Agree 100%. Kraft wants more than an apology now. Goodell's head or Kensil's - take your pick Roger.Ed Hillel said:
There is zero chance that Robert Kraft does not get the entire report on his desk at some point. That would be my counterpoint to people who fear Wells and Goodell will work this thing out behind closed doors somehow. Kraft would release the report and destroy everything in his path. Moreover, if something untoward ever happened that didn't hit the report, I'm confident Kraft would get the information. I'm sure he has an ally somewhere in the Paul Weiss buildings.
"Y'all got anymore of those kicking balls...I need a fix bad man"Marciano490 said:What's fascinating to me, here, is that there's apparently a thriving black market for unused kicking balls that's lucrative enough for people to risk plum jobs over. Like, how are these balls marketed and sold, what's the going rate, etc?
Hendoo said:Haha! Scott miller is from flushing NY and is a Jets fan according to his facebook https://m.facebook.com/scott.miller.18400?fref=nf
MarcSullivaFan said:Doesn't "like" NFL anymore.
The guy in the dancing pic is the same guy as the LinkedIn pic, checked before posting.Andrew said:
He looks like a little girl, too!
Me neither.
Kull said:Agree 100%. Kraft wants more than an apology now. Goodell's head or Kensil's - take your pick Roger.
I meant that nobody cares about his, "Woe is me, as a Patriots fan!" sackcloth and ashes bit.drleather2001 said:Apparently, he and the people who threw the bottle do.
"I mean, you'd think that they'd be able to exhaustively prove a negative by now, right?!?"drleather2001 said:"If defendant X was innocent, why is the state going through the trouble of holding a trial? He must be guilty."
It's staying on ice. But given the way this story started it's semi-miraculous that an increasingly plausible outcome involves the drinking of champagne.DennyDoyle'sBoil said:
I really think we should be keeping the champagne on ice.
Ed Hillel said:
I got through about a minute and now Felger is calling the Patriots liars as is whoever this clown is with him and they both think they did deflate the footballs because they are liars we shouldn't trust. Good God, why do people subject themselves to this garbage? I'm mad at myself for even giving them 90 seconds.
Hendoo said:Haha! Scott miller is from flushing NY and is a Jets fan according to his facebook https://m.facebook.com/scott.miller.18400?fref=nf
Wait, wait, you forgot one:drleather2001 said:
Listen carefully:
The league does not give a shit about integrity. It only cares about appearing to care deeply about integrity.
The league's success is not based on fairness, or justice, or caring about its players, or breast cancer, or Play 60, or any of that stuff. All it cares about is making people think they care, because that's good Public Relations, and good P.R. is good for getting advertisers and negotiating TV contracts, and getting advertisers and favorable TV contracts helps them make money.
That's it. Also, there is no fucking Easter Bunny.
If Goodell and the NFL determine it's better for business to bury parts of the Wells investigation, they will do so. The end.
Kraft already knows the content of most of the video evidence which came almost exclusively from the Pats. Some might have come from NFL Films as well. I think he might have a pretty good idea of the content of any testimony provided by NEP employees.Ed Hillel said:There is zero chance that Robert Kraft does not get the entire report on his desk at some point. That would be my counterpoint to people who fear Wells and Goodell will work this thing out behind closed doors somehow. Kraft would release the report and destroy everything in his path. Moreover, if something untoward ever happened that didn't hit the report, I'm confident Kraft would get the information. I'm sure he has an ally somewhere in the Paul Weiss buildings.
kartvelo said:You mean the game in Indianapolis, where the Colts' staff would have been responsible for the game balls?
Colts general manager Ryan Grigson mentioned that the organization reached out to the NFL in the week leading up to the AFC Championship Game regarding concerns with underinflated footballs. The Patriots and Colts had played on Nov. 16 of the regular season, so this confirms (from this viewpoint) that Indianapolis had suspicions from that game which sparked the NFL's actions during the AFC title game. Grigson declined further comment, citing the ongoing investigation, after saying that he was simply doing his job to ensure a level playing field.
No, it's not. It's like the assistant director of FIBA or whatever the hell it was putting more time on the clock in the gold medal game. Or a DA watching from the gallery objecting to a question in a case being tried by one of his ADAs. Or Silver overruling a call on replay.Shelterdog said:I'm apparently not making myself clear. Kensils actions were stupid but the fact that he(and not an official)did them is a big nothing.
8slim said:Here's one thing we definitively learned in the past 36 hours...someone(s), most likely someone(s) at NFL HQ, has it in for the Pats. I am VERY cautious to ever come to a conclusion like that, because it seems so ridiculous, but it also seems like an unavoidable conclusion at this point.
Someone(s) familiar with the investigation fed a reporter the info that a Pats game day employee tried to get an unapproved ball introduced into play. That said someone(s) apparently didn't mention to said reporter that it was a fired NFL employee that gave the unapproved ball to said Pats game day employee it's incredibly damning.
The intent was obvious, to cast more suspicion upon the Pats.
Harry Hooper said:
No offense, but we learned that with the leak that came out as the Pats were in flight to Arizona.
8slim said:
Well if you know that they're cheating but you just can't prove it, then the ends justify the means, right?
E5 Yaz said:
Probably earlier
I'm with you, but the biggest issue to me is whether anyone else was in the room, preferably someone the public would accept as unbiased. If he went into a room by himself, then screw anything that comes out of it. Why should anyone just take him at his word?Myt1 said:No, it's not. It's like the assistant director of FIBA or whatever the hell it was putting more time on the clock in the gold medal game. Or a DA watching from the gallery objecting to a question in a case being tried by one of his ADAs. Or Silver overruling a call on replay.
Just because someone is high up in an organization doesn't mean it's proper for them to do a job designate for another. Because you get this kind of clusterfuck.
DennyDoyle'sBoil said:
I really think we should be keeping the champagne on ice.
I don't like a place where the NFL is backed into a corner to avoid looking like the shitshow that it is, because the end of the story there could easily be to throw red meat to the haters. I think it's pretty clear there's a pack of hungry wolves who will snap at just about anything that allows them to continue the Patriots as cheaters narrative, and the league may ultimately decide that's their best way out of a jam, even if it puts them at war with Kraft. They'll figure that part out when they need to.
We also really have no idea what the facts are. For all we know, Wells' marching orders have morphed into pouring over tapes of old games trying to find something incriminating with respect to footballs.
What the shit show of the last few days, and all the incredible press on this, has I think done is make sure that the investigation won't be half-assed. There are just too many people paying attention. One of the best pieces of info came early on when the NYT reported Wells was calling physics departments, because it made clear that the investigation was serious, taking into account what the rest of the world was looking at, and wasn't just going to be a quick "the balls are deflated, burn them" affair. But other than that, we really don't know yet where this yellow brick road is going to end.
Ed Hillel said:I'm with you, but the biggest issue to me is whether anyone else was in the room, preferably someone the public would accept as unbiased. If he went into a room by himself, then screw anything that comes out of it. Why should anyone just take him at his word?
Or the Browns General Manger texting plays to coaches during a live NFL game.Myt1 said:Just because someone is high up in an organization doesn't mean it's proper for them to do a job designate for another. Because you get this kind of clusterfuck.
Shelterdog said:
Where Kensil clearly fucked himself is that now he looks like a man on a mission to fuck the Patriots. Somehow these reports always have a fall guy...
I think it's unlikely that *the* NFL is working against them. I think it's quite possible that some people within the NFL have a beef with them for whatever reason.BusRaker said:Is the Patriot's run of success hurting or helping the NFL as a whole? I'm trying to isolate a motive the supersedes simple jealousy why the NFL would actively work against them.
Well, the following players were available when the Patriots should have been picking in 2008:tim mccarver said:I wonder how many Super Bowls the Pats would have - if the nfl wasn't actively working against them.
I'm only half kidding.
Harry Hooper said:
As I noted in this thread when the NYT published the story indicating science supports the Pats and natural pressure loss, the downside of that story was it gave Kensil & Co. an idea of the numbers to fake to put it beyond natural causes. If it is true that Kensil "took charge" of the halftime ball check {great Munich Olympics reference, BTW}, a huge part of this investigation is going to be what he claims he found when he tested the balls.
There is no rational explanation beyond jealousy.BusRaker said:Is the Patriot's run of success hurting or helping the NFL as a whole? I'm trying to isolate a motive the supersedes simple jealousy why the NFL would actively work against them.
None of them went to Rutgers.RememberTheGronkans said:Well, the following players were available when the Patriots should have been picking in 2008:
Jordy Nelson
Matt Forte
DeSean Jackson
Martellus Bennett
Jamaal Charles
I'd say any one of those players might just mean at least one more Superbowl for the Patriots.
They just might have ended up with Ray Rice, who went in the second round that year.P'tucket said:None of them went to Rutgers.
Or were an undersized or injury prone corner.P'tucket said:None of them went to Rutgers.
djbayko said:
The NYT article came out 11 days after the AFCCG. Since Kensil's findings allegedly triggered the investigation, I would think he'd have to be on record much earlier than Jan 29. If Kensil under-inflated his numbers to account for science (assuming no one else was witness to his measurements), then his source would have to be something other than the NYT.
Bill would've traded out of the pick and landed all five later in the draft.RememberTheGronkans said:Well, the following players were available when the Patriots should have been picking in 2008:
Jordy Nelson
Matt Forte
DeSean Jackson
Martellus Bennett
Jamaal Charles
I'd say any one of those players might just mean at least one more Superbowl for the Patriots.
lexrageorge said:There is no rational explanation beyond jealousy.
Are we sure Kraft doesn't have cameras in that bathroom McNally "ducked into?" If there's video evidence of the entire chain of command of the footballs, that should pretty much conclusive, given all the video on the sidelines.E5 Yaz said:I think it's a safe bet that the vast majority of the NE fanbase isn't going to put any faith into Kensil's view of things. And, of course, that's not going to matter if the Wells report leans heavily on what Kensil has to say.
There's really no conclusion to this saga that won't be disputed
If Kraft has video of a bathroom, he might have bigger problems than footballs.Ed Hillel said:Are we sure Kraft doesn't have cameras in that bathroom McNally "ducked into?" If there's video evidence of the entire chain of command of the footballs, that should pretty much conclusive, given all the video on the sidelines.
Tough luck for #2 Kensil if he's screwed by something he wrote down.djbayko said:
The NYT article came out 11 days after the AFCCG. Since Kensil's findings allegedly triggered the investigation, I would think he'd have to be on record much earlier than Jan 29. If Kensil under-inflated his numbers to account for science (assuming no one else was witness to his measurements), then his source would have to be something other than the NYT.
Edit: I don't understand plurals.
What happened? What was the process that led to the story being published, then altered, and the time lag in which it happened? I wish I was in position to provide those answers, but that's not my job and quite honestly, I don't know those answers. But it is my job to communicate with you and be honest and accountable. I've said in the past that I feel like an ombudsman would be beneficial for all involved when it comes to coverage of the Patriots/under-inflated footballs.
[...]
As for my personal opinion on under-inflated footballs, I don't think this is a story to be reported in pieces because we're not getting the full context when that happens. The best thing, from this view, is to wait for the complete Wells report. [...] I don't believe ESPN currently has an ombudsman. Perhaps this will expedite the process, or they can get someone in there as a temp just to address this issue. I believe it is important.
[...]
I'm afraid that the damage is pretty much already done. Perceptions are shaped, right or wrong, and those are hard to change. For that, I personally hold the NFL accountable. My confidence in them to handle this the right way is not high. [...] If the Wells report turns up nothing, I do believe we very well could hear an apology from the NFL to the Patriots. They've created this.
mabrowndog said:
\MarcSullivaFan said:Reiss is a good guy. He's not going to be at ESPN much longer.
Sadly I think a guy like him, to stay in media, pretty much has to sell out to "storylines" Kravitz-style (or locally Gasper is a good example of someone who was once fact based, and now writes whatever will get eyeballs).Papelbon's Poutine said:Yeah, I think it's pretty obvious he won't be long for the WWL. I'm anxious to see where he lands. Really if about four or five guys left for elsewhere I might be willing to finally cut the cord and just forgo ESPN in all forms all together except for live games.