#DFG: Canceling the Noise

Is there any level of suspension that you would advise Tom to accept?


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Traut

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DeJesus Built My Hotrod said:
So Robert Kraft - the guy who brought long term success to what was once the laughing stock of professional sports - decides that it is in the team's and league's best interest to sqaush this whole silly thing and some folks here, who have far less perspective on it than Kraft, are criticizing him?

Really? Maybe we really are the worst sports fans ever...
Exactly. Bob Kraft knows exactly what he's doing. And aside from Brady, has more skin in this game than anyone. Whether his options are limited, he made a deal for Brady, or he's determined that the PR hit of continuing this dings his bottom line - he made a well informed good choice. 
 

AB in DC

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If a bunch of owners don't issue press releases thanking Kraft for doing "what's best for the NFL" then they're even bigger scumbags than Goodell.
 

DeJesus Built My Hotrod

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Stitch01 said:
Pats fans are going to have to hear bullshit about cheating from muppet opposing fans looking to strike at their betters for, well, ever because the league is run by incompetent morons.  Maybe give people a little time to blow off steam?
I live in a place where I hear about it constantly. I just laughed at a Dolphins fan who roots for renowned cheater and dirty player Ndamukong Suh.

I don't blame Kraft for anything. The reality is that Pats fans would draw ire no matter what. Its a byproduct of the team's success.
 

Average Reds

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GregHarris said:
Can't quote reply, but what the hell does that mean.  Cynicism?
 
 
It means that they don't believe that Kraft did anything for the good of the league.  They think he did it because he had no choice.
 
My guess is that they are right, but not for the reasons most of them think.
 

PedroKsBambino

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jsinger121 said:
 
Greg A. Bedard ‏@GregABedard  3s4 seconds ago
Was told by a high-ranking NFL source that Kraft's decision to stand down does not include a deal on Brady. Surprising to me.
 
 
If there were a deal, there's no chance it would be explicitly linked to this.  It would be a back-room understanding.  So I could not be less surprised that the leaking league official said what he did.
 

joe dokes

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Salem's Lot said:
 
I'm not worrying about what idiot opposing fans say. I'm worrying about the affect that crap like this will have on actual games. 
 
Brady being out and not having a draft pick will hurt. What else is there? Jim Nantz's tsk-tsking being piped in over the PA of opposing stadiums to rattle the team?
 

fairlee76

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Stitch01 said:
Pats fans are going to have to hear bullshit about cheating from muppet opposing fans looking to strike at their betters for, well, ever because the league is run by incompetent morons.  Maybe give people a little time to blow off steam?
Not to single you out, but who gives a shit about what opposing fans say?  I'm going to Denver to visit family this weekend and I am sure there'll be plenty of deflategate talk.  Just like there was still Spygate talk a year ago. I do think that reasonable fans know this entire saga is bullshit, that everyone doctors footballs, and that the Pats got screwed here.  And hell, a lot of the NFL viewing public lives in shitholes like Cleveland, Jacksonville, and Houston.  Let them have their little moment :).
 
I do agree with whoever said Kraft should have spent more time addressing the fact that the league needs to clean up how the footballs are handled pre-game.  Stronger protocols, precise gauging and tracking, etc.
 

BigJimEd

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Trautwein's Degree said:
Exactly. Bob Kraft knows exactly what he's doing. And aside from Brady, has more skin in this game than anyone. Whether his options are limited, he made a deal for Brady, or he's determined that the PR hit of continuing this dings his bottom line - he made a well informed good choice. 
but that's the difference between the owner and the fans. Owner worries about line. Fans only worry about on the field. First and forth round pick hurts that.
 

SuperManny

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Bleedred said:
Thoughts:
 
4.  Jonathan Kraft's instincts would have had him fight this....and it would have been the wrong instincts IMO.   We're far better off with Bob K as owner than we will be with Jonathan...unless Jonathan has learned some humility in the last 10 years working with Bob (pretty unlikley IMO). 
 
I don't see the benefit of accepting the punishments. Yes, you save some cash on lawyer fees but the NFL punishments have tarnished the Patriots brand based off of inconclusive evidence. The Patriots brand wasn't worse off by fighting the punishments even if it was destined to lose.
 

rodderick

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DeJesus Built My Hotrod said:
I live in a place where I hear about it constantly. I just laughed at a Dolphins fan who roots for renowned cheater and dirty player Ndamukong Suh.

I don't blame Kraft for anything. The reality is that Pats fans would draw ire no matter what. Its a byproduct of the team's success.
 
You think there's no difference between the "ire" the Patriots drew in 2005 and the ire they draw now? People don't give a shit about haters, people give a shit about their team's accomplishments being dismissed at every step.
 

denilson3

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Over the last week most of New England rallied behind the Patriots. That's all gone now. The NFL put him in this position but Kraft just screwed himself badly.
 
It's one thing to release a statement that you won't appeal given how hard it would be to win, but to go up there and say you respect the commissioner after everything that's happened during the past year is just a giant middle finger to your best fans. I want nothing to do with any of this old boy's network bullshit.
 

ragnarok725

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Trautwein's Degree said:
Exactly. Bob Kraft knows exactly what he's doing. And aside from Brady, has more skin in this game than anyone. Whether his options are limited, he made a deal for Brady, or he's determined that the PR hit of continuing this dings his bottom line - he made a well informed good choice. 
 
A well informed good choice for Robert Kraft does not necessarily align with a well informed good choice for fans of the Patriots, or fans of the NFL, though - right? He's weighing a different set of pros and cons in fighting it than the rest of us would tabulate.
 

Dead Balls

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I wonder how many people have been turned off to the NFL like I have by all of this?  I'm done.  This is WWF level ridiculousness. 
 

timelysarcasm

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canvass ali said:
Kraft is pissed and is going to stay pissed.  My optimistic hope is that he wants to hold the higher moral ground in the mind of his fellow owners as he begins the backstage campaign against Goodell.
 
Who the hell cares at that point? They boned us - repeatedly - and the legacy of cheaters is cemented. Getting a new commish does nothing.
 

BusRaker

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The league and fans of the other 31 teams think it's totally acceptable to "handicap" the Patriots because we win so much.

If this was happening to the Browns ....
 

Reverend

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rodderick said:
 
Maybe a fucking Jets fan should think about stepping away from the discussion when it's half an hour old and clearly involves an emotional subject to Pats fans here.
 
Eh, he likes trolling for emotional reactions. Don't feed the troll, maybe? We can handle it if he gets really far out of line. In some ways, he's not wrong. "Fan" is short for fanatic, yeah? Most fans have some kind of irrational belief at some point or another--that's almost part of the point.
 
Hell, SeanBerry himself thought Sanchise was going to pan out and get good. :)
 

Traut

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BigJimEd said:
but that's the difference between the owner and the fans. Owner worries about line. Fans only worry about on the field. First and forth round pick hurts that.
But he can't change that. That penalty was, from my understanding, never going to be successfully appealed. Kraft would have been waging a battle he knew he was going to lose. The purpose of which would have been to undermine Goodell. 
 

Stitch01

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fairlee76 said:
Not to single you out, but who gives a shit about what opposing fans say?  I'm going to Denver to visit family this weekend and I am sure there'll be plenty of deflategate talk.  Just like there was still Spygate talk a year ago. I do think that reasonable fans know this entire saga is bullshit, that everyone doctors footballs, and that the Pats got screwed here.  And hell, a lot of the NFL viewing public lives in shitholes like Cleveland, Jacksonville, and Houston.  Let them have their little moment :).
 
I do agree with whoever said Kraft should have spent more time addressing the fact that the league needs to clean up how the footballs are handled pre-game.  Stronger protocols, precise gauging and tracking, etc.
Not sure why you would think you were singling me out, Im not mad at Kraft.  I just think maybe before asking if we "maybe are the worst fans ever", we can give people some time to vent.
 

joe dokes

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rodderick said:
 
Maybe a fucking Jets fan should think about stepping away from the discussion when it's half an hour old and clearly involves an emotional subject to Pats fans here.
 
Or maybe this is just a good time to practice laughing at the fans whose favorite team's *only* football success is schadenfreude.
 

ernieshore

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Honest question - any chance this is a move by Kraft to get the owners back on his side, and then ultimately oust Goodell?
 
Though from all the reports of Kraft and Roger bro-hugging, it doesn't sound like it. 
 

TheoShmeo

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How could anyone here know jack shit about how Bob Kraft and Jonathon would differ on this matter?
 
I get that people are pissed but please, unless you have some kind of inside track, knowing the differences in how this father and son think and would react is virtually impossible.
 
My guess -- and it's only that -- is that they are 100% simpatico on this decision, whether you like what they decided or not. 
 
Have we ever heard a single report about them differing on anything significant regarding the Pats, especially after a firm decision was reached?
 

Smiling Joe Hesketh

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fairlee76

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Stitch01 said:
Not sure why you would think you were singling me out, Im not mad at Kraft.  I just think maybe before asking if we "maybe are the worst fans ever", we can give people some time to vent.
No worries.  I was thinking more about the opposing fan angle than anything to do with Kraft.
 

rodderick

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dcmissle said:
Now see, THAT is interesting. No flowers in that statement.

There was clearly further downside to Kraft that people here have no focused on. Not in terms of guilt/innocence in this matter. Broader things more important over the long haul.
 
Like what? They are getting railroaded with penalties and Kraft will be known as a cheater and everything he ever accomplished as an owner will forever be put to question. Now, fans of his team are also starting to turn against him and think he was weak in his response. What bigger, more important things was he wise to prioritize here?
 

RedOctober3829

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On that Bedard tweet, I wouldn't expect the NFL to come out and publicly say that Kraft's acceptance included a reduction of the Brady suspension.  That would be terrible precedent.  The appeal will still have to happen.
 

tedseye

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Remember what the under - the - table deal was in the Cuban Missile Crisis: Soviets remove missiles from Cuba. No deal is announced. U.S. and Soviets privately agree that several months later, U.S. will remove it's missiles from Turkey, saying they had become obsolete and we had been planning to remove them anyway. Public explanation for decades is there is no connection between the two withdrawals.

Watch for "independent" action by Goodell sometime soon.
 

denilson3

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TheoShmeo said:
How could anyone here know jack shit about how Bob Kraft and Jonathon would differ on this matter?
 
I get that people are pissed but please, unless you have some kind of inside track, knowing the differences in how this father and son think and would react is virtually impossible.
 
My guess -- and it's only that -- is that they are 100% simpatico on this decision, whether you like what they decided or not. 
 
Have we ever heard a single report about them differing on anything significant regarding the Pats, especially after a firm decision was reached?
 
My track is more inside than yours is.
 

ragnarok725

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dcmissle said:
Now see, THAT is interesting. No flowers in that statement.

There was clearly further downside to Kraft that people here have no focused on. Not in terms of guilt/innocence in this matter. Broader things more important over the long haul.
 
More important to whom? How much do we care whether it's Kraft or some other power broker that gets a seat at the next CBA negotiation? Or what committees Kraft gets to chair? Do we care about it more than seeing that the truth about this farcical investigation come to light (even discounting the possibility of any real concessions being made)?
 

Smiling Joe Hesketh

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Trautwein's Degree said:
But he can't change that. That penalty was, from my understanding, never going to be successfully appealed. Kraft would have been waging a battle he knew he was going to lose. The purpose of which would have been to undermine Goodell. 
And that would have been a noble goal which would have made the league better.
 

Ed Hillel

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RedOctober3829 said:
On that Bedard tweet, I wouldn't expect the NFL to come out and publicly say that Kraft's acceptance included a reduction of the Brady suspension.  That would be terrible precedent.  The appeal will still have to happen.
 
Well, the NFL wouldn't want to go around setting a terrible precedent or anything...
 

Bleedred

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SuperManny said:
 
I don't see the benefit of accepting the punishments. Yes, you save some cash on lawyer fees but the NFL punishments have tarnished the Patriots brand based off of inconclusive evidence. The Patriots brand wasn't worse off by fighting the punishments even if it was destined to lose.
Maybe so...except that going fully nuclear on the NFL and losing serves no purpose either.  It may satisfy our bloodlust for the injustice of the penalty, but after costing the NFL and NEPatriots millions, and then losing....where are we?  We'd then be the pariah of the league among the owners (much worse so than we are now).   
 

joe dokes

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rodderick said:
 
You think there's no difference between the "ire" the Patriots drew in 2005 and the ire they draw now? People don't give a shit about haters, people give a shit about their team's accomplishments being dismissed at every step.
 
Really? Other than players, of course, do fans really feel this way?
 

Reverend

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fairlee76 said:
Not to single you out, but who gives a shit about what opposing fans say?  I'm going to Denver to visit family this weekend and I am sure there'll be plenty of deflategate talk.  Just like there was still Spygate talk a year ago. I do think that reasonable fans know this entire saga is bullshit, that everyone doctors footballs, and that the Pats got screwed here.  And hell, a lot of the NFL viewing public lives in shitholes like Cleveland, Jacksonville, and Houston.  Let them have their little moment :).
 

 
Somebody should slap a Tom Brady jersey on that cat.
 

DennyDoyle'sBoil

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dcmissle said:
Now see, THAT is interesting. No flowers in that statement.

There was clearly further downside to Kraft that people here have no focused on. Not in terms of guilt/innocence in this matter. Broader things more important over the long haul.
 
The owner of the Texans probably believes, genuinely, that the Patriots were guilty and were caught.  None of the details that intrigue us are probably even on his radar.  He may be misinformed.  He may have his head in the sand, but I think it's highly likely that is what he genuinely believes.  
 
That's really the part that I think people find hard to believe and hard to stomach.  But the things that other owners are saying are exactly what I would imagine myself saying if I didn't follow every twist and turn in this saga.
 
In fact, this is what I expect Bob Kraft would say if this were all happening with the Broncos.
 

Stitch01

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Rudy Pemberton said:
 
thankfully, we all have you here every step of the way to educate us. how's the air up there on your horse?
Not sure why that raised your ire, he's right (about the consequences to fighting)
 

GregHarris

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Money is that much of a factor, really?  His TP is made out of 100's at this point, and his family is set for generations.  There's got to be a lot more at stake.
 

CSteinhardt

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Dead Balls said:
I wonder how many people have been turned off to the NFL like I have by all of this?  I'm done.  This is WWF level ridiculousness. 
 
As an Eagles fan, that's where I end up on all of this.  I'll still watch Eagles games, but I'm not paying the NFL for their product anymore.  I like the NFL, and I like the WWE, but I like my football separate from my wrestling.  And when Chip Kelly pulls off some sort of magic 4-QB formation with Tebow and wins a Super Bowl, I don't want the whining from other teams that they're not playing nice, and I don't want the complaints from Patriots fans that it's not a level playing field to be legitimate.  I want the Eagles to win a Super Bowl because they're the best team in the NFL, not because the commissioner decided it was our turn, and I'm no longer confident that would be the case.  I hope you guys go 15-1 this season.
 

Bleedred

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TheoShmeo said:
How could anyone here know jack shit about how Bob Kraft and Jonathon would differ on this matter?
 
I get that people are pissed but please, unless you have some kind of inside track, knowing the differences in how this father and son think and would react is virtually impossible.
 
My guess -- and it's only that -- is that they are 100% simpatico on this decision, whether you like what they decided or not. 
 
Have we ever heard a single report about them differing on anything significant regarding the Pats, especially after a firm decision was reached?
Unless of course you've worked with them; opposite them in other contexts (i.e.  non-football)   
 

ShaneTrot

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DeJesus Built My Hotrod said:
I live in a place where I hear about it constantly. I just laughed at a Dolphins fan who roots for renowned cheater and dirty player Ndamukong Suh.

I don't blame Kraft for anything. The reality is that Pats fans would draw ire no matter what. Its a byproduct of the team's success.
You are exactly right. No one cares that MN heated footballs last year because they suck. I wouldn't trade being a Pats fan for any other football fandom. Plus the maulings they will be handing out next year will be epic.
 

ragnarok725

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Trautwein's Degree said:
But he can't change that. That penalty was, from my understanding, never going to be successfully appealed. Kraft would have been waging a battle he knew he was going to lose. The purpose of which would have been to undermine Goodell. 
 
...certainly sounds like a worthy cause to me. And if he gave up the opportunity to do that to stay in the good graces of other owners... be it for profit or power of some kind... well I don't love that decision.
 

ifmanis5

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Kraft did the smart thing. Even a total exoneration in court isn't going to change anyone's mind at this point, so why fight i? It's just more bad publicity cycles with not much upside.
 

DennyDoyle'sBoil

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PedroKsBambino said:
 
Figured the idiot writer mischaracterized the quote.  That's exactly the kind of flowery comment I'd expect
 
He didn't just mischaracterize it, he actually misquoted it -- he put words in quotes that aren't actually in the statement.