2023 Post-Mortem - The Hitting.

Rovin Romine

Johnny Rico
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Jul 14, 2005
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I thought some dedicated threads re: How things went in 2023 might be useful. (I'll let someone else do the post-mortem pitching thread.)

Overall, it was a disappointing year re: hitting. At the end of the day it seems the majority of the players left something significant on the table. Not that they sucked (in some cases) but that they didn't trend the right way, or fell apart at some point. As far as the mainstays went, we had reasonable expectations for most of them:

Wong/McGuire should have been just under league average, with McGuire hitting and Wong showing power/speed.​
Casas should have been an offensive plus.​
Arroyo/Mondesi should have been league average.​
Hernandez/Chang/Story should have been average to plus. (With Chang a clear minus and Story offsetting that.)​
Devers should have been a major offensive plus.​
Verdugo/Duvall/Yoshida/Refsnyder should all have been positive offensive contributors of one degree or another.​
Turner a bit of a candidate to regress, but at least an average DH.​
Instead, I'd say that the only expectations that were met were: Casas and Duvall. IMO, Turner slightly over-performed, and the main offensive plus in the OF turned out to be Duran, who had been written off by most (including myself) as a AAAA type player. Pablo Reyes turned out to be a great-pickup, but the rest (SSS Abreu excepted), be they opening-day roster players, expected replacements, stop gaps, callups, or traded-for players, ranged from mildly to majorly disappointing, considering their careers to date.​
We can look at it this way.​

Players who should have stepped forward but did not/mildly regressed:
Devers. His age 26 season (this one) had a lower OPS and OPS+ than his 3 previous full seasons.​
Verdugo. His age 27 season (this one) had a slightly higher OPS. . .but by OPS+ he's been trending mildly down for 3 seasons now.​
Yoshida. I'm putting him here due to his second-half fade to black.​
Wong/McGuire. Seem to be in the same "bottom quartile" of expected results.​
Urias. Bounced back from his MIL experience, but again, short of his better years.​

Players who absolutely cratered offensively:
Story. Yes, there was injury, but his approach was not optimal when he came back.​
Hernandez. Awful. Went on to hit much better in LAD.​
Arroyo. Two years of just-above league average OPS+ to an 80.​
Refsnyder. 143 OPS+ to 87. Some might be less than ideal platoon use? Overall, a huge step back.​
Alfaro. Yes, a stopgap, but just terrible as opposed to prior years.​
Tapia. Same.​
Chang. Never great, somehow worse than before.​
Dalbec. Same.​

Players who were called up: either did well then cratered, or just failed (SSS or not):
Dalbec, Rafaela, Hamilton. (Alfaro and Tapia could go here also.)​

Players who were average/positive call-ups:
Valdez, Abreu.​

Players who were failed rehabs/acquisitions (e.g., signed/acquired for unrealized potential.)
Mondesi, Tapia, Alfaro, Chang (?), Urias(?)​

Players who were positive rehabs/acquisitions:
Pablo Reyes.​

Players who Improved, Held Fast, or were Bright Spots:
Improved:​
Casas. And even there he had a long transition to being a ML hitter.​
Duran. Revamped swing in minors, then slumped and recovered at the ML level.​
Held Fast/slightly improved:​
Turner. Vet from outside org, kept career pattern, but beat aging curve.​
Duval. Vet from outside org, kept career pattern (to extent there is one, but 2023 wasn't a great leap forward.)​
Bright Spots:​
Abreu. SSS. Hot bat straight from the minors.​
Maybe Valdez? Relatively SSS, but basically the league-average bat as expected.​
Maybe Pablo Reyes? He was certainly useful, but it's hard to say whether he improved or just had opportunity.​

I think the above is a pretty strong indictment of the field staff/hitting coaches.

First off, the caveats: I don't expect miracles. I don't expect the coaching to rehabilitate everyone. I expect some positives and some negatives. I know they don't control injuries, and there will always be a player that's resistant to the message/method other players embrace. It's a long season, and players will slump and recover, etc. etc. etc.

Yet here. . .I think the only positives that the hitting coaches seem to have their fingerprints on are Casas and Duran. And it's notable they're both kind of freaks - Casas in terms of his batting eye, and Duran in terms of his speed. And even so, Casas had a very long adjustment period, so given the suck-fest everywhere else in the lineup, you have to wonder if Casas's adjustment period mightn't have been shortened. But at least he didn't slump later - so that remains a strong positive. Duran hit well, slumped at the ML level and came back. I think Duran's the best feather in the hitting coaches cap. It's what you want them to do (or preside over) - fixing hitters, getting what they can out of them.

As noted above, everyone else seemed to backslide substantially or mildly, apart from two vets from outside the system (Turner and Duval).

Particularly disappointing was the inability to get Yoshida or Story back on track later in the season. Or unstick Hernandez or Arroyo. Or get Devers and Verdugo to take a step forward. I mean, slumps and streaks aside, these are years where they should be plateauing or growing as hitters, not trending downward after 162 games.

(Which is why I think it's absolutely insane they want to go around again with the same field staff. They don't really have a track record of hitters flourishing under their watch.)

I'm open to the possibility that more sophisticated number crunching might tell a different tale. But the season writ-large seems highly suggestive, if not conclusive, to me.

Anyone want to have a go at it?
 
Last edited:

Sandy Leon Trotsky

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Mar 11, 2007
6,489
I thought some dedicated threads re: How things went in 2023 might be useful. (I'll let someone else do the post-mortem pitching thread.)

Overall, it was a disappointing year re: hitting. At the end of the day it seems the majority of the players left something significant on the table. Not that they sucked (in some cases) but that they didn't trend the right way, or fell apart at some point. As far as the mainstays went, we had reasonable expectations for most of them:

Wong/McGuire should have been just under league average, with McGuire hitting and Wong showing power/speed.​
Casas should have been an offensive plus.​
Arroyo/Mondesi should have been league average.​
Hernandez/Chang/Story should have been average to plus. (With Chang a clear minus and Story offsetting that.)​
Devers should have been a major offensive plus.​
Verdugo/Duvall/Yoshida/Refsnyder should all have been positive offensive contributors of one degree or another.​
Turner a bit of a candidate to regress, but at least an average DH.​
Instead, I'd say that the only expectations that were met were: Casas and Duvall. IMO, Turner slightly over-performed, and the main offensive plus in the OF turned out to be Duran, who had been written off by most (including myself) as a AAAA type player. Pablo Reyes turned out to be a great-pickup, but the rest (SSS Abreu excepted), be they opening-day roster players, expected replacements, stop gaps, callups, or traded-for players, ranged from mildly to majorly disappointing, considering their careers to date.​
We can look at it this way.​

Players who should have stepped forward but did not/mildly regressed:
Devers. His age 26 season (this one) had a lower OPS and OPS+ than his 3 previous full seasons.​
Verdugo. His age 27 season (this one) had a slightly higher OPS. . .but by OPS+ he's been trending mildly down for 3 seasons now.​
Yoshida. I'm putting him here due to his second-half fade to black.​
Wong/McGuire. Seem to be in the same "bottom quartile" of expected results.​
Urias. Bounced back from his MIL experience, but again, short of his better years.​

Players who absolutely cratered offensively:
Story. Yes, there was injury, but his approach was not optimal when he came back.​
Hernandez. Awful. Went on to hit much better in LAD.​
Arroyo. Two years of just-above league average OPS+ to an 80.​
Refsnyder. 143 OPS+ to 87. Some might be less than ideal platoon use? Overall, a huge step back.​
Alfaro. Yes, a stopgap, but just terrible as opposed to prior years.​
Tapia. Same.​
Chang. Never great, somehow worse than before.​
Dalbec. Same.​

Players who were called up: either did well then cratered, or just failed (SSS or not):
Dalbec, Rafaela, Hamilton. (Alfaro and Tapia could go here also.)​

Players who were average/positive call-ups:
Valdez, Abreu.​

Players who were failed rehabs/acquisitions (e.g., signed/acquired for unrealized potential.)
Mondesi, Tapia, Alfaro, Chang (?), Urias(?)​

Players who were positive rehabs/acquisitions:
Pablo Reyes.​

Players who Improved, Held Fast, or were Bright Spots:
Improved:​
Casas. And even there he had a long transition to being a ML hitter.​
Duran. Revamped swing in minors, then slumped and recovered at the ML level.​
Held Fast/slightly improved:​
Turner. Vet from outside org, kept career pattern, but beat aging curve.​
Duval. Vet from outside org, kept career pattern (to extent there is one, but 2023 wasn't a great leap forward.)​
Bright Spots:​
Abreu. SSS. Hot bat straight from the minors.​
Maybe Valdez? Relatively SSS, but basically the league-average bat as expected.​
Maybe Pablo Reyes? He was certainly useful, but it's hard to say whether he improved or just had opportunity.​

I think the above is a pretty strong indictment of the field staff/hitting coaches.

First off, the caveats: I don't expect miracles. I don't expect the coaching to rehabilitate everyone. I expect some positives and some negatives. I know they don't control injuries, and there will always be a player that's resistant to the message/method other players embrace. It's a long season, and players will slump and recover, etc. etc. etc.

Yet here. . .I think the only positives that the hitting coaches seem to have their fingerprints on are Casas and Duran. And it's notable they're both kind of freaks - Casas in terms of his batting eye, and Duran in terms of his speed. And even so, Casas had a very long adjustment period, so given the suck-fest everywhere else in the lineup, you have to wonder if Casas's adjustment period mightn't have been shortened. But at least he didn't slump later - so that remains a strong positive. Duran hit well, slumped at the ML level and came back. I think Duran's the best feather in the hitting coaches cap. It's what you want them to do (or preside over) - fixing hitters, getting what they can out of them.

As noted above, everyone else seemed to backslide substantially or mildly, apart from two vets from outside the system (Turner and Duval).

Particularly disappointing was the inability to get Yoshida or Story back on track later in the season. Or unstick Hernandez or Arroyo. Or get Devers and Verdugo to take a step forward. I mean, slumps and streaks aside, these are years where they should be plateauing or growing as hitters, not trending downward after 162 games.

(Which is why I think it's absolutely insane they want to go around again with the same field staff. They don't really have a track record of hitters flourishing under their watch.)

I'm open to the possibility that more sophisticated number crunching might tell a different tale. But the season writ-large seems highly suggestive, if not conclusive, to me.

Anyone want to have a go at it?
I don't really know how to look this up but if you break the team down individual by individual, there's almost no way to think that they were a weak offensive team. But the team would (this is what I don't know how to look up... and I don't think it correlates to "against good pitching" or "against shitty pitching" either)... but this team was more Collective Jekkyl and Hyde than any team I can recall. The assumption over a year is that all players will slump but other players will have a good streak at the same time which balances out the overall offense but this just wasn't the case. Again... could be completely off and I suspect that won't be the case as much going forward. But... I also think that there's some general coaching there that can help. I know the best case for scoring is to swing for the fences but when the team gets collectively constipated, I really think the best option at times is to play for the slap single, stolen base, sac fly- which is one of the reasons I'm hesitant to trade Duran. His injury lines up pretty perfectly with the team playing like garbage (and his offensive ascent to them playing good). I hate to use the phrase, "spark plug" (more like butt-plug, Ted!) but damnit that kid really did seem to create some heat.
 

zenax

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Apr 12, 2023
360
I don't really know how to look this up but if you break the team down individual by individual, there's almost no way to think that they were a weak offensive team.
Well, the answer I'm including from bb-ref only includes batting RHB/LHB at the different parks by the Red Sox (sorted by OPS); however, Red Sox LHB at Fenway had an .835 OPS while their RHB had a .754 OPS at home.
https://www.baseball-reference.com/teams/split.cgi?t=b&team=BOS&year=2023#plats::18
 

Rovin Romine

Johnny Rico
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Jul 14, 2005
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I don't really know how to look this up but if you break the team down individual by individual, there's almost no way to think that they were a weak offensive team. But the team would (this is what I don't know how to look up... and I don't think it correlates to "against good pitching" or "against shitty pitching" either)... but this team was more Collective Jekkyl and Hyde than any team I can recall. The assumption over a year is that all players will slump but other players will have a good streak at the same time which balances out the overall offense but this just wasn't the case. Again... could be completely off and I suspect that won't be the case as much going forward. But... I also think that there's some general coaching there that can help. I know the best case for scoring is to swing for the fences but when the team gets collectively constipated, I really think the best option at times is to play for the slap single, stolen base, sac fly- which is one of the reasons I'm hesitant to trade Duran. His injury lines up pretty perfectly with the team playing like garbage (and his offensive ascent to them playing good). I hate to use the phrase, "spark plug" (more like butt-plug, Ted!) but damnit that kid really did seem to create some heat.
They were certainly streaky. But I don't think the results of this year are merely the clustering of hot streaks (wasting runs) and cold streaks (causing losses.) It's the fact that over 162 the field staff is getting less out of what they have. I don't know where that comes from, or if it's correctable. But for all the fact that they were offensively adequate as a club (6th in runs, I think), it's not a good sign when your best hitters stagnate, and you can't get any production out of the supporting cast.
 

sezwho

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Jul 20, 2005
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Isle of Plum
They were certainly streaky. But I don't think the results of this year are merely the clustering of hot streaks (wasting runs) and cold streaks (causing losses.) It's the fact that over 162 the field staff is getting less out of what they have. I don't know where that comes from, or if it's correctable. But for all the fact that they were offensively adequate as a club (6th in runs, I think), it's not a good sign when your best hitters stagnate, and you can't get any production out of the supporting cast.
Bats can be streaky in a way speed isn’t and once Duran went down they seemed very slugging dependent to score runs. It’s why I’m perhaps a bit more optimistic than others of a lineup starting both he and Ceddanne. Abreu looks quick too. It’s more than just steals, though somehow pitch clock seemed to occasionally exacerbate pitcher anxiety from a real threat on basepaths and things spiraled sometimes…like double steals and errors.
 

nvalvo

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Jul 16, 2005
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Rogers Park
Bats can be streaky in a way speed isn’t and once Duran went down they seemed very slugging dependent to score runs. It’s why I’m perhaps a bit more optimistic than others of a lineup starting both he and Ceddanne. Abreu looks quick too. It’s more than just steals, though somehow pitch clock seemed to occasionally exacerbate pitcher anxiety from a real threat on basepaths and things spiraled sometimes…like double steals and errors.
Story is just as fast as those two guys — Duran 29.5 max ft/sec; Story 28.8; Rafaela 28.7 — if he ever gets on base again.
 

jon abbey

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Jul 15, 2005
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I don't really know how to look this up but if you break the team down individual by individual, there's almost no way to think that they were a weak offensive team. But the team would (this is what I don't know how to look up... and I don't think it correlates to "against good pitching" or "against shitty pitching" either)... but this team was more Collective Jekkyl and Hyde than any team I can recall. The assumption over a year is that all players will slump but other players will have a good streak at the same time which balances out the overall offense but this just wasn't the case. Again... could be completely off and I suspect that won't be the case as much going forward. But... I also think that there's some general coaching there that can help. I know the best case for scoring is to swing for the fences but when the team gets collectively constipated, I really think the best option at times is to play for the slap single, stolen base, sac fly- which is one of the reasons I'm hesitant to trade Duran. His injury lines up pretty perfectly with the team playing like garbage (and his offensive ascent to them playing good). I hate to use the phrase, "spark plug" (more like butt-plug, Ted!) but damnit that kid really did seem to create some heat.
BOS was 43-39 when Duran started, 35-45 when he didn’t, so that backs you up some. Of course they were 44-42 with Keekay starting, so who knows.
 

derekson

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Jun 26, 2010
6,254
They were certainly streaky. But I don't think the results of this year are merely the clustering of hot streaks (wasting runs) and cold streaks (causing losses.) It's the fact that over 162 the field staff is getting less out of what they have. I don't know where that comes from, or if it's correctable. But for all the fact that they were offensively adequate as a club (6th in runs, I think), it's not a good sign when your best hitters stagnate, and you can't get any production out of the supporting cast.
The Red Sox were 6th in runs but only had a 100 OPS+. Fenway was a massive hitters' park.
 

Fishy1

Head Mason
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Nov 10, 2006
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The Red Sox were 6th in runs but only had a 100 OPS+. Fenway was a massive hitters' park.
I'll add to this that a lot of the guys who started hot faded hard. Verdugo and Yoshida in particular. In fact Verdugos wrc+ ended up being identical with Urias (98). Even Turner ended up with a WRC+ of 114, which is good, but not great. Casas and Duran, two of the teams hottest hitters, going down at the end of the season did not help things.