Price had a 4 inning 60 pitch session Tuesday. Couldn't find a link to the results with a quick search (I'm at work) but this one shows he will have the sim game.
Ian BrowneVerified account @IanMBrowne
David Price will start rehab assignment Sunday at Pawtucket, John Farrell has just announced. Five innings, 70 pitches.
Wasn't his last live session just 45 pitches (3 innings simulated, 15 each)? If that is so, seems like the jump to 70 pitches seems a bit aggressive. I'm not the guru here, but I was expecting a 3-4 inning rehab start instead of 5 inning - 70 pitches. I assume the 5/70 is whatever comes first.
Ok, I missed that session in the process. Stepping from controlled 45 - 60, now up to 70 in a live game seems like a conservative progression. I'd rather he be right than to rush him back and he's not ready.Price had a 4 inning 60 pitch session Tuesday. Couldn't find a link to the results with a quick search (I'm at work) but this one shows he will have the sim game.
http://www.cbssports.com/mlb/news/red-sox-lay-out-a-timetable-for-david-price-that-could-still-lead-to-a-may-return/
So he can beat up on A ball kids? I think he'd need to be out a lot longer before he started that low in the system for rehab starts, it really wouldn't work him out enough.Could he be shipped to Florida or someplace without a chance of rain? I assume Portland has the same chance of rain that Pawtucket and Boston has.
The important thing for Price is to get him throwing innings not necessarily his stats..As long as he is throwing pitches and innings in a game, the stats or competition level shouldn't matter. He could pitch at Greenville as long as he gets innings.So he can beat up on A ball kids? I think he'd need to be out a lot longer before he started that low in the system for rehab starts, it really wouldn't work him out enough.
Oh, I wasn't thinking the stats mattered at all, just that A ball level kids might not offer him the sort of challenge that would stress him at all, or require him to throw more than a bare minimum of pitches, which is not a good way to build him back up to starting.The important thing for Price is to get him throwing innings not necessarily his stats..As long as he is throwing pitches and innings in a game, the stats or competition level shouldn't matter. He could pitch at Greenville as long as he gets innings.
Let's hope he is only rusty and not damaged.Price at 52 pitches in 1 1/3 innings. A 15 pitch at bat for the leadoff hitter ends with a double. 4 for 8 with a walk (and home run) allowed first time through the order.
Maybe needs more than one rehab start?
So this is just armchair psychology, but I wonder how it will affect Price to come back having been supplanted as the staff ace by Chris Sale, who has been everything (and more) that Price was expected to be. Even the whole "nobody does well in his first year pitching in Boston" myth has been shattered by Sale's dominant start to the season. I wonder if it will inspire Price to be even better, or if it will shake his confidence to the point that this just ends up being a wasted year.
It would be quite a statement if the pitcher we got "on Sale" (contract-wise) were better than the one we paid "full Price" for.
First actual game against KIDS.It was his first actual game since last season.
He said he felt great. That's all that matters. Hopefully the results are little better next start.
It's essentially a spring training game. He probably didn't even give a shit about balls and strikes. He was going through the motions and just working on mechanics. I'm not worried about the results (unless it's injury related, of course).First actual game against KIDS.
First actual game against KIDS.
You're one of these guys that freaks out over a few bad games in spring training too, huh?Mechanics have a lot to do with balls and strikes.
Seems like he needs at least one more rehab start.Boston Herald said:Price finished with 89 pitches -- the goal was to be around 85-90 -- 61 for strikes and lasted just 3 2/3 innings. He allowed six runs, three earned, on seven hits, including three more singles in the second inning where allowed two runs. He struck out four, walked one and had the wild pitch.
Price left the park after his start without talking to reporters.
The most encouraging sign was his velocity, but the Bats had no trouble timing up his fastball, and Price's accuracy was spotty. His changeup and cutter were his best pitches, which he went to more as the game progressed.
Or the injury affects his command more than his velocity.His velocity has been fantastic. Sounds like he's missing up and away alot.
Also sounds like the defense was really really bad.
Obviously alot of rust still there
John Lackey 2011 says hi.Or the injury affects his command more than his velocity.
Yyyyep. Velocity without command would suggest that something may be structurally amiss. And we are getting close to the point where a Tommy John surgery would cost him most of 2018, too.John Lackey 2011 says hi.
Yup. We've danced this dance before and I wasn't a fan then either. I hope I'm wrong but...John Lackey 2011 says hi.
John Lackey 2011 says hi.
Look, there coul d be something wrong that requires intervention. But if we could diagnose elbow trouble from a box score, Dr. Andrews would be out of business tomorrow.Yyyyep. Velocity without command would suggest that something may be structurally amiss. And we are getting close to the point where a Tommy John surgery would cost him most of 2018, too.
So what you're saying is totally logical.Look, there coul d be something wrong that requires intervention. But if we could diagnose elbow trouble from a box score, Dr. Andrews would be out of business tomorrow.
I should also point out that Price is not focusing right now on getting hitters out. He's getting stretched out and building arm-strength. If this continues for the next few weeks, then we'll talk.
I don't buy the bolded. Maybe he's not "into" the game as much as he would be in the majors, but he is assuredly trying to get people out. He is assuredly attempting to throw strikes and not have the ball crushed. Those things didn't happen well at all in his two rehab starts. I think there is cause for concern here. I'm not saying don't bring him up, but coming off of an elbow injury that required a trip to Andrews and not being able to compete very well at the AAA level because of control IS concerning. I personally will be worried if he takes the hill for the Sox in 5 days.Look, there coul d be something wrong that requires intervention. But if we could diagnose elbow trouble from a box score, Dr. Andrews would be out of business tomorrow.
I should also point out that Price is not focusing right now on getting hitters out. He's getting stretched out and building arm-strength. If this continues for the next few weeks, then we'll talk.
Here's the thing for me (the bolded). He's been to Andrews already. He got the all-clear in terms of it not being something that had to be repaired surgically. That's the big thing that makes this feel different to 2011 Lackey to me. Lackey didn't see Andrews. He didn't get that reassurance. He took 3 weeks off in May for "elbow strain" then kept pitching like a stubborn mule.I don't buy the bolded. Maybe he's not "into" the game as much as he would be in the majors, but he is assuredly trying to get people out. He is assuredly attempting to throw strikes and not have the ball crushed. Those things didn't happen well at all in his two rehab starts. I think there is cause for concern here. I'm not saying don't bring him up, but coming off of an elbow injury that required a trip to Andrews and not being able to compete very well at the AAA level because of control IS concerning. I personally will be worried if he takes the hill for the Sox in 5 days.
It's an oversimplification to say that pitchers aren't focused on getting hitters out, but when you are talking about rehab starts, it's accurate.I don't buy the bolded. Maybe he's not "into" the game as much as he would be in the majors, but he is assuredly trying to get people out. He is assuredly attempting to throw strikes and not have the ball crushed. Those things didn't happen well at all in his two rehab starts. I think there is cause for concern here. I'm not saying don't bring him up, but coming off of an elbow injury that required a trip to Andrews and not being able to compete very well at the AAA level because of control IS concerning. I personally will be worried if he takes the hill for the Sox in 5 days.
Alex Speier has him 93-96 which would be better than basically any point last year and in line with his career which yes, is fantastic. He also threw nothing but fastballs the first inning.His velocity was 92-94, so it's not like it was "fantastic" as mentioned upthread. That said - it really could be just rust. He hasn't thrown meaningful pitches since October.
This is completely reasonable.So what you're saying is totally logical.
That said, having watched baseball for decades, and seen patterns emerge over time, sometimes it's hard to shake an overall impression from an ongoing landscape.
For me, having seen Price have reduced velocity last year generally, reduced effectiveness last year, the shut down in Spring Training this year, the inability to reach his pitch count in two AAA starts and the inability to get guys out in those two starts adds up to a concerning narrative.
I could not possibly diagnose anything specific from that narrative. But let's just say that I am not going to be surprised if this ends badly.
I'll take 96. Alex Fiorino had him 91-92 in the first and then topping out at 94. According to him he also only threw fastballs in the first which helps support others claims that he was working on stuff as his primary concern and trying to get zeros second.Alex Speier has him 93-96 which would be better than basically any point last year and in line with his career which yes, is fantastic. He also threw nothing but fastballs the first inning.
In that case, he'll fit right in with just about everybody not named Kimbrel or Sale.Reading the game reports I really wonder if he just didn't throw his change, which was his best put away pitch last year.
Seems like has was able to get ahead quickly, but really battled to finish them off.
What exactly is prolonged about the rehab stint so far? After a few bullpens and simulated games, Price has made two rehab starts. I know the way they were talking about his expected pitch counts, it seemed like he was going to ramp up fast, but this seems normal to me. He's in spring training right now...a period that typically takes a pitcher 5-6 weeks to get to the point where he's ready to throw 90-100+ pitches every fifth day in regular season situations. Where Price is seems to be about week four...maybe two starts from being Opening Day ready.Having not seen the games and actual pitches the alleged command issues, I'm not ready to solidify this worry, and maybe it is just a stepping stone in an unusual rehab progression, but I think if all was doing well as I had expected a month ago, his last start would have been sharp and it would have been in a Boston uniform. A prolonged and unsuccessful rehab assignment leads me to think that it is not just a progression towards full strength, but that he is working through an ongoing issue and his arm isn't right.
Keeps him pitching every 5 days.Pete AbrahamVerified account @PeteAbe 7m7 minutes ago
Price starts on Monday in Chicago.
why Monday instead of Tuesday is my only quibble
That's the part that bothers me.Guess he's going to do the rest of his building up in games that count.
What are these numbers? Some variation of game scores, from best to worst for each pitcher?I'll be at this game; I was hoping for Sale, but I'll take what I can get.
More substantively, I just saw this chart that SoxScout shared on twitter (he's @redsoxstats over there). It really highlights the blackhole that the fifth starter spot has been. Sale's been phenomenal, Rodriguez very good, Porcello mostly good, Pomeranz mostly okay... and the fifth starter spot has been horrible.
The takeaway: I'm not sure we're giving up all that much opting for a premature Price over, say, a reprise from Brian Johnson or Hector Velazquez.