Bruins Trade Rumors/Targets

[kenneycb]

My favorite was from B's media day in preseason a couple years ago where he stepped all over Fred's toes when he was talking to Thornton. Fred was trying to keep it friendly and Haggs barged in and asked Thornton how much longer he thought he could play. Loved when T&R roasted him for that one.

 

[burstnbloom]

Haggs is a fucking moron.

Has anyone listened to his full segments on T&R? Lots impossible for his to answer a question without rambling for about 5 minutes after. T&R make fun of him for it somewhat, but he's completely unlistenable.

 
I agree.  One of my favorite Haggs moments was on Felger's cross check show where Felger and Millbury gave him shit about rambling senselessly and having only a short amount of time for his answer before he ever said anything. 
 
Regarding the initial point, he may be full of shit, but my guess is he's close to Chia's expected default position.  I can't see him wanting to move pieces off of the roster,though I do suppose he would if the right offer came around. 
 
After last night, I'm pretty much in the scorched earth camp with this team. Something significant needs to happen. 

 

[j44thor]

 
I agree.  One of my favorite Haggs moments was on Felger's cross check show where Felger and Millbury gave him shit about rambling senselessly and having only a short amount of time for his answer before he ever said anything. 
 
Regarding the initial point, he may be full of shit, but my guess is he's close to Chia's expected default position.  I can't see him wanting to move pieces off of the roster,though I do suppose he would if the right offer came around. 
 
After last night, I'm pretty much in the scorched earth camp with this team. Something significant needs to happen. 

 
While I don't disagree I think it is a lot easier said than done.  This team has too much talent for a blow up and yet most of the talent has underperformed to the point that their trade value is suppressed.  This year Chia really was playing with one hand tied behind his back thanks to the GFIN year last year.  They had to deal with 4.79 in cap penalties this year, that is a top 6 forward, top 4 D they could have used that on.
 
While I know +/- is a flawed stat I do think it has some value as an outlier and it appears to me that Paille is killing this team.  He is a -10 and the no other FW with at least 35+ GP is a minus.  Just mind boggling how that can be accomplished.  His primary linemate Campbell is a +3.  Paille also has 1 G in 55 games.  It would be hard not to upgrade that spot and while that isn't a significant move it would be a good start.  Either give one of the kids a shot or make a minor move for a Jiri Tlusty who can also help the PP.
 
The bigger issue is on the backend where this team definitely needs a top 4 D.  Not the proverbial puck mover, just a solid 2-way defender.  An Andrew Ference type would be ideal for this team.  McQuaid is ideal as a bottom pairing D and getting exposed in a top 4 role.

 

[burstnbloom]

 
While I don't disagree I think it is a lot easier said than done.  This team has too much talent for a blow up and yet most of the talent has underperformed to the point that their trade value is suppressed.  This year Chia really was playing with one hand tied behind his back thanks to the GFIN year last year.  They had to deal with 4.79 in cap penalties this year, that is a top 6 forward, top 4 D they could have used that on.
 
While I know +/- is a flawed stat I do think it has some value as an outlier and it appears to me that Paille is killing this team.  He is a -10 and the no other FW with at least 35+ GP is a minus.  Just mind boggling how that can be accomplished.  His primary linemate Campbell is a +3.  Paille also has 1 G in 55 games.  It would be hard not to upgrade that spot and while that isn't a significant move it would be a good start.  Either give one of the kids a shot or make a minor move for a Jiri Tlusty who can also help the PP.
 
The bigger issue is on the backend where this team definitely needs a top 4 D.  Not the proverbial puck mover, just a solid 2-way defender.  An Andrew Ference type would be ideal for this team.  McQuaid is ideal as a bottom pairing D and getting exposed in a top 4 role.

 
Agreed, and I should clarify.  I don't necessarily mean "blow it up,"  I do mean that no one should be safe.  I think a culture shifting move needs to be made to snap these guys out of it.  I understand the restrictions Chia is working with after last year and I was all on board with it at the time.  I still think it was a good decision.  That said, I'm at the point where I'd like to see something big happen.  The effort/decision making that we are seeing shows a serious need for a wake up call.  I don;t think they are complacent, I just think they've gotten sucked into a pattern and need some kind of catalyst to get them out of it.  If there isn't a hockey trade out there to do this, then I wouldn't make a move just to make it, but I think it should be considered. 
 
On your second point, I couldn't agree more.  The 4th line is a boat anchor for this team.  Campbell and Paille are awful, yet Claude still throws them out there after a goal to "spark" the team.  They generate zero offense and consistently get hemmed in in their own zone.  I cannot wait for them to be gone next year. 

 

[RedOctober3829]

Something that bears watching: Chris Stewart not at Sabres practice today.

 

[cshea]

Grabbing Stewart 2 weeks before the deadline would be so underwhelming. 

 

[PedroSpecialK]

Speaking of potentially underwhelming... Viktor Stalberg is on waivers. 2 years after this season, $3m cap hit.
 
I can't shake the feeling they'll claim him - getting a slightly better Paille at a $1.7m premium strikes me as something this front office would do.

 

[MiracleOfO2704]

If they do, can Neely veto the waiver claim and fire Chiarelli by folding chair impact?

 

[Reardon's Beard]

He's played with Loui for Sweden. Do they grab him and finally form the All Swede Line?

 

[RedOctober3829]

Theres a chance the Boston Bruins could part ways with a pair of veterans prior to the 2015 NHL Trade Deadline.

According to Sportsnets Nick Kypreos, the Bruins are open to moving defenceman Dennis Seidenberg and forward Loui Eriksson prior to March 2.

The Bruins dont have much free cap space and still have to sign pending restricted free agents Reilly Smith, Dougie Hamilton and Torey Krug, all of whom could earn decent salaries based on their quality play. Moving Seidenberg or Eriksson or both could alleviate some salary cap pressure.

http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/boston-bruins-could-trade-loui-eriksson-dennis-seidenberg-before-deadline/

Grain of salt that is Kypreos.

 

[cshea]

Good luck moving Seidenberg.

Eriksson should have value, may or may not have an NMC. I don't see much of a point in moving him though, he's got a good contract and has played well. Unless we're selling, Eriksson should either stay or they should be bringing in a significant right wing upgrade.

 

[Toe Nash]

Maybe you could move Seidenberg for just a low pick to a rebuilding team that is near the cap floor and wants his leadership/experience. But those are by definition bad teams, and why would he waive his NMC to go to a bad team? Any good team is probably not going to want his contract unless they are overvaluing his current and future worth.
 
Agree on Eriksson too. If you're not giving up on this year or doing some kind of major shakeup, he should stay. He's not the problem, nor is he going to net some kind of huge return. Any Eriksson deal is likely to be a sideways move.

 

[TheRealness]

Good luck moving Seidenberg.

Eriksson should have value, may or may not have an NMC. I don't see much of a point in moving him though, he's got a good contract and has played well. Unless we're selling, Eriksson should either stay or they should be bringing in a significant right wing upgrade.

 
Yeah, that report is a little surprising. I doubt there is much of a market for Seidenberg, and while Eriksson has value it's hard to see them put together a deal unless they are getting something back. Maybe they are looking at Seidenberg as a trade piece to balance salaries? Not sure what to make of that report, but we've been hearing Eriksson's name for a while now so I have to assume he's a serious contender to be dealt. 
 
Does Seids have a full NMC? 

 

[cshea]

I'm assuming he does, but NHLNumbers doesn't have NMC/NTC's like Cap Geek did, so it's just a guess based on how every core member Chiarelli has extended has some form of NMC/NTC.

As we approach the deadline, I think Chiarelli needs to take a long term view. I'm not sure wasting assets on a the 2015 versions of Zanon/Mottau/Rolston type rentals would do much for this year. I don't think they should sell, but I do think any moves should be with an eye towards the future and re-positioning the core.

 

[TheRealness]

I'm assuming he does, but NHLNumbers doesn't have NMC/NTC's like Cap Geek did, so it's just a guess based on how every core member Chiarelli has extended has some form of NMC/NTC.

As we approach the deadline, I think Chiarelli needs to take a long term view. I'm not sure wasting assets on a the 2015 versions of Zanon/Mottau/Rolston type rentals would do much for this year. I don't think they should sell, but I do think any moves should be with an eye towards the future and re-positioning the core.

 
How would you feel about moving Seidenberg/Eriksson/Subban/2nd rd for Yandle and Vermette? I feel like Vermette and Eriksson doesn't gain much, but the improvement on the backend with Yandle might be worth it depending on how you feel about Yandle. I say this because there has been talk they were close to a deal with Phoenix and I wonder if that type of deal is what they are talking about. 
 
I have absolutely no read on this though. This deadline could go in all sorts of directions. 

 

[cshea]

 
How would you feel about moving Seidenberg/Eriksson/Subban/2nd rd for Yandle and Vermette? I feel like Vermette and Eriksson doesn't gain much, but the improvement on the backend with Yandle might be worth it depending on how you feel about Yandle. I say this because there has been talk they were close to a deal with Phoenix and I wonder if that type of deal is what they are talking about. 
 
I have absolutely no read on this though. This deadline could go in all sorts of directions. 

I don't really love that deal. They alleviate some cap problems, but I don't love the actual return and think they could do better. Vermette's a downgrade from Eriksson and is a 32 year old UFA to be. He's also a weird fit as a left shot center. Pass. I do like Yandle as a piece for the top 4, but feel like they could get him for less.

 

[TheRealness]

I don't really love that deal. They alleviate some cap problems, but I don't love the actual return and think they could do better. Vermette's a downgrade from Eriksson and is a 32 year old UFA to be. He's also a weird fit as a left shot center. Pass. I do like Yandle as a piece for the top 4, but feel like they could get him for less.

 
Normally I am a big proponent of weathering the storm and being patient, but this team really needs a kick in the ass. I feel like I'm grasping at straws here with trying to figure out a potential trade they could make. 
 
Personally, I'd like to see them move Soderberg who has fallen off a cliff recently and his lack of speeds seems to have caught up to him. I'd much rather see them move on from him in a Vermette deal, and add another piece on top. I have taken a 180 on the Yeti. I'd rather they move on from him and get more speed on that 3rd line. But with him being a UFA, I doubt he has any significant value with his play of late and his previous history with the Blues and Bruins and not wanting to come over. 

 

[cshea]

I actually think Soderberg would have a lot of value if they wanted to move him. If your a cap strapped contender in need of a center, who would you rather have, Vermette at $3.75m or Soderberg at $1 million? They have nearly identical numbers, albeit Vermette is a faceoff wizard and is better defensively.

Soderberg is pretty much useless without Eriksson, so might as well lump Soderberg in with Loui if they are indeed trying to dump Loui.

 

[Ed Hillel]

Let's assume nobody wants to take Seidenberg and his contract. If you give him the rest of the season and he still looks like a statue, does he get amnestied? I think one could make a good argument for it. Maybe this is a separate thread, but it assumes Seidenberg isn't traded, so we should maybe at least wait until then.

 

[RedOctober3829]

I would not mind trading Loui because, as stated above, it opens up some cap flexibility for this offseason.  Seidenberg would be good for a team who wants to GFIN, has money, and needs a top 4 D-man.  He's not the horse he was in 2011, but he'd be solid for a contender who need a top 4 D-man.  His contract off the books would be very nice too.  Those two contracts off the books would open up an additional $8.25 million in cap space for 2015 and $4 million in 2016/2017 according to Sportrac.  Considering that 11 spots are going to have to be filled this offseason(I count 5 UFA's(Soderberg, Campbell, McQuaid, Paille, Bartkowski) and 6 RFA's(Hamilton, Krug, Smith, Svedberg, Cunningham, and Caron) and bigger contracts are coming for Hamilton for sure and maybe Krug they will need as much cash as possible.
 
Ed--the opportunity to use compliance buyouts passed this offseason.  That isn't possible anymore.

 

[RedOctober3829]

I'm assuming he does, but NHLNumbers doesn't have NMC/NTC's like Cap Geek did, so it's just a guess based on how every core member Chiarelli has extended has some form of NMC/NTC.

As we approach the deadline, I think Chiarelli needs to take a long term view. I'm not sure wasting assets on a the 2015 versions of Zanon/Mottau/Rolston type rentals would do much for this year. I don't think they should sell, but I do think any moves should be with an eye towards the future and re-positioning the core.

 

Heiko Oldoerp ‏@HeikoOldoerp 12m12 minutes ago
 
Eben mit Dennis #Seidenberg bzgl. Tradegerüchten telefoniert. Er wusste von nichts, hat zudem auf seine No trade clause verwiesen. #NHL

 
Translated from German by Bing
With Dennis #Seidenberg phone regarding trade rumors. He didn't know, referenced in addition its clause No. trade. #NHL

 
 

 

[TheRealness]

Ok, got it. Does anyone on the Bruins not have a NMC at this point? Does Claude? When does it become absurd to give out NMC's like candy? 3rd line players? 4th line? Backup goalies? Assistant coaches. Just absurd. 
 
If (when?) Chiarelli gets fired, he can look back on his doling out of NMC (and the Seguin trade) as his downfall. 

 

[Salem's Lot]

Ok, got it. Does anyone on the Bruins not have a NMC at this point? Does Claude? When does it become absurd to give out NMC's like candy? 3rd line players? 4th line? Backup goalies? Assistant coaches. Just absurd. 
 
If (when?) Chiarelli gets fired, he can look back on his doling out of NMC (and the Seguin trade) as his downfall. 

It's funny because usually teams give guys NTC's so that good players will take a home town discount instead of testing the market. Chiarelli seems to over pay AND give out the NTC's to everyone. I can't get over how bad he's managed to screw up a team that was in the finals 18 months ago. I know some of it is injuries to Chara and Seidenberg but the inability to move pieces around to pick up some of the slack for those guys is frustrating to say the least.

 

[cshea]

At last check they had 10- Chara, Rask and Bergeron were full NMC's, IIRC. Krejci has a limited no-trade that kicks to a full no-trade at some point (maybe this offseason when the extension kicks in?) Marchand, Kelly and Lucic have limited NTC's. Eriksson had one, but he waived it to come here. Before shutting down, Cap Geek didn't know if the Bruins gave it back to him. I assume they did. Seidenberg's I honestly can't remember if it is full or limited. Savard is the last one.

Unfortunately, handing out NMC's is pretty much the only thing GM's can give out to entice players to take less than market value. Chiarelli did this with Kelly and Seidenberg, and now we're in a jam.

 

[Ed Hillel]

Ed--the opportunity to use compliance buyouts passed this offseason.  That isn't possible anymore.

 
Got it, I mis-read and was distinguishing between accelerated compliance buyout and compliance buyout. I guess they are the same thing.

 

[Salem's Lot]

Unfortunately, handing out NMC's is pretty much the only thing GM's can give out to entice players to take less than market value. Chiarelli did this with Kelly and Seidenberg, and now we're in a jam.

 
I realize that the NMC is a negotiating carrot to get the player to take less money, but then Chiarelli goes and pays them at the top of the market anyway. Why are they giving a bottom 6 forward like Chris Kelly a four year $12 million dollar deal with a NTC? Those guys are very replaceable and in many cases you can find one on a ELC if you draft decently. The Seidenberg deal I have no problem with. Top pairing defensemen get NTC's & a team assumes a risk of injury with any contract. However the need to overpay to keep replaceable, aging, veteran bottom 6 forwards is killing them on the cap. They have $6 million tied up in Kelly, Campbell & Paille right now. Kelly is about $1.5 million overpaid and you could make a good argument to waive both Campbell & Paille. They have to start trusting their farm system more and focus on improving the first line instead of wasting resources on the bottom 2 lines.  

 

[NYCSox]

To be fair they are constantly hampered in the offseason by the lunacy of mandating that Savard's contract count for cap purposes. I mean that's why Boychuk is gone. That doesn't excuse overpaying guys like Paille and Campbell, though admittedly neither seemed to be overpaid last season when that line was terrific.
 
So it's part bad luck, part stupid rules and part poor management.

 

[cshea]

Kelly is being paid less than market value. Like it or not, he took a discount. Jaret Stoll is LA's version of Kelly and he makes $3.25 million. Dave Bolland was the Blackhawks version of Kelly and he got $5.5 million on the open market (with a lowered cap). St. Louis has Berglund at north of $3 million. Just to name a few.

I agree with you on the farm system. They have do better drafting and developing talent. Chicago is able to walk away from Bolland because they have guys like Shaw on an ELC to replace Bolland. The Bruins haven't been able to do that since Marchand. Dry drafts have caught up.

 

[FelixMantilla]

http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/draft/teams/dr00004919.html

 

[NYCSox]

That's an ugly run since 2006. And of course you can't count Seguin or Hamilton since those were slam dunk picks.

 

[TFP]

That's an ugly run since 2006. And of course you can't count Seguin or Hamilton since those were slam dunk picks.

So Hamilton at 9 was a slam dunk but Hamill at 8 wasn't. Got it.

 

[NYCSox]

I don't recall Hamill being regarded as a consensus top 10 pick. Or that we were all shocked and pleased that he was available at 8.  
 
As I recall we were thrilled beyond belief that Hamilton was there at 9.

 

[NickEsasky]

So Hamilton at 9 was a slam dunk but Hamill at 8 wasn't. Got it.

Maybe I am missing your point but wasn't Dougie a complete slam dunk at 9? I remember watching the draft with you actually and we were shocked that Dougie slipped to the Bruins. I am not as aware of the Hamill draft, but given some of the names of guys picked after him, he probably shouldn't have been a slam dunk. 

 

[cshea]

They were both considered safe picks. The 07 draft was pretty hit-or-miss. The Hamilton draft was a bit more loaded, but they should get credit for selecting Hamilton over a bunch of other defensemen that were available (Siemens, Murphy, Beaulieu).

They've had varying degrees of success in the first round. Hamil and Caron were misses, Colborne has turned into a decent player and Hamilton looks to be a stud in the making. It's more the depths of the drafts where they haven't had success. From 06-now Michael Hutchinson is really the only player they've drafted outside of the first round that has turned into an established NHL player. Easier said than done of course, especially with them drafting in the low 20's all these years, but they could've done better. This is an argument for another day/thread though.

 

[RedOctober3829]

I@ShawnHutcheon: .@DarrenDreger on @NHLonNBCSports, "(#NHLBruins) Chiarelli is trying to make deals. He's looking for forward and defenseman.."

 

[burstnbloom]

Maybe I am missing your point but wasn't Dougie a complete slam dunk at 9? I remember watching the draft with you actually and we were shocked that Dougie slipped to the Bruins. I am not as aware of the Hamill draft, but given some of the names of guys picked after him, he probably shouldn't have been a slam dunk. 

 
Hamill was a pretty "safe" pick at the time.  He was coming off a 90+ Pt season in the WHL as a 17 year old.  He just turned out to be fucking awful.  I was a Couture guy.  They should have listened to me.  That whole draft was an unmitigated disaster.  

 

[Zososoxfan]

People keep advocating for a shake up and then mentioning names like Loui, Kelly, Soderberg, and other bottom 9/bottom pair players. That doesn't meet the definition of shake up to me. Is there any desire in RMPS to shop core guys like Krejci, Marchand, Looch, Chara, or Rask (I adamantly refuse to mention Bergy here)? That would qualify as a team-changing trade to me and may be what's in order, but per usual, I defer to you more knowledgeable folk.

 

[TSC]

People keep advocating for a shake up and then mentioning names like Loui, Kelly, Soderberg, and other bottom 9/bottom pair players. That doesn't meet the definition of shake up to me. Is there any desire in RMPS to shop core guys like Krejci, Marchand, Looch, Chara, or Rask (I adamantly refuse to mention Bergy here)? That would qualify as a team-changing trade to me and may be what's in order, but per usual, I defer to you more knowledgeable folk.

 
There's plenty of people who think Lucic and/or Marchand could/should go.

 

[TheRealness]

 
There's plenty of people who think Lucic and/or Marchand could/should go.

 
Trading Marchand would be a mistake, IMO. He fits the faster NHL much better than Looch. 
 
I love Lucic. He's been my favorite player since he arrived. My tag line is even in reference to my undying love for him. 
 
But, he needs to be traded. He's not worth $6m. He won't ever be worth more, and his salary level is really hampering them. They need to move on. He's a third line player masquerading as a top line wing. 

 

[cshea]

My list of untochables is...Patrice Bergeron. Everyone else I'd listen on, with varying degrees of enthusiasm.

 

[TSC]

My list of untochables is...Patrice Bergeron. Everyone else I'd listen on, with varying degrees of enthusiasm.

 
Dougie.
 
A big, offensively gifted defenseman who has all the tools to be great defensively as well?

He should retire a Bruin.

 

[teddykgb]

At some point he does have to make that leap, but I wouldn't trade him either.
 
From a roster construction perspective, I'd be open even to Rask.  I know it's likely to get me shouted down, but I think there's a fundamental imbalance in the entire roster in the sense that if you have a 7 million dollar goaltender, he probably shouldn't require a defensive system and superstar defensemen to put up superstar numbers.  I'd stop short of calling him a product of the system, but I find it very concerning that when Chara and Seidenberg show signs of slipping, the goalie also slips into the pack.
 
I actually really like Tuuka and his numbers are not far off from being the goalie we're paying for, so there's plenty of sense in the argument that you have to ride it out.  He certainly makes some incredible saves and I'm sure that I'd miss him if I had to watch what an actual average goaltender in the league looks like.  I don't think he's the reason why they are where they are. (it feels necessary to qualify the hell out of this because I'm certain I'm about to be called stupid)  But I think that this team has so much committed to preventing goals that it absolutely HAS to be great at that.  I wouldn't be eager to trade Rask, but I'd certainly wonder whether some other team might value him enough to give up a lot for him.

 

[j44thor]

 
Dougie.
 
A big, offensively gifted defenseman who has all the tools to be great defensively as well?

He should retire a Bruin.

 
Problem is he could get expensive before he is close to his potential.  See Tyler Myers for example.
He might not be who he ends up for another 3-4 years as D typically blossom later in their careers.  Can the B's afford to wait that long and pay a premium in the short term?
 
I'm not advocating trading him but for the right deal I don't think he is untouchable.

 

[TSC]

 
Problem is he could get expensive before he is close to his potential.  See Tyler Myers for example.
He might not be who he ends up for another 3-4 years as D typically blossom later in their careers.  Can the B's afford to wait that long and pay a premium in the short term?
 
I'm not advocating trading him but for the right deal I don't think he is untouchable.

 
He's an RFA for next season.
 
I just assume him the heir apparent to Chara and his contract come 2016.

 

[cshea]

Only way I'd trade Dougie is if they're getting a similarly young, signed, more developed 2-way #1 defenseman back. Guys like Pietrangelo or OEL. Pipe dreams, of course, but there are a handful of guys out there like that.

 

[Salem's Lot]

There isn't a single player on this team I wouldn't move in the right deal. I would actively be looking to move Lucic since he has value around the league and I wouldn't want to resign him when his contract runs out after next year. 

 

[FL4WL3SS]

 
Trading Marchand would be a mistake, IMO. He fits the faster NHL much better than Looch. 
 
I love Lucic. He's been my favorite player since he arrived. My tag line is even in reference to my undying love for him. 
 
But, he needs to be traded. He's not worth $6m. He won't ever be worth more, and his salary level is really hampering them. They need to move on. He's a third line player masquerading as a top line wing. 

I'm on board with your thinking.

 

[cshea]

Ferlin up, apparently. A little weird unless I missed an injury last night, but maybe they're finally ready to re-work the 4th line?

 

[FL4WL3SS]

The 4th line is the least of this team's problems.

 

[cshea]

On a macro level, sure the 4th line isn't the main problem. It's still a problem they have and it should've been addressed a lot sooner. Paille/Campbell/Cunningham have been terrible. Campbell in particular has been arguably the worst NHL player this season. -15 CorsiOn per 60, it's a fire drill in our own end when he steps on the ice. Paille is -8, still terrible, and has scored all of 1 goal. They continue getting ice time despite being hemmed in shift after shift. They can't keep rolling this guys out there.