So the NFL couldn't get the tape, but if he asked for it he would've received it, and then he would've sent it to the NFL. So basically the NFL is incompetent and his failure to act created this?
The Ray Rice Debacle
- Thread starter amarshal2
- Start date
Ed Hillel said:
I tuned in late, but either way how is this not him trashing Goodell? If he could've gotten it certainly Goodell could've as well.
Not disagreeing with you, Ed. Just posing questions since nothing seemed to be cleared up by what I heard.
I'm not trying to restart the debate about whether the type of contact matters, but comments like this seem to do nothing to advance the discussion or resolve the open issues:
Harry Hooper said:
Not if he throws his owner under the bus. The NFL is like the mafia that way.
He'll toe the company line.
Ozzie has quotes or responses in the press release. He said that he asked Ray if he hit Janay and Ray said yes. However, he didn't go into further details.
Seriously. I'm shocked by the number of folks who are judging the overall business acumen of Goodell or Bisciotti by how good they look in a press conference.dcmissle said:
Ozzie has already said Ray gave them an accurrate account. It's still unclear what Bisciotti was saying in terms of whether he believed Ray gave them an accurate account. On the one hand, he said the video changed everything. On the other, he said that they had an accurate account from their security guy. He answered the hypothetical that Ray being drunk "could" have impacted his ability to accurately recall what happened, but he never said that Ray gave them an inaccurate account. That was one of the many softball questions that were leading in nature and basically were designed to absolve the Ravens of blame before the man even answered.
Bisciotti's role doesn't necessarily involve talking to the media. Some owners don't. They have people for that.Shelterdog said:
Goodell's job does. He is the public face of the league. When he clowns his way through a press conference, it's legit to question his acumen for the job he holds. If his talent lies in negotiations over TV deals, or finance, or opening new markets, he can do those things without taking a job where your average high school newspaper reporter could make him look like a stooge.
What's interesting -- and a bit jarring -- is that this is only the second time I recall seeing him in front of a microphone. The first time was when they canned Billick and hired Harbaugh.Shelterdog said:
He really has been a stealth owner and up to now an ideal owner. Let's the football guys do their stuff and is nearly invisible
I didn't watch the press conference but there are answers in the press release. As noted above, Ozzie asked him a leading question - "Did you hit her" - to which Ray said yes. Ozzie did not press for details. Darren Sanders (head of security) reports that the NJ police official told him it was unclear whether Ray punched or slapped Janay, but Ray told him that he slapped Janay.
No one alleges that Ray spoke to Bisciotti directly.
Perhaps I've seen too much of this, but it's pretty common for an abuser to let people think what they want to think. Ray Rice was not going around to people, "No, I didn't slap her, I f'ng threw an uppercut and knocked her out." Abusers describe the minimum necessary. If he tells the story and people think he slapped her and she hit her head on the wall and passed out, well, he's not going to correct them. If he tells his story and people think he hit her but both of them might have been drunk and there was other altercations that might minimize the effects, he's not going to correct them. Even to the high school students, he said "I hit her" but there's no way that any high school student would think that he did what he did.
And again, the one thing that no one seems to take into account is that the one thing that - in my opinion - Ray is almost certainly lying about is that this never happened before. There is no "Oh my god, what I have done?" moment that one would expect if this was something that never happened before.
https://twitter.com/jksports
Richard Deitsch @richarddeitsch 1m
Have not seen ESPN PR this aggressive defending reporting in some time. Tweet after tweet from @jksports and @ESPNprDScott on Ravens.
https://twitter.com/ESPNprDScott
Richard Deitsch @richarddeitsch 1m
Have not seen ESPN PR this aggressive defending reporting in some time. Tweet after tweet from @jksports and @ESPNprDScott on Ravens.
https://twitter.com/ESPNprDScott
wade boggs chicken dinner said:
I haven't really Zapruder-watched the film - is it obvious that he actually punched vs slapped her? I mean, he's certainly big and built enough that if he 'slapped' her it's not going to be a little slap, it's absolutely going to knock her into the wall. Other than some silly argument over whether he told them the technical truth or not, does it really matter if he hit her with an open vs closed hand?
I don't really see how this is something the Ravens can hang their hat on, that he said he just "slapped her". I feel like I'm watching some really odd law & order where a mafia goon is arguing "well, technically we didn't "crush" him with the baseball bat, we merely "smacked" him with it".
Watched the Ley interview. Obviously there are some factual disputes but I have to say that on the text message issue, I think Van Natta was stunned there were more than what he knew about and he seems to have the worst of the argument on that specific issue.
The Ravens are going to skate away untouched on this. Watch. When it is all said and done the NFL will have come down harder on the Steelers and Broncos for violating the salary cap during their Super Bowl winning seasons. The Ravens will skate through both NFL punishment and the court of public opinion.
What a farce.
What a farce.
Absolutely. Everyone involved has skin in the game and is motivated for this go away as quietly and as quickly as possibly......or as far away as it can. Goodell, Rice, the Ravens, the owners, the sponsors......everyone.Norm Siebern said:
It's kinda comical how this has now tuned into a "Did he punch her or slap her?" when all of western civilization has seen by now that she moved toward him and he HIT her!! What difference does a closed or open fist make?
Well then.
The Associated Press @AP 8m
BREAKING: Law enforcement official says he sent video to attention of NFL security chief Jeffrey Miller.
The Associated Press @AP 8m
BREAKING: Law enforcement official says he sent video to attention of NFL security chief Jeffrey Miller.
You get that? Originally AP's source told the AP that he/she did not want to identify Miller as recipient.Winger 03 said:
So Miller denies receiving it, and the source says, "Well fuck this then" and relieves AP of the restriction that Miller not be identified.
That dynamic has animated this story from the beginning -- the apparent boldfaced lying just prods fed up people to come forward.
If the head of security is doing his job he just might not show the quasi legally obtained tape to Goodell-plausible deniability and what not.DrewDawg said:
When high faulting lawyers are involved people go through all kinds of contortions to not see bad stuff so they can say "I never saw that."
Ed: Also think like a sneaky lawyer. The claim is that someone sent the video to the NFL and the response is "I never saw it"? Why not say we never got it? Perhaps NFL higher ups asked for it, got it, had it summarized for them but never actually saw it.
Sure that happens in large corporations. But it doesn't make sense to go through such gymnastics to justify a weak suspension for insignificant Ray Rice.Shelterdog said:
Curiouser and curiouser. Hard to believe Miller, as former Commissioner of Pa State Police, would flat-out lie--yet somebody from an NFL headquarters phone confirmed receipt. The sender, probably NJ State Police, likely knew Miller (refers to him as 'Jeff').
If, as seems likely, the NFL is the source of the leak that there's another Jeff Miller in Marketing, that sounds like a pathetic attempt to plead confusion. Obviously any NFL employee would know which Miller a Ray Rice tape was intended for.
If, as seems likely, the NFL is the source of the leak that there's another Jeff Miller in Marketing, that sounds like a pathetic attempt to plead confusion. Obviously any NFL employee would know which Miller a Ray Rice tape was intended for.
I believe the source specifically told AP that he/she didn't know Miller.lambeau said:
My guess is that Miller, rather than Goodell, ends up being the high-ranking person who loses his job over this. His denial was so emphatic and specific that I suspect it's true, but if so, the comedy of errors (or worse) that resulted in him not seeing this video is unlikely to reflect well on him.
maufman said:
It is not credible to believe that Miller's admin. viewed the video and did not give it to him.
Was coming to post the exact same thing.Papelbon's Poutine said:
If you work for the NFL why not show Goddell the video? And if you are RG why wouldn't you have wanted to see it? All it did was confirm what most people suspected anyway. If the answers to those questions are that he wanted to be lenient with Rice and therefore intentionally chose not to watch evidence that may have contradicted Rice's story, then "I didn't see it" should not save his job here.
That Wash Post article on NFL security a few weeks ago was eye opening. Who knows how much they've covered up in the past. That elevator video is the hand that pops out of the water at the end of Deliverance.
spoiler complaint in 3,2,1.....
spoiler complaint in 3,2,1.....