The all-Joe-Girardi-all-the-time Thread

[MentalDisabldLst]

I didn't see any thread discussing the Yankees manager.  For most teams, that would be a good sign - if you're not worthy of being remarked on,  you're probably not fucking up too badly.
 
Last night he got thrown out of a game after umpire Laz Diaz (who, to be fair, is a bit of a hot-head) "Gave him the Mutombo".  Apparently he meant wagging his finger at Girardi, though for a second I hoped he had wandered towards Girardi in front of all of Yankee Stadium drunkenly shouting "WHO WANTS TO SEX DIAZ?".  Anyway - unprofessional of Diaz?  sure.  But what was Girardi doing arguing balls and strikes in the first place, especially for something non-egregious?
 
And then there's the broader question: do fans (of any team) regard him as a good manager?  He certainly seems to not be abysmally detrimental to the team's success, but I've also never really seen him in the Joe Maddon / Mike Scioscia "meddling and egotistical but competent" category, nevermind the Terry Francona / Bob Melvin / Bruce Bochy division of "actual value added as a manager".  How is he doing?  How is he regarded?

 

[EvilEmpire]

I love Girardi, He favors veterans a bit much, but does a good job overall. Handles the pitching staff well. Seems accountable. Gets fired up at the right time, but generally maintains his bearing. He's fine with the media. Players seems to respect him. He's solid. I don't know what a spectacular manager really looks like, but I can't think of any that I'd rather have right now.

With regards to Diaz: his strike zone seemed inconsistent. Weaver's low pitch to Gardner was not a strike and Girardi was justified in getting mad. Unfortunately, after the confrontation, the strike zone for Yankee pitchers seemed to get even smaller. Kelley threw a ball down the middle, but low, in the same place Diaz called a strike on Gardner. This time it was a ball. Diaz is an asshole. He goads players and is unprofessional.

There is also some history. Diaz is the same guy who wouldn't let Russell Martin throw the ball back to his pitcher a couple of years ago. He's an asshole.

 

[Year of Yaz]

I didn't see any thread discussing the Yankees manager.  For most teams, that would be a good sign - if you're not worthy of being remarked on,  you're probably not fucking up too badly.
 
Last night he got thrown out of a game after umpire Laz Diaz (who, to be fair, is a bit of a hot-head) "Gave him the Mutombo".  Apparently he meant wagging his finger at Girardi, though for a second I hoped he had wandered towards Girardi in front of all of Yankee Stadium drunkenly shouting "WHO WANTS TO SEX DIAZ?".  Anyway - unprofessional of Diaz?  sure.  But what was Girardi doing arguing balls and strikes in the first place, especially for something non-egregious?
 
And then there's the broader question: do fans (of any team) regard him as a good manager?  He certainly seems to not be abysmally detrimental to the team's success, but I've also never really seen him in the Joe Maddon / Mike Scioscia "meddling and egotistical but competent" category, nevermind the Terry Francona / Bob Melvin / Bruce Bochy division of "actual value added as a manager".  How is he doing?  How is he regarded?

I don't know if I believe that managers have that much effect. Certainly Bobby V can make a bad situation worse but it takes good players having good years and avoiding injuries. If JF's firrst year had been 2012 they probably still would have sucked. I'm sure that Francona had the same personality and baseball knowledge when he managed bad teams in Philly.

 

[TSC]

I love Girardi, He favors veterans a bit much, but does a good job overall. Handles the pitching staff well. Seems accountable. Gets fired up at the right time, but generally maintains his bearing. He's fine with the media. Players seems to respect him. He's solid. I don't know what a spectacular manager really looks like, but I can't think of any that I'd rather have right now.

With regards to Diaz: his strike zone seemed inconsistent. Weaver's low pitch to Gardner was not a strike and Girardi was justified in getting mad. Unfortunately, after the confrontation, the strike zone for Yankee pitchers seemed to get even smaller. Kelley threw a ball down the middle, but low, in the same place Diaz called a strike on Gardner. This time it was a ball. Diaz is an asshole. He goads players and is unprofessional.

There is also some history. Diaz is the same guy who wouldn't let Russell Martin throw the ball back to his pitcher a couple of years ago. He's an asshole.

 
If only it were easy to prove these kinds of things....
 

 

 

[EvilEmpire]

If only it were easy to prove these kinds of things....

Thanks. Kelley's pitch #2 looked a bit higher than that when I was watching, but I can't argue with the plot. I thought it was closer to pitch #2 of Gardner's AB.

 

[jtn46]

I can't stand Girardi as a Sox fan, which is probably a plus to Yankee fans.
 
That said, I like the way he manages his pen. If you give Girardi a decent bullpen arm, he'll put them in good situations, won't often let them hang themselves and will show confidence in them. I think a lot of David Robertson's success can be attributed to Girardi's usage of him.

 

[jon abbey]

I generally like him, but he's going to have a big test in the near future if Jeter doesn't start hitting, now that Ryan is back. 

 

[derekson]

My biggest beefs with Girardi are that he issues far too many intentional walks and that he seems to sometimes manage his clubhouse as if he's running a high school team or something (see things like banning candy bars and other sweets from the clubhouse). MLB players deserve to be treated like adults.
 
He can get a little crazy with overmanaging in other ways besides the IBBs at times, but the intentional walks seem to be the worst offense on strategy.

 

[EvilEmpire]

My biggest beefs with Girardi are that he issues far too many intentional walks and that he seems to sometimes manage his clubhouse as if he's running a high school team or something (see things like banning candy bars and other sweets from the clubhouse). MLB players deserve to be treated like adults.

You should have seen him with the chicken and beer. Completely lost his shit.

 

[glennhoffmania]

I don't think he's costing them a meaningful number of wins or anything, but I think he over-manages a lot and I could see him rubbing some people the wrong way.  He doesn't come off as sincere to me and I think he tries too hard to look like a smart guy or a tough guy when he should just not give a shit about how he is perceived.  I think that his over-managing is most evident when he makes multiple pitching changes in an inning.  And I agree with JA that he's in a really tough spot re: Jeter.  I don't think any manager would be able to navigate this issue easily, and it's probably even more difficult for Girardi given their history.

 

[orphan]

I like Girardi, although like some fans I'm also frustrated with him at times. I think his decisions are not entirely his, but part of the Yankees thinking, which is open to debate. Cashman said this a few days ago “You want to give veterans ample time to work through the ups and downs of a normal season. You try to make sure you are evaluating on a long-term basis and not overreacting to the short term.” 
 
Cashman did however answer in the affirmative when questioned about Girardi's decision making autonomy.  
 
Source: http://nypost.com/2014/05/05/benching-jeter-get-ready-for-girardis-major-conundrum/

 

[Dahabenzapple2]

I generally like him, but he's going to have a big test in the near future if Jeter doesn't start hitting, now that Ryan is back. 

Harold Reynolds says Jeter is getting hot - since he hit his first HR tonight

As far as Girardi, he is solid, reliable, boring and arrogant

Perfect Yankee manager

 

[jon abbey]

Intentional walks are so ripe for second-guessing either way, and of course it's impossible to know what the other result would have been. Last night he tried getting out Pujols with two outs and two bases open, and Pujols burned him and tied the game.
 
I very much like his willingness to lose the DH whenever necessary, I think he's even a bit innovative for an AL manager in this way (?). It seems to be the right move almost every time he tries it, or at the very least it doesn't end up backfiring. 

 

[EvilEmpire]

As far as Girardi, he is solid, reliable, boring and arrogant

This comment helped me realize something. Girardi reminds me of a few Army O-6s I've worked for over the years. He has a similar look -- a sort of weathered fitness. That, plus a very direct manner of communicating, along with a kind of understated arrogance. Arrogance that sort of seeps through even when he is saying humble things. I can't really describe it well. I can easily see him putting his arm around a struggling young pitcher and finding the right words to get his head in the right place. I can also see him being a total dick at times too.

I don't know if all that should make me like him more or less, but it sort of helps me realize where that sense of nagging familiarity I've had about him for a long time comes from.

 

[derekson]

I've seen Maddon give up the DH for tactical platoon advantages and things more than Girardi. I agree that both are smart to do it from time to time when it gives them an advantage. Pretty much every other manager is completely unwilling to do it even though the consequences really aren't dire.
 
Intentional walks are a good idea far less often than most managers use them, and Girardi uses them more than just about anyone else (AL only here, obviously walking the #8 guy to get to the pitcher in the NL is frequently a good idea and leads to inflated totals in that league).

 

[jon abbey]

Intentional walks are a good idea far less often than most managers use them, and Girardi uses them more than just about anyone else (AL only here, obviously walking the #8 guy to get to the pitcher in the NL is frequently a good idea and leads to inflated totals in that league).

 
It looks like Farrell just doesn't do it almost at all, but besides Boston NY was somewhere in the middle of the AL last season:
 
http://espn.go.com/mlb/stats/team/_/stat/pitching/year/2013/league/al/sort/intentionalWalks/type/expanded/order/true

 

[derekson]

 
It looks like Farrell just doesn't do it almost at all, but besides Boston NY was somewhere in the middle of the AL last season:
 
http://espn.go.com/mlb/stats/team/_/stat/pitching/year/2013/league/al/sort/intentionalWalks/type/expanded/order/true

 
I suspect having good bullpens most years has reduced Girardi's totals over the last few years. Or maybe he's learned after being burned by some dumb ones? The Yankees were 2nd and 3rd in the AL in 2010 and 2011. I think I've seen more IBBs early in games from Girardi than I can recall seeing any other manager call for. You see him go for an IBB in the 3rd, 4th, or 5th inning to try and get a DP to get out of a big inning. Realistically any IBB that isn't late and close is just going to be a bad idea.
 
I'm trying to think of a way to look at IBB issued vs situations where it'd be a legitimate option but I'm have trouble defining an "IBB situation". Maybe 6th inning or later, game within 3 runs, first base open with 1 or 2 outs and runners in scoring position? Something like that?

 

[Rice4HOF]

In my mind the only legitimate IBB situation is when the run of the batter you are walking doesn't matter. i.e., bottom of the 9th or a later inning and the winning run is on base. Otherwise it only makes sense if the batter you are walking is WAY better than the next one.  By way better, I'm talking about walking Barry Bonds to pitch to a pitcher. Not walking Ortiz to pitch Napoli.

 

[HriniakPosterChild]

You're ignoring the platoon advantage on purpose?