Jayson Tatum's Rise to the Top

[chilidawg]

FWIW, DARKO has JT at 5 (caveat: it's not a rating system per se), behind Giannis, Embiid, Lebron, and Jokic. Slightly ahead of Durant. The turnaround to Tatum's season is breathtaking. Left out Lebron, since it's restricted to 5 for graphing and we should only focus on guys who made the playoffs.

View attachment 50716

tl;dr; Tatum is now the fourth best basketball player on earth.

Remember early this season and he was trending down? Good times.

 

[reggiecleveland]

A major concern I have with TL being out, is Tatum will use more energy on D. He is a fantastic defender, but gets some rest when TL is changing shots.

 

[DeJesus Built My Hotrod]

FWIW, DARKO has JT at 5 (caveat: it's not a rating system per se), behind Giannis, Embiid, Lebron, and Jokic. Slightly ahead of Durant. The turnaround to Tatum's season is breathtaking. Left out Lebron, since it's restricted to 5 for graphing and we should only focus on guys who made the playoffs.

View attachment 50716

tl;dr; Tatum is now the fourth best basketball player on earth.

I love that curve too. The Tatuming is happening.

 

[Jimbodandy]

A major concern I have with TL being out, is Tatum will use more energy on D. He is a fantastic defender, but gets some rest when TL is changing shots.

Oh yeah. I think that happened in Milwaukee to both Tatum and Brown. It will happen in the playoffs regardless, but exacerbated without TL. We're seeing the difference in safety net already.

 

[lovegtm]

...
We'll see what it looks like in the playoffs when teams can gameplan and have better options for defending Tatum one on one. If it still looks like this against second round opponents -- if Milwaukee or Miami are forced to blitz him on small-small PnRs, or Tatum eats those switches alive -- then I'll probably have to change how I see Tatum. Until then, though... I think I'm with Duncan and Leroux. Probably (well, almost certainly) a top 10 player when factoring in defense. Eminently portable (as good or better off ball as on ball), but maybe not scalable at high enough efficiency to be the number 1 shot creator on a championship winner.
...

This is where the Celtics improved roster construction has really unlocked Tatum's game. The Celtics have 4 guys who are either very dangerous in space or elite shooters or both (Brown, White, Smart, PP, maayyybbeee can include Grant here). This lets the Celtics choose who to set the small/small or like-sized screens with, and in turn forces the choice of blitz or let Tatum attack a weaker defender. The Celtics nearly always have 2-3 of these other guys on the floor.

It's interesting that we all have pined for more shooting (still do), but a lot of the Celtics offensive success is having good scorers/decision makers attacking defenses that Tatum has scrambled just by running a simple screen.

As you noted, NBA coaches don't seem comfortable at all when Tatum draws a weaker defender, hence the blitzing. Even guys like Luka aren't this much of an emergency when they get a weaker guy on the perimeter, which probably accounts partially for the increased attention and better impact offensive metrics for Tatum (he does much better in Darko on offense than Luka this year, which shocked me).

What changes about this in the playoffs? What are the counters?

• Blitzing. Just doesn't work at this point, since Tatum has seen it so much and is so tall.
• Tell the primary defender to just stick with Tatum no matter what. Tatum has gotten really, really good at taking the advantage the screen gives him and then attacking to force other defenders to help, at which point he's able to easily read what the help opens up.
• Be really good at switching anything. The only team in the league that really has the personnel to do this is the team that Tatum currently plays for, although Miami, Milwaukee and Toronto (unlikely matchup) can do it in certain lineups.
• Switch the screen to eliminate the initial advantage, and then shade help towards the weaker defender now on Tatum. That's probably what we'd see a lot of against Milwaukee, but it's tough, because Tatum is getting good at setting up teammates for drives when their defender is shading to the nail or into the paint.

I don't mean to say Tatum is unstoppable; he'll have bad games, and he'll need to be able to destroy switches that are only moderate advantages. But I'm not sure that that's different from any other offensive superstar outside of Durant; there are ways to slow them all down in a playoff setting.

We only have one playoff series with Tatum as The Guy--the Brooklyn series last year. He was really good in that, and that was with an atrocious supporting cast. Given that, and the clear improvements he's made sense, I'm not sure why he's not seen as a primary offensive engine. I suspect the reason is TS% + assist numbers.

 

[benhogan]

Remember early this season and he was trending down? Good times.

Hate to boil it down to one thing, but his 3pt shooting was broken earlier this season. When Tatum is a consistent 40% from 3 he's a TOP5 NBA player trending towards the best player in the league.

He's still learning, growing, leaping.

The best way to stop JT is to get up under him, be physical, and hope the refs get under his skin with the lack of calls. Then hope this negatively impacts his 3pt shooting. The Heat (Martin/Butler/Lowry/Bam/PJ) specialize in that. He'll eventually outgrow it (by also getting bigger/stronger), but it's his kryptonite at the moment.

 

[Eddie Jurak]

What changes about this in the playoffs? What are the counters?

• Blitzing. Just doesn't work at this point, since Tatum has seen it so much and is so tall.
• Tell the primary defender to just stick with Tatum no matter what. Tatum has gotten really, really good at taking the advantage the screen gives him and then attacking to force other defenders to help, at which point he's able to easily read what the help opens up.
• Be really good at switching anything. The only team in the league that really has the personnel to do this is the team that Tatum currently plays for, although Miami, Milwaukee and Toronto (unlikely matchup) can do it in certain lineups.
• Switch the screen to eliminate the initial advantage, and then shade help towards the weaker defender now on Tatum. That's probably what we'd see a lot of against Milwaukee, but it's tough, because Tatum is getting good at setting up teammates for drives when their defender is shading to the nail or into the paint.

I don't mean to say Tatum is unstoppable; he'll have bad games, and he'll need to be able to destroy switches that are only moderate advantages. But I'm not sure that that's different from any other offensive superstar outside of Durant; there are ways to slow them all down in a playoff setting.

I think if you are a team considering how to defend Tatum, it becomes a matter of trying to pick and choose your spots. Double off of Smart, Horford, White, Theus hoping that Smart will mount a vicious assault on the backboard and rim with a dozen bricks. If things are going really bad, double off of anyone but Brown, figuring that it is better to force Grant and Pritchard to beat you than to let Tatum do it. Let Tatum get his against single man coverage, but try to make him work. If Tatum is running pick and rolls with Smart, maybe you put someone you want to guard Tatum on Smart to being with. The Celtics will eventually adjust to that but maybe you win a couple of key possessions that way.

 

[lovegtm]

I think if you are a team considering how to defend Tatum, it becomes a matter of trying to pick and choose your spots. Double off of Smart, Horford, White, Theus hoping that Smart will mount a vicious assault on the backboard and rim with a dozen bricks. If things are going really bad, double off of anyone but Brown, figuring that it is better to force Grant and Pritchard to beat you than to let Tatum do it. Let Tatum get his against single man coverage, but try to make him work. If Tatum is running pick and rolls with Smart, maybe you put someone you want to guard Tatum on Smart to being with. The Celtics will eventually adjust to that but maybe you win a couple of key possessions that way.

Man, I'm not sure coaches will just live with Pritchard and Grant taking open 3s. PP is automatic; we're not talking about a 2 attempt/36 center who shoots 35% and you dare to shoot.

 

[RorschachsMask]

He obviously shouldn’t win, or be top 3. But this is still cool to see.

View: https://twitter.com/ThNBACentral/status/1512503794654801921?s=20&t=mOigU_QLJ72OYkYxcH4dXA

 

[Saints Rest]

I think if you are a team considering how to defend Tatum, it becomes a matter of trying to pick and choose your spots. Double off of Smart, Horford, White, Theus hoping that Smart will mount a vicious assault on the backboard and rim with a dozen bricks. If things are going really bad, double off of anyone but Brown, figuring that it is better to force Grant and Pritchard to beat you than to let Tatum do it. Let Tatum get his against single man coverage, but try to make him work. If Tatum is running pick and rolls with Smart, maybe you put someone you want to guard Tatum on Smart to being with. The Celtics will eventually adjust to that but maybe you win a couple of key possessions that way.

Seems to me that the Celtics would counter (if not simply start) with a plan to determine who is the weakest defender (at least against Tatum) and use that guy to set the pick. So if Duncan Robinson is covering Grant, then Grant sets the pick.

 

[Eddie Jurak]

Man, I'm not sure coaches will just live with Pritchard and Grant taking open 3s. PP is automatic; we're not talking about a 2 attempt/36 center who shoots 35% and you dare to shoot.

I suggested that as a fallback, not as a primary strategy. Grant has been mired in a shooting slump of late.

Seems to me that the Celtics would counter (if not simply start) with a plan to determine who is the weakest defender (at least against Tatum) and use that guy to set the pick. So if Duncan Robinson is covering Grant, then Grant sets the pick.

That us what I was getting at when I said "The Celtics will eventually adjust to that but maybe you win a couple of key possessions that way."

There's also the scram switch - maybe as the Celtics are setting up the PNR to attack Robinson, a preferred defender switches with Robinson. The Celtics do things like this. None of it works as a gamelong strategy, but I think it would work for possessions here and there.

 

[lovegtm]

I suggested that as a fallback, not as a primary strategy. Grant has been mired in a shooting slump of late.
That us what I was getting at when I said "The Celtics will eventually adjust to that but maybe you win a couple of key possessions that way."

There's also the scram switch - maybe as the Celtics are setting up the PNR to attack Robinson, a preferred defender switches with Robinson. The Celtics do things like this. None of it works as a gamelong strategy, but I think it would work for possessions here and there.

Yup, these are all things coaches can try. Might work a bit here and there. The challenge for opposing teams is that Tatum handles the ball a lot, and there are only so many of these adjustments, so it's hard to make money with them over the course of a 7-game series, or even after another coach has rolled them out.

I think you're in this camp as well, but this is why I think it's likely Jayson Tatum is an elite offensive player: there aren't good counters to take him out of the game consistently, and the ones that do exist will probably be solved by him.

 

[Jakarta]

This is where the Celtics improved roster construction has really unlocked Tatum's game. The Celtics have 4 guys who are either very dangerous in space or elite shooters or both (Brown, White, Smart, PP, maayyybbeee can include Grant here). This lets the Celtics choose who to set the small/small or like-sized screens with, and in turn forces the choice of blitz or let Tatum attack a weaker defender. The Celtics nearly always have 2-3 of these other guys on the floor.

It's interesting that we all have pined for more shooting (still do), but a lot of the Celtics offensive success is having good scorers/decision makers attacking defenses that Tatum has scrambled just by running a simple screen.

As you noted, NBA coaches don't seem comfortable at all when Tatum draws a weaker defender, hence the blitzing. Even guys like Luka aren't this much of an emergency when they get a weaker guy on the perimeter, which probably accounts partially for the increased attention and better impact offensive metrics for Tatum (he does much better in Darko on offense than Luka this year, which shocked me).

What changes about this in the playoffs? What are the counters?

• Blitzing. Just doesn't work at this point, since Tatum has seen it so much and is so tall.
• Tell the primary defender to just stick with Tatum no matter what. Tatum has gotten really, really good at taking the advantage the screen gives him and then attacking to force other defenders to help, at which point he's able to easily read what the help opens up.
• Be really good at switching anything. The only team in the league that really has the personnel to do this is the team that Tatum currently plays for, although Miami, Milwaukee and Toronto (unlikely matchup) can do it in certain lineups.
• Switch the screen to eliminate the initial advantage, and then shade help towards the weaker defender now on Tatum. That's probably what we'd see a lot of against Milwaukee, but it's tough, because Tatum is getting good at setting up teammates for drives when their defender is shading to the nail or into the paint.

I don't mean to say Tatum is unstoppable; he'll have bad games, and he'll need to be able to destroy switches that are only moderate advantages. But I'm not sure that that's different from any other offensive superstar outside of Durant; there are ways to slow them all down in a playoff setting.

We only have one playoff series with Tatum as The Guy--the Brooklyn series last year. He was really good in that, and that was with an atrocious supporting cast. Given that, and the clear improvements he's made sense, I'm not sure why he's not seen as a primary offensive engine. I suspect the reason is TS% + assist numbers.

This is a great post and I think the most success teams will have against Tatum and the Celtics is by a combination of all of the above, plus mixing in different zone defenses. Coaches like Spo and Nurse who aren’t afraid to mix up coverages at least allow their teams to possibly confuse Tatum or someone else on the Cs being in the wrong spot for long enough that the shot clock becomes more of a factor. Someone like Doc who seems these days to make adjustments by “doing what we do but better” will be eaten alive by Tatum.

It’s also where the Celtics having a bunch of seemingly high IQ guys and excellent decision makers helps to counteract this. They are less likely to get confused and being able to attack defenses teams are less comfortable playing may outweigh the benefits of trying to confuse the Celtics.

 

[RorschachsMask]

View: https://twitter.com/taylorcsnow/status/1513570860543660049?s=20&t=IahQxE80DBpbDtuwE07FJQ

 

[DJnVa]

 

[DGreenwood]

It's weird but not that weird. You can get outscored in 3 out of 4 quarters and still win the game. I haven't looked at the stats though. I think that will tell the story.

Edit: Here's the stats for March. Link

2nd Edit: I just noticed this award covers March and April. Here's those stats. Link

 

[lovegtm]

It's weird but not that weird. You can get outscored in 3 out of 4 quarters and still win the game. I haven't looked at the stats though. I think that will tell the story.

Edit: Here's the stats for March. Link

2nd Edit: I just noticed this award covers March and April. Here's those stats. Link

Huh, those stats don't really make Giannis look better.

 

[RorschachsMask]

I’m kind of in shock, Nick Wright thinks Tatum is deserving of 1st team. Anyone who follows that clown is well aware of his weird Tatum thing.

View: https://twitter.com/getnickwright/status/1513654067586863104?s=20&t=xGdCl3bb1p4-i7Qhlfwnlw

 

[DGreenwood]

Huh, those stats don't really make Giannis look better.

In March alone I could kinda see it, but when you include April it gets murky with Giannis, Embiid, KD, and Tatum. I'm not sure I would have picked Giannis but probably wouldn't have picked Tatum out of that group either.

 

[DJnVa]

It's weird but not that weird. You can get outscored in 3 out of 4 quarters and still win the game. I

I understand that. But this type of thing isn't quite the same thing as a team scoring 7 runs in the first, and giving up single in 4 innings and winning 7-4, you know? Unless Tatum averaged like 1.5 PPG that other week or Giannis was at like 50 ppg, it seems odd.

I'm not advocating letters to the editor here, just thought it was interesting.

 

[djbayko]

I understand that. But this type of thing isn't quite the same thing as a team scoring 7 runs in the first, and giving up single in 4 innings and winning 7-4, you know? Unless Tatum averaged like 1.5 PPG that other week or Giannis was at like 50 ppg, it seems odd.

I'm not advocating letters to the editor here, just thought it was interesting.

Recency bias. Giannis had a pair of 40+ / 10+ / 5+ games and many were reconsidering him for MVP (although Jokic helped put an end to that).

 

[Euclis20]

I’m kind of in shock, Nick Wright thinks Tatum is deserving of 1st team. Anyone who follows that clown is well aware of his weird Tatum thing.

View: https://twitter.com/getnickwright/status/1513654067586863104?s=20&t=xGdCl3bb1p4-i7Qhlfwnlw

It's not a weird Tatum thing, guy has a bug up his ass for anything Boston related. Anyone who accepts that only one of Embiid/Jokic can make first team is going to give Tatum a really long look for first team. Giannis has a lock on one forward slot, the other could go to any of Tatum, Durant, Derozan or Lebron. Durant missed a ton of time (and his team isn't even in the playoffs yet), Lebron couldn't even get into the top 10 (and he missed a ton of time), and Derozan fell off his career peak from mid-season (and the Bulls were awful down the stretch). Wright has a real problem with Jokic (or at least his MVP argument) so it makes sense that he has Tatum on 1st team.

Considering how Tatum and the Celtics closed the year, any argument for a forward over Tatum (other than Giannis) is going to be pretty hard to make. Unless we just ignore games played, team performance, and actual positions.

 

[JakeRae]

It's not a weird Tatum thing, guy has a bug up his ass for anything Boston related. Anyone who accepts that only one of Embiid/Jokic can make first team is going to give Tatum a really long look for first team. Giannis has a lock on one forward slot, the other could go to any of Tatum, Durant, Derozan or Lebron. Durant missed a ton of time (and his team isn't even in the playoffs yet), Lebron couldn't even get into the top 10 (and he missed a ton of time), and Derozan fell off his career peak from mid-season (and the Bulls were awful down the stretch). Wright has a real problem with Jokic (or at least his MVP argument) so it makes sense that he has Tatum on 1st team.

Considering how Tatum and the Celtics closed the year, any argument for a forward over Tatum (other than Giannis) is going to be pretty hard to make. Unless we just ignore games played, team performance, and actual positions.

Agreed. Tatum should be the second ranked actual forward. He may not get there as Embiid and Jokic have the split position thing and Durant and Lebron have names/reputations, but the only player who actually plays Tatum’s “position” who had a better season than he did is Giannis.

Separately, Tatum is a borderline top 5 MVP candidate so his being in the conversation for first team makes perfect sense.

 

[MillarTime]

The only change I'd make to KOC's All-NBA teams is to move DeRozan to the 2nd team and LeBron to the 3rd team. DeRozan was a revelation and had a career year in his early 30s. I'd want to reward that. He could easily be the best player on a top 3 seed if his team didn't literally fall apart. LeBron had remarkable statistical season and should be All-NBA, but the Lakers were a complete dumpster fire.

 

[RorschachsMask]

He finished the regular season 5th in overall RAPTOR, 4th in LEBRON, 5th in DPM, 7th in EPM, and 4th in RPM. Even with the rough start finishing in the paint, he finished ahead of last year, and shot the same at the rim as KD. Also ended up with the highest TS since his rookie year, despite shooting just 35.3 from deep.

Usually when guys have ridiculous on/off’s, it’s because the team is lacking behind him. But I think almost everyone would agree that the Celtics have one of the best top 8s in the league. Here’s how the starters finished in net rating on/off, per nba.com tracking.

Tatum +14.0
Jaylen +5.4
Rob +4.6
Smart +4.3
Horford +4.1

In 225 minutes with Tatum in, without any other starter on the floor with him, the team had a +21.05 net rating, which is insane. Only a small amount of the votes are public right now, but looks like he is in line to make 1st team all nba.

https://tinyurl.com/4v4bzhh8

 

[lovegtm]

He finished the regular season 5th in overall RAPTOR, 4th in LEBRON, 5th in DPM, 7th in EPM, and 4th in RPM. Even with the rough start finishing in the paint, he finished ahead of last year, and shot the same at the rim as KD. Also ended up with the highest TS since his rookie year, despite shooting just 35.3 from deep.

Usually when guys have ridiculous on/off’s, it’s because the team is lacking behind him. But I think almost everyone would agree that the Celtics have one of the best top 8s in the league. Here’s how the starters finished in net rating on/off, per nba.com tracking.

Tatum +14.0
Jaylen +5.4
Rob +4.6
Smart +4.3
Horford +4.1

In 225 minutes with Tatum in, without any other starter on the floor with him, the team had a +21.05 net rating, which is insane. Only a small amount of the votes are public right now, but looks like he is in line to make 1st team all nba.

https://tinyurl.com/4v4bzhh8

As I've been harping on, and you've been implying, if you look at anything besides TS%+assists (metrics, eye test, on/off, team performance), Jayson Tatum is a superstar. In order to not think this, you have to re-define "superstar" to mean "TS%".

 

[Jimbodandy]

He finished the regular season 5th in overall RAPTOR, 4th in LEBRON, 5th in DPM, 7th in EPM, and 4th in RPM. Even with the rough start finishing in the paint, he finished ahead of last year, and shot the same at the rim as KD. Also ended up with the highest TS since his rookie year, despite shooting just 35.3 from deep.

Usually when guys have ridiculous on/off’s, it’s because the team is lacking behind him. But I think almost everyone would agree that the Celtics have one of the best top 8s in the league. Here’s how the starters finished in net rating on/off, per nba.com tracking.

Tatum +14.0
Jaylen +5.4
Rob +4.6
Smart +4.3
Horford +4.1

In 225 minutes with Tatum in, without any other starter on the floor with him, the team had a +21.05 net rating, which is insane. Only a small amount of the votes are public right now, but looks like he is in line to make 1st team all nba.

https://tinyurl.com/4v4bzhh8

Great post.

The bolded makes me happy in the consistency of those metrics. From an impact POV, it's Giannis and Joel, and then a small group that includes Tatum. Pretty impressive company.

 

[benhogan]

He finished the regular season 5th in overall RAPTOR, 4th in LEBRON, 5th in DPM, 7th in EPM, and 4th in RPM. Even with the rough start finishing in the paint, he finished ahead of last year, and shot the same at the rim as KD. Also ended up with the highest TS since his rookie year, despite shooting just 35.3 from deep.

Usually when guys have ridiculous on/off’s, it’s because the team is lacking behind him. But I think almost everyone would agree that the Celtics have one of the best top 8s in the league. Here’s how the starters finished in net rating on/off, per nba.com tracking.

Tatum +14.0
Jaylen +5.4
Rob +4.6
Smart +4.3
Horford +4.1

In 225 minutes with Tatum in, without any other starter on the floor with him, the team had a +21.05 net rating, which is insane. Only a small amount of the votes are public right now, but looks like he is in line to make 1st team all nba.

https://tinyurl.com/4v4bzhh8

Thanks for posting

Friends of Tatum (media folks that have him, 1st Team, All NBA)
1. Pina/SI
2. Herring/SI
3. Devine/Ringer
4. Russello/Ringer
5. Simmons/Ringer
6. KOC/Ringer
7. KC Johnson/NBC Sports

Ringer folks pressured by Bill?

 

[Spelunker]

Simmons/Russillo have votes?

 

[The Raccoon]

Simmons/Russillo have votes?

Yes, BS for a couple of years at least, Russillo for the first time this year.

 

[benhogan]

Simmons/Russillo have votes?

go to the attachment, tons of info

View: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1KMzwRcilLDej0BWl7eYE_OYC9Tx9olI_Ptn-nHjKfpQ/htmlview?pru=AAABgEhAbmA*HqSDd-rwY05p4eoKKNYcFQ#gid=643451732

 

[RorschachsMask]

This kind of seemed like “the” game for a lot of people to realize how great he is defensively.

View: https://twitter.com/HoopsEmpire_/status/1516010784207347719?s=20&t=fvWh37vm8dP__pMbm1O6ng

 

[wade boggs chicken dinner]

This kind of seemed like “the” game for a lot of people to realize how great he is defensively.

View: https://twitter.com/HoopsEmpire_/status/1516010784207347719?s=20&t=fvWh37vm8dP__pMbm1O6ng

Follow-up post:

"Couldn’t find that since January, but on the season he’s guarded roughly 5500 possessions and gave up sub-1K points, and held opponents to 42/33 splits when he guarded them."

View: https://twitter.com/HoopsEmpire_/status/1516012377619243012

 

[lovegtm]

If the Celtics have a good playoff run, people will start to think of him like Kawhi. He's different in a lot of ways on both ends, but just in the "guy who is a top-3 player because he's so elite on both ends" ways.

(I'm speaking about where the narrative will go; don't want to do another Jayson Tatum ranking discussion.)

 

[RorschachsMask]

View: https://twitter.com/Tucker_TnL/status/1516457685050269697?s=20&t=bIBKUhOP4vbuwT8KRCqkvw

 

[lovegtm]

One cool thing in this series is seeing how real Tatum's defense can be (when he's not gassed, as in 4Q game 1).

He's the primary defender on the most unstoppable offensive player in the world, and he's making his life hell.

Whenever we rank Tatum as a top X player, we're always giving him a little bump for his D, but offense is always given the priority. However, which of the other top-10 guys can do this to Durant?

It's a real game-changer, and we need to start thinking of Tatum more like prime Kawhi with passing, and less like poor man's Luka with a bit of extra D.

 

[RorschachsMask]

One cool thing in this series is seeing how real Tatum's defense can be (when he's not gassed, as in 4Q game 1).

He's the primary defender on the most unstoppable offensive player in the world, and he's making his life hell.

Whenever we rank Tatum as a top X player, we're always giving him a little bump for his D, but offense is always given the priority. However, which of the other top-10 guys can do this to Durant?

It's a real game-changer, and we need to start thinking of Tatum more like prime Kawhi with passing, and less like poor man's Luka with a bit of extra D.

I posted in the analysis thread, but when Durant was defended by Tatum last night (45 possessions), 4 points on 0-7 shooting, no assists, and 3 turnovers. I thought they did great on KD in game 1, but he missed a lot of pretty good looks. Last night I thought it was completely on the defense, mainly Tatum with some help from Al.

Through two games he’s averaging 25/5/8 on a 58% TS, while he’s spent around 100 possessions defending Durant and Kyrie. He’s a top 5 player now, IMO. Or at the very least is knocking on the door of it

 

[lovegtm]

I posted in the analysis thread, but when Durant was defended by Tatum last night (45 possessions), 4 points on 0-7 shooting, no assists, and 3 turnovers. I thought they did great on KD in game 1, but he missed a lot of pretty good looks. Last night I thought it was completely on the defense, mainly Tatum with some help from Al.

Through two games he’s averaging 25/5/8 on a 58% TS, while he’s spent around 100 possessions defending Durant and Kyrie. He’s a top 5 player now, IMO.

Yeah, I won't crown his ass until/we see this full postseason run, but there's a chance that by the end of the playoffs, we think the top 3 is Giannis, Embiid, and Tatum. (For 16-game players.)

 

[wade boggs chicken dinner]

Whenever we rank Tatum as a top X player, we're always giving him a little bump for his D, but offense is always given the priority. However, which of the other top-10 guys can do this to Durant?

It's a real game-changer, and we need to start thinking of Tatum more like prime Kawhi with passing, and less like poor man's Luka with a bit of extra D.

Giannis can. It would be interesting to see what Embiid could do if he had to. With respect to former top-10 players, Kawhi used to be able to do it. So did LBJ. Maybe AD could have. But that's why two-way wings are so important.

I'll note that Forsberg interviewed Beal in the lead-up to the series and Beal said something interesting: that when JT was young, he was over 6 feet and playing PG. At that time - Beal thought JT looked like a young Shaun Livington. Not really a picture of what I thought JT would be doing in youth ball.

 

[DeJesus Built My Hotrod]

If this has been posted already, tough Rocco's. Timi coming with elite clamps content

View: https://twitter.com/TheNBACentral/status/1517577524498374656?t=_QLGvTszDaUvcG0QLa5rDg&s=19

 

[RorschachsMask]

While averaging 30/5/8 on a 58.4% TS. Also, a TS of 106% in crunch time. Small sample obviously, but small samples matter more in the playoffs.

View: https://twitter.com/ChrisForsberg_/status/1518167869879631873?s=20&t=TZ28MO9S4kskUKNUJnYPrA

 

[lovegtm]

While averaging 30/5/8 on a 58.4% TS. Also, a TS of 106% in crunch time. Small sample obviously, but small samples matter more in the playoffs.

View: https://twitter.com/ChrisForsberg_/status/1518167869879631873?s=20&t=TZ28MO9S4kskUKNUJnYPrA

If he were a 3&D guy scoring 12/game on a couple 3s, and playing this defense, he'd still be an impact player. That he's doing it as an efficient primary offensive engine, with the other team selling out to stop him, is ridiculous.

If there were a DPOY award solely for the postseason, Tatum would be a leading candidate right now.

I love that he wanted this matchup, got it, and then has gone out and been by far the best player in it. MVP shit.

 

[128]

View: https://twitter.com/NBAHistory/status/1518054260595851264

 

[Everetts Dinosaurs]

While averaging 30/5/8 on a 58.4% TS. Also, a TS of 106% in crunch time. Small sample obviously, but small samples matter more in the playoffs.

View: https://twitter.com/ChrisForsberg_/status/1518167869879631873?s=20&t=TZ28MO9S4kskUKNUJnYPrA

Insane stats regardless of who is in the other side. Another level completely given it's KD

 

[benhogan]

While averaging 30/5/8 on a 58.4% TS. Also, a TS of 106% in crunch time. Small sample obviously, but small samples matter more in the playoffs.

View: https://twitter.com/ChrisForsberg_/status/1518167869879631873?s=20&t=TZ28MO9S4kskUKNUJnYPrA

I wonder what the tracking data says after Game 4? Tatum didn't really cover KD that much in the first half

 

[RorschachsMask]

I wonder what the tracking data says after Game 4? Tatum didn't really cover KD that much in the first half

Looks like only 18 possessions tonight.

View: https://twitter.com/lissmx14/status/1518787197654253568?s=20&t=y5Qu2UrZF6KLt4DPrUrmSg

 

[benhogan]

Looks like only 18 possessions tonight.

View: https://twitter.com/lissmx14/status/1518787197654253568?s=20&t=y5Qu2UrZF6KLt4DPrUrmSg

Scott Foster did some of his best work tonight

Thought Grant did a decent job on KD. Jaylen, not so well. BUT my eye test could be off

 

[RorschachsMask]

Scott Foster did some of his best work tonight

Your top 3 Tatum isn’t too far from reality ATM, and he’s being universally acknowledged as one of the few true superstars in the league.

 

[Jimbodandy]

Scott Foster did some of his best work tonight

I mean...conspiracy theorists are generally not worth listening to, but Scott Foster getting another 3-0 series and his crew fouling out a guy who's a borderline top 1 player in the world right now with 2 minutes left...Silver reads Twitter, right?

 

[slamminsammya]

Scott Foster did some of his best work tonight

Thought Grant did a decent job on KD. Jaylen, not so well. BUT my eye test could be off

He was treating Jaylen like a mosquito tonight. He doesn't have the size or strength to bother KD at all, that seemed clear.