan Francisco on waivers from Blue Jays
Red Sox claim INF Juan Francisco from Blue Jays
- Thread starter Corsi
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There's the power hitting LH third baseman we've been looking for. Too bad he's a terrible fielder. And his lefthandedness means he isn't really platoonable with Holt or Cecchini. 107 OPS+ last year, 99 for his career. Worth picking up for free.
The relentless pursuit of 245 lb third basemen continues. They must be the new market inefficiency.
Jason Mastrodonato @JMastrodonato 3s3 seconds ago
If the Red Sox actually think they'll have room for Francisco (plus Brock Holt) on the 25-man, all but guarantees that OFs will be dealt.
If the Red Sox actually think they'll have room for Francisco (plus Brock Holt) on the 25-man, all but guarantees that OFs will be dealt.
Matt Collins @RedSox_Thoughts · 6m6 minutes ago
MLBTR projects $2.2M RT @brianmacp: Juan Francisco has three years of service time and thus is arbitration-eligible this winter.
MLBTR projects $2.2M RT @brianmacp: Juan Francisco has three years of service time and thus is arbitration-eligible this winter.
soxhop411 said:
It does not bode well for Nava/Cespedes/Victorino being on this team in the future
Watched him quite a bit last year in the Jays broadcasts
He got extremely hot in May , crashed in June, recovered in July, has a horrible August and then was hardly used the rest of the year.
The Jays announcers were pretty down on him by the end of the year.
This in his age 27 season
http://espn.go.com/mlb/player/splits/_/id/29601/juan-francisco
My last memories of him were in his down spell so I don't have a particularly favourable impression.
And he can't field.
He got extremely hot in May , crashed in June, recovered in July, has a horrible August and then was hardly used the rest of the year.
The Jays announcers were pretty down on him by the end of the year.
This in his age 27 season
http://espn.go.com/mlb/player/splits/_/id/29601/juan-francisco
My last memories of him were in his down spell so I don't have a particularly favourable impression.
And he can't field.
Toronto sportscasters are cheering the news that the Red Sox have relieved the Blue Jays of Can't Hit a Curve Ball Francisco.
Or it could mean that Francisco is Panda-insurance. If Panda is signed, Francisco will likely be non-tendered.
I don't expect Francisco to be the answer to the 3b problem but can play either corner as needed and adds a bit of pop and a LH bat to the bench. Could also serve as a throw in in any potential trade.
gammoseditor said:
I was thinking the same thing.
Which contending teams need a slugging RHH 1B/DH on a one year deal?
Certainly not LAA or LAD. Probably not Oakland, Detroit or Cleveland. Seattle, probably. Washington, perhaps. KC might. SF conceivably.
Seattle for Iwakuma had been discussed, but it's far too early to read this as anything significant. Right now it feels like worse case scenario insurance.
I may have known this at some point and have no forgotten -- what's their financial commitment with this? The Sox could waive him at some point in the near future, right, for minimal cost?
gammoseditor said:
This would mean giving the strong side of the platoon to a guy with a .310 career OBP vs RHP. I don't even like that scenario as insurance.
Yeah - this is just depth 3B insurance incase they do not get any of Panda/Headley/Hanley. If they land a real 3B, Francisco is back on the waiver wire before arb #'s are exchanged.
Hee Sox Choi said:
I think it's very likely one of Cespedes or Napoli is moved. I don't know why it's assumed Cespedes is the guy to go. Moving Napoli frees up more money. For me it depends on what we can get for each of them.
Even if they do sign Sandoval, if no regulars are traded we only have 2 regulars who can hit left handed. I know some have argued they'd rather have good RHH than bad LHH, but Francisco has a pretty good track record against RHP.
Edit - The reason i don't see it as 3B insurance is two fold. A left side of the infield with Xander and Francisco sounds like a disaster. Also for the reason posted above, we could really use 2 lefties. I also think Cespedes could be moved and Francisco transitioned to LF.
gammoseditor said:
Either way, I'd much rather have Daniel Nava hitting against RHP than Juan Francisco, be it at 1B or LF. I don't see any scenario in which Francisco has a meaningful number of ABs with the Red Sox.
If they obtain a real 3b, and keep Francisco and Holt on the 25 man, they would be committing to 4 OFers ie they would have to move 2 of the 6. Ditto if they want to run out a JF/WMB platoon at 3b or a Craig/Francisco platoon at first. Not following this at all.
seems likely Francisco won't end up on the roster--the insurance hypothesis others have offered sounds right (i.e. he only stays if other plans don't work out)KillerBs said:
Stan Papi Was Framed said:
The caveat being that "other plans" means "Sox charter doesn't fall from the sky one day."
I'll be shocked if he's anything more than a packing peanut in the package used to acquire a real major leaguer sometime before April 1.
this is one of those subtraction by addition deals, isn't it? Means a lower return on Cespedes or Nava than otherwise, perhaps.BCsMightyJoeYoung said:
If Napoli is moved, who starts at 1b? Craig? No one on this board has faith in Craig returning to glory and the Sox front office is smarter than we are, so why would they get rid of Napoli and count on Craig to be the starting 1b? And Francisco is not going to be the starting platoon at 1b vs. Rs. That's ridiculous, look at the stats.
Hee Sox Choi said:
Francisco was much better against RHP last year than Napoli, is 6 years younger, and will cost $12-14 million less. I'm not saying it's going to happen. I am saying if someone blows you away with an offer for Napoli it could work out. The extra money makes it a lot easier to land 2 of Lester/Hamels/Scherzer.
The Mort Report said:
According to a quick google search, he's been out of options since 2011, which was why the Reds traded him to the Braves.
If Napoli is moved it will signal that the Sox are going with the youth movement. I've noticed the small pocket of fans that would like to see Napoli moved are the same ones clamoring for Travis Shaw. I've been mentioning this next line for 4 years. Travis Shaw is not an MLB starter. He could have an okay career off the bench as a Loney lite but he is not a starting first baseman. Napoli isn't going anyways and Francisco isn't the answer either.gammoseditor said:
How about over their careers? Napoli had a messed up finger last year and bats cleanup for the Red Sox. Juan Francisco just got waived and was passed over by 6 or 7 teams. I don't think a smart, contending team trades Naps and inserts Francisco as the starting 1B vs. Rs.gammoseditor said:
Hee Sox Choi said:
Not to mention that even in a year where Francisco was "much better" against RHP than Napoli, his OBP was still .034 points lower. This shouldn't even be a consideration.
Are we even sure Brock Holt will be on the team? They have enough hitting on the bench and I can't see Brock Holt being 2nd on our SS depth chart. If an injury happened they'd have to rush Marrero if he isn't traded himself this offseason.
Seems an all glove SS who can play 2b/3b too is a better fit than Holt's supersub ability that won't even be needed, especially since the Sox were hesitant to play him at SS. I wouldn't be surprised if Holt wasn't here. No need for him in the OF, won't play him at short, Dustin Pedroia at 2nd. He could see time at 3rd I guess, but team would need a backup SS still.
This team has very little SS depth along with the 3b issue and I don't think Holt helps solve it enough to be a lock for a roster spot.
Seems an all glove SS who can play 2b/3b too is a better fit than Holt's supersub ability that won't even be needed, especially since the Sox were hesitant to play him at SS. I wouldn't be surprised if Holt wasn't here. No need for him in the OF, won't play him at short, Dustin Pedroia at 2nd. He could see time at 3rd I guess, but team would need a backup SS still.
This team has very little SS depth along with the 3b issue and I don't think Holt helps solve it enough to be a lock for a roster spot.
Holt started 7 or more games at 7 different positions (all but P & C), including SS where he made 0 E's in 11 starts. Being able to back up every position and hit lefthanded is incredibly valuable to this roster. Holt is way more valuable than a all-glove/no-hit back-up IF.bosox79 said:
Now, if some team makes a nice offer for Holt or he needs to be included in a deal to get a star pitcher, then I won't be sad if he goes. But a guy that is adequate at that many positions is incredibly valuable.
Agree on both points re Holt -- he is a very valuable bench player and he is a potential trade piece, especially if there is a team out there that sees him as a starting 2B.
But even if Holt is dealt, they do need to carry a UI/back up SS (Weeks?), which (assuming 12 pitchers) precludes carrying Juan Francisco on the bench AND 5 OFers.
It is just a curious move, on the cusp of signing a starting 3B, even tho he does some value despite his extreme hacktivism.
But even if Holt is dealt, they do need to carry a UI/back up SS (Weeks?), which (assuming 12 pitchers) precludes carrying Juan Francisco on the bench AND 5 OFers.
It is just a curious move, on the cusp of signing a starting 3B, even tho he does some value despite his extreme hacktivism.
So a guy with a significantly better career line than Loney except for ONE season in the PCL, a career line very comparable to Adam LaRoche, is obviously at the age of 24 nothing more than a bench 1B?Tyrone Biggums said:
Please share your prognostication powers with us to solve more pressing issues than the future of Travis Shaw, oh great swami.
Also, as one of the few Travis Shaw for 1B 2016 people around I have never supported the idea of trading Napoli. Most "trade Napoli" suggestions I've seen involve immediately signing LaRoche to make the lineup more left handed in fact, which would have a real probability of blocking Shaw long enough for Sam Travis or Nick Longhi to catch him. Not exactly a pro-Shaw argument.
Anyhow, Francisco + Middlebrooks would in theory be a productive 3B platoon, and if either suddenly learned to hit for the contact they have both flashed in the high minors the Sox would have a worthwhile multi-year option at 3B for comparatively low money. In that scenario the abject failure of both Francisco and Middlebrooks could be insured against with Cecchini's potential advancement or Holt having another pot of gold spell.
Am I the only one who sees this as an attempt to make an upgrade on Alex Hassan? I can't even fathom the front office making this claim as a precursor to moving Napoli. If they hope to contend in 2015 and that's what they are planning, we are in a ton of trouble.
gammoseditor said:
Can't help but wonder if, on some Orioles' message board, in reaction to the news that the O's have picked up Alex Hassan on waivers from the A's, someone is posting something akin to: "could mean the front office has no intention of bringing back either Cruz or Markakis."
It's a cover their butts in case they miss on all the free agent 3Bs move. A guy who put up a >.700 OPS at 3B last year who is left handed and hits home runs was available for literally nothing, as in the club gave nothing for him and isn't committed to paying him anything until the season starts.Snodgrass'Muff said:
Now worst case scenario they go into 2015 with Francisco/WMB as a platoon/competition and Brock Holt as the MI/dark horse candidate. If they all shit the bed they'll still have Cecchini as a mid-season alternative.
Go bust a nut on Moncada and honestly, it wouldn't be a horrible strategy to go forward with. The other guys all get their shot while Moncada gets up to speed with a year in AA (the Francisco/WMB season) and a year in AAA (the Cecchini season). If none of them have locked it down then it's Moncada time. If he can't lock it down, well, then Devers/Chavis. You would think that between all of those guys they could find one worthwhile starting 3B.
Still prefer just paying Panda/Headley Lamarr/DivaRam or hell, even Lowrie on a one year stop gap deal because I'm sick of 3B sucking, but if they can't get any of them at a reasonable deal and want to save the overpay for Lester I could live with that.
