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2018 Cowboys: Turning over the same leaf

Discussion in 'Blinded by the Lombardis: Patriots Forum' started by Bosoxen, Jan 23, 2018.

  1. Oil Can Dan

    Oil Can Dan Well-Known Member Lifetime Member SoSH Member

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    Also don't forget 1.5 years of Cooper vs .5 of Tate.
     
  2. Bosoxen

    Bosoxen Bounced back Lifetime Member SoSH Member

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    It's important to remember that there is a large overlap between Cowboys fans and Rangers fans. In addition to being among the worst in their respective sports, Rangers fans are still waiting for Nelson Cruz to catch the ball, so the World Series is a bit of a trigger for them.

    Personally, my reaction was more along the lines of, "Yuck, get him off my screen," not so much, "What is HE doing there?!" Whatever, it was the end of their bye week. I have no problem with it.

    Also, why are you watching that show? That shit will rot your brain!
     
  3. soxhop411

    soxhop411 Member SoSH Member

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    So....

    When does Jerry fire the entire coaching staff?
     
  4. Greg29fan

    Greg29fan Member SoSH Member

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    That draft pick they traded might end up in the top five, which pushes it into another class of stupid.
     
  5. jmm57

    jmm57 Member SoSH Member

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    Especially when it looks like you probably need that pick to get a QB.
     
  6. Oil Can Dan

    Oil Can Dan Well-Known Member Lifetime Member SoSH Member

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    If the season ended today Dallas would draft #10 overall. Seems like top 5 isn’t in the cards.
     
  7. pappymojo

    pappymojo Member SoSH Member

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    They might not break top 5 but they can certainly drop lower than the 10th pick.

    Teams that are 3-5: Jaguars, Colts, Cowboys, Lions, Buccaneers

    Teams that are 3-6: Jets, Broncos

    Teams with worse records: Bills, Browns, Raiders, Giants, Cardinals, 49ers

    There are a lot of bad teams in the NFL.
     
  8. budcrew08

    budcrew08 Member SoSH Member

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    So the team sucks but not enough to make a difference and if they did, they wouldn’t benefit anyway. Fuck
     
  9. BigSoxFan

    BigSoxFan Member SoSH Member

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    At least they have a lot of cap space this offseason to make the necessary changes. Oh, wait...
     
  10. Bosoxen

    Bosoxen Bounced back Lifetime Member SoSH Member

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    I'm 100% in favor of getting rid of Garrett and the entire coaching staff (I'd like to keep Kris Richard but if the baby has to go out with the bath water, so be it). Of course, there's still the problem of the person doing the replacing. I'm going to go out on a limb and say no one here thinks they won't just bring in another puppet head coach.

    It's almost like the reason nothing changes is because the same guy has been running the show for over 20 years.
     
  11. Greg29fan

    Greg29fan Member SoSH Member

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    The old man is still talking about giving Dak his contract extension this morning, so after that it'll be The Clapper.

    Like I said in the game thread last night, some convenient boogeyman will be scapegoated and the gang will all be back in 2019.
     
  12. Bosoxen

    Bosoxen Bounced back Lifetime Member SoSH Member

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    They already have that: WR and offensive line coach. Never mind that those were self-inflicted wounds. Jerry can't fail, he can only be failed.
     
  13. The Process

    The Process lurker

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  14. Bosoxen

    Bosoxen Bounced back Lifetime Member SoSH Member

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    That's the problem. He does know he's the issue but he doesn't care. He's already said if anyone else were the GM, he'd have fired him years ago. Translation: Tough shit, I'm running this until I die.
     
  15. Greg29fan

    Greg29fan Member SoSH Member

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    I hated the Vander Esch pick - I was very wrong. Guy is a stud.
     
    #215 Greg29fan, Nov 18, 2018
    Last edited: Nov 18, 2018
  16. BigSoxFan

    BigSoxFan Member SoSH Member

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    With Smith going down for the season, Cowboys have a great shot to win their division. No excuse to lose a home game to a backup QB.
     
  17. Tangled Up In Red

    Tangled Up In Red Well-Known Member Lifetime Member SoSH Member

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    Strong typo for wrong, I assume?
    As a Boise fan, love seeing LVE succeed (and DeMarcus and Crawford and next season, Ced Wilson...)
     
  18. Greg29fan

    Greg29fan Member SoSH Member

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    Yes, I meant wrong LOL.
     
  19. Bosoxen

    Bosoxen Bounced back Lifetime Member SoSH Member

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    Jesus, this post gave me a heart attack. As I first started reading it, I thought you meant Tyron Smith. Then I read the rest of the post.

    As for the latter part of it, never underestimate their ability to make backup QBs look like Steve Young. Yes, I chose that specific name because they always seem to allow backups to run all over the place in addition to ripping them to shreds through the air. Colt McCoy is no stranger to this phenomenon.
     
  20. Oil Can Dan

    Oil Can Dan Well-Known Member Lifetime Member SoSH Member

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    So assuming the Boys take care of business on Thursday they'll be in 1st place in the division. All back aboard the Dak train? The Garrett train?
     
  21. Bosoxen

    Bosoxen Bounced back Lifetime Member SoSH Member

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    Speaking for me: no and no. Prescott is still inaccurate and timid. He has internal clock issues and refuses to step up into the pocket, always electing to roll out - often into pressure and resulting in unnecessary sacks. Garrett continues to be plagued by clock management issues (though he was bailed out by Quinn inexplicably using a timeout during the final drive) and appears to be in denial over the fact that Maher is having kicking issues. I thought playing for the long FG at the end was a mistake and they were lucky to get out of there without having to go to overtime. Also, his reaction to the monumentally stupid penalty by Lance Lenoir was completely galling. I'm not saying he has to dress him down right there but that almost felt like he was ok with what happened. Oh and he sucks at replay challenges.

    Anything short of an appearance in the NFC Championship game should result in Garrett and Linehan being shown the door and the admission that the search for a franchise QB should begin anew. But that is not the world we live in and the only way we'll be rid of that trio would be a complete implosion down the stretch.

    Edit: To be more fair, they could potentially win the division at 8-8. That's not exactly a ringing endorsement for Garrett, since an 8-8 coach is pretty much what he is.
     
    #221 Bosoxen, Nov 19, 2018
    Last edited: Nov 19, 2018
  22. Greg29fan

    Greg29fan Member SoSH Member

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    McCoy is 2-0 against Dallas and played extremely well in their win @ Cowboys Stadium in '14, so this seems like ludicrously, dangerously premature talk. I like Alex Smith more than a lot of people but I don't think it's a massive downgrade given McCoy's familiarity with Gruden's system.
     
  23. The Process

    The Process lurker

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    I'm afraid this is exactly what will happen. Home games really don't mean that much in this rivalry that I remember.

    No and no for me too. I don't see any reason to keep the band together. Up and down seasons aren't what this franchise should be about. JJ has already committed to Dak, hopefully at least Garrett goes. Who the hell knows tho? We all know who the biggest problem our team has and he won't fire himself, so i'm not all that sure it would matter anyway.
     
  24. maufman

    maufman Anderson Cooper x Mr. Rogers Staff Member Dope Gold Supporter

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    Dak has bought himself another year. Which is fine — unless you think Joe Flacco is set to enjoy a renaissance season at age 34, the alternatives for a team with no first-round pick won’t be attractive.

    It’s probably more discouraging for Cowboys’ fans that Garrett has likely bought himself another year — but again, what are the alternatives? The likes of John Harbaugh, or even Josh McDaniels, aren’t going to sign up to coach for Jerrah. The best option might be to give Garrett another year anyway, then blow up the whole thing after next year (let Dak walk, trade Zeke, bring in a new coach and let him choose his QB).
     
  25. Greg29fan

    Greg29fan Member SoSH Member

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    Here's the thing about Jason - is he bad? Undoubtedly yes, but I don't find him overly worse than most coaches out there. My biggest issue with the coaching staff was, is, and will continue to be the offensive coordinator.

    I mean supposedly Sean Payton is one of the best in the league, but he had a complete abomination of a game last night, running out of challenges in the first half and calling a bad timeout that ultimately helped Dallas seal the game.
     
  26. tims4wins

    tims4wins PN23's replacement SoSH Member

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    I agree with this. There are some difference making coaches, maybe like 5-7 of them, then a whole bunch of mediocrity, then a few absolutely shitty ones. Garrett is somewhere in the middle, not all that different from a Mike McCarthy or a Tomlin or whatever.
     
  27. Super Nomario

    Super Nomario Member SoSH Member

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    I don't disagree with your main point - Garrett is OKish - but blaming the OC is weird. Garrett outranks the OC. If he doesn't like the game plan during the week, he can tell Linehan to change it. If he doesn't like the way certain players are developing on offense, he can work with them personally. If he doesn't like the calls on game day, he can overrule them. And the O is his side of the ball; it might be different if we were talking about the defense. But we can assume that the way the O is running is a reflection of how Garrett wants it run.
     
  28. TFisNEXT

    TFisNEXT Well-Known Member Lifetime Member SoSH Member

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    I agree with the sentiment that Garrett is middle of the pack. He's had his ups and downs. His career record is 74-58....is the natural sentiment that the Cowboys had a lot more talent on the roster than that record? Some of those 8-8 teams in the 2011-2013 period were pretty brutal....not that I really give a ton of credit to Garrett for it. Tony Romo probably should get most of the credit for dragging some of those awful rosters to 8-8. But I don't think the team has underachieved on the whole since he got here based on the roster he is dealt. The 2014 and 2016 teams could have gone further of course, but their divisional round losses to a good Packers team weren't exactly choke jobs...they were razor close games.

    The biggest issue with the Cowboys was wasting most of Romo's prime with a bad supporting cast and now wasting some of the cheap Dak/Zeke years with no other offensive talent and that is not on Garrett. They do have Cooper now, but they paid out of the nose for him and he's only here through 2019.

    I've never really seen the Cowboys quit under Garrett and that's something that can't be said for all head coaches. His players fight for him and that's worth something. Given Jerrah is still around for a while, I'd take my chances with Garrett over anyone else he is going to hire who is actually willing to work for him....I don't see another Parcells coming to Dallas anytime soon.
     
  29. TFisNEXT

    TFisNEXT Well-Known Member Lifetime Member SoSH Member

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    Gotta give Dak some props after killing him in the game thread. He deserved to be killed for those misses/turnovers. But he kept punching back and overcame the adversity. Threw for 455 and 3 TDs.

    Also, Garrett going for it on 4th down in overtime instead of kicking the FG paid off. Still not sure I would have done that but at least he's being aggressive again in recent games.
     
  30. Bosoxen

    Bosoxen Bounced back Lifetime Member SoSH Member

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    I'll say this for the guy, there is no quit in him. Lesser mortals would have thrown in the towel after that second interception. But for fuck's sake can someone on the coaching staff teach him the finer points of being an NFL quarterback? The first interception was a lazy pass which maybe, possibly have been an easy TD had he not stared at the receiver the whole way. The fumble was just more of the same of him flailing the ball away from his body while in the pocket. The second interception was probably his worst throw of the day, from which there were many to choose. Finally, the game winning TD could just as easily have been a game winning TD the other way. A non-spare corner breaks on that ball and probably ends the game in the most Cowboys way possible.

    The inaccuracy is one thing but the carelessness is fucking grating. You can get away with one or the other on occasion but having both in the same game is generally a recipe for disaster. I know it's easy to shit on the defense for their performance in the 4th quarter but they don't win that game without their second consecutive opening half shutout. A win is a win and they're now set up nicely to win the division but God damn if this team doesn't shave years off my life every damn week.

    With all that said, I'd like to give a special shout out dumb shit Jourdan Lewis for fumbling the opening kickoff (I don't know how they didn't give Philly the ball there). If that didn't set the tone for the Keystone Cops routine the game ended up being, I don't know what did.
     
  31. Oil Can Dan

    Oil Can Dan Well-Known Member Lifetime Member SoSH Member

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    Congrats on the win and the division. I will never, ever understand how they decided that was Cowboys ball on the opening kickoff, or how that was OPI on Goedart.
     
  32. 21st Century Sox

    21st Century Sox Member SoSH Member

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    I don't know if I can give him much credit. I appreciate his tenacity to still try and throw the ball downfield, but he is the sole reason this game was not a blowout. He is just so damn inaccurate. Never mind the multiple misses, one or two that would have been walk in TD's. Never mind the pick in the end zone on the underthrow. There are so many completions with him where the receiver has to hesitate/break stride, or lunge to just make the grab, that RAC yards are severely limited. If Dallas lost last night, it was 100% Dak. I have been a lifelong fan, and see the potential to go deep with such a stout defense, but I think Dak will be the undoing.

    I agree with you on Garrett. I 100% wanted to kick the FG there. The only time you don't is if you don't believe your defense can stop the other team. Not the case here, despite tiring late. But....it worked out...
     
  33. TFisNEXT

    TFisNEXT Well-Known Member Lifetime Member SoSH Member

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    One "good" thing about Dak's deficiencies is that most of them are coachable...I.E protect the fucking ball with two hands when you step up in the pocket and the footwork on some of his throws.

    The less coachable things he seems to do pretty well on...like his reading the defense and his above average ability to face down adversity, not get too down on himself, and fight to the end. He is finding the open guys and he's taking the shots down the field a lot more now. That's a good thing and I do think it points at least partially to the lack of WR talent prior to the Cooper trade. Gallup is also showing significant improvement from early season which definitely helps.

    Improve the footwork a little and we will see him connect on some of those including both picks (that airmail to Gallup was really egregious).

    I know you have generally been a big thumbs down on Dak, but I do think he can be a top 10-12 QB or so with a little more coaching. He's 25 so we've probably not seen his best yet. He's never going to be an Aaron Rodgers or a Tom Brady but very few are. This team doesn't need one to win though. Their identity is the Oline, Zeke, and the defense which is rapidly budding into a top unit.

    That said, I wouldn't quite trust Dak yet in 2018 and without Travis Frederick, I think these guys are still a little short for a good playoff run. 2019 might be their chance though if things break right.
     
  34. Bosoxen

    Bosoxen Bounced back Lifetime Member SoSH Member

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    I'm with you on the fumble. That 100% should have been Philly ball. There was absolutely clear recovery on the replay - in fact, I was cursing up a storm over the fact that Grugier-Hill, of all people, was the one who recovered the damn thing. I was still cursing Lewis for the decision to even take the ball out of the end zone when they gave the replay decision. I was aghast. The OPI was a little less clear. There was definitely a push off but I think the most jarring thing there is that it's never called - not unlike the lowering the helmet penalty on Elliott. Both of those plays are technically penalties but neither is rarely, if ever, called.
    I agree. Hence my exasperation that it doesn't appear to be improving. Either the coaching staff is oblivious to these flaws or the coaching he's receiving isn't what or where it needs to be. I suppose it's also possible he's just not coachable but I'm not prepared to launch that accusation at him. Nothing I've seen would seem to even remotely suggest that's the case.
    We can throw Zach Martin on that list too. The word today is that the injury is not "serious" but they're certainly not ruling out the possibility of him missing some time. And then there's the clearly diminished Tyron Smith, he of the knee brace on his elbow fame. This team is just not set up to do much this year and I laughed when Buck/Aikman started talking about them potentially being elite. All they're doing is leading one of the worst divisions in football and, outside of the Saints, they haven't exactly defeated a murderer's row of opponents in the current win streak.

    With the way they play and every game is one bad break away from disaster, they're a prime one-and-done candidate. Unless I'm reading the standings wrong, if the playoffs were to start this week, they'd get the Seahawks. That's certainly a winnable game but I sure as hell wouldn't put money on it.
     
  35. BigSoxFan

    BigSoxFan Member SoSH Member

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    Barring something crazy, the winner of tonight's Seahawks/Vikings game is the Cowboys' likely WC opponent. Tough to say who the Cowboys would rather face. I'd probably want to take my chances against Cousins vs. Wilson even though I think Minnesota has the more-talented team.
     
  36. Greg29fan

    Greg29fan Member SoSH Member

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    This team does have a resilience to it like most Garrett teams have had, but it's mainly I think they're eventually winning close games that should have been blowouts due to the QB play and mistakes.

    I'm also here to eat crow on the Cooper trade. What he's done and where that pick is going to end up, I think it worked out very well.
     
  37. BigSoxFan

    BigSoxFan Member SoSH Member

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    I think you can comfortably argue that this one trade basically won the division for the Cowboys given his performance against the Redskins and Eagles. They're not world beaters even with Cooper but this is a team that shouldn't be overlooked come playoff time. I think they'll beat whoever they play in the WC round and give New Orleans/LAR a tough game in the Divisional Round.
     
  38. johnmd20

    johnmd20 literally like ebola Lifetime Member Gold Supporter SoSH Member

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    I think Dallas is primed to make the playoffs and then lose a heartbreaker, because that is what they do. But the team is rounding into form, they dominated that game yesterday and it should never have sniffed overtime.

    It is hard to argue that Cooper trade wasn't anything but a massive success. He's completely turned the entire team around with his presence and his play. He's won two games almost by himself and is carrying them to the playoffs.
     
  39. Bosoxen

    Bosoxen Bounced back Lifetime Member SoSH Member

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    Cooper is the first player in NFL history to have three go-ahead/game-winning TD receptions in the 4th quarter/OT. As meaningless as that stat is, it's still insane to think he was basically their entire offense from the 4th quarter on.

    I've also done a complete 180 on that trade. He's been completely worth it and is likely miles better than anything they could have gotten with that pick.
     
  40. TFisNEXT

    TFisNEXT Well-Known Member Lifetime Member SoSH Member

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    Wilson has pretty awful numbers against Dallas so I wouldn't mind Seattle either. Then again, they've had their way with Cousins for the most part back from his Redskins days but I really don't want to watch the Cowboys' offense against Minnesota's defense. Despite the struggle up in Seattle this year, I think the offense would move it pretty easily against the Seahawks' diminished defense.

    Either way, I think the Cowboys would be favored against both of them. But I'm with bosoxen in that I certainly wouldn't put my money on it.
     
  41. TFisNEXT

    TFisNEXT Well-Known Member Lifetime Member SoSH Member

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    MRI on Martin's knee was negative. So that's good news. Might play against Indy. They'll need him to be on the field if they want to go anywhere...even if he's only at 80-90%. He's that good.
     
  42. DanoooME

    DanoooME Well-Known Member Gold Supporter SoSH Member

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    How'd that work out week 3?
     
  43. TFisNEXT

    TFisNEXT Well-Known Member Lifetime Member SoSH Member

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    Pretty sure I already mentioned they struggled in Seattle early in the year in the post you actually quoted.

    Regardless, different offense back then sans Cooper...and they still rushed for 166 yards. I'm pretty confident they would move it well against them in a rematch in Dallas. I would just worry about the turnovers. Seattle is still pretty good in that department.
     
  44. Greg29fan

    Greg29fan Member SoSH Member

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    Yeah I'm not looking forward to playing Seattle - outside of 2014 they have pretty much run roughshod over the Cowboys for a while now and they seem built to win a 20-14 rock fight forcing three or four turnovers.

    Edit-And it's also impossible to root for moving up to the 3 seed with the specter of having to play Aaron Rodgers in the 3/6 game still a possibility.
     
    #244 Greg29fan, Dec 10, 2018
    Last edited: Dec 10, 2018
  45. Greg29fan

    Greg29fan Member SoSH Member

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    A humiliating, embarrassing, pathetic performance by a team that had obviously been reading the press clippings about them.

    Enjoy hearing for the next week about what a bunch of chokers you are.
     
  46. budcrew08

    budcrew08 Member SoSH Member

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    They had three decent scoring chances that I saw, the blocked FG and two fourth-and-shorts. So while 23-0 looks brutal, maybe it’s a little closer upon further inspection.

    Need to go back home and get back to basics, beating Tampa’s ass.
     
  47. Bosoxen

    Bosoxen Bounced back Lifetime Member SoSH Member

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    Except that it wasn't. They got their asses beat up and down the field, all day long. Sure, they moved the ball a little bit but that was because Elliott was the one player on the roster who came to play. Everyone else was dog shit of various degrees of sogginess. I don't feel like I need to list all the ways in which they were dreadful but I can if you need a refresher.

    Honestly, if you think the score would have remained 23-17 even if the Cowboys had miraculously converted on all three of those possessions you listed (though I'm being kind giving you the blocked field goal), you didn't watch the same game I did.
    Yup. And now, with Philly beating the Rams on the road with their mediocre-backup-QB-turned-Christlike-savior, the pressure is squarely on the wounded Cowboys. Sure, their next two games are winnable but I would not be the least bit surprised to see them choke away the division. Would be the most Cowboys thing ever to complete the sweep of their division rival on a fluke play and then lose all of their remaining games to lose the division to that very rival. I would actually be pulling for that if there were any hope that would cause Garrett to be shown the door. But I know that would be extremely unlikely, even in that nightmare scenario. So, hey, let's do this again exactly the same way next year! It has worked so well the last 22 years.
     
  48. BigSoxFan

    BigSoxFan Member SoSH Member

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    You guys get Tampa at home next week. I understand the PTSD of the past 2+ decades but Cowboys will wax these guys and then get to rest up in Week 17. Cowboys seem to suffer the same issues as the Pats in that they're really good at home and piss poor on the road.
     
  49. Bosoxen

    Bosoxen Bounced back Lifetime Member SoSH Member

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    The Cowboys have a 43-36 record at the Death Star. I wouldn't call that "really good". That's barely passable for a team that has had championship aspirations in nearly 1/3 of the years of its existence. I daresay it's very Garrett-like.
     
  50. BigSoxFan

    BigSoxFan Member SoSH Member

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    Sorry, I was referring to this season where the team is 6-1 at home and 2-5 on the road, which is a similar split that the Patriots are dealing with. Cowboys average 10PPG more at home than on the road (24.7 vs. 14.7). That's a pretty decent spread but I admittedly haven't compared it across the league.
     

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