Really hope this isn’t a scenario where he avoids TJ surgery until June or so, then eventually gives in and gets it ruining his 2021 as well
Why is everyone so sure that it’s the team trying to avoid surgery at all costs, and not the guy that is actually getting cut?I assume they are trying to avoid surgery at all costs. And that will result in him finally deciding to have surgery around the all-star break ensuring he misses all of 2021, too.
We tried rest and rehab. It didn’t work.
And as for the criticisms of people playing armchair doctor, nobody gets a 3rd opinion if the first two opinions are “you don’t need surgery.” At least one of the first two is, or both are on the fence.
Uh huh.I wish he would have the surgery and just get it over with already. It should of happened last Sept. Stupid team.
I can think of other folks who I believe need surgery but it doesn't mean that they would agree with meI wish he would have the surgery and just get it over with already. It should of happened last Sept. Stupid team.
He'll be taking up the same "space" on the roster whether he has surgery or not.This is great. He can take up a roster space and THEN get TJ
IANAD, yet even I know it's difficult to perform surgery on someone who may not want surgery because they may not need surgery.For those of you who don't know, radsox is a radiologist and has a pretty good idea about this medical type stuff.
https://www.espn.com/mlb/story/_/id/28842932/red-sox-ace-chris-sale-flexor-strain-throw-weekRed Sox ace Chris Sale has a flexor strain in his pitching arm and will be shut down from throwing for a week.
Red Sox manager Ron Roenicke updated Sale's status Thursday morning, telling reporters that an MRI showed no notable damage to the left-hander's elbow.
Sale underwent an MRI on Tuesday, and the results were examined by Red Sox doctors along with renowned surgeons Dr. James Andrews and Dr. Neal ElAttrache.
Roenicke said that neither Andrews nor ElAttrache recommended surgery for Sale's elbow.
"Doctors have advised him to wait another week before he starts throwing again," Roenicke said. "He'll start playing catch again. If everything is good, we'll progress."
You don't think Andrews and ElAttrache know "this pattern" pretty well too? I'll defer to them - I assume if their diagnosis was "maybe you can get away with not having surgery but in all likelihood you'll need it in the end" Sale would just be getting the surgery now. The fact that he is not strongly suggests that the doctors think there is a good chance that Sale will never need it.I agree with everyone who has said that no one should take surgery lightly, and only do it when it is totally necessary. But, I have a hard time believing it's not going to be necessary in this case. I feel like we've seen this pattern with enough pitchers to know how it's going to end. Definitely not saying anyone should do anything differently here, but if Sale can make 25 starts this year I will be fairly shocked.
2-3 weeks probably won't affect a timeline too much if he gets TJ. I'm OK with this.
Or they want to try this first either way, because with the variance in time on a TJ recovery 2-3 weeks makes no difference, and not getting the surgery saves you an enormous amount of time. Worth it either way.You don't think Andrews and ElAttrache know "this pattern" pretty well too? I'll defer to them - I assume if their diagnosis was "maybe you can get away with not having surgery but in all likelihood you'll need it in the end" Sale would just be getting the surgery now. The fact that he is not strongly suggests that the doctors think there is a good chance that Sale will never need it.
This might be the case but reading between the lines ..."The UCL looks the same as the last image" would imply that the PRP injection did not result in any improvements. Obviously some damage existed at the time of the injection or it would be seen as necessary.Maybe the reason they didn't do Tommy John is because his UCL is fine.
Jason Mastrodonato
@JMastrodonato
Red Sox say flexor strain for Chris Sale. Roenicke: “The UCL looks the same as the last image... doctors have advised him to wait another week before he starts throwing again. He’ll start playing catch again. If everything is good we’ll progress.”
Yeah, pitch the 1st inning every other day.Maybe he’d be used as an opener if no surgery.
Oh yeah, don't get me wrong, I am deferring to the doctors. If they say this is the plan, I am not someone to say otherwise. I guess my internal bias of feeling like these things "always" end in surgery is at play here, but if they don't think he needs it now and can get better with a few weeks of rest, that is a much better outcome.You don't think Andrews and ElAttrache know "this pattern" pretty well too? I'll defer to them - I assume if their diagnosis was "maybe you can get away with not having surgery but in all likelihood you'll need it in the end" Sale would just be getting the surgery now. The fact that he is not strongly suggests that the doctors think there is a good chance that Sale will never need it.
This might be a question for @radsoxfan , but how often does the dye contrast option get done to prove conclusively, either way, the severity of this kind of injury? Is it a special request that has to be made?Flexor strains almost always are the precursor to TJ surgery. I wonder if the normal MRI isn't showing it, like with Severino on the Yankees. Didn't find the problem until it was dye contrasted
In a world of me-first , lack of accountability in athletics Chris Sale is a breath of fresh air.Jesus is Sale tough on himself
View: https://twitter.com/byJulianMack/status/1235624238125469696
“@byJulianMack: Sale: I don’t think I’ve ever let anybody down this hard. Ever. And that sucks, honestly.
@PeteAbe: You didn’t do anything wrong.
Sale: Well, Try telling everybody that. I have an expectation level. That’s never changed and they put faith in me and I messed up
View: https://twitter.com/guerinaustin/status/1235590594879254528
“@guerinaustin: “I don’t think I’ve ever let anybody down this hard..ever… and that sucks.”
“Someone gives you something because they believe in you, they expect something from you and you don’t live up to that.. “
-Sale
#RedSox”
https://www.nbcsports.com/boston/red-sox/devastated-chris-sale-laments-not-living-red-sox-contract-admits-tommy-john-still-table
Don't you mean pitch the 1st inning every other month?Yeah, pitch the 1st inning every other day.
This is an example of why maybe Sox fans shouldn't be in such a rush to assume Sale's elbow is toast. If it were, he'd have had the surgery already. If his UCL were torn, he wouldn't have needed three opinions. But it apparently isn't.I wish he would have the surgery and just get it over with already. It should of happened last Sept. Stupid team.
It's just frustrating that it seems like the worst case scenario in that it's causing him not to be very durable or to pitch full seasons, but it also cannot be fixed. Nobody wants to put their car in the shop for several months but if the alternative is that you can't rely on it ever you'd probably take the six months.This is an example of why maybe Sox fans shouldn't be in such a rush to assume Sale's elbow is toast. If it were, he'd have had the surgery already. If his UCL were torn, he wouldn't have needed three opinions. But it apparently isn't.
And we're sick of him breaking down every single season, including that one, considering he just signed a ridiculous extension and hasn't pitched well in nearly a calendar year, longer if you look at just regular seasons. If we were going to be Pollyannas about every player to win a title, this board would get pretty boring pretty fast. it's a what have you done for me lately business and lately he hasn't done shit.Sick of the negative comments on a guy who has given his all for the Red Sox and was instrumental in the magic season of 2018.
FTFYYou know, it's nice for him to give all those quotes and hold himself accountableand all that but it's starting to feel like a broken record. One can only hear someone lament their misfortunes so long before one starts to resent the sentiment altogetherbut there are times when these things are out of one's control.
Ladies and gents, I give you SoSH's Chris SaleAnd we're sick of him breaking down every single season, including that one, considering he just signed a ridiculous extension and hasn't pitched well in nearly a calendar year, longer if you look at just regular seasons. If we were going to be Pollyannas about every player to win a title, this board would get pretty boring pretty fast. it's a what have you done for me lately business and lately he hasn't done shit.
Welcome to the list.Ladies and gents, I give you SoSH's Chris Sale
Boring > stupid.And we're sick of him breaking down every single season, including that one, considering he just signed a ridiculous extension and hasn't pitched well in nearly a calendar year, longer if you look at just regular seasons. If we were going to be Pollyannas about every player to win a title, this board would get pretty boring pretty fast. it's a what have you done for me lately business and lately he hasn't done shit.
Oh for Christ sake. You really think he's actively trying to get hurt? No, he's just as mystified as the rest of us as to why he keeps having arm problems. He's more pissed off and angry about this than any of us are. And to criticize him for a "ridiculous extension" is ridiculous in of itself. Would you be turning down $145 million from your employer if offered? I'm going to assume no. It's an unfortunate situation that Sale and the Sox are in, but to criticize him for getting hurt is not the way to go about it.And we're sick of him breaking down every single season, including that one, considering he just signed a ridiculous extension and hasn't pitched well in nearly a calendar year, longer if you look at just regular seasons. If we were going to be Pollyannas about every player to win a title, this board would get pretty boring pretty fast. it's a what have you done for me lately business and lately he hasn't done shit.
Can they hire Dombrowski again just to fire him again?
I'm very appreciative for the title, but the dude did pretty much exactly what people predicted (leaving the team worse off than when he inherited it) AND gave out one of the worst contracts in franchise history in the process, one that has already crippled this team for 2020 and cost them, at least in part, the best player they've had since who knows when, a guy who may not come back until his prime is gone, if ever.
They should have just made him the closer, because he can't pitch 6 innings consistently anymore. His delivery sucks, he's too thin, and every other guy who has ever had that combination has broken down around the same age or so. I cannot believe this franchise was so stupid.
Until he shows he can pitch well, consistently, and can even be 80% of what he was, it is, by far, the worst contract ever handed out. It's the inverse of the Ruth sale.
I don't even think it's close as it stands right now. Fortunately, or unfortunately, we have several more years to see if he can pull the nose up or if his pitching career winds up the same as that dude who built his own steam-powered rocket: sky high for a moment in time, then a quick descent and abrupt ending.
Are we already writing off Plawecki?
This might be a question for @radsoxfan , but how often does the dye contrast option get done to prove conclusively, either way, the severity of this kind of injury? Is it a special request that has to be made?
You know, it's nice for him to give all those quotes and hold himself accountable and all that but it's starting to feel like a broken record. One can only hear someone lament their misfortunes so long before one starts to resent the sentiment altogether.
Speaking strictly for myself, it's not any individual post that drew my response, but the near total of your work here in this thread. Outside of the Plawecki and MRI questionsAnd we're sick of him breaking down every single season, including that one, considering he just signed a ridiculous extension and hasn't pitched well in nearly a calendar year, longer if you look at just regular seasons. If we were going to be Pollyannas about every player to win a title, this board would get pretty boring pretty fast. it's a what have you done for me lately business and lately he hasn't done shit.
Seconded. Just about the worst kind of reactionary garbage.Speaking strictly for myself, it's not any individual post that drew my response, but the near total of your work here in this thread. Outside of the Plawecki and MRI questions
the rest was over the top, reactionary, fan boy, game thread slop. We all have those type posts at times, but IMO the bulk of your posts in this thread were shit.