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I can never be satisfied. Can you?

Discussion in 'Red Sox Forum' started by Lose Remerswaal, Sep 29, 2017.

?

What's it gotta be?

Poll closed Oct 4, 2017.
  1. Win the World Series

    14.2%
  2. Make it to the World Series

    9.4%
  3. Win their division series

    26.6%
  4. Win at least one game in the postseason

    23.6%
  5. I am already satisfied

    14.6%
  6. They lost me when ... (Papi retired, they traded Shaw, something else)

    3.0%
  7. I just like to vote

    8.6%
  1. Ale Xander

    Ale Xander Member SoSH Member

    Messages:
    8,852
    Not satisfied in the least bit. Today was one giant cocktease. Hurts more than last year. Sale and Devers deserve better.
     
  2. Bob Montgomery's Helmet Hat

    Bob Montgomery's Helmet Hat has big, douchey shoulders Lifetime Member SoSH Member

    Messages:
    24,802
    The win yesterday was the first by a Red Sox team in a game facing elimination, since the 2008 ALCS against the Rays. That's something good for the kids to build on.
    I'm sad when the season is over, so I'm sad today. But I enjoyed the season. I like this team a lot.
     
  3. exGloucester

    exGloucester Well-Known Member Lifetime Member SoSH Member

    Messages:
    1,266
    I'm mostly satisfied. I followed my team all season and they won the division, and the last two games were great. That's a real good season.
     
  4. Doooweeeey!

    Doooweeeey! Well-Known Member Bronze Supporter SoSH Member

    Messages:
    1,327
    It was a tall order to win this Division Series (my vote in the poll). Was hoping for a little more of that '04, '07 or '13 Magic after the Game 3 win.
    Not to be. Glad they didn't get swept and fought hard to the last out, as they did in every game this season including so many in extra innings .

    Thanks for the memories, 2017 Boston Red Sox!!
     
  5. streeter88

    streeter88 Well-Known Member Silver Supporter SoSH Member

    Messages:
    597
    I thought they played hard and showed great fight in the last two games -- just as they had all season. It is no accident that this team was 15-3 in extras.

    But there will be a lot of second guessing by far more knowledgeable fans and Red Sox management over the course of the offseason. There seemed to be multiple spots during this series where a different decision was called for -- pointed out by others in other threads so no need to rehash them -- that held the team back from achieving the improbable ALDS series win that I voted for.

    Very exciting core of players coming back for next year. I hope they find a way to keep Nunez and an get upgrade at 1B, that Pedey gets healthy eventually, and that a healthy Price joins Sale and a revamped Porcello and Edro next year. And I wonder will we get to see Thornburg in the pen even?
     
  6. AB in DC

    AB in DC OG Football Writing Silver Supporter SoSH Member

    Messages:
    3,372
    Look, this Astros team is a fricking juggernaut. With Verlander and a healthy Keuchel this is basically a 110-win team. Not much the Sox could have done here.
     
  7. Kielty's Last Pitch

    Kielty's Last Pitch lurker

    Messages:
    118
    Based on my preseason expectations, I'm satisfied. Nunez was a huge loss, but they still put up a fight at the end. If Mookie's screeching liner wasn't caught, Benny wouldn't have been doubled off 1B and Moreland wouldn't have been thrown out at the plate. One play cost them three runs, they came thisclose to David Price shining in a Game 5.
     
  8. santadevil

    santadevil Well-Known Member Silver Supporter SoSH Member

    Messages:
    2,583
    I'm not satisfied, starting pitching killed us.
    It's tough to think that if they got any decent pitching out of them that we would have had such a great series.
    But giving up runs in the first inning of each game really put them on their heals
     
  9. Rovin Romine

    Rovin Romine Johnny Rico Lifetime Member SoSH Member

    Messages:
    7,464
    Well, they played with some heart the last two games. I'm not really satisfied, but I'm not nearly as irritated as I would be if game 3 were a repetition of games 1 and 2.

    They need to play with more head next year.
     
  10. drbretto

    drbretto guidence counselor Silver Supporter SoSH Member

    Messages:
    7,747
    We could all use more head. :)

    (totally agreed, BTW. I don't mind not having the best team, but mental errors drive me nuts)
     
  11. Papo The Snow Tiger

    Papo The Snow Tiger lurker

    Messages:
    613
    I was as upset or disappointed as anyone on the board yesterday, but this afternoon I watched the end of "Faith Rewarded" and it kind of got me over the funk. I still get a little nervous seeing how close Dave Roberts was to being out, but watching that '04 team kind of put into perspective how hard it is to win even one World Series, and the Sox have won three in the last 13 years. I'm willing to bet any one of us would have taken that if it were offered prior to 2004. This current edition of the Sox is good to very good, and a few more right moves could put them over the top. Even with the less than optimal outcome I'm satisfied with this season, although I'd still like to see MLB hold Mark Wegner accountable for his shitty work behind the plate yesterday.
     
  12. dbn

    dbn Well-Known Member Silver Supporter SoSH Member

    Messages:
    6,826
    This season was like when I dined at Morimoto Napa. I wasn't "satisfied" because I knew I was eating at a Morimoto restaurant and had expectations of being amazed, but I wasn't. It was still pretty damn good, though.
     
  13. Rovin Romine

    Rovin Romine Johnny Rico Lifetime Member SoSH Member

    Messages:
    7,464
    I'm glad to know someone around here can still handle a straight line.
     
  14. DeadlySplitter

    DeadlySplitter Member SoSH Member

    Messages:
    8,587
    the Yankees dismantling the 102 win Indians has made this season less satisfying for the moment.

    completely unfair but I'm sure I'm not alone. the Yankees were not supposed to be at our level again anytime soon.
     
  15. Bergs

    Bergs Well-Known Member Gold Supporter SoSH Member

    Messages:
    8,694
    You are absolutely not alone.
     
  16. streeter88

    streeter88 Well-Known Member Silver Supporter SoSH Member

    Messages:
    597
    I think if you polled SOSH, you would get 95% agreement. Yankees should not have been good this year, and it is very unfortunate that monstrous Judge kid finally figured it out.

    Edit: I hope the league figures out how to pitch him next year, he needs to suffer a big time regression. I am very very sick of the all rise for the judge crap.
     
  17. MikeM

    MikeM Member SoSH Member

    Messages:
    2,197
    This season sucks until the Yankees go home losers. Period.

    That said the Yankees were being underrated by a lot of people going in to this season (on that note, a lot of those same people also got their answer on why the MFY would be interested in signing Chapman), and the post-Ortiz Sox in turn were being a little overrated. We should have won more games and went on to do so in the regular season, but the supposed gap between us was never as big as some hyped it out to be imo.
     
  18. burstnbloom

    burstnbloom Member SoSH Member

    Messages:
    1,589
    I think it's a safe bet that Judge has a serious regression next year. So many of his underlying stats look unsustainable especially his 40+% Hr/FB. That said, even with regression, I think we're dealing with a .880-.900 ops player for a long time, unfortunately.
     
  19. JimD

    JimD Member SoSH Member

    Messages:
    5,926
    I'm annoyed at the Yankees for getting to the ALCS, but I'm frankly more pissed right now at the Indians for crapping their pants and letting NY push them aside. I know Tito would be nominated for sainthood by most of SoSH but he did not have his team prepared once the Yankees started punching back - they were a Girardi brainfart away from losing the series in four games.
     
  20. Kielty's Last Pitch

    Kielty's Last Pitch lurker

    Messages:
    118
    The league did figure him out. More fastballs, higher and above the strike zone, and more sliders.

    Make mistakes, he'll crush 'em. Execute, he'll freeze or whiff.

    1-for-20 with 16 K's in the ALDS. Postseason series record for K's, in just 5 games.

    He's more likely to evolve into Adam Dunn than Barry Bonds.

    But overall, yeah the Sox will have a hard time keeping up if Sanchez, Hicks and Bird stay healthy.
     
  21. Snodgrass'Muff

    Snodgrass'Muff oppresses WARmongers Gold Supporter SoSH Member

    Messages:
    26,897
    If his floor is a borderline hall of famer, I don't think that's going to be as comforting as you may have intended.

    Edit: I should amend that. If his the floor on his bat is a borderline hall of fame offensive profile (Dunn clearly gets sunk on the defensive side), then... blah blah blah.
     
  22. Kielty's Last Pitch

    Kielty's Last Pitch lurker

    Messages:
    118
    462 homeruns alone doesn't get you into the Hall, not when you're a career .237 hitter who has never won any award, never led the league in anything except Walks (2) and Strikeouts (4), and never been Top 20 in MVP voting. Kingman wasn't a borderline HOF'er, and his offensive numbers are damn close to Dunn.

    Don't get me wrong, Judge will be around for a while hitting 30-40 homeruns .... but I'd be surprised if he ever gets serious MVP consideration again.
     
  23. Snodgrass'Muff

    Snodgrass'Muff oppresses WARmongers Gold Supporter SoSH Member

    Messages:
    26,897
    He stacks up pretty well against Jim Rice (again, just the bat). Dunn has 80 more HR, more than twice the walk rate, a .012 advantage in career OBP, and is just .012 behind in career SLG.

    His bat is borderline even if his defense (or lack thereof) sinks him before he even gets started.

    Based on what? Even if you regress his BABIP to something more normal (for someone who hits the ball as hard as he does, let's say .320), you're talking about a batting average in the mid .200's, an OBP around .400 and a SLG in the high 500's with 35+ HR true talent. By random variation alone, he should have another season or two where he's getting MVP votes.
     
  24. grimshaw

    grimshaw the new rudy SoSH Member

    Messages:
    2,538
    You are overrating Dunn's offense. His wRC+/OPS+ and wOBA are all like 250th all time.

    His bat is obviously better than a lot of catchers who are in, but it falls way short for 1st base or even LF.

    If you want to pick someone close to him rate stat wise, I'd go with Ryan Klesko - someone who I can confidently say isn't a borderline hall of famer and spent a lot of time at 1b and lf.

    OBP and slugging
    Klesko - .370/500
    Dunn - .362/.490

    wOBA
    Klesko - .372
    Dunn - .367

    wRC+
    Klesko -127
    Dunn - 123

    OPS+
    Klesko - 128
    Dunn - 124

    Dunn obviously blows him away in home runs, but that's about all he has going for him. I'd be shocked if he got 5% of the vote.
     
  25. Snodgrass'Muff

    Snodgrass'Muff oppresses WARmongers Gold Supporter SoSH Member

    Messages:
    26,897
    Of course he won't. The total package isn't anywhere near hall of fame worthy. I was only talking about his bat stacking up against some bats that are just in or just out of the hall. He doesn't have a prayer of making it in, though.

    And we're getting pretty far afield of the actual point here. If Judge's floor is Adam Dunn's bat with solid average to above average defense in right field, he's still a really good player.
     
  26. Wingack

    Wingack Yankee Mod Dope SoSH Member

    Messages:
    18,073
    Of course, Dunn nor Rice nor Klesko, ever had an OPS in their entire careers as close to Judge had this year in his rookie year. That being said I do think that it is impossible to know what Judge is going to be moving forward. There has never been a player quite like him.

    Except for Giancarlo Stanton really, and I think there are going to be a couple years where he hits .240 like Stanton has. But Stanton's main bugaboo has been his health. If Judge can stay on the field more than Stanton, I think there are a couple more 45 HR seasons in that bat, even if the BA dips.
     
  27. snowmanny

    snowmanny Well-Known Member Gold Supporter SoSH Member

    Messages:
    7,552
    But Judge is 25 and Stanton was a rookie at 20 and put up a .969 OPS at 22. There hasn't been another like him as you say. McGwire is the closest comp but he had, um, special circumstances.
     
  28. Wingack

    Wingack Yankee Mod Dope SoSH Member

    Messages:
    18,073
    I compare him to Stanton, because obviously there is the tremendous power, but I think they both are capable of seasons of having years like they both had this year, and then hitting .240 in another year (like Stanton has). They are big boys, and I think when they go wrong, it can go really wrong for them and the slumps are longer. But just as easily as they can hit .240 and be a rich-man's Mark Trumbo, they can bounce back and hit .280 the next year and all of a sudden be the best player in the whole league.
     
  29. canyoubelieveit

    canyoubelieveit Member SoSH Member

    Messages:
    4,845
    The Red Sox were entertaining all summer long. Every one of their games mattered. They held on to win the division. They didn't get swept in the playoffs and lost to a better team. The Yankees did not win the pennant.

    I am very satisfied with the 2017 season.
     
  30. JimD

    JimD Member SoSH Member

    Messages:
    5,926
    I'm pretty satisfied with our new manager (and our team president for getting it done right away).
     

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