LB coach Patrick Graham leaving Patriots to become Giants DL coach

[soxhop411]

“@caplannfl: Giants are expected to add #Patriots LBs coach Patrick Graham as DL coach, source confirmed.”

“@cpriceNFL: A loss for Pats. Many had him pegged as future DC in NE if/when Patricia left. https://t.co/12IgpGF2sW”

“@MarkDanielsPJ: That’s surprising. Graham called the defense in the preseason finale. A lot of coaching changes for the Patriots. https://t.co/vPB5zao4CX”

 

[soxhop411]

“@MarkDanielsPJ: Will be interesting to see who replaces Graham on the Patriots staff. Here’s one guess - Stephen Belichick. He worked with Graham a lot.”

 

[Dr. Gonzo]

Could be coincidental but the coaches that oversee the two deciding factors in the AFC Championship game have moved on. Googs for o line issues and now Graham for Collins being turned inside out twice by Owen Daniels for touchdowns.

With Googs, his contract was up. Graham could be the same but I wonder if BB was simply unhappy with preparation for the game and adjustments, or lack thereof, in the game.

 

[Stitch01]

Linebackers played fine. The called defense vs that pass play led to the first TD. I doubt BB fired a coach because Collins got beat once.

 

[Super Nomario]

Linebackers played fine. The called defense vs that pass play led to the first TD. I doubt BB fired a coach because Collins got beat once.

I agree they didn't fire anybody because of two plays, but there's no called defense in the world that intentionally leaves a receiver wide open behind the defenders. Someone screwed up.

 

[DJnVa]

“
“@cpriceNFL: A loss for Pats. Many had him pegged as future DC in NE if/when Patricia left.

Because this rules out him returning?

 

[Stitch01]

I agree they didn't fire anybody because of two plays, but there's no called defense in the world that intentionally leaves a receiver wide open behind the defenders. Someone screwed up.

Of course no plays are designed to give up an easy TD, but there are plays where the defense called is set up well to counter what the offense is trying to do and plays where its a real challenge against what the offense is trying to do. The play and routes called put a lot of pressure on Collins to cover a double move in the middle of the field from an underneath zone assignment with basically no help. That TD was primarily a good play call/adjustment at the line where Denver deserves credit compared to the 2nd TD where Collins got caught with poor coverage technique.

 

[Super Nomario]

Of course no plays are designed to give up an easy TD, but there are plays where the defense called is set up well to counter what the offense is trying to do and plays where its a real challenge against what the offense is trying to do. The play and routes called put a lot of pressure on Collins to cover a double move in the middle of the field from an underneath zone assignment with basically no help. That TD was primarily a good play call/adjustment at the line where Denver deserves credit compared to the 2nd TD where Collins got caught with poor coverage technique.

I don't think being a good playcall and being a mistake by the defense are exclusive. It was a smart playcall because the route pattern increased the likelihood that the defense would blow the coverage, but I'm not going to give a pass on the defense (not sure if it was actually Collins' responsibility or the adjacent zone defender) blowing the coverage. I agree it's a different sort of play than the second, but the first play might reflect more poorly on the coaching, as presumably there would be a specific coaching point(s) to avoid exactly what happened (whereas the second play was just bad technique, which can happen to anyone).

 

[Stitch01]

Meh, if you have the all-22 look at the play when Daniels does his double move, its hard to see any glaring error. Sometimes you basically just tip your cap to the other team.

 

[Super Nomario]

Meh, if you have the all-22 look at the play when Daniels does his double move, its hard to see any glaring error. Sometimes you basically just tip your cap to the other team.

I don't know who screwed up, but I can guarantee someone did. There's no called defense in the world where you leave a player totally uncovered for a 21-yard touchdown.

 

[Bowhemian]

I don't know who screwed up, but I can guarantee someone did. There's no called defense in the world where you leave a player totally uncovered for a 21-yard touchdown.

I agree with you. To me it looked like on the first play, Collins thought that he was supposed to stay in the middle zone, therefore was handing the receiver off to a safety in the deep zone. We may never know if that was an error on Collins’ part, on the safeties part, or was a mistake on the play call/coaching. On the second play, it was simply a bad play by Collins. He made the wrong move and got burned.

 

[Hoodie Sleeves]

I don't know who screwed up, but I can guarantee someone did. There's no called defense in the world where you leave a player totally uncovered for a 21-yard touchdown.

No, but there are plays that are specifically designed to do this - sometimes the other team just calls the right play and you can't really defend it with the particular players on the field/defense called. Seam routes against cover 2 are an example - they're designed to make sure that someone isn't covered.

Sometimes the linebacker does the right thing by handing off a guy who is leaving his zone, but the safety has already picked someone else up - this sort of stuff is how you beat zone.


The defense was the only reason they were even in that game - I really doubt this has anything to do with those two plays.

 

[Super Nomario]

No, but there are plays that are specifically designed to do this - sometimes the other team just calls the right play and you can't really defend it with the particular players on the field/defense called. Seam routes against cover 2 are an example - they're designed to make sure that someone isn't covered.

Sometimes the linebacker does the right thing by handing off a guy who is leaving his zone, but the safety has already picked someone else up - this sort of stuff is how you beat zone.

Defenses know all this, though, why is there are coaching points to counter common beaters of the defense that you're calling - usually the underneath defender carrying the receiver vertically to ensure he doesn't end up wide open in the end zone. That might still be to the offense's advantage, but at least you make the quarterback make a throw.

The defense was the only reason they were even in that game - I really doubt this has anything to do with those two plays.

I agree with this totally - the D was great after that first drive, and I'd be stunned if Graham is gone because of this.

 

[Hoodie Sleeves]

Defenses know all this, though, why is there are coaching points to counter common beaters of the defense that you're calling - usually the underneath defender carrying the receiver vertically to ensure he doesn't end up wide open in the end zone. That might still be to the offense's advantage, but at least you make the quarterback make a throw. .

Not to get all ridiculous, but offenses know that defenses know this stuff - there's a lot that goes into playcalling, and guys get schemed wide open relatively often, even against good defenses. Offense isn't the Broncos strong suite, but they're a good, well coached team.

 

[Super Nomario]

Not to get all ridiculous, but offenses know that defenses know this stuff - there's a lot that goes into playcalling, and guys get schemed wide open relatively often, even against good defenses. Offense isn't the Broncos strong suite, but they're a good, well coached team.

Guys only get wide open behind the entire defense when someone screwed up. I'm not saying that it wasn't well-designed by Denver, or that the design didn't stress the defense so that someone screwed up, but I'm sure that a wide-open touchdown wasn't what was supposed to happen when the D got that look.

 

[Stitch01]

I don't know who screwed up, but I can guarantee someone did. There's no called defense in the world where you leave a player totally uncovered for a 21-yard touchdown.

True, its never designed that way, but of course no one is claiming that. It was an offensive play that was very hard for that defense to defend properly.

 

[Stitch01]

I agree with you. To me it looked like on the first play, Collins thought that he was supposed to stay in the middle zone, therefore was handing the receiver off to a safety in the deep zone. We may never know if that was an error on Collins’ part, on the safeties part, or was a mistake on the play call/coaching. On the second play, it was simply a bad play by Collins. He made the wrong move and got burned.

The safety and Ninkovich both get frozen by the route combinations. There's a still that shows it in the all-22, I'll see if I can figure out how to put it up when I have a little time. It put the combination put the four defenders on that side of the field into a tough position collectively. Possible to defend? Sure, if Collins takes the defender all the way up the seam, but given he's in the underneath zone and Daniels ran a double move, where he first looks like he's going to go into Nink's zone, and the called defense potentially have safety help over the top. Glaring error to the point where linebacker play was a deciding factor in the game or something that would get BB on the linebacker coach for? Really hard to see given there were four players involved and only one was a LB.

Sometimes the other team just executes something well. That was a really nice play call and design. Even if Collins follows Daniels up the seam there is probably going to be a lot of space there for Manning to make that throw.