Jurassic World 3: Where the Dinosaurs have Quad Injuries and Hate Their Shoe Deals

the moops said:

Taurean Prince is already 23 years old. Two years older than Sabonis and Kennard. Three years older than Ball, Ingram, and Adebayo. No chance anyone chooses him over Ball or Ingram.

I can maybe squint and see liking Sabonis and/or Adebayo over Ball, but even then, I think you gotta go with the wing in Ingram over the centers.

And just not seeing it in Kennard. He is a fine player and will be in the league for years providing some value, but he probably is who he is.

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Yeah, I definitely overstated the case with the inclusion of guys like Kennard and Prince. I just wanted to push back a bit on the idea that the Lakers are choc full of young blue-chippers while the Clips are totally bereft of them. I think #12-13 have a ton of value, and I'd assume Montrezl Harrell and Tobias Harris are fairly positive assets as well. I do like Ingram (marginally) the best of all the assets on both teams — he's still super-young and showed some beastly flashes last season — but the fact that he's burned up two of his cheap years relative to this year's #12-13 is not immaterial.

And as long as we're living with Ingram getting pricy when he hits his peak (even his second remaining "cheap" season is $7.2M) ... is his peak level that much higher than the current level of Tobias Harris, who's 25 years old, 6'-9", put up 20 pts / 6 reb / 3 ast per 36 last year, and has shot over 41% from 3 for two straight seasons?

Sam Ray Not said:

Yeah, I definitely overstated the case with the inclusion of guys like Kennard and Prince. I just wanted to push back a bit on the idea that the Lakers are choc full of young blue-chippers while the Clips are totally bereft of them. I think #12-13 have a ton of value, and I'd assume Montrezl Harrell and Tobias Harris are fairly positive assets as well. I do like Ingram (marginally) the best of all the assets on both teams — he's still super-young and showed some beastly flashes last season — but the fact that he's burned up two of his cheap years relative to this year's #12-13 is not immaterial.

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I think people are forgetting the fact that the inhumanly talented high school class of 2017 means that a lot of guys that are normally mid lottery picks are going to slip into the middle of the round, and there are a lot of real wildcard players that are going to be there in the 9-18 range (given that the Spurs already have #18).

Sophomores like Miles Bridges and Robert Williams. Upperclassman like Mikal Bridges, Jerome Robinson, and Aaron Holiday. Super-high upside freshman that usually get drafted higher like Colin Sexton, Zhaire Smith, Kevin Knox, Mitchell Robinson (could be the next Clint Capela, but could just as easily be the next JaVale McGee) and Lonnie Walker (again, not a fan, but I have a friend that watches more Miami ball than anyone in their right mind should that swears that he's going to be the next Donovan Mitchell and the scouts seem intrigued by his upside).

Then you get into guys that might not have that possible superstardom next to their name, but can be projected out to legit starting talent guys, like Shai Gilgeous-Alexander or Troy Brown. So the Spurs would have a lot of options with three picks in that range, and adding Tobias Harris to that roster ensures that whoever they added would develop in a winning environment. So it's a much better deal than people are imagining.

nighthob said:

I think people are forgetting the fact that the inhumanly talented high school class of 2017 means that a lot of guys that are normally mid lottery picks are going to slip into the middle of the round, and there are a lot of real wildcard players that are going to be there in the 9-18 range (given that the Spurs already have #18).

Sophomores like Miles Bridges and Robert Williams. Upperclassman like Mikal Bridges, Jerome Robinson, and Aaron Holiday. Super-high upside freshman that usually get drafted higher like Colin Sexton, Zhaire Smith, Kevin Knox, Mitchell Robinson (could be the next Clint Capela, but could just as easily be the next JaVale McGee) and Lonnie Walker (again, not a fan, but I have a friend that watches more Miami ball than anyone in their right mind should that swears that he's going to be the next Donovan Mitchell and the scouts seem intrigued by his upside).

Then you get into guys that might not have that possible superstardom next to their name, but can be projected out to legit starting talent guys, like Shai Gilgeous-Alexander or Troy Brown. So the Spurs would have a lot of options with three picks in that range, and adding Tobias Harris to that roster ensures that whoever they added would develop in a winning environment. So it's a much better deal than people are imagining.

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Would you trade Lebron for a middle first round pick? Harden? Curry?

The Spurs aren't looking at him as an injury prone malcontent. They view him as a top 5 player in the league. They wont get that kind of return - you never do when top talent forces their way out - but accepting a mid-first rounder to pick up a flyer prospect isn't a consideration. They'll have to readjust based on market, but they're better waiting for the trade deadline if they can only snag a bid first round pick.

Kenny F'ing Powers said:

Would you trade Lebron for a middle first round pick? Harden? Curry?

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If I were the Cavaliers and I could trade my about-to-leave superstar for Tobias Harris and two late lottery picks this year I'd do it in a cocaine heartbeat.

Kenny F'ing Powers said:

The Spurs aren't looking at him as an injury prone malcontent. They view him as a top 5 player in the league. They wont get that kind of return - you never do when top talent forces their way out - but accepting a mid-first rounder to pick up a flyer prospect isn't a consideration. They'll have to readjust based on market, but they're better waiting for the trade deadline if they can only snag a bid first round pick.

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The Clippers have picks 12 and 13, which is what Sam Ray Not was discussing, Tobias Harris and two lottery picks (plus whatever else was needed to make the deal work). In any normal year you might make the gamble that maybe someone will cough up more at the trade deadline, but the odds of someone coughing up more for a pure rental are usually bad to begin with. In this case the odds of getting a legit starter and two lottery picks for someone bound to go home to LA would be non-existant.

Now if the Lakers were coughing up Ball/Ingram/Hart for Leonard, that would be one thing (I know the Spurs say they don't want Ball, but there are probably lots of teams that would like him that he could be immediately dealt to, like the Knicks, for example), but we already saw this exact scenario last summer and the Lakers refused to part with anything for Paul George. And the Spurs probably really do have a "Fuck the Lakers" mentality.

Ed Hillel said:

If the Celtics get Kawhi, the far more likely scenario has to be LeBron coming to Boston, right? I’d be more than fine letting Brown, Smart, salary filler, draft picks, and one of Kyrie/Al go to get those two guys on board. I’d want at least two years from LeBron, though. And without LeBron coming, I’m not giving up Brown for Kawhi.

Tatum/Hayward/Al/LeBron/Kawhi

My goodness.

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This is virtually impossible. To acquire both Lebron and Kawhi, the Celtics would need about $45 million in tradeable salary (probably more because that number assumes perfect proportionality on each trade). Excluding the players you list, they have the following tradeable contracts:

Morris ($5.4M)
Irving ($20.1M)
Brown ($5.2M)
Yabusele ($2.7M)
Rozier ($3.1M)
Ojeleye ($1.4M)
Nader ($1.4M)
Theis ($1.4M)

That's a total of $40.7 million, or not enough. Now, it is possible that could convince Smart to agree to a sign and trade, which adds $6M (his outgoing value is his QO level). They could also possibly convince Monroe or Baynes to agree to a sign and trade, which would also add about $6M/player.

You probably need two of those 3 three to agree to sign and trades to make the pieces work from a salary perspective, which seems unlikely.

Then you need to actually make the trades work. (Note: you could do this with Horford going to Cleveland, but I don't think Cleveland would necessarily agree to that as I'm not sure that Horford has a ton of trade value and he's a bad fit in Cleveland that would cost them a fortune.)

Realistically, we're not acquiring either of Lebron or Kawhi, but we're more or less certainly not acquiring both.

JakeRae said:

Realistically, we're not acquiring either of Lebron or Kawhi, but we're more or less certainly not acquiring both.

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I'd say acquiring Kawhi is very realistic. He's asked for a trade, and every observer lists up as one of the top 2 or 3 destinations.

moondog80 said:

I'd say acquiring Kawhi is very realistic. He's asked for a trade, and every observer lists up as one of the top 2 or 3 destinations.

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The problem with Kawhi for the most rumored package is the cap apocalypse that the Celtics might endure

Are there any reliable estimates of where the cap will be in 2 years? Googling turns up a ton of different guesses, but I have no sense of who (if anyone) has real insight. If it were, say, 120m, that changes the math quite a bit, though that doesn't seem likely from the more recent estimates I've come across.

The gambling revenues have thrown a spanner into the works, no one has any idea what sort of impact this is going to have on BRI.

finnVT said:

Are there any reliable estimates of where the cap will be in 2 years? Googling turns up a ton of different guesses, but I have no sense of who (if anyone) has real insight. If it were, say, 120m, that changes the math quite a bit, though that doesn't seem likely from the more recent estimates I've come across.

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Bobby Marks is usually good on the cap and he's been using an estimate of $108MM for 2019-2020.

jhp64 said:

Okay, let's kill two birds with one stone. How about the Cavs do a sign and trade: Lebron for Kawhi + Patty Mills? Spurs are happy, Pop is vindictively happy, Cleveland gets Kawhi (at the price of Mills) for a departing Lebron. Lebron joins a playoff team with a real coach.

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The Cavs can't trade LeBron. He is a FA and will name his destination. That landing spot certainly isn't going to be San Antonio with Gasol, Parker and Ginobili.

Why would Danny give up real assets for a disgruntled, injured athlete who is going to be a free agent in one year? Is it the hope of sweet-talking him into staying here? I'd be thrilled to get him if I thought that there was a chance that he'd be here for more than a year, but for one year? No thanks.

Koufax said:

Why would Danny give up real assets for a disgruntled, injured athlete who is going to be a free agent in one year? Is it the hope of sweet-talking him into staying here? I'd be thrilled to get him if I thought that there was a chance that he'd be here for more than a year, but for one year? No thanks.

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For starters, Kawhi Leonard is a top 5 player and literally the best LeBron/Durant defender out there when healthy. In his last healthy season, he was a legit MVP player. Last year was a bad year but if you're not overly concerned with his health or demeanor going forward (note: I am), you'll never have a better chance to acquire a player of his caliber. And he'll only be 27 in a few days so you're getting prime years. He is almost a perfect wing in the Stevens system. He can defend multiple positions, create his own offense, is a very good FT shooter, and shoots 3's in the 38-40% range. In the same vein as Kyrie, I think Kawhi has been gone for so long that we kind of forget just how good he is.

Now, for a team like the Celtics, there are a host of complications. For one, he would either require us to trade Kyrie or Jaylen Brown. That's a big risk if you assume that Kyrie wants to stick around since there's no guarantee Kawhi signs a long-term deal. Secondly, there are injury and makeup concerns due to last year's debacle. I'm not as scared about the latter but the quad injury is scary and isn't going away. The question is how well can it be managed going forward. Finally, the financial considerations are very real if Jaylen plus filler is going out and not Kyrie. If the latter happens, you're basically committing to losing either Kyrie or Kawhi next offseason.

All in all, I think Ainge will absolutely investigate but the potential downside for a team that is already going to be damn good may scare him off. I think he is going to remain involved until the end but will ultimately pass.

Everything you said about Kawhi's level of play is true. If Danny could extend him now, there's almost no price too high to pay. But since he can't, I think he will offer up a pu-pu platter that does not include Kyrie, Brown or Tatum; but will certainly include draft picks and anyone named Marcus. He will get outbid, shrug his shoulders, and make do with the core talent that he has now.

Koufax said:

Everything you said about Kawhi's level of play is true. If Danny could extend him now, there's almost no price too high to pay. But since he can't, I think he will offer up a pu-pu platter that does not include Kyrie, Brown or Tatum; but will certainly include draft picks and anyone named Marcus. He will get outbid, shrug his shoulders, and make do with the core talent that he has now.

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Honestly, who can beat an offer of Brown, Rozier, Morris, filler and the SAC pick?

I know I'm biased, but I'd certainly take that over Ingram and Kuzma or Fultz, Saric Covington and #10

I think Brown is by far the best piece of any of those and the SAC pick is the 2nd most valuable piece. If the Lakers include Lonzo maybe they get close, but I still think that offer is the best realistic one out there

But why would we offer that without assurances from Kawhi that no one thinks we’d get?

Do we r

DrewDawg said:

But why would we offer that without assurances from Kawhi that no one thinks we’d get?

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Do we really think Kawhi will turn down Boston? It's a large city with an excellent team, and we'd be easy favorites in the east with that team, and it would probably be his best shot at heating the Warriors.

Remember that the Celtics weren't on Kyrie's initial list either.

I think there's a chance we get an assurance

Bosox1528 said:

Do we r

Do we really think Kawhi will turn down Boston? It's a large city with an excellent team, and we'd be easy favorites in the east with that team, and it would probably be his best shot at heating the Warriors.

Remember that the Celtics weren't on Kyrie's initial list either.

I think there's a chance we get an assurance

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Kawhi has a ring and a Finals MVP. It's quite possible he's not dying to win another title and now just wants his preferred geographic location, which looks to be LA. He's such a quiet guy that we'll never really know what he's looking for.

Bosox1528 said:

Do we r

Do we really think Kawhi will turn down Boston? It's a large city with an excellent team, and we'd be easy favorites in the east with that team, and it would probably be his best shot at heating the Warriors.

Remember that the Celtics weren't on Kyrie's initial list either.

I think there's a chance we get an assurance

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Well, getting that assurance is different. But I don’t think we’ve seen a report that he’d be willing to entertain that.

I can't fathom Popovich not trading Kawhi to a random Western Conference team if they have the best offer. I absolutely can fathom him not trading Kawhi to the Lakers unless their deal is two levels higher than any other offer.

I can't fathom Ainge offering Brown for quite possibly just one year of Leonard. That's Devers for Machado bullshit. I can barely fathom the Sixers offering #10 in a deep draft, Saric and Covington for quite possibly just one year of Leonard. I think the Celtics offer would almost have to be Kyrie (if the C's think Irving is gone after a year) or a signed Smart plus Rozier or a pick or something. Someone's likely to beat the latter offer - which in itself is a big gamble - maybe Philly.

Trading for one year of Leonard becomes only worth it to Boston if they win the title.

Edit- everyone has Boston on the list of teams in play to get Kawhi because, as I heard on the radio today, "they can offer Tatum and Brown!" Edit2- I believe that was Jalen Rose. And then Mike Greenberg jumped in as the voice of reason and said if he was Boston he would offer only Tatum straight up or Brown plus something else, not both.

Koufax said:

I think he will offer up a pu-pu platter that does not include Kyrie, Brown or Tatum; but will certainly include draft picks and anyone named Marcus.

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Mookie Betts isn't going anywhere.

Mugsy's Jock said:

Mookie Betts isn't going anywhere.

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His name isn't Marcus, anyway. It's Markus.

BigSoxFan said:

Kawhi has a ring and a Finals MVP. It's quite possible he's not dying to win another title and now just wants his preferred geographic location, which looks to be LA. He's such a quiet guy that we'll never really know what he's looking for.

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If I’ve read correctly, if he doesn’t go to LAL this summer (assuming LBJ and George sign there), they can’t afford him next year. So they probably aren’t an option next summer. Not sure how much that changes the entire calculus but it’s definitely something to consider.

I'm moving into the "hard pass" camp on Leonard. I wouldn't offer either Tatum or Brown, though I could see Irving, if they don't think Irving will want to resign. Beside the points that have been made here ad nauseam -- that nagging injury, flight risk -- I think the salary cap math is a major negative. Plus, to make this deal happen you risk trading away some decent bench depth. And what if the trade hurts team chemistry? If Danny tried to get Kawhi at the trade deadline, that was before he had any idea how far an Irving-less and Hayward-less team could go in the playoffs. He probably thought he really needed that piece to contend. Now it's clear that this year's Celts plus Irving could have beaten Cleveland, and possibly given the Warriors a run for their money. With Hayward, they definitely could have. And the Celts young stars have room to grow, unlike the Warriors. Why mess around with this team, unless the move's a clear slam dunk? (Also, by definition, he should be willing to pay less to get Kawhi now than at the trade deadline, since he would only have him for one set of playoffs, not two -- so if Brown was on the table before, I'm willing to bet he's probably not now.)

bosockboy said:

If I’ve read correctly, if he doesn’t go to LAL this summer (assuming LBJ and George sign there), they can’t afford him next year. So they probably aren’t an option next summer. Not sure how much that changes the entire calculus but it’s definitely something to consider.

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Yup. LAL would almost certainly be out of the running but the LAC have a lot of expiring money coming off the books after next season, especially if Jordan and Rivers decline their player options.

I think calling Kawhi a rental is not entirely accurate but the possibility certainly exists. I’m confident that if Ainge trades for Kawhi, it’ll be because he has a good feeling about our chances of re-signing him.

Just to highlight the stupidity of many people who get paid to analyze basketball, someone named Rohan Nadkarni on si.com proposes the following trade:

Spurs receive: Kyrie Irving, Jaylen Brown, Marcus Morris, Aron Baynes, 2019 First Round Pick

Celtics receive: Kawhi Leonard, Derrick White, Pau Gasol

The 2019 pick is the Kings pick.

https://www.si.com/nba/2018/06/18/nba-draft-2018-trade-ideas-kawhi-leonard-kyrie-irving-spurs-celtics?utm_source=twitter.com&utm_campaign=sinow&xid=socialflow_twitter_si&utm_medium=social

bosockboy said:

If I’ve read correctly, if he doesn’t go to LAL this summer (assuming LBJ and George sign there), they can’t afford him next year. So they probably aren’t an option next summer. Not sure how much that changes the entire calculus but it’s definitely something to consider.

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This depends on what LAL does this offseason. If they sign Lebron, then yes, they will not have space the following year because Lebron isn't going there to play with the kids and some one year contract guys.

However, they could easily have enough space next offseason, if they sign PG or something. For he may sign there for the long haul, and may be a bit more patient. Deng will be an expiring next year and probably much easier to move. So theoretically they could sign PG, sign Randle, keep their young guys, round out the roster with one year contract guys, and have space next year to go after Kawhi. Could also look to move Ingram or Ball next offseason with Deng to bring in a third guy.

Bosox1528 said:

Do we r

Do we really think Kawhi will turn down Boston? It's a large city with an excellent team, and we'd be easy favorites in the east with that team, and it would probably be his best shot at heating the Warriors.

Remember that the Celtics weren't on Kyrie's initial list either.

I think there's a chance we get an assurance

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Kawhi will have options next summer and is a Cali guy. The only time he's been out of Cali is right now and he's asking to be traded out of Texas...….it is extremely optimistic to feel that Boston will be his choice. The difference with Kyrie is that he DIDN'T have options and needed a team that had what Cleveland wanted to do a deal. We still don't know if we are on Kyrie's list as he could be saying all the right things which are necessary for him to maintain the peace since we bailed him out of Cleveland.

nighthob said:

The gambling revenues have thrown a spanner into the works, no one has any idea what sort of impact this is going to have on BRI.

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I would not expect them to be material. Something like a billion dollars was bet in Vegas on basketball last year (college and pro). The NBA has asked for a 1% cut of all wagers, so even if you assume all money was bet on the NBA, that would only come to $10M. 50% of that would go towards the cap, which is then divided among 30 teams. That's like $170K/team. Sportsbetting legalization may grow the pie, but it would need to be orders of magnitude larger to have an impact.

Yes, but the question is what happens with the proliferation of legalized sports betting on the national level. Unlike other countries in the US sports betting as limited to one locale, now there are going to be sports books everywhere. Including online eventually (here in the US, elsewhere this is legal, obviously).

I largely agree that the ultimate cap impact won’t be huge, but no one knows what legal sports betting is going to look like in the US in five years, so there’s still no way to calculate the impact with certitude.

HomeRunBaker said:

Kawhi will have options next summer and is a Cali guy. The only time he's been out of Cali is right now and he's asking to be traded out of Texas..

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He has been out of CA for 7 years. Sure, he may like to go back, but you have been on this "XXXXX is from CA and really wants to go back and play for LAL" too many times if I remember correctly.

the moops said:

He has been out of CA for 7 years. Sure, he may like to go back, but you have been on this "XXXXX is from CA and really wants to go back and play for LAL" too many times if I remember correctly.

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Yeah and it happens all the time. Players desire to return to their desired location like LeBron returned to Cleveland, D-Wade to Miami......it is the fundamental reason why the "hometown discount" exists because players and/or their families are comfortable in that area. Is there any reason to suggest that Kawhi would welcome going to Boston? He has no ties here or in this area whatsoever. There is zero to suggest he would choose Boston except for wishful guessing.

HomeRunBaker said:

Yeah and it happens all the time. Players desire to return to their desired location like LeBron returned to Cleveland, D-Wade to Miami......it is the fundamental reason why the "hometown discount" exists because players and/or their families are comfortable in that area. Is there any reason to suggest that Kawhi would welcome going to Boston? He has no ties here or in this area whatsoever. There is zero to suggest he would choose Boston except for wishful guessing.

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I agree with your overall point, but D Wade? Not exactly the best example.

Papelbon's Poutine said:

I agree with your overall point, but D Wade? Not exactly the best example.

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Why not? He mended fences with Riley at his agents funeral and they discussed his return which came a week or two later.

Again, that is neither here nor there and we don't disagree about the big picture.

Fact of the matter is that nobody knows squat about Kawhi and what makes him tick. He’s as guarded as Duncan was. If this LA thing were as simple as people are making it out to be, then he could have just played out next season and become a FA next summer at which point both LA teams may be able to sign him outright.

I have no reason to assume that LA isn’t his geographic preference but we have no idea what other factors he’s looking for. It’s not really wishful guessing to assume that most players would probably like to play on a team that will compete for championships while being coached by a top 3 coach in the league.

Not everyone wants the Boston media scrutiny and I think Kawhi due to his personality could potentially be one of them but we just don’t know. Until I see reputable sources saying that Boston is not an option, I see no reason to assume that he’s not at least partially open to the idea. All the talk to-date has been Kawhi-to-Boston. There has been plenty of time for his camp to set the record straight. I think we’ll know in due time where his head is at, perhaps as early as the draft.

HomeRunBaker said:

Why not? He mended fences with Riley at his agents funeral and they discussed his return which came a week or two later.

Again, that is neither here nor there and we don't disagree about the big picture.

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Not to further derail, but his return was a salary dump during all the swapping Lebron did at the deadline. It was expected he’d probably go back to retire there, but his return wasn’t exactly his choice.

Papelbon's Poutine said:

Not to further derail, but his return was a salary dump during all the swapping Lebron did at the deadline. It was expected he’d probably go back to retire there, but his return wasn’t exactly his choice.

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Yep, and Wade is from Chicago. The geography/home roots was the point of the Kawhi to LA stuff.

bosockboy said:

Yep, and Wade is from Chicago. The geography/home roots was the point of the Kawhi to LA stuff.

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Is it? It might be, or he might just have planned to team up with LeBron on the Lakers and the hometown stuff is a cover to make it look less Kevin Durant. None of us really know what Kawhi is prioritizing here. I've heard several different sets of odds from Vegas sportsbooks touted. All of them have the Lakers odds-on and then some combination of LAC, Philly, Boston, staying in SA and Cleveland in varying orders.

JakeRae said:

This is virtually impossible. To acquire both Lebron and Kawhi, the Celtics would need about $45 million in tradeable salary (probably more because that number assumes perfect proportionality on each trade). Excluding the players you list, they have the following tradeable contracts:

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I thought I had put this in my original post (I didn’t), but I was thinking Smart would have to go as part of a sign and trade, maybe something like 3/38 or something. That would allow them to do Brown and Smart straight up for Leonard and have plenty left to match for LeBron. The problem is time is not on their side and I don’t know if Smart or the Spurs would want him at that contract.

Royal Reader said:

Is it? It might be, or he might just have planned to team up with LeBron on the Lakers and the hometown stuff is a cover to make it look less Kevin Durant. None of us really know what Kawhi is prioritizing here. I've heard several different sets of odds from Vegas sportsbooks touted. All of them have the Lakers odds-on and then some combination of LAC, Philly, Boston, staying in SA and Cleveland in varying orders.

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I think some of us are discussing Kawhi's destination choice next summer and others his influence on where he is traded this summer. Two very different things.

HomeRunBaker said:

I think some of us are discussing Kawhi's destination choice next summer and others his influence on where he is traded this summer. Two very different things.

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I don’t see that they’re particularly - or functionally - different, despite recognizing the distinction. Unless Popovich wants to give him a big middle finger and take a pile of crap for him, no team is trading anything of value for one season of him if they aren’t at least led to believe he’s resigning end of season. I feel pretty confident that wherever he gets moved, he’ll be there for the next five years and he and his agent will have a say in that; but ymmv.

Kawhi isn't going to sign a 4 year deal next offseason regardless of where he ends up.

Royal Reader said:

Is it? It might be, or he might just have planned to team up with LeBron on the Lakers and the hometown stuff is a cover to make it look less Kevin Durant. None of us really know what Kawhi is prioritizing here. I've heard several different sets of odds from Vegas sportsbooks touted. All of them have the Lakers odds-on and then some combination of LAC, Philly, Boston, staying in SA and Cleveland in varying orders.

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Yup, and all those odds are based on the same initial report that Kawhi wants to be traded to the Lakers. Other than that information, assuming it's even correct, it's anyone's guess.

Papelbon's Poutine said:

I don’t see that they’re particularly - or functionally - different, despite recognizing the distinction. Unless Popovich wants to give him a big middle finger and take a pile of crap for him, no team is trading anything of value for one season of him if they aren’t at least led to believe he’s resigning end of season. I feel pretty confident that wherever he gets moved, he’ll be there for the next five years and he and his agent will have a say in that; but ymmv.

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Won’t his options for a place to sign a year from now be narrowed down by the end of this off-season as trades and signings happen? For example, if LAL signs LBJ and PG and someone else to fill up their space, won’t it cease to be an option for Kawhi?

the moops said:

Kawhi isn't going to sign a 4 year deal next offseason regardless of where he ends up.

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The assumption being that he wants to get back on the market when has 10+ years of service and is eligible for the 35% max? So he signs a 2+1?

Saints Rest said:

Won’t his options for a place to sign a year from now be narrowed down by the end of this off-season as trades and signings happen? For example, if LAL signs LBJ and PG and someone else to fill up their space, won’t it cease to be an option for Kawhi?

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Yes and no. The Lakers would have a tough time freeing up space in 2019, if they sign Lebron and PG this summer, but there will be many more teams with space in 2020, including the Clippers could potentially have enough space for at least two max contracts.

the moops said:

Kawhi isn't going to sign a 4 year deal next offseason regardless of where he ends up.

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I'll slightly disagree with this. The story that what he's suffering from is calcification of the quad means that there's a greater than zero chance that we never see MVP level Kawhi again. I fully expect him to sign a 2+2 just in case.

HomeRunBaker said:

I think some of us are discussing Kawhi's destination choice next summer and others his influence on where he is traded this summer. Two very different things.

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I think they amount to the same thing. Kawhi wants to go to LA, win a championship, and make a ton of money, in some order. SA wants the best package, to get Kawhi out of conference and possibly to screw the Lakers for tapping him up.

These are obviously difficult to reconcile. Kawhi can basically refuse to re-sign with anyone but LAL. That kills SA's leverage, but still doesn't guarantee they think Brandon Ingram is enough to swallow their distaste for the Lakers. If Kawhi refuses to report to SA, states publicly he's going to the Lakers in '19, then he's a pure rental, and that has the paradoxical effect of opening up the places he could end up being sent. If you're Cleveland, do you send eight if you get assurances that LeBron would opt in for one more run? Does Milwaukee or Toronto have the assets to try to get out of 'pretty good' purgatory? Would Portland decide Lillard/McCollum has reached its ceiling and trade CJ for a guy who is both probably a better fit alongside Dame, while also being an expiring which could get them out of cap hell after the season?

The closest thing to meeting both sides' needs seems to be going to Philly. They can pay him, good young players, he'll be in the playoffs for the whole of his next contract. But whether that is likely pretty much entirely depends on how set he is on both the ideas of going to LA and teaming up with LeBron.

nighthob said:

I'll slightly disagree with this. The story that what he's suffering from is calcification of the quad means that there's a greater than zero chance that we never see MVP level Kawhi again. I fully expect him to sign a 2+2 just in case.

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Those don't exist. Can only have an opt out for the final year of a contract.