Durant to Warriors

Grin&MartyBarret

Member
SoSH Member
Oct 2, 2007
4,932
East Village, NYC
I have no more information than you (or perhaps less) but given the fact that Durant actually pulled the trigger now rather than next year strongly suggests that he knows Westbrook is leaving.

So why not go back for one more year? If Westbrook is, in fact, planning to leave it creates a lot of uncertainty around the team and it also has the potential to affect performance. More to the point, if Durant chose to stay, his window to join Golden State would have closed as they would likely would resign Barnes and some of their other free agents and then had to pay Curry next offseason.
It could strongly suggest that. It might also suggest that he doesn't like playing with Westbrook. Or that he felt that if he was going to be giving up touches to a lead guard, it should be somebody more efficient than Westbrook. It could also suggest, as you pointed out, that Durant was set on Golden State and this was his one opportunity to get there. Those are all real possibilities that have nothing to do with Westbrook leaving OKC.
 

DJnVa

Dorito Dawg
SoSH Member
Dec 16, 2010
54,150
I think it's pretty obvious he's taking his shot at the ring. If he gets it, he's out to whoever provides the most money and a decent shot at another title.
Can you think of a scenario where he wins a title this coming season, then doesn't feel as if the Warriors were his best shot at another title? Because we know they will pay him.
 

gammoseditor

also had a stroke
SoSH Member
Jul 17, 2005
4,233
Somerville, MA
First of all, I strongly disagree with the first sentence. The East was a fait accompli all year, and the West got a lot weaker after the top four than it had been for years. GS/SA played at a historic level, but OKC choked away virtually every big regular season game they played in. No one took them seriously until Adams and Roberson emerged in the playoffs and they kicked it up a level. And the GS team everyone is worried about "ruining" the league won a league record 73 games. They are better on paper, but do you think they're going to win more than 73? If so, I'd like to see that.
The West regular season was great last year when the Warriors played the Spurs. Now both leagues are going to be like the East. The East playoffs were bad last year. Now both leagues are going to be like the East. The finals were great this year. Now they won't be. Just my opinion. I hope I'm wrong.

Edit: And I don't care how many regular season games the Warriors win next year. If they wanted to they could win 76. They are going to coast and save energy for the playoffs, especially on the road. Just like this years Cavs. It won't be fun to watch.
 

kelpapa

Costanza's Hero
SoSH Member
Feb 15, 2010
4,655
Edit: And I don't care how many regular season games the Warriors win next year. If they wanted to they could win 76. They are going to coast and save energy for the playoffs, especially on the road. Just like this years Cavs. It won't be fun to watch.
How do you know all of this already? We are still several months away from the regular season starting.
 

snowmanny

Member
SoSH Member
Dec 8, 2005
15,772
A very close parallel is Moses going to the 82-83 Sixers who had just lost the finals. They did dominate: for one year. Then Red got really pissed and we all survived.
 

gammoseditor

also had a stroke
SoSH Member
Jul 17, 2005
4,233
Somerville, MA
How do you know all of this already? We are still several months away from the regular season starting.
I don't "know" it. I suspect they're going to see that they killed themselves in the regular season last year and didn't win it all while the Cavs took it easy in the regular season and won and decide that's the better approach. Either way that's not the point. If they do decide they want to go for a regular season wins record I'm not really going to care anyway. I'm not impressed by the best players deciding they don't want a challenge and want to all play together kicking everyone's ass. Again, that's an opinion. I said already I hope I'm wrong and the league is competitive.
 

reggiecleveland

sublime
Lifetime Member
SoSH Member
Mar 5, 2004
28,013
Saskatoon Canada
A very close parallel is Moses going to the 82-83 Sixers who had just lost the finals. They did dominate: for one year. Then Red got really pissed and we all survived.
I have thought of that parallel. Quite different. The sixers had a guy, Dr. J. as their star that was not good enough to be the feature guy on a championship team, not with Kareem, Magic and Bird around. Moses was the missing piece, and the best player.

Had Dr J. forced himself to the Lakers that would be similar to what Durant had done.

Keep in mind the Sixers were supposed to be unbeatable with all their talent before Moses, it was "unfair" to have McGinnis, Erving, Collins, on one team.

Snowmanny has a point teams find ways to beat you. The Cavs adjusted their D after struggling to stop the Raptors to slowing down the Warriors.

I still want to see them play together. It is hard for them to be better offensively , at least in the regular season than this year.
 
Last edited:

snowmanny

Member
SoSH Member
Dec 8, 2005
15,772
Good points Reggie. I would add that when the Sixers got Malone it gave them the last two MVPs (Moses 82 and Erving 81) so Dr J was still considered a top player.
 

zenter

indian sweet
SoSH Member
Oct 11, 2005
5,641
Astoria, NY
I'm not sure about the LBJ superteam, but I think there's an excellent chance KD is one and done in Oakland. A lot of the hot-takes on his motives assume otherwise.
I know you probably don't have specific evidence, but can you provide insight on why you think this? To me, it's at most 50/50 one and done, probably more likely he stays.

The scenario where he leaves is where his presence simply doesn't gel with the team - either on-court or off, or both. When not in annihilation-lineup mode, Durant may need to carry a bigger defensive load than he's used to as everyone will attack PG (Steph and Livingston), and "insert Center here" will probably not be as good as he's used to with Adams (though Kanter has sucked, so he's used to this). That said, he'd have faced that without Serge, too. Besides, he's never played with super-elite defenders like Thompson and Green, so it's probably a wash.

Jesus, this team is vicious (barring injury).
 

Three10toLeft

New Member
Oct 2, 2008
1,560
Asheville, NC
I love everybody bashing KD for this move. It's high comedy.

This is a different era of basketball. These guys are competitive, but it's not to the level it was in the 80's/90's. Times have changed, culture has changed. Get over it.

KD has shown how patient and unselfish he is by playing nice with Westbrook as long as he has without killing him. Maybe he figured if he's gonna sacrifice some shots to another guard on the team, he'd prefer one that is, ya know, actually efficient.

I'm a Celtics fan, I was bummed we lost out on KD. But I'm thrilled as a basketball fan to see what this Warriors team will do. It's clear they are building something special that we won't see again. Two of the best shooters of all time on one team, both completely unselfish, just wanting to win. Now playing with one of the best pure scorers of this generation, who hasn't ever played in a properly coached offense.

I don't think KD left for the Warriors just because they're favorites to be back in the Finals again. It was also because of the culture that this franchise has built the past few years. That's more special than anything any other team could have offered him.
 

DJnVa

Dorito Dawg
SoSH Member
Dec 16, 2010
54,150
I love everybody bashing KD for this move. It's high comedy.
By "everybody" you mean "not everybody" right? Because although there have been posters says that this makes them think less of KD there's also been a lot of people saying they don't blame KD at all.
 

E5 Yaz

polka king
Lifetime Member
SoSH Member
Apr 25, 2002
90,639
Oregon
I love everybody thinking everybody thinks the same way about everything
 

jon abbey

Shanghai Warrior
Moderator
SoSH Member
Jul 15, 2005
71,212
The West regular season was great last year when the Warriors played the Spurs. Now both leagues are going to be like the East. The East playoffs were bad last year. Now both leagues are going to be like the East. The finals were great this year. Now they won't be. Just my opinion. I hope I'm wrong.
What? The Warriors totally outclassed the Spurs in the regular season, beating them handily 3 of 4 and losing once without Iguodala and Bogut in SA. The Spurs have added Pau Gasol which should improve them a bit even if Duncan retires. Also, the Finals were only competitive because Green was suspended for game 5 and then Bogut and Iguodala got hurt plus of course Curry was pretty clearly not 100 percent. I strongly disagree that that series was anywhere near "great", most games weren't even competitive one way or the other.

So basically you're pining for something that didn't come close to existing this past season, good luck with that. One or two injuries (and both Curry and Durant have histories) and you're right back where we were this year.
 

gammoseditor

also had a stroke
SoSH Member
Jul 17, 2005
4,233
Somerville, MA
What? The Warriors totally outclassed the Spurs in the regular season, beating them handily 3 of 4 and losing once without Iguodala and Bogut in SA. The Spurs have added Pau Gasol which should improve them a bit even if Duncan retires. Also, the Finals were only competitive because Green was suspended for game 5 and then Bogut and Iguodala got hurt plus of course Curry was pretty clearly not 100 percent. I strongly disagree that that series was anywhere near "great", most games weren't even competitive one way or the other.

So basically you're pining for something that didn't come close to existing this past season, good luck with that. One or two injuries (and both Curry and Durant have histories) and you're right back where we were this year.
Before those games they were exciting games. You weren't excited for those games? Will you be more excited to watch the Spurs and Warriors this year? if so, great. Maybe this is just a matter of opinion. I'm pining for not knowing who is going to be in the finals before the season starts. If you think anyone other than the Cavs and Warriors have a chance, great. I don't. I did last year.

Maybe we should have known last year it was going to be Warriors and Cavs. But if Durant didn't go to the Warriors now it would be an open question. Now it's not.

To your point, the Finals would not have been competitive last year if Curry wasn't hurt and Green wasn't suspended. Well if last year wasn't competitive wait until this year.
 

TheoShmeo

Skrub's sympathy case
Lifetime Member
SoSH Member
Jul 19, 2005
12,890
Boston, NY
By "everybody" you mean "not everybody" right? Because although there have been posters says that this makes them think less of KD there's also been a lot of people saying they don't blame KD at all.
And not to mention that people who are kind of in between. People who well understand the move but, at the same time, are somewhat disappointed by it for the reasons that have already been discussed. Said differently, it's not even that some are pro and some are anti; there's a swath of people who are in the middle-ish zone.

That's where I am. I totally get wanting to play for a potential champion and with a team that plays an incredibly fun brand of basketball. I love that he wasn't driven by the highest dollar. I very well might have made the same choice in his position. And, at the same time, I find going to the team that just beat yours and that is totally stacked to be a little disappointing, and not just from as Celtics fan perspective. I can't totally put my finger on the latter and the former is very clear to me, for whatever that means.

But - and this is in response to the post you were responding to, DrewDawg, not yours -- I guess it's more fun to completely ignore nuance and assume that the position you are poking fun at is THE position.
 

bankshot1

Member
SoSH Member
Feb 12, 2003
24,820
where I was last at
I haven't read the thread, but I imagine this thought has been expressed, but here goes anyway.

KD has earned the right to play and compete with whomever he wants.

But he was so close to beating GS last year (up 3-1 in the WCF) that why wouldn't he want to to re-up for one more year (with the opt-out option) in the hopes he could climb the mountain with OKC.

Maybe Jerry West told him he would have opted out in the 60s, if he had the the choice, and joined the Cs, or maybe with Wilt in SF, rather than wait until '72 to win his ring.
 

Devizier

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 3, 2000
19,593
Somewhere
He values winning the most right now. Once he gets a taste, I think it will be all about the cash with a reasonable chance to win a title again. Unlike with LeBron going CLE->MIA->CLE, he won't be going back to OKC, but he'll head somewhere with a really good shot.
It didn't hurt for Cleveland to have Irving and Wiggins in the fold when Lebron decided to go back there. If they had turned out like, say, the Nets, there's no reunion.
 

jon abbey

Shanghai Warrior
Moderator
SoSH Member
Jul 15, 2005
71,212
But he was so close to beating GS last year (up 3-1 in the WCF) that why wouldn't he want to to re-up for one more year (with the opt-out option) in the hopes he could climb the mountain with OKC.
Because GS wouldn't have the money next summer to pay him, and clearly that's where he wanted to be.
 

crystalline

Member
SoSH Member
Oct 12, 2009
5,771
JP
. Also, the Finals were only competitive because Green was suspended for game 5 and then Bogut and Iguodala got hurt plus of course Curry was pretty clearly not 100 percent.
The Finals were only competitive because the refs totally changed the way contact was called, both inside and out, from game 1 to game 6.

Also Curry's size and the defensive strategy against him mattered. Curry isn't a big guy and every team in the playoffs decided to hit him as hard and as often as possible and his body wore down.

It's still hard for me to spend too much time on the NBA due to the way refereeing style can change the complexion of a game. However I think Durant will help GSW tremendously -- he will take some of the load off Curry next year in the regular season, and GSW will rest Curry to avoid the physical beat down we saw this year.
 

wade boggs chicken dinner

Member
SoSH Member
Mar 26, 2005
30,811
Magic and Kareem played with each other, and had Worthy. Bird had McHale, Jordan had Pippen. I really don't understand what GOAT conversations Durant took himself out of this weekend. If OKC had drafted Curry and signed Green as an FA to get here, no one would be saying the same thing. Who cares how we got here?
Magic and Kareem were different as they weren't really of the same era (same as Duncan and Robinson). But as for McHale and Worthy and Pippen - who knows how good they could have been if they had been on their own team but for history, they are not going to be considered in the same class as Bird, Magic, and Jordan.

Durant could have been talked about in the same level as Bird, Magic, and Jordan had he gone somewhere and been the best player on a team that won multiple championships. Obviously, at this point, he just wants to get one. I understand the reasoning but as I said earlier, there aren't many top-5 players in their prime that would do what Durant did.

I mean can you see Larry deciding to go to the Lakers to play with Magic (or vice-versa) - assuming, for the point of this discussion, that they didn't dislike each other immensely?
 

zenter

indian sweet
SoSH Member
Oct 11, 2005
5,641
Astoria, NY
But he was so close to beating GS last year (up 3-1 in the WCF) that why wouldn't he want to to re-up for one more year (with the opt-out option) in the hopes he could climb the mountain with OKC.
Because GS wouldn't have the money next summer to pay him, and clearly that's where he wanted to be.
Why wouldn't they have the money next year? They could have just resigned Curry using his Bird rights after they made it official with Durant.
Agreed. It's likely not GSW's choice. It's got to be Durant - three possibilities: 1) He wants to get paid next summer, when the cap spikes again. 2) He wanted the opportunity to leave if it is a bad fit. 3) He wasn't sure about leaving OKC and GSW offered an opt-out carrot like a good drug dealer.
 

Auger34

used to be tbb
SoSH Member
Apr 23, 2010
9,621
I don't understand at all this faux-intellectual approach where I'm supposed to be happy about this because there might be an all time great team pulled together (augmenting what was just an all time great team). It really isn't going to be fascinating to watch them take a run at their own record because A) we now know they can do it and B) they just added a gigantic superstar to the team that just did it one season prior.

It's not a sour grapes reaction as a Celtics fan to hate this. They were always a long shot. I just want to watch guys compete. Kevin Durant leading a team against Steph Curry is what I want to see, not Curry and Durant yukking it up on the sidelines in the 4th quarter of a game they're up by 40. This league is at its best when it has a half dozen to a dozen guys all vying to be the top dog. This superteam movement just isn't interesting or fun to me.

If Durant had spent more of his career toiling away in OKC or for some other team trying and failing to get over Steph's Warriors and then had made the choice after he could no longer be the #1 to chase a title like this the reaction would be entirely different. Malone, as an example, was no longer the player he had been at his pinnacle and was never going to get there alone at that point. Those post prime title chases are fine because they almost acknowledge the passing of the mantle that happens in sports. Durant is just too good to give up on fighting Curry and instead join up with them.
I agree with this 100%. To the "KD can go wherever he wants bla bla bla" crowd. Yeah, no shit. Until you mentioned that to me, I was crying next to my cell phone and frantically refreshing my emails because there's no way my good buddy Kevin forgot to consult me before making his final decision.
It's obviously his right to go wherever he wants and he chose to go to Oakland. However, IMO, it's a completely spineless decision and an easy way out for him. He chose the path of least resistance to a title, and agreed to become a 2nd banana to another player WHILE in his prime.

I do think it will be interesting to see how Durant handles being more of a villain and having more scrutiny towards his actions. Up to this point, he's been pretty much Teflon and still found ways to complain about the medias treatment of him. I am thinking that he won't like having a big target on his back.

In the end, Durant got his choice of where to go and made the decision as to what he thinks is the best for him and his family. I can't take that away from him. However, I don't know how one could look at this and not question what he did. He just packed up his bags and went from a team that very well could have been Finals Favorites to a team that just broke the regular season wins record. That seems like a pretty clear cut case of givijg up and joining the winning team
 

DeJesus Built My Hotrod

Well-Known Member
Lifetime Member
SoSH Member
Dec 24, 2002
48,704
Why wouldn't they have the money next year? They could have just resigned Curry using his Bird rights after they made it official with Durant.
Because its not just Curry. They are looking to compete next season too and absent Durant they would have likely brought back Harrison Barnes at a max deal and either resigned Ezeli or his replacement.

This was the window for both Golden State and Durant.
 

CleverLoginName

New Member
Apr 23, 2010
3
I just don't see how these Super teams are good for the modern day NBA. The Warriors don't need Durant to be in the championship picture for multiple years going forward.. Durant going to them is just overkill. He makes an already historic Warrior team that much better than any other team including the Cavs. They'll just outscore the other opponent to the point were any of their potential defensive issues will be negated. How is watching this team blow out other teams by 40 points fun to watch?
 

TheoShmeo

Skrub's sympathy case
Lifetime Member
SoSH Member
Jul 19, 2005
12,890
Boston, NY
I just don't see how these Super teams are good for the modern day NBA. The Warriors don't need Durant to be in the championship picture for multiple years going forward.. Durant going to them is just overkill. He makes an already historic Warrior team that much better than any other team including the Cavs. They'll just outscore the other opponent to the point were any of their potential defensive issues will be negated. How is watching this team blow out other teams by 40 points fun to watch?
From a Warriors perspective, I can't see this being overkill given that they just lost the title. They were arguably missing something against better competition and they got that in Durant. They also made a team that nearly beat them in the western finals substantially weaker, a value by itself.

I can see questioning Durant. But the Warriors? They made the smartest move possible and it's not for them to think about whether it's good for the NBA as a whole. I want my teams to maximize their chances of winning at every step and that's exactly what Golden State did.
 

Three10toLeft

New Member
Oct 2, 2008
1,560
Asheville, NC
By "everybody" you mean "not everybody" right? Because although there have been posters says that this makes them think less of KD there's also been a lot of people saying they don't blame KD at all.
My bad, I honestly skimmed through the responses and reactions the past few pages, and I was also taking in to account how some of my friends reacted when they heard the news. For the most part they were angry, and thought it was a chicken shit move. I should've chosen different words or maybe paid closer attention to the sentiments in this specific thread before I said "everyone".
 

reggiecleveland

sublime
Lifetime Member
SoSH Member
Mar 5, 2004
28,013
Saskatoon Canada
I love everybody bashing KD for this move. It's high comedy.

This is a different era of basketball. These guys are competitive, but it's not to the level it was in the 80's/90's. Times have changed, culture has changed. Get over it.

.
I love how everybody that is in their 20s wants to tell me about the 80s.
 

moly99

Member
SoSH Member
Jun 28, 2007
939
Seattle
I'm a Celtics fan, I was bummed we lost out on KD. But I'm thrilled as a basketball fan to see what this Warriors team will do.
I am sure the vast majority of fans see it the same way. But how many non-Warriors and non-Celtics games will you be interested in watching this year?

I was a skeptic about the Cavs and Heat (and for good reason: it took both of those teams a year to figure things out) and even I believe that the Warriors are a lock to win the title next year barring severe injury to Durant, Curry or Green. Personally I now have absolutely no interest in watching the NBA's product that does not involve the Celtics until the conference finals.

I don't blame Durant for his choice. I blame the idiotic NBA owners and their max contracts that cause star players to form teams of superfriends. But I don't think there's any question that this is bad for every team other than the GSW.
 

Three10toLeft

New Member
Oct 2, 2008
1,560
Asheville, NC
I am sure the vast majority of fans see it the same way. But how many non-Warriors and non-Celtics games will you be interested in watching this year?
I'm probably the wrong person to ask, since I subscribe to League Pass every year. Yeah, I feel like the Warriors are prohibitive favorites to win it, but so were the Heat in '11(?) and we saw what happened in the Finals that year. Nothing is set in stone.

The W's could have trouble getting everything to gel early on. They're going to lose a good deal of their depth, etc.

It's not like the NBA was ever a league of true parity. 4 teams at best start the year as actual championship contenders. Maybe this year it's only 3, with the top team being heavily favored.
 

JimBoSox9

will you be my friend?
SoSH Member
Nov 1, 2005
16,677
Mid-surburbia
Magic and Kareem were different as they weren't really of the same era (same as Duncan and Robinson). But as for McHale and Worthy and Pippen - who knows how good they could have been if they had been on their own team but for history, they are not going to be considered in the same class as Bird, Magic, and Jordan.

Durant could have been talked about in the same level as Bird, Magic, and Jordan had he gone somewhere and been the best player on a team that won multiple championships. Obviously, at this point, he just wants to get one.
That mythical team just wasn't going to happen without an at-least-borderline-HOF #2 and All-Star #3 playing alongside him, period end of story. That's the league now. Go anywhere else, and there was significant risk that it never comes together. It was pretty unlikely he was going to surpass Bird, Magic, Jordan, or LeBron anyways, and playing with Steph Curry isn't going to freeze him out of the top-10 mix along with Russell/Wilt/Kareem/whoever.

I understand the reasoning but as I said earlier, there aren't many top-5 players in their prime that would do what Durant did.
As per the below, I think there haven't be, but there increasingly will be.

I mean can you see Larry deciding to go to the Lakers to play with Magic (or vice-versa) - assuming, for the point of this discussion, that they didn't dislike each other immensely?
No, I definitely can't, but this is where "it's a different era" is relevant and determinative, because there's no denying there's a distinct split between Jordan-and-earlier versus LeBron-and-after in terms of how players view their competition outside of the 48 minutes on the court, mainly due to social media and LeBron himself. I unequivocally think we're better off for it, and should generally be applauding athletes for taking more agency over their destinations and viewing their choices as part of a roster whole and not as a pure revenue play.
 

DanoooME

above replacement level
SoSH Member
Mar 16, 2008
19,924
Henderson, NV
Can you think of a scenario where he wins a title this coming season, then doesn't feel as if the Warriors were his best shot at another title? Because we know they will pay him.
Well, I think there's definitely a scenario where he listens to everyone heaping the bullshit on him (a lot of it in this thread) that he had to join a loaded team to win a title. Then he wants to go out and prove it by winning with a different team, whether that be the Celtics, Spurs, Clippers, or someone else.
 

DeJesus Built My Hotrod

Well-Known Member
Lifetime Member
SoSH Member
Dec 24, 2002
48,704
Just adding an observation made by Sam Amick and Ray Ratto on the local sports radio here in the Bay Area this afternoon. People who try to frame Durant's decision to join the already excellent Warriors versus what stars of old might do (e.g. would Bird ever make the same decision? And I know the answer) ignore how basketball has changed over the past few decades.

Amick points out that the vast majority of youth players come through the AAU system where they end up spending lots of time with one another, forging relationships that serve as the basis for these unions. Furthermore, shared agents, sponsors, business ventures, promotional events and social media draw these guys together in ways that were unheard of just two decades ago.

In short, as long as the individual salary cap exists, you can expect more players trying to team up with their buddies going forward.
 

Three10toLeft

New Member
Oct 2, 2008
1,560
Asheville, NC
Funny enough, I remember Under Armour being a thorn in Nike's side two summers ago when they were aggressively pursuing Durant when he was a sneaker free agent. They were the main reason why KD's Nike contract was so expensive. UA must really be kicking themselves that they weren't able to close that deal.
 

Sportsbstn

Member
SoSH Member
Apr 8, 2004
8,794
This caught my eye more than anything else in the article:

"Durant didn't want to be the leader anymore. The Warriors' "Strength In Numbers" mantra wasn't just a catchphrase. It was what he wanted"