Wasn't Ayton the consensus #1 in most of these mocks because everyone knew Phoenix needed a big and was likely to pick him, rather than because the evaluators necessarily thought he was the best player? (That's usually how mock drafts work.)I just looked up a bunch of 2018 mock drafts, here's where he went:
4th (SI)
3rd (NBA Draft Room)
3rd (Business Insider)
3rd (BR)
2nd (NBA.com)
2nd (Forbes)
3rd (CBS Sports)
2nd (ESPN)
3rd (WaPo)
3rd (NBC Sports)
3rd (USA Today)
2nd (The Athletic)
Ayton was the consensus #1, nearly no one had Luka going first (no one with a column, anyway). Everyone mentions his playmaking, size and incredibly high floor, but plenty worried that his athleticism would keep him from being a superstar, which is what everyone is looking for with the #1 pick. That's not to say that the GMs who passed him over shouldn't pay the price, but it is 100% revisionist history to pretend that he was the surefire #1 and teams were reaching taking Ayton and Bagley (and Young, sort of) over him.
HRB starts off the thread really high on Luka and then slowly loses faith in him over the course of the year until proclaiming him like, the 10th best player on his board. It was like watching a straight A student start to dabble with pot and by the end he is strung out on the street corner.Luka blew past his “ceiling” of Toni Kukoc before he hit legal drinking age.
he lives n the second floorI'm so bummed because I was in Dallas in early December and caught a Mavs game - only time I've ever seen Luka play - and he was so...bleh in that game. I was hoping to see LUKA, but all I got was luka.
Generally teams don't draft for need when they have the 1st pick (not since the Jordan, anyway). If they don't need the player who is the consensus #1 they trade out. That said, here are some of the top prospect rankings from 2018 (from what I could find from those who differentiate between rankings and mock draft).Wasn't Ayton the consensus #1 in most of these mocks because everyone knew Phoenix needed a big and was likely to pick him, rather than because the evaluators necessarily thought he was the best player? (That's usually how mock drafts work.)
He was the consensus #1 before anyone knew Phoenix was going to be drafting first. Put simply you don’t often find guys with his combination of size/length/athleticism/power with the skill set to be a force in the modern NBA. He had Embiid type upside, and it’s understandable that Phoenix gambled on him.Wasn't Ayton the consensus #1 in most of these mocks because everyone knew Phoenix needed a big and was likely to pick him, rather than because the evaluators necessarily thought he was the best player? (That's usually how mock drafts work.)
I’m pretty serious. I agree Luka was going to be able to score better, and Ball was always likely to be the better defender. The point, however, is that a lot of people were higher on Ball than Luka before their respective drafts, and that the things that now make Luka wayyyy better were far from slam dunks at draft time.Lonzo Ball? Are you serious with that comp? Doncic was never going to be Lonzo Ball. He was always going to be a much better scorer.
Their defense is abysmal and Zion doesn’t look like the same guy.Pelicans are a bummer. I thought they might use the bubble to come out firing, but it's just not clicking for them. The Spurs enter halftime on pace to score ~120 and up by 18.
This.I just looked up a bunch of 2018 mock drafts, here's where he went:
4th (SI)
3rd (NBA Draft Room)
3rd (Business Insider)
3rd (BR)
2nd (NBA.com)
2nd (Forbes)
3rd (CBS Sports)
2nd (ESPN)
3rd (WaPo)
3rd (NBC Sports)
3rd (USA Today)
2nd (The Athletic)
Ayton was the consensus #1, nearly no one had Luka going first (no one with a column, anyway). Everyone mentions his playmaking, size and incredibly high floor, but plenty worried that his athleticism would keep him from being a superstar, which is what everyone is looking for with the #1 pick. That's not to say that the GMs who passed him over shouldn't pay the price, but it is 100% revisionist history to pretend that he was the surefire #1 and teams were reaching taking Ayton and Bagley (and Young, sort of) over him.
Mocks are to a large degree attempts to predict the draft, rather than straight rankings of best prospects, right? I just looked at the Ringer draft prep stuff - Ayton was mocked first, but all three of their Big Boards (KOC, Tjarks, Chau) had Doncic #1 in the individual ranker's opinion. My personal recollection is similar - a lot of media types felt that Doncic should go number one, but Ayton would. This article suggests that ESPN had Doncic #1 going into the draft, though they'd had Ayton and Porter Jr top at different points in the lead up. Also points out that there was lots of disagreement around the league as to who the best prospects were. Ayton was mocked number one all the time because it was clear the Suns were taking him.I just looked up a bunch of 2018 mock drafts, here's where he went:
4th (SI)
3rd (NBA Draft Room)
3rd (Business Insider)
3rd (BR)
2nd (NBA.com)
2nd (Forbes)
3rd (CBS Sports)
2nd (ESPN)
3rd (WaPo)
3rd (NBC Sports)
3rd (USA Today)
2nd (The Athletic)
Ayton was the consensus #1, nearly no one had Luka going first (no one with a column, anyway). Everyone mentions his playmaking, size and incredibly high floor, but plenty worried that his athleticism would keep him from being a superstar, which is what everyone is looking for with the #1 pick. That's not to say that the GMs who passed him over shouldn't pay the price, but it is 100% revisionist history to pretend that he was the surefire #1 and teams were reaching taking Ayton and Bagley (and Young, sort of) over him.
Pels are making a run, but I agree on Zion. Dude looks huge too. KOC was making a point on one of his recent pods that Zion doesn't look like the same defender he was at Duke.Their defense is abysmal and Zion doesn’t look like the same guy.
Derrick White just went down with a non- contact knee injury, which would be a tough blow for the Spurs chances of taking the 8th spot.
I'm sure some do that, but mocks are part best prospect ranking, part predicting who will be picked, and part saying who SHOULD be picked. No need to overthink this one: Most outlets had Ayton as the best prospect, Ayton as the player the Suns should pick, and Ayton as the player the Suns WOULD pick. Most people just missed on Luka having legit MVP upside, let alone getting to that level before age 21. Some people definitely got it right (the Ringer types being foremost among them) but it's pretty fair to say that Ayton was at the top of most boards, regardless of their purpose.Mocks are to a large degree attempts to predict the draft, rather than straight rankings of best prospects, right? I just looked at the Ringer draft prep stuff - Ayton was mocked first, but all three of their Big Boards (KOC, Tjarks, Chau) had Doncic #1 in the individual ranker's opinion. My personal recollection is similar - a lot of media types felt that Doncic should go number one, but Ayton would. This article suggests that ESPN had Doncic #1 going into the draft, though they'd had Ayton and Porter Jr top at different points in the lead up. Also points out that there was lots of disagreement around the league as to who the best prospects were. Ayton was mocked number one all the time because it was clear the Suns were taking him.
Even if there were rumors Doncic wouldn’t have played in Sactown, the smart move was still to make a deal like Atlanta did, trading down a spot or two and picking up a future pick for your trouble to take the same guy you wanted anyways.Taking Ayton was defensible, Bagley only so in so far as there were strong rumors that Doncic wasn't willing to go there.
Whether or not it was semi-accidental, Ainge nailed this non-move. What an albatross that contract would have been.Dame is at it again. Horford looks like he is 100 years old.
Yes, I didn’t want that contract but...I don’t really want Kemba’s either. Might ultimately be close to a wash from a pure value standpoint.Whether or not it was semi-accidental, Ainge nailed this non-move. What an albatross that contract would have been.
I wonder if Brogdon was ever a possibility. Would have been a really great fit and much cheaper.Yes, I didn’t want that contract but...I don’t really want Kemba’s either. Might ultimately be close to a wash from a pure value standpoint.
Yeah. Most of my Kemba concerns are health related and his size/age. Don’t fault Ainge for getting him but he’s going to be a very expensive 3rd or 4th option for the duration. Just have to hope the knee issue doesn’t linger.I wonder if Brogdon was ever a possibility. Would have been a really great fit and much cheaper.
In other news, Jabari Parker getting some run against the Rockets. On his 5th team, woof. I’m old enough to remember when I thought he could be the next Paul Pierce.
What even happened to jabari. He shoots a high percentage and seems capable of being an efficient 20 ppg scorer. Is his defense horrible? Or is it something else. I haven’t paid enough attention to his career to knowI wonder if Brogdon was ever a possibility. Would have been a really great fit and much cheaper.
In other news, Jabari Parker getting some run against the Rockets. On his 5th team, woof. I’m old enough to remember when I thought he could be the next Paul Pierce.
Two ACL tears in the same knee. The injury is bad enough but losing that crucial development time in the first 3-4 years is just brutal.What even happened to jabari. He shoots a high percentage and seems capable of being an efficient 20 ppg scorer. Is his defense horrible? Or is it something else. I haven’t paid enough attention to his career to know
He was never willing to put in the rehab work. He got his first knee injury in high school and put on about 30lbs, and not in a good way. The injuries just continued to pile up from there.What even happened to jabari. He shoots a high percentage and seems capable of being an efficient 20 ppg scorer. Is his defense horrible? Or is it something else. I haven’t paid enough attention to his career to know
The signs were there on Horford. His last year with the Celtics, he was noticeably getting worn down. I remember how spry he would look after 3 days rest. That probably told Ainge that he was no longer built for a starting role and a full NBA season.What an albatross that contract would have been.
EC 4-6 seeds*
MIA 43-27 (IND, OKC, IND)
IND 43-27 (MIA, HOU, MIA)
PHI 42-28 (PHX, TOR, HOU) - 1.0 GB
*In the event that MIA and IND finish with the same record, MIA wins the tiebreaker. PHI loses tiebreakers with MIA and IND.
WC play-in game
MEM 33-38 (BOS, MIL)
POR 33-39 (DAL, BRK) - 0.5 GB
SAS 31-38 (HOU, UTA) - 1.0 GB
PHX 31-39 (OKC, PHI, DAL) - 1.5 GB
Worn down to a nub because CBS continuously played him at the 5. @benhogan pointed it out many times.The signs were there on Horford. His last year with the Celtics, he was noticeably getting worn down. I remember how spry he would look after 3 days rest. That probably told Ainge that he was no longer built for a starting role and a full NBA season.
I think that you owe Hogan royalties for using "worn down to a nub"(TM).Worn down to a nub because CBS continuously played him at the 5. @benhogan pointed it out many times.
These are all (obviously) must win games for them and it's the first relevant run the Suns have had in years. Really disappointing.Ayton's post-draft stock just fell even more after the recent discussion about him...
View: https://twitter.com/GeraldBourguet/status/1292890991188353024?s=20
He's probably speeding to the court on a luggage cart with a hotel security escort clearing out the hallways ahead of him.Follow-up. We have a Doug Mirabelli situation with the player en-route to make the game haha.
View: https://twitter.com/ShamsCharania/status/1292892849483153410?s=20
Ayton has been cleared and is en route now to join the Suns for Thunder game, sources said.
Chicken parm in hand...He's probably speeding to the court on a luggage cart with a hotel security escort clearing out the hallways ahead of him.
Last 3 games Zion is scoring 24 ppg in just over 24 minutes, with 5.3 rebounds and 2.7 assists.Their defense is abysmal and Zion doesn’t look like the same guy.
Derrick White just went down with a non- contact knee injury, which would be a tough blow for the Spurs chances of taking the 8th spot.
Yeah, understatement. In 5 games in which his team was outscored by 39 (1 win in 5 games) his +/- was -97 in about 103 minutes. In the one game he didn't play, they won by 11 (against the Wizards, granted). A guy with his athleticism, strength and basketball IQ shouldn't be this bad on defense, ever.Last 3 games Zion is scoring 24 ppg in just over 24 minutes, with 5.3 rebounds and 2.7 assists.
Before the bubble he was 23 ppg in 29 minutes, 6.5 boards and 2.1 assists. But his +/- has fallen off a cliff from pre-bubble.
Sixers play PHX tomorrow at 4:30 p.m. They're off tonite.Embiid is out tonight with an ankle injury per Woj