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Bruins in 18-19

Discussion in 'Rick Middleton's Pron 'Stache: Bruins Forum' started by RedOctober3829, May 6, 2018.

  1. jk333

    jk333 Member SoSH Member

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    2,236
    Carlo is the guy I’d trade, not Krug. I think he was somewhat exposed this year after a great rookie season that was bolstered by playing with Chara.

    That said, he has the tools and they would need to be offered a really good player for him. I think next year’s D is set. As it turns out, McDonagh for Carlo and a 1st could have been better but it would have been a tough price at the time. But, they were 3rd in goals against this year... seems difficult to justify major changes to that unit even after losing to your rival in 5 games.

    Chara-McAvoy
    Krug-Carlo
    Gryz-Miller
    McQ

    Solid group that is going to cost a ton to “upgrade”. Better to wait and see if Gryz, Carlo, Zboril or Ukk can develop into that 1b and hope McAvoy continues to a 1A type.
     
    #51 jk333, May 9, 2018
    Last edited: May 9, 2018
  2. BigMike

    BigMike Dope Dope

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    20,887
    I do agree that basically the only thing they have in common is the fact they are tiny. I see a lot of people talking like maybe if Krug is gone, Gryz will suddenly burst out as an offensive player. I just don't think the talent is there. Sure he might bet more points, but he is never going to be a krug.

    I guess I am not sure of either being long term guys, as they are both deeply flawed.

    Krug trade value is likely extremely high, near the top of the Bruins, so you might consider moving him.

    In terms of OEL, really good offensive player, but has he not basically developed into a Rich man's version of Krug. Obviously being buried on a bad team makes you wonder, but can his defense rebound?

    And Frederick is the one prospect in the system who is off limits to me. the Bruins have a DESPERATE need for him to make it.
     
  3. cshea

    cshea Member SoSH Member

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    18,277
    Acciari having surgery for a sports hernia he dealt with from November.

    Marchand has a groin injury. He also said he needs to “cut the shit.”
     
  4. RedOctober3829

    RedOctober3829 Member SoSH Member

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    Brandon Carlo said he's going to be walking in about a week and should "absolutely" be ready for camp.

    Riley Nash confirmed that he suffered a concussion at the end of the regular season.
     
    #54 RedOctober3829, May 9, 2018
    Last edited: May 9, 2018
  5. cshea

    cshea Member SoSH Member

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    Rask having minor surgery for an ankle bursa.

    Chara dealt with a UBI in the playoffs.
     
  6. RedOctober3829

    RedOctober3829 Member SoSH Member

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    Torey Krug broke his ankle. 2 month recovery time.
     
  7. RedOctober3829

    RedOctober3829 Member SoSH Member

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    Jake DeBrusk had an AC joint injury in his shoulder.
     
  8. cshea

    cshea Member SoSH Member

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    Chara also broke a finger in game 2 against Toronto. 6 week recovery.
     
  9. cshea

    cshea Member SoSH Member

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    Bergeron missed Game 4 against Toronto with concussion symptoms. Also dealt with a groin injury all season that might require surgery.
     
  10. cshea

    cshea Member SoSH Member

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    Backes “doesn’t feel right” so seems he is concussed.
     
  11. FL4WL3SS

    FL4WL3SS Member SoSH Member

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    It'd be nice to have a season of relative health. Good Lord
     
  12. Ale Xander

    Ale Xander Member SoSH Member

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    They're fairly deep, at least in terms of playable NHL talent. Problem is lack of a Tyler Johnson type player on a secondary line. Unfortunately Backes and Rick are 5 years past that point, and Krejci was never that great a defender. Hopefully Debrusk or someone can develop into that player. But right now they're top-heavy, even if the top is probably the best in the game.

    Are we 100% sure Chara is coming back? Assuming he is, call me crazy, but I'd go offense-first on the top D pairing and put Krug/Chuck there; they can handle the workload. I'd probably take Chara off the special units, at the very least limit his minutes, and save him for April/May/June. He looked out of gas this year to the point where it affected his decision-making; plus it would reduce likelihood of injury. Play Carlo/Gryz/Miller more with a 2+ lead or deficit in the 3rd.

    If you can get a 5th or better for mcquaid, do it, if not, keep him on the 9th floor as injury insurance.

    Agree with letting nashes go. Other than Krejci, and perhaps Backes, no bad contracts here, and you need Backes as a locker room presence besides Bergy (and Chara). If you have Marcand creating drama, having Backes (someone more objective towards Marchand, than Bergy, given the lines and time together) is almost a necessity given the youth of the team.

    Team is relatively young (except Chara), so let's use that to our advantage. Build up assets and use them at the deadline, again, to fix injury problems and make a targeted move.

    Kuraly is definitely a guy to keep, totally agreed there. One of the few bright spots these playoffs.

    Looking forward to seeing JFK and other newcomers develop too.
     
  13. edmunddantes

    edmunddantes Member SoSH Member

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    I'm not as up on the NHL concussion protocol, but that doesn't read well for any of the parties involved
     
  14. PedroSpecialK

    PedroSpecialK Comes at you like a tornado of hair and the NHL sa Silver Supporter SoSH Member

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    Agreed. If they knew he was potentially concussed and let him sit out a playoff game without putting him through concussion protocol (independent of his history) that's an awful look for the franchise.
     
  15. LogansDad

    LogansDad Member SoSH Member

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    Absolutely agree, but especially with his history, and after seeing the hit he took in game 3 that (probably) led to him feeling that way. I get that it's the playoffs, and this seemed to be the first time a few years that the Bruins looked like they could be competitive, so people want to play through stuff.... but I really don't like hearing about them fucking around with potential head injuries.
     
  16. Murby

    Murby lurker

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    Agreed. This is a bad look. Either Bergy just told them that he "wasn't feeling well" and they didn't ask him about a possible concussion because they didn't want to say the c-word or they knew it and didn't act upon it. Suppose there is a third option: they asked him about a concussion and he demurred.

    It looks bad and is deeply concerning.
     
  17. cshea

    cshea Member SoSH Member

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    Isn’t there another possibility here? He could’ve reported the symptoms, but passed the baseline tests, so it wasn’t diagnosed and thus not in the protocol? I’m not sure how the protocol works, is it reporting the symptoms that trigger the protocol, or once he reports symptoms does he have to go through tests and then be diagnosed before entering the protocol?

    Maybe it is splitting hairs.
     
  18. LogansDad

    LogansDad Member SoSH Member

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    14,770
    Yeah, after my post yesterday I read that he was suffering from a cold at the same time, and that ended up being what the problem was. So, maybe it isn't so bad?
     
  19. RedOctober3829

    RedOctober3829 Member SoSH Member

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    Don Sweeney says he's had some discussions to see if there's a possible move to get Bruins back into first round of draft. (They traded first round pick in Rick Nash deal.)
     
  20. cshea

    cshea Member SoSH Member

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    Not sure what that trade would look like. Probably have to be a Bjork/Heinen + trade. No other obvious candidates. I guess maybe Krug, but I think if Krug goes it would be in a package for a better two-way LHD.
     
  21. kenneycb

    kenneycb Hates Goose Island Beer; Loves Backdoor Play SoSH Member

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    I have no idea how they would even do that unless it's Krug or a smattering of prospects and futures. They have a deep prospect pool none that are worthy of a first on their own.
     
  22. PedroSpecialK

    PedroSpecialK Comes at you like a tornado of hair and the NHL sa Silver Supporter SoSH Member

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    Maybe a team values the '19 draft class more highly than '18? From most publications I've read the consensus seems to be more upside in '19 but I'll be damned if I know.
     
  23. Salem's Lot

    Salem's Lot Andy Moog! Andy God Damn Moog! SoSH Member

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    CC was hinting at Krug for #10 from Edmonton but that's likely to be speculation.
     
  24. cshea

    cshea Member SoSH Member

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    I guess that is decent value, but I don’t see how that really helps the Bruins in 2018-2019. It is trading from their biggest area of need for futures.

    Fluto has tossed out Klefbom from EDM as a possible trade target.

    Edit: Apparently Chiarelli is on record saying he would move #10 for an offensive dman. The Oilers somehow had a putrid PP. Hence the Krug speculation.
     
    #74 cshea, May 10, 2018
    Last edited: May 10, 2018
  25. NYCSox

    NYCSox chris hansen of goats Lifetime Member SoSH Member

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    The Oilers already have three LD in Nurse, Klefbom and Sekera. They'd have to move someone to take back Krug. Sekera isn't going anywhere with his injury and contract and Nurse is still very young and fairly cost effective. Maybe there is room for a swap to get a little bigger (at least size maybe not so much physicality) on the blue line?
     
  26. Salem's Lot

    Salem's Lot Andy Moog! Andy God Damn Moog! SoSH Member

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    Maybe Nurse and #10 for Krug and #57?
     
  27. FL4WL3SS

    FL4WL3SS Member SoSH Member

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    That would be massively stupid. If they wanted a first round pick so badly, they should have held onto their own. Now Sweeny wants to trade more assets away? Doesn't make much sense.
     
  28. kenneycb

    kenneycb Hates Goose Island Beer; Loves Backdoor Play SoSH Member

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    Meh, he's exploring alternatives. I have no problem with that, especially if they are eyeing a specific player. It's not harm, no foul at least until he actually calls in the trade.
     
  29. timlinin8th

    timlinin8th Member SoSH Member

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    The other problem with any Oilers rumors is that Edmonton already has almost $18M tied to 4 D-men already, with Nurse and Benning both having expiring ELCs and will be due raises. If the Oilers flip Nurse for Krug, thats adding another 5.5M to a D corps that is already pretty expensive while not having a really good top line D option.

    Seriously, this Edmonton team is Chiarelli style cap management at its worst.
     
  30. NYCSox

    NYCSox chris hansen of goats Lifetime Member SoSH Member

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    If it's going to happen, the only that makes sense is some version involving Klefbom and his 4.1M per contract.
     
  31. PedroSpecialK

    PedroSpecialK Comes at you like a tornado of hair and the NHL sa Silver Supporter SoSH Member

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    I think it's all kind of moot (or at least I would hope) - I don't see a scenario in which moving Krug in a deal makes the B's better, unless it's part of a deal for an Erik Karlsson / Seth Jones level defenseman.
     
  32. veritas

    veritas Member SoSH Member

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    If anyone is going to overpay in a trade it’s Chia. #10 and RNH is something that seems somewhat reasonable and works with salary
     
  33. cshea

    cshea Member SoSH Member

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    Here’s my State of the Bruins heading into silly season next month.

    FORWARD

    Marchand - Bergeron - Pastrnak
    DeBrusk - Krejci - Bjork
    Donato - XXX - Backes
    Heinen - Kuraly - Acciari

    I don’t thing much work needs to be done with the forward group. I’d bring back Kuraly, let everyone else go. I’d consider a Schaller reunion if he is willing to stay for cheap (ie the $750K he played for this year), but he had a nice year so I assume someone will give him a nice raise. Frederic and JFK can battle it out in camp for the 3C spot. Another option is Donato as 3C. The loser goes to Providence, where they’ll also have Szwarz as insurance. Czarnik is unrestricted, I’d like to bring him back as a center, but he may get more of an opportunity elsewhere and even if he does sign, he’ll be waiver eligible which could cause a bit of a roster log jam. Ryan Fitzgerald is a wing, but had a nice season for Providence (21-16= 37 in 65 games) so he could push for a bottom 9 spot, but it’s hard to see too much room unless they move out a wing or Bjork starts the year in Providence. I’ve long been intrigued by Cehlarik, but he can’t seem to stay healthy. Wonder if he’ll be trade bait.

    They’re in good shape here. Nothing drastic needs to happen. They need a little more time to see exactly what they have with some of the kids before making any external moves. Bjork and Donato are still unknown and Heinen is somewhat of a mystery. Did he hit a wall in the 2nd half, or is his first half closer to what he is?

    DEFENSE

    Chara - McAvoy
    Krug - Carlo
    Grzelyck - Miller
    McQuaid

    Obviously the talk here is finding a 2-way LHD that can eat minutes on the 2nd pair a la McDonagh in Tampa. Dangling Krug and futures for an upgrade seems to the be the most realistic scenario, but that is easier said than done. Maybe Carolina and their new nutty owner puts Slavin of Hanifin on the block. There are also rumors of Klefbom or Nurse out of Edmonton. I’m not sure who else is really available, the type of player the Bruins need don’t get traded often. The Bruins do have a ton of LHD’s at varying stages of development in the system, but I don’t think any of the kids are really ready to step into that sort of role. Zboril is probably the closest, but it is probably preferable to let him continue developing in Providence to start the season and then ease him in as an injury replacement and let him work his way up as desired, like they did with Grz. It is hard to tell with some of the kids that come over from European pro leagues, must maybe Vaakanainen is someone who could make a quick transition. McQuaid is (finally!) in the last year of his deal, might as well keep him around as the healthy scratch.

    GOAL

    Rask
    McIntyre

    I’m not a Khudobin fan, I’d save the cap space and give McIntyre a look or see if I can save a few bucks with some other journeyman. Khudobin posted a .938 save percentage through his first 9 appearances, then a .901 the rest of the way (22 appearances). He had a .904 in 2016/2017. Maybe it’s cherry picking, but to me the lousy .901 is more of what he is than the 9 game hot streak (which admittedly came right when the team needed it). He’s below replacement level, in my opinion. Roll the dice with Zane.

    All in all, I think we are looking at another quiet offseason. They’ll do their due diligence in trying to find a LHD, but they have been looking for that since Sweeney took over, so I’m not sure they get it done.
     
  34. Smiling Joe Hesketh

    Smiling Joe Hesketh All Hail King Boron Dope

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    I can't agree with you assessment of Dobby. Gustavsson (.908, 2.72) was below replacement level. Just last year the Bruins suffered through Dobby's bad start under Claude along with Zane and Subban, now THAT was below replacement level. Once Cassidy came aboard he started giving Dobby regular starts and lo and behold he was much better. And this year I can't see an argument that he was in any way anything other than exactly what they needed from the backup goalie.

    They need a guy to keep Rask down to under 60 starts. Sticking Zane in there would be a big risk. If you want to move on from Dobby, fine, but if the rookie isn't up to it they can't just pull a Broduer and play Rask 70+ games. While Dobby did tail off after his hot streak, too many other guys don't ever have a hot streak.
     
  35. cshea

    cshea Member SoSH Member

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    18,277
    The bar to clear is pretty low. 2 years ago Khudobin and the other backups didn’t win them a game until like March, and Khudobin himself was sent to Providence for a short stint because he wasn’t trusted. I don’t think the 9 game hot streak should override the larger sample we have on Khudobin. He’s been a sub .910 goalie since his Carolina days in 14/15.

    Maybe Zane’s not the answer, but I’d be comfortable giving him a look. If he got consistent starts against soft opponents, he could be fine. Subban was fine for Vegas. Zane’s got a good pedigree- Hobey finalist in college and won the AHL save percentage 2 years ago (and I believe he won the AHL version of the Vezina), and good to great AHL numbers. He wasn’t as good this year as last year, but performed better as the year wore on.
     
  36. AMcGhie

    AMcGhie The Robinson Canoe of RMPS SoSH Member

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    A competent backup goalie is something that can be had for not a huge price from a team that is out of the playoffs. I'd say give Zane a shot and leverage the cap space and trade for someone mid-season if he's not the answer at the backup spot for 25-30 starts (which would put Tuukka at 52-57)
     
  37. veritas

    veritas Member SoSH Member

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    This is some great analysis, I agree with most of it, except for one thing. I don't think Heinen is a mystery. I think at the end of next year we'll be laughing at some team for giving Riley Nash $14/4, wondering when Backes fell off a cliff, and then looking at Heinen and his 55 points / +20 and it'll all make sense. He slowed down at the end of the season, but his numbers overall are still fantastic. I was perplexed at him being benched in the playoffs, I thought he was punished for the poor play of Riley/Backes.

    They do have some very interesting lineup issues to address this offseason though. I think they need to address their depth at center and they think they need to get sturdier at LD. I think Krug and one of their young forwards for a C and LD is something they should be exploring, in some combination. That could leave them with something like this (I traded Krug For Klefbom+ and Donato+ For Staal, for an example. Maybe Krug for RNH and a LD from somewhere else. Whatever):

    Marchand-Bergeron-Bjork
    Heinen-Staal?-Pastrnak
    DeBrusk-Krejci-Backes
    Kuraly-Frederic-Acciari
    Agostino-JFK-Czarnik

    Chara-McAvoy
    Klefbom?-Carlo
    Grz-Miller
    Zboril/Lauzon-McQuaid

    That's a much more balanced lineup than they have at the moment. Is it better? Whatever they do, this team is really fucking deep with good young players next season, and in big trouble if they can't ditch Krejci or Backes the following year.
     
  38. timlinin8th

    timlinin8th Member SoSH Member

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    Yeah, even when Heinen “wasn’t playing well” he was still making plays and I think his possession numbers backed that up. He probably did hit a bit of a rookie wall but expecting him to maintain the torrid pace he had at the beginning of the season was unreasonable anyways. Who he really is probably lives in between that hot start and the guy at the end - he had 47 points total this past season so I’d say your 55pt prediction is a pretty good one - which is stellar for a bottom 6 guy.
     
  39. TheRealness

    TheRealness Don't make him go all Lucic on your ash SoSH Member

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    I assume you're not serious about adding Eric or Jordan Staal considering I don't think either is much of an upgrade, and I think you make the Bruins worse long term by trading Donato. Remember that Eric Staal's career looked over just a year ago, or at least, he looked like a bottom 6 player. I want no part of him.

    I don't have an issue trading for a Center, but I would only be on board if they (1) were able to get younger and faster, and (2) did so for a legitimate 2C that allowed them to trade Krejci. I think that's a pipe dream on either account.

    The Klefbom stuff is interesting, but I doubt the Bruins make any significant moves. I think they should continue to rely on their youth movement, and look to accentuate with a depth signing for the 4th line and that is it.
     
  40. cshea

    cshea Member SoSH Member

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    Eric Staal has rejuvenated his career in Minnesota. He looked cooked his last few seasons on Carolina and then when he was traded to the Rangers. His last 2 years:

    16/17- 82 games, 28-37=65
    17/18- 82 games, 42-34=76

    He’s back to being a monster. He’s on a great contract, $3.5 million for next season and then he is a UFA. I’d be all over him if the Wild were to make him available. My only concern in the veritas scenario is trading a young possible C like Donato for a 33 year old C. At some point the Bruins need to try and put a succession plan in place for Bergeron and Krejci.
     
  41. Salem's Lot

    Salem's Lot Andy Moog! Andy God Damn Moog! SoSH Member

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    Staal could potentially be a great deadline pickup for a contender at that contract. I'm not sure the Bruins should give up premium prospects for him at this point. He's a put you over the top piece and the Bruins aren't there yet. I'd only consider dealing a Donato for that top 4 left side young defenseman with term.
     
  42. cshea

    cshea Member SoSH Member

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    The more I look around, the more I think they need to target one of the Carolina D, Hanifin or Slavin. Either player represents more of an upgrade on Krug and would be the heir to Chara on the left side.

    They lusted after Hanifin in 2015 but failed in their attempt to move up to get him, so there is some history. Slavin is really good too and has a great $5.3 AAV contract through his age 31 season. Slavin probably better in the defensive end, Hanifin is currently better on the offensive end, but they’re both young top pair guys. Slavin/Hanifin - McAvoy is your top pair for the next decade. The price for either in trade would probably be painful, but I think they need to look long and hard at it.
     
  43. timlinin8th

    timlinin8th Member SoSH Member

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    i don’t see the Bruins trading for an older C, despite Staal turning back into a beast. The age is definitely a factor, and I think while the plan is to let Frederic and JFK compete for the 3C spot out of camp, the team may also be hopeful of the best-case scenario that whichever of Frederic/JFK that doesn’t break camp with the team spends another year in Providence and gains more experience as Krejci’s contract continues to tick away. FWIW Frederic doesn’t even hit RFA until Krejci is UFA (JFK is the year before)
     
  44. LogansDad

    LogansDad Member SoSH Member

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    14,770
    You guys are way more in the loop on this stuff than me, but I wouldn't be surprised (or opposed to) if the team mostly stays pat, even if it means taking a step back in the upcoming season.

    They had a great year this year, but I think most of us would agree that they were definitely ahead of schedule. It always felt like the plan was to stay sort of competitive through 2018 and have the kids running the show by 2019-2020, to me. If they look to be one player away at the deadline, maybe move some assets then, but I'm not opposed to throwing some of the younger guys into a trial by fire to see how they respond.

    I would love to see an upgrade at LD as well, but I'm not sure they really have the parts to move to make a major upgrade happen. I could be way, way off base here, though.
     
  45. TheRealness

    TheRealness Don't make him go all Lucic on your ash SoSH Member

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    I don't think there is anyway Carolina parts with Hanifin without getting someone like Pastrnak, Carlo, or maybe a pu pu platter of Donato, DeBrusk and a few of our LD (Zboril, Lauzon, etc) in Providence. Is it really worth it to add him and then open up such significant holes elsewhere? I don't think so. I am a big fan of Gryz, and feel one of Zboril, Lauzon or the finnish guy Urho Uakalakaklkanaaneinanen will end up working into a spot.

    The only way I think it makes sense is if the centerpiece is Krug, and I don't see another team doing that even if we chip in draft picks or Donato. At least, not for an elite talent like Hanifin.

    Thus, why I think the Bruins will stand pat for the most part, make some depth signings, and go into the season continuing the youth movement.
     
  46. cshea

    cshea Member SoSH Member

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    I wouldn’t give up Pastrnak, but I’d give up pretty much whatever else they want. Agreed that it maynot be enough.
     
  47. Haunted

    Haunted The Man in the Box SoSH Member

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    While Krug is easily exposed when given top 4 minutes against good offensive teams, I think we undersell his value as a PP specialist and offensive zone D man. His shot is crazy good and his movement with the puck (mostly) is excellent. I would not look at him as a trade chit.

    I agree with the "stand pat, accept a possible step back" suggestion by others. If they're in a good position at trade deadline time again, make another medium-impact move if possible or just more depth moves.
     
  48. jk333

    jk333 Member SoSH Member

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    What’s the latest on Hannifin’s development? What I’ve read has been mixed with some pegging him as future true #1 and others as a future 1b Dougie Hamilton type.
     
  49. cshea

    cshea Member SoSH Member

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    Hanifin currently plays on Carolina’s second pair with Trevor Van Riemsdyk. Average a shade under 19 minutes/game. Mostly used in an offensive role- 62% ozone start, 2nd in PP TOI behind Faulk, only 6 PK minutes all year. Strong possession, 56% Corsi at even strength. His TOI jumped about a minute per game this season so he was starting to gain their trust.

    Still only 21, trending towards a #1 in my opinion.
     
  50. veritas

    veritas Member SoSH Member

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    As I said in my post, Klefbom/Staal was just an example, two players at LD and C I thought were of similar value to Krug + one of their promising young forwards. Staal is really fucking good. Klefbom is overall a downgrade from Krug but is a much more balanced player. My greater point was that they can make a couple of lateral moves to balance out some of the holes on their roster, namely center depth and size/defense at LD.

    I really don't think the Bruins are going to go into next season with Frederic or JFK as their 3rd line center, as promising as they may be. And between Krejci's age and injury history (not to mention Bergeron), they're one injury away from a huge problem. I'd much rather see them acquire a 2C than bring back Riley.

    Hanifin would be great, not sure the price would be reasonable. There aren't a lot of other options. Klefbom as I mentioned. Jake Muzzin would be great, no idea what the price would be, don't think LA would be in any hurry to trade him. But given his age, likely a lot cheaper than Hanifin and probably give you similar value over the short term.

    Jake Gardiner's name is always talked in Toronto trade rumors. Maybe an RFA like Brady Skjei. Skjei is much more of a puck mover than a defender though. Someone like Schlemko would fit what they're looking for, but they're not trading with Montreal.
     

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