McAdam: “Full Throttle” may mean business as usual

[SouthernBoSox]

Several people on this board swore up and down that Bloom built an amazing farm system that was set up to win now and the next several centuries. And that ownership was absolutely begging him on bended knees to spend all the money in the world to win; the only thing holding them back was blooms absolutely infallible track record of valuation and making sure that they could only spend money on surefire winners like Corey Kluber. When I said that FSG seemed to have other priorities, I was told definitively that they have 20 years of success and that means their priorities could not have possibly changed. Given what I was told, how could this report be true?
Oh well. Full throttle!

Bloom was fired because he lacked conviction. Now, maybe that’s on the owner leadership, but there is evidence justifying Blooms departure.

He did massively clean up the payroll and build a very nice farm, albeit with pitching deficiencies.

The 2022 trade deadline was a clown show. Not getting under the luxury tax by a minor amount was horrible business.

The 2023 trade deadline completely lacked any sort of direction and the team crumbled.

We identified good free agents but was married to $/value. He correctly identified Zack Eflin as a great target, but refused to outbid the Rays for 3/$40mm. If you believe in that player, offer 3/$50 and go get them even if it isn’t of “value”. The Red Sox are in a much different spot if they get Eflin.

Bloom was clever and a good talent evaluator, but he lacked aggressiveness and conviction.

We will see if Breslow is more of the same and if he is maybe you can shift majority blame on ownership, but we aren’t quite there yet.

 

[lexrageorge]

Ok, I buy the premise that they are closer to top three than the fifth team by revenue, but the scarcity of elite free agents means that’s plenty far enough when you add in a couple GFINs. Now you are out of the top 5 basically every year for FAs (edit - unless you are the GFIN).

Was it @jon abbey that quoted Friedman up thread? "If you're always rational about every free agent, you will finish third on every free agent."

The trick is being irrational for the right free agents. I can see the Sox thinking Montgomery or Snell being the wrong free agents to be irrational about.

Regardless of whether the article is accurate, you have the the Dodgers, Mets, Yankees and probably at least Philadelphia all in positions to set the market for top tier free agents. The Red Sox clearly aren't involved in that space, except as a supplier of the talent - they are more of a Nordstrom's Rack type of shopper.

The owners of this team owe the fans nothing after all the joy they have provided however that's in the past. FSG now seems content to play the game where they develop talent and hope to catch lightning in a bottle. Spending money on elite FA guarantees nothing so this approach makes some sense. They just won't be competing for the big impact players when they are available.

The Red Sox do make more in revenues than either the Mets or the Phillies, and have much higher ticket prices than either as well. So I would expect them to be in on big name players from time to time. It’s OK to be slective (and I will be OK if they end up sitting out this particular feeding frenzy), but refusing to engage in that market at all in future seasons is simply not justified.

 

[BringBackMo]

Ok, McAdam has historically been a sober observer of what’s been going on, definitely a different branch than Sons of Dan Shaugnessy who drive so much of Boston media. BUT, I don’t think this piece says what is being characterized here.

This tidbit is NOT sourced to anyone with the Red Sox.

In the aftermath of the Yamamoto news, one industry official was speculating on how the Red Sox might pivot to find the necessary starting pitching. When I suggested free agent Jordan Montgomery as a good fall-back option, the official scoffed and offered that even Montgomery would be too expensive for the Red Sox’s current budget plans.

If the Sox are not going to spend in the top five of baseball teams, then I agree that it’s time for Henry to sell the team. But I remain dubious that this is the case. I continue to believe that we should see how the offseason unfolds before drawing conclusions.

 

[NickEsasky]

The trick is being irrational for the right free agents. I can see the Sox thinking Montgomery or Snell being the wrong free agents to be irrational about.


The Red Sox do make more in revenues than either the Mets or the Phillies, and have much higher ticket prices than either as well. So I would expect them to be in on big name players from time to time. It’s OK to be slective (and I will be OK if they end up sitting out this particular feeding frenzy), but refusing to engage in that market at all in future seasons is simply not justified.

When is there not going to be a feeding frenzy for free agents? The market just goes up year after year. Today’s prices will higher next year and the year after and the year after. Free agency is not an efficient use of money we all agree, but unless you’re providing all your own talent it’s a necessary evil. And if we count on what we have for 2024 then we’re unlikely to be competing for the playoffs.

 

[uncannymanny]

The owners of this team owe the fans nothing after all the joy they have provided however that's in the past.

I’m sorry, but why not? Fans paid for their tickets and TV packages in those seasons and, presumably, the team still plans to charge to view the team.

 

[BringBackMo]

Several people on this board swore up and down that Bloom built an amazing farm system that was set up to win now and the next several centuries. And that ownership was absolutely begging him on bended knees to spend all the money in the world to win; the only thing holding them back was blooms absolutely infallible track record of valuation and making sure that they could only spend money on surefire winners like Corey Kluber. When I said that FSG seemed to have other priorities, I was told definitively that they have 20 years of success and that means their priorities could not have possibly changed. Given what I was told, how could this report be true?
Oh well. Full throttle!

Nobody argued this. This is a complete mischaracterization of what people argued. Can you please post some examples of people making this argument?

The farm system is dramatically better than it was when Bloom was hired, and he wanted to continue to improve it. He got fired.

 

[InsideTheParker]

Maybe I missed it, but none of you ever seems to mention Imanaga anymore. Isn't he a free agent? Is he expected to cost too much? From what I read a while back, Brez is interested in him.

 

[lexrageorge]

When is there not going to be a feeding frenzy for free agents? The market just goes up year after year. Today’s prices will higher next year and the year after and the year after. Free agency is not an efficient use of money we all agree, but unless you’re providing all your own talent it’s a necessary evil. And if we count on what we have for 2024 then we’re unlikely to be competing for the playoffs.

Never claimed there wouldn’t be a feeding frenzy next offseason. Just pointing out that perhaps Montgomery or Snell are not viewed as highly by the Sox front office as others here believe they should be.

I will be surprised if the Sox don’t make a serious push for Imanaga. But nobody knows where the bidding will go or what his decision process will be.

 

[CoffeeNerdness]

Ok, McAdam has historically been a sober observer of what’s been going on, definitely a different branch than Sons of Dan Shaugnessy who drive so much of Boston media. BUT, I don’t think this piece says what is being characterized here.

This tidbit is NOT sourced to anyone with the Red Sox.

If the Sox are not going to spend in the top five of baseball teams, then I agree that it’s time for Henry to sell the team. But I remain dubious that this is the case. I continue to believe that we should see how the offseason unfolds before drawing conclusions.

Is Bloom currently employed in an official capacity? Sources seem likely to be Bloom, someone under Bloom who was fired as well, or one of the guys that got interviewed for the job Breslow got. Dave Bush since it's a pitching based query from McAdam?

 

[tims4wins]

I don't mind not breaking the bank for overrated talent, and I don't feel like there are a lot of can't miss free agents left (though I'm way less aware than I used to be).

I am completely opposed, however, to never breaking the bank for anyone.

And you could argue the one guy they did it for wasn’t one of those guys.

 

[brienc]

Since the owners are no longer speaking honestly to the fans, all we can do is read tea leaves. There seems to have been a sea change in the philosophy of ownership, which coincides with Gerry Cardinale buying 10% of Fenway Sports Group. So perhaps what he says here is an insight to the thinking at Fenway.

Where do we go from here

 

[6-5 Sadler]

Honestly we’re probably wasting too much time on a throwaway comment from an executive who’s not affiliated with the organization and has no idea of their budget expectations for next year.

On its face it doesn’t even make sense. The Sox have about $189M in salary and benefits committed to next year according Red Sox Payroll. The last 2 years they’ve been at $227M and $236M. Let’s say Montgomery gets $30M per year (I don’t think it’ll be that high), our payroll would still be less than prior years if we signed him (assuming no other moves). So I think it really is less about a willingness to spend and more about spending on the right talent.

 

[moondog80]

The 2022 trade deadline was a clown show.

You mean other than getting Wilyer Abreu and Emmnauel Valdez for 2 months of Christian Vazquez, while shedding Jake Dikeman's salary to pick up a catcher that had 3+ years of cost control and outperformed Vazquez the rest of that season (and Vaz went on to sign a deal that almost immediately went way underwater). But yes, the organization that won't spend did stay above the tax, which cost them a relatively small amount of draft capital that equated to far less than Abreu + Vazquez.

The 2023 trade deadline completely lacked any sort of direction and the team crumbled.

Would we be happy if they had the conviction of the Angels? Standing pat is just as much a decision as 100% sell or 100% buy, and can easily be justified by their circumstances.

He correctly identified Zack Eflin as a great target, but refused to outbid the Rays for 3/$40mm. If you believe in that player, offer 3/$50 and go get them even if it isn’t of

It's very well documented that Elfin wanted to go to Tampa, and didn't even ask Boston for a counter once TB matched Boston's offer.

 

[Fishercat]

Never claimed there wouldn’t be a feeding frenzy next offseason. Just pointing out that perhaps Montgomery or Snell are not viewed as highly by the Sox front office as others here believe they should be.

I will be surprised if the Sox don’t make a serious push for Imanaga. But nobody knows where the bidding will go or what his decision process will be.

I think this summarizes well why I'm not that scared of about FSG's spending quite yet even if I hated the Bloom to Breslow ordeal. We've had two very public FA hunts this off-season with both going to a bidder that made perfect sense to the FA that is willing to put money out there no other team is (including those in NY). Jordan Montgomery has been quite solid over the past few years but I can understand why an owner might be gunshy to commit 7/210 or something like that to a 30+ strong #2 starter type. Snell is extremely interesting but also has the problem so much of the Sox staff has - limited innings output leading to heavy pen and starter depth usage. Montgomery or Snell not being a Sox in 2024 might be disappointing but isn't a red flag to me yet. There will be other stuff that represents that.

 

[Fishercat]

You mean other than getting Wilyer Abreu and Emmnauel Valdez for 2 months of Christian Vazquez, while shedding Jake Dikeman's salary to pick up a catcher that had 3+ years of cost control and outperformed Vazquez the rest of that season (and Vaz went on to sign a deal that almost immediately went way underwater). But yes, the organization that won't spend did stay above the tax, which cost them a relatively small amount of draft capital that equated to far less than Abreu + Vazquez.



Would we be happy if they had the conviction of the Angels? Standing pat is just as much a decision as 100% sell or 100% buy, and can easily be justified by their circumstances.




It's very well documented that Elfin wanted to go to Tampa, and didn't even ask Boston for a counter once TB matched Boston's offer.

To add on to this, at least in 2023, Bloom did what most of the board said the Sox should do - stay pat and take a marginal upgrade if it came across. The team just collapsed. We can put that on who we want but very few people were screaming to sell or buy until it was obvious what the team was in September as opposed to July.

 

[Pedroia's Itchy Nose]

If true, then I think it's a big mistake to trade the top prospects for pitching. If the new watchword is mid-budget, then the only way the team is going to be in a really good position to win is hitting big on prospects.

 

[DeJesus Built My Hotrod]

I’m sorry, but why not? Fans paid for their tickets and TV packages in those seasons and, presumably, the team still plans to charge to view the team.

FSG owns the Sox and can do with them as they please. If they choose the path of not competing with Steve Cohen and the Dodgers for free agents, the only thing fans can do in response is spend their money on other forms of entertainment. Maybe that will move the needle but I suspect the Red Sox owners have a very good handle on how competitive they actually need to be to keep revenues growing - its probably not as much as we'd like.

Sports owners don't owe the fans anything but these people won multiple world series, starting with the one many of us thought we'd never see. I am entirely comfortable showing gratitude for that while acknowledging that it could be as far as this ownership group is willing to go to pursue championships. That doesn't mean they won't win another but given what we've seen of their interest in paying top tier talent, they aren't going to do so by signing a bunch of big name FAs to try and get them over the top.

 

[SouthernBoSox]

You mean other than getting Wilyer Abreu and Emmnauel Valdez for 2 months of Christian Vazquez, while shedding Jake Dikeman's salary to pick up a catcher that had 3+ years of cost control and outperformed Vazquez the rest of that season (and Vaz went on to sign a deal that almost immediately went way underwater). But yes, the organization that won't spend did stay above the tax, which cost them a relatively small amount of draft capital that equated to far less than Abreu + Vazquez.



Would we be happy if they had the conviction of the Angels? Standing pat is just as much a decision as 100% sell or 100% buy, and can easily be justified by their circumstances.




It's very well documented that Elfin wanted to go to Tampa, and didn't even ask Boston for a counter once TB matched Boston's offer.

Not getting under the 22 tax forced a situation where 23 was a must reset year. Selling, but not selling enough, to get under was bad business. I’m kinda stunned you are defending it.

The 2023 deadline accomplished zero things. It didn’t reinforce a team that needing reinforcements badly and it didn’t sell off short term assets. It’s not a defendable trade deadline.

I say those things as a Bloom defender btw. I like him a lot. But there were mistakes made

 

[6-5 Sadler]

A documented pursuit, but also one where it sure seems like they weren't really in it. They didn't get a second meeting, and we haven't heard much about what their offer was other than it was under $300M, which puts them at best a distant 4th. Pursuing guys by making offers you know they won't accept is a classic sports team move to show your fans "We tried" when you don't have any real intention of spending, by saying "we missed on the top guys, so we didn't overpay for lesser guys"

I’m not going to go overboard defending this ownership group because I think we should be spending substantially more than we do. I do however think their pursuit of YY was legitimate. There are multiple reports of a $300M initial offer - I know Passan refuted this by saying no official offers were made but I imagine to get an initial meeting teams had to discuss some parameters of how much they would be willing to offer. It sucks we didn’t get a visit but who knows how legitimate those were vs. YY being set on LA and taking meetings to drive up their offer.

 

[Petagine in a Bottle]

Henry is on record as being opposed to paying pitchers for their decline years; and he pivoted from Dombrowski to Bloom when he saw the Rays beat the Sox while he was paying a ton of money to an injured and expensive rotation of Sale, Price, Porcello, and Eovaldi. He moved on from Bloom to the pitching focused Breslow, yet we expect them to go back to the spending ways that got them Price and Sale, just now that they are almost out of it? Or to suddenly trade their top prospects and gut the system?

It’s frustrating to not win the offseason, but I am not sure signing Jordan Montgomery or Blake Snell is the quick fix anyways, and those guys will be on the payroll for a long time.

 

[Philip Jeff Frye]

I don't understand. We couldn't hope to extend Mookie, the best player this team has developed since Yaz, without ruining our future financial flexibility. We had to get under the luxury tax threshold to create future financial flexibility. We signed mediocre players like Duval and Kluber to short term contracts to create future financial flexibility. When are we going to take advantage of all this flexibility?

The Sox didn't bother to compete for marquee assets like Ohtani and Soto, made only an apparently half-hearted attempt to sign Yamamoto, and now we hear that Snell and Montgomery aren't the sorts to break the bank for. Any of these decisions is defensible in a vacuum, but together they start to look like a pattern.

Maybe all our financial downsizing in recent years is to increase the flexibility to pay out dividends to ownership?

 

[moondog80]

Not getting under the 22 tax forced a situation where 23 was a must reset year. Selling, but not selling enough, to get under was bad business. I’m kinda stunned you are defending it.

The 2023 deadline accomplished zero things. It didn’t reinforce a team that needing reinforcements badly and it didn’t sell off short term assets. It’s not a defendable trade deadline.

I say those things as a Bloom defender btw. I like him a lot. But there were mistakes made

I will buy that in 2023 they failed by not adding a starter or two at a time when it was a dire need. But in 2022 they had about a 1 in 3 shot at the postseason at the time of the deadline. I'm OK with staying over the tax there. It's also not clear to me that they would rocketted over the tax in a way that would have made a difference in 2023 even if they had reset in 2022.

 

[tims4wins]

I think this summarizes well why I'm not that scared of about FSG's spending quite yet even if I hated the Bloom to Breslow ordeal. We've had two very public FA hunts this off-season with both going to a bidder that made perfect sense to the FA that is willing to put money out there no other team is (including those in NY). Jordan Montgomery has been quite solid over the past few years but I can understand why an owner might be gunshy to commit 7/210 or something like that to a 30+ strong #2 starter type. Snell is extremely interesting but also has the problem so much of the Sox staff has - limited innings output leading to heavy pen and starter depth usage. Montgomery or Snell not being a Sox in 2024 might be disappointing but isn't a red flag to me yet. There will be other stuff that represents that.

Will, as in fait accompli? Ha.

I’m not going to go overboard defending this ownership group because I think we should be spending substantially more than we do. I do however think their pursuit of YY was legitimate. There are multiple reports of a $300M initial offer - I know Passan refuted this by saying no official offers were made but I imagine to get an initial meeting teams had to discuss some parameters of how much they would be willing to offer. It sucks we didn’t get a visit but who knows how legitimate those were vs. YY being set on LA and taking meetings to drive up their offer.

The pursuit may have been legit but to me it’s still a red flag if they truly thought they had a chance. Which seems to be the case. They seem delusional about the state of the franchise.

 

[bosockboy]

I’m not going to go overboard defending this ownership group because I think we should be spending substantially more than we do. I do however think their pursuit of YY was legitimate. There are multiple reports of a $300M initial offer - I know Passan refuted this by saying no official offers were made but I imagine to get an initial meeting teams had to discuss some parameters of how much they would be willing to offer. It sucks we didn’t get a visit but who knows how legitimate those were vs. YY being set on LA and taking meetings to drive up their offer.

Sadly, if Yoshida was part of the plan to lure Yamamoto, it was a spectacular failure.

 

[mikcou]

FSG owns the Sox and can do with them as they please. If they choose the path of not competing with Steve Cohen and the Dodgers for free agents, the only thing fans can do in response is spend their money on other forms of entertainment. Maybe that will move the needle but I suspect the Red Sox owners have a very good handle on how competitive they actually need to be to keep revenues growing - its probably not as much as we'd like.

Sports owners don't owe the fans anything but these people won multiple world series, starting with the one many of us thought we'd never see. I am entirely comfortable showing gratitude for that while acknowledging that it could be as far as this ownership group is willing to go to pursue championships. That doesn't mean they won't win another but given what we've seen of their interest in paying top tier talent, they aren't going to do so by signing a bunch of big name FAs to try and get them over the top.

NESN’s ratings tanked in 2022 (35% YOY decline) and then stayed steady in 2023. 2021 was itself a pretty decent decline from 2019. Maybe they have some long term deals that can help stabilize advertising money, but even if revenue is growing in a technical sense, I suspect that at some point that is going to create a significant gap on the top line v. what they would have if they were marketable and competed. This would be a pretty concerning trend to me (excluding COVID impacted 2020 season):
2019: 5.25
2021: 4.23
2022: 2.65
2023: 2.65

Part of that may be competition for entertainment, but a good chunk of it really is the 2022 and 2023 product was garbage. I used to watch 300+ hours of Sox games a year. I may have done half that last year and that mirrors a lot of the people I interact with who would all watch more if the team, you know, was good.

2022 and history: https://www.sportsbusinessjournal.com/Daily/Issues/2022/12/28/Media/red-sox-nesn-360-viewership-down.aspx
2023 flat: https://www.forbes.com/sites/maurybrown/2023/10/05/mlb-regional-sports-networks-see-7-gain-for-2023-season/?sh=54f9e059a8af

 

[astrozombie]

I don't understand. We couldn't hope to extend Mookie, the best player this team has developed since Yaz, without ruining our future financial flexibility. We had to get under the luxury tax threshold to create future financial flexibility. We signed mediocre players like Duval and Kluber to short term contracts to create future financial flexibility. When are we going to take advantage of all this flexibility?

The Sox didn't bother to compete for marquee assets like Ohtani and Soto, made only an apparently half-hearted attempt to sign Yamamoto, and now we hear that Snell and Montgomery aren't the sorts to break the bank for. Any of these decisions is defensible in a vacuum, but together they starts to look like a pattern.

Maybe all our financial downsizing in recent yeras is to increase the flexibility to pay out dividends to ownership?

This guy gets it. Picking nits, I would say that ownership wants to pursue other investments rather than pay out dividends, but same difference.

 

[RedOctober3829]

You mean other than getting Wilyer Abreu and Emmnauel Valdez for 2 months of Christian Vazquez, while shedding Jake Dikeman's salary to pick up a catcher that had 3+ years of cost control and outperformed Vazquez the rest of that season (and Vaz went on to sign a deal that almost immediately went way underwater). But yes, the organization that won't spend did stay above the tax, which cost them a relatively small amount of draft capital that equated to far less than Abreu + Vazquez.



Would we be happy if they had the conviction of the Angels? Standing pat is just as much a decision as 100% sell or 100% buy, and can easily be justified by their circumstances.




It's very well documented that Elfin wanted to go to Tampa, and didn't even ask Boston for a counter once TB matched Boston's offer.

Those trades you mentioned at the ‘22 deadline are the epitome of how they’ve done business since the Mookie trade. They are more concerned about perceived value on the margins rather than addressing the real issues on this team which is premium talent in order to win. Wilyer Abreu, Emmanuel Valdez, and Reese McGuire are not anything to champion as great moves. They’re fringe major league players.

I’ve heard about moves to create financial flexibility for years now. They’re under the tax now. No excuse not to open the wallet to add the top of the rotation starters or a right handed power bat they need. They have the resources to do so and the most disappointing thing is they appear to be choosing not to.

 

[snowmanny]

Sadly, if Yoshida was part of the plan to lure Yamamoto, it was a spectacular failure.

Well, if the plan was anything besides “Boston is a great place to play, we will accommodate all your needs, we will be competitive, and we will pay you the most - just look at this number!!!” then it was a flawed plan.

 

[sezwho]

Sadly, if Yoshida was part of the plan to lure Yamamoto, it was a spectacular failure.

I’m also still taking the over on 830ops with some form of representative defense: aka minimal range but minimal laughers.

 

[chawson]

They're a last place organization going forward with a last place mentality and a last place vision, which is what they have been-- if what you posited based on the McAdam report is accurate.

A little late to the party here but I’ll echo those who have pointed out that the McAdam piece is not a “report.” It’s a column he files routinely, literally called SOME THINGS I THINK. Digital editors in newsrooms nowadays budget some editorial space for stories that “get people talking.” This is that.

Is the prospect of signing Jordan fricking Montgomery to an 8-year, $175-200M contract beyond criticism? That’s the assumption that McAdam is making here. Either he actually believes that — which makes him an idiot unfit for his job — or he’s suspending that belief to stoke a restless fan base over a holiday.

Can we let maybe, idk, 25 percent of the winter’s free agents sign before losing our minds? This is completely embarrassing. There are many, many paths to take.

I’m actually as concerned with the Sox spending for spending’s sake as I am that they are cheap.

Yes, same here. Pretty hopeful Breslow and co. are smart enough to tune it out.

Several people on this board swore up and down that Bloom built an amazing farm system that was set up to win now and the next several centuries. And that ownership was absolutely begging him on bended knees to spend all the money in the world to win; the only thing holding them back was blooms absolutely infallible track record of valuation and making sure that they could only spend money on surefire winners like Corey Kluber. When I said that FSG seemed to have other priorities, I was told definitively that they have 20 years of success and that means their priorities could not have possibly changed. Given what I was told, how could this report be true?
Oh well. Full throttle!

You have to selectively ignore so much information to arrive here.

 

[Daniel_Son]

Both Snell and Montgomery have some pretty significant warts. They're going to demand ace-like contracts. It sucks that they missed out on Yamamoto (and I do think FSG was legitimate in their pursuit) but I'm honestly okay with those two guys becoming albatrosses for some other teams. They're not the guys you break the bank for.

Now, if Roki gets posted next year? Go fucking nuts, Bres.

 

[moondog80]

Those trades you mentioned at the ‘22 deadline are the epitome of how they’ve done business since the Mookie trade. They are more concerned about perceived value on the margins rather than addressing the real issues on this team which is premium talent in order to win. Wilyer Abreu, Emmanuel Valdez, and Reese McGuire are not anything to champion as great moves. They’re fringe major league players.

They weren't franchising altering moves, but there were unquestionably good moves, and certainly not worthy of being labeled a "clown show", which is what I was responding to.

 

[NickEsasky]

A little late to the party here but I’ll echo those who have pointed out that the McAdam piece is not a “report.” It’s a column he files routinely, literally called SOME THINGS I THINK. Digital editors in newsrooms nowadays budget some editorial space for stories that “get people talking.” This is that.

Is the prospect of signing Jordan fricking Montgomery to an 8-year, $175-200M contract beyond criticism? That’s the assumption that McAdam is making here. Either he actually believes that — which makes him an idiot unfit for his job — or he’s suspending that belief to stoke a restless fan base over a holiday.

Can we let maybe, idk, 25 percent of the winter’s free agents sign before losing our minds? This is completely embarrassing. There are many, many paths to take.



Yes, same here. Pretty hopeful Breslow and co. are smart enough to tune it out.



You have to selectively ignore so much information to arrive here.

So thinking Montgomery might be a worthy addition makes McAdam unfit for his job but say assuming Franchy was always on the cusp of a breakout because of exit velocities is just an astute observation?

 

[simplicio]

Since the owners are no longer speaking honestly to the fans, all we can do is read tea leaves. There seems to have been a sea change in the philosophy of ownership, which coincides with Gerry Cardinale buying 10% of Fenway Sports Group. So perhaps what he says here is an insight to the thinking at Fenway.

Where do we go from here

Honestly I've wondered about this alot, as the past couple years we're seeing revenue streams like RSNs kick the bucket while the free agent market simultaneously goes bananas. It feels really weird and unsustainable.

 

[pk1627]

Sean McAdam’s reporting

 

[simplicio]

Both Snell and Montgomery have some pretty significant warts. They're going to demand ace-like contracts. It sucks that they missed out on Yamamoto (and I do think FSG was legitimate in their pursuit) but I'm honestly okay with those two guys becoming albatrosses for some other teams. They're not the guys you break the bank for.

Now, if Roshi gets posted next year? Go fucking nuts, Bres.

If Roki gets posted next year there's no bank to break, it's an Ohtani/Angels situation, not a Yamamoto one (unless he waits till 2026).

 

[NickEsasky]

Sean McAdam’s reporting

Given how Bloom reacted to X signing with SD it seems like they expected him back. How is this bad reporting by McAdam?

I get a huge chunk of the media sucks in this city, but too many posters here are quick to criticize the actual good ones because they don’t fit their world view.

 

[Harry Hooper]

Honestly I've wondered about this alot, as the past couple years we're seeing revenue streams like RSNs kick the bucket while the free agent market simultaneously goes bananas. It feels really weird and unsustainable.

Thanks to brienc for posting the Cardinale interview. The RSN issues are certainly a concern, but Cardinale seems to be ignoring completely the advent of the burgeoning gambling-associated revenues.

 

[chawson]

So thinking Montgomery might be a worthy addition makes McAdam unfit for his job but say assuming Franchy was always on the cusp of a breakout because of exit velocities is just an astute observation?

Quite a stretch here, bud.

Of course Jordan Montgomery is a good addition. But yes, if McAdam is asserting that the Red Sox passing on him at 8/$175-200 makes them fundamentally philosophically different than they used to be, that Montgomery is unequivocally a good signing at that price, then he’s unfit for his job. He should know that’s not true.

 

[astrozombie]

Lots of touchy posters here. I've maintained for awhile that FSGs goal for years now has been saving money first and being competitive second.

 

[sezwho]

Sean McAdam’s reporting

Ive no particular reason to doubt this accuracy. It is also the type of thing we want to hear in the moment.

 

[NickEsasky]

Quite a stretch here, bud.

No please enlighten me I’m just a simple clod who likes watching good baseball. How is one statement proof someone is a moron while the other is proof we’re all idiots for thinking he was a AAAA player who couldn’t hit ML pitching consistently?

 

[simplicio]

Why are y'all posting DMs on the main board?

Given how Bloom reacted to X signing with SD it seems like they expected him back. How is this bad reporting by McAdam?

I get a huge chunk of the media sucks in this city, but too many posters here are quick to criticize the actual good ones because they don’t fit their world view.

I have no issue with McAdam, but let's not take his opinion pieces as internally sourced statements of fact either, yeah?

 

[NickEsasky]

Why are y'all posting DMs on the main board?

I have no issue with McAdam, but let's not take his opinion pieces as internally sourced statements of fact either, yeah?

I already said in my first post it was clearly an opinion piece by McAdam. I was just pushing back on the post that implied he has no bonafides as a reporter.

 

[chawson]

No please enlighten me I’m just a simple clod who likes watching good baseball. How is one statement proof someone is a moron while the other is proof we’re all idiots for thinking he was a AAAA player who couldn’t hit ML pitching consistently?

I already said in my first post it was clearly an opinion piece by McAdam. I was just pushing back on the post that implied he has no bonafides as a reporter.

Do you need to go back and read what I wrote, maybe a bit slower? You’re stretching and repackaging everything I posted quite a bit to fit your argument.

 

[NickEsasky]

Do you need to go back and read what I wrote, maybe a bit slower? You’re stretching and repackaging everything I posted quite a bit to fit your argument.

Where does McAdam put a price on Montgomery? You have no idea what he thinks he is worth for the Red Sox to pay for him. That’s you putting words in his mouth to fit your argument.

edit: typos. Damn autocorrect

 

[chawson]

Where does McAdam pit a price on Montgomery? You have no idea what he thinks is worth it for the Red Sox to pay for him. That’s you putting words in his mouth to fit your argument.

No it’s not, that’s me inferring that McAdam has done his research and knows Montgomery’s market. We’ll see what he signs for.

Are you reading it like he’s saying the Sox are fools for not signing Montgomery to something like E-Rod’s 4/$80 contract or 5/$100M? Because that would be silly on everyone’s account.

 

[NickEsasky]

No it’s not, that’s me inferring that McAdam has done his research and knows Montgomery’s market. We’ll see what he signs for.

Are you reading it like he’s saying the Sox are fools for not signing Montgomery to something like E-Rod’s 4/$80 contract or 5/$100M? Because that would be silly on everyone’s account.

To the bolded, no of course not but we also have no idea what his market truly is. If he gets 8 years then I’ll be glad we didn’t give him that too but we have no idea if he’ll get that. But at some point the team’s going to have to pay to play.

edit: also, what research should McAdam be doing on the market? Looking at what other reporters mention which are largely agent wishlists?

 

[grimshaw]

Henry is on record as being opposed to paying pitchers for their decline years; and he pivoted from Dombrowski to Bloom when he saw the Rays beat the Sox while he was paying a ton of money to an injured and expensive rotation of Sale, Price, Porcello, and Eovaldi. He moved on from Bloom to the pitching focused Breslow, yet we expect them to go back to the spending ways that got them Price and Sale, just now that they are almost out of it? Or to suddenly trade their top prospects and gut the system?

It’s frustrating to not win the offseason, but I am not sure signing Jordan Montgomery or Blake Snell is the quick fix anyways, and those guys will be on the payroll for a long time.

The quickest fix to me is Trevor Story being healthy and useful, and Devers playing like an early prime guy. The defense is not a quick fix because the corner infield and outfield defense is awful - and their best defensive guy was moved. If they sign Teoscar, his move from right to left would be an improvement over Yoshida, but then you have a huge drop off in right field defense and a good, but not great hitting perma-DH. And Teoscar may not necessarily be much better than Yoshida. This is as square peg/round hole a lineup as I can remember since Duquette had Canseco and Kevin Mitchell in the outfield together.

I think for them to contend, they'd need to be ultra aggressive with their top tier minor leaguers and hope for the best which they showed signs of last season. Selfishly it would fun, but it could backfire long term.

 

[Quatchie]

I do wonder how long it will be before FSG brings up the idea of a new stadium. While I understand this is a notion many will dismiss you have to wonder if the changing economics of the game make a new stadium a must if the fans truly expect the Red Sox to spend at LAD/MFY/Mets levels in the future. Have they maxed what they can economically with Fenway and NESN?