Week 13 NFL game thread

[joe dokes]

Yeah the league had no choice but to suspend JuJu. I could be convinced that the hit itself was maybe legal, or right on the edge based on the rule as written and, under normal circumstances, worthy of nothing more than a fine. But in a game in which one of your teammates was carted off the field with what sure as shit looked like a spinal chord injury, you cannot stand over a guy you just demolished and taunt him when it's obvious he's hurt.

This seems right. Even if it was just your run-of-the-mill blown ACL on a completely legal play, standing over and taunting the injured guy might be suspendable. And the guy's teammates might not even have a problem with it.

(FWIW--not just you, but I've seen it a bunch of times...spinal cord (no 'h'))

 

[Captaincoop]

I am in the minority here, but thought JuJu put on a clean hit. VIOLENT, but clean. Impact was primarily JuJu shoulder to Burfict Sternum. Definitely some contact with sides of each helmet, but not leading with the head at all, and blocking a definite could be tackler. Standing over and taunting after the Shazier play was ugly and deserved a flag, but not sure this kid deserves a game suspension. The only one that looked like legit suspension to me was Iloka.

It sure looked like a textbook helmet-to-helmet shot, using the crown of his helmet to hit Burfict in the facemask, and a super dangerous one at that. And then some taunting thrown in as a cherry on the sundae.

 

[jercra]

There's a lot of talk about how to fix the concussion issues here and someone said it up thread, the players don't care. I was listening to Denver sports radio on my way home from lunch today and good portion of it was Brandon Stokley (retired 3 years ago) talking about how Bills players need to get revenge on Gronk when the Pats play the Bills next, no matter what form that takes. I highly doubt the attitude of the average locker room has changed that much since he was in the league. Not a single caller that I heard disagreed with them, but that's likely more to do with the nature of sports talk radio callers than the general fan.

 

[Leather]

That may be true, but Stokley’s career placed him on a Pats rival for almost his entire career. Including Indy and Denver. I think there’s a strong possibility he was throwing red meat to his listeners/former fans.

 

[Deathofthebambino]

It sure looked like a textbook helmet-to-helmet shot, using the crown of his helmet to hit Burfict in the facemask, and a super dangerous one at that. And then some taunting thrown in as a cherry on the sundae.

I'm with you. I don't even see the argument. The top of JuJu's helmet (because he lowered his head, although not as far as Shazier) hits Burfict square in the side of the chin. It's basically the same place a boxer is going for when they try to knock their opponent out (they don't aim for the forehead or the side of the head).

And if the taunting was the cherry on the sundae, then the fact that it was also an illegal blind side block in the head/neck area is the little candy pieces thrown all around. I mean, JuJu is clearly running towards/parallel to his own end zone, and he hits a defenseless player in the head/neck area. It's a textbook illegal blind side block.

This is pretty much exactly the type of hit that the league has tried to legislate out.

 

[KiltedFool]

He turned his head to the side as he went in, which isn't what you do if you're using your head as a weapon.

His suspension has been upheld. Iloka's will be decided tomorrow.

 

[johnmd20]

That may be true, but Stokley’s career placed him on a Pats rival for almost his entire career. Including Indy and Denver. I think there’s a strong possibility he was throwing red meat to his listeners/former fans.

Or maybe, just maybe, the players themselves just really do want to hurt the players on the other team to establish dominance?

 

[Leather]

Or maybe, just maybe, the players themselves just really do want to hurt the players on the other team to establish dominance?

Ahem. “That may be true, but...”

At some point, I have to believe the players (and their coaches) realize that rampant revenge tactics leave everyone open to injury and ultimately hurts everyone.

Anecdotally, has anyone “taken out” Suh? Talib? Burfict? I think it behooves the players to talk big and play up the drama and psych themselves up, but I have a hard time believing it actually happens on a regular basis.

 

[johnmd20]

Ahem. “That may be true, but...”

At some point, I have to believe the players (and their coaches) realize that rampant revenge tactics leave everyone open to injury and ultimately hurts everyone.

Anecdotally, has anyone “taken out” Suh? Talib? Burfict? I think it behooves the players to talk big and play up the drama and psych themselves up, but I have a hard time believing it actually happens on a regular basis.

Crabtree tried to punch Talib. Burfict got clobbered by a chop back block not two days ago. And there really isn't anything you can do about Suh because he's on the defensive line, he's rarely in a situation where he's vulnerable to a blindside hit.

You think these guys are just talking big? After the game Monday night, it seems like it's a heck of a lot more than talk. Point being, if the players don't seem to care about the health of well being of other players, it's hard to even envision a fix to this problem.

 

[Marciano490]

Crabtree tried to punch Talib. Burfict got clobbered by a chop back block not two days ago. And there really isn't anything you can do about Suh because he's on the defensive line, he's rarely in a situation where he's vulnerable to a blindside hit.

You think these guys are just talking big? After the game Monday night, it seems like it's a heck of a lot more than talk. Point being, if the players don't seem to care about the health of well being of other players, it's hard to even envision a fix to this problem.

I'm sure there's a "it won't happen to me" level of thinking going on with a lot of these guys. Remember, for the most part, the ones playing on Sundays are in the top whatever percentile of everything physically, including not getting injured or sick or having to deal with the normal physical limitations most of us encounter. Plus, they're young and that mindset behooves them as they get ready to play. I think you might be on to something here.

 

[Leather]

Look, I have no idea. I'm probably inserting my own variety of rationalism into an environment (an NFL locker room) where no such rationalism exists, or at least the motivating factors are completely beyond my ken.

 

[Kenny F'ing Powers]

I don't think there's a ton of player targeting.

I do KNOW that emotions get the best of people in competitive sports, and blowing motherfuckers up is an awesome feeling in football. Neither Gronk nor Juju walked to the line before the play planning their actions. Juju's presented itself on a platter with someone that concussed his fellow WR last season. Gronk lost his cool.

This shit will always happen in contact sports. At every level. Much to the chagrin of us stat nerds, people are not machines.

 

[BigJimEd]

Iloka suspension overturned

 

[Ralphwiggum]

I think it is probably pretty hard to exact revenge on a particular player on the field of play without it being completely obvious and drawing a penalty, and exposing yourself to the risk of a fine or suspension. I'm not saying it doesn't or can't happen, but it has to be (a) a player willing to take the penalty/fine/suspension, (b) good enough so that the coach doesn't cut or bench the player for being an idiot, or on a team where the "revenge" would be done with the tacit or implicit support of the coach, (c) who finds himself in proximity to the player he wants to cheap shot during a play, and (d) it probably has to be a divisional situation since non-divisional teams don't play each other frequently enough. Unless you have a team full of cheap shot artists with a coach who either thinks that stuff is part of the game, or lacks the institutional control within his locker room, it seems like situations for "revenge" shots would be few and far between. Which is maybe partly why the Steelers and Bengals keep playing this shit fest, ugly "AFC North" games.

 

[bakahump]

Its certainly not out of the realm that the Bills Secondary tries to tackle Low....but not too low. Whats Gronk Do? Stand up and push a Bill? He (and any player who does something as obvious and wrong as Gronk did) gave up his moral high ground about being tackled around the knee.

I just hope he gets through the Bills game without an injury or another PF/suspension and we can move on.

 

[RedOctober3829]

Steelers say that Ryan Shazier underwent spinal stabilization surgery last night in Pittsburgh.

 

[RedOctober3829]

NOT GOOD for Ryan Shazier. He is definitely done for the season and may never play football ever again.


Rapoport: #Steelers LB Ryan Shazier’s spinal surgery will necessitate months of recovery, sources say, before he considers a return to football. His season is over. A very difficult situation.