106.7 mph to be exact2022 - He had his throwing hand pinkie near snapped-off by a 100mph come-backer, which any manly-man would have just caught with his teeth.
106.7 mph to be exact2022 - He had his throwing hand pinkie near snapped-off by a 100mph come-backer, which any manly-man would have just caught with his teeth.
Thank you for verifying what I wrote.Huh? The “last season with an OPS under
700 was 2020”? So, the season before last? Kike’s a career .737 ops guy; with seasons ranging from .607 to .836. He’s a solid enough player but his performance has been all over the place. He’s had seven seasons with 200+ plate appearances and put up the following OPS: 836, 607, 729, 806, 715, 786, and now 613.
Let's not forget another means for acquiring and signing players. The Red Sox just participated in the third MLB draft of Bloom's short tenure. There are possible returns there that may well turn out to be blue chip players and all star caliber players who are healthy and in their prime while wearing a Boston uniform. That's yet to be determined and it may take a bit longer to develop some of these players due to the fact that the 2020 college and minor league seasons were wiped out.Yes, I think you're right the picture is more nuanced than I articulated. But there are qualifiers to your qualifiers: Kiké was brought in as a super utility player - primarily to play second - and it was an accident of circumstance, and his career year performance, that he became the regular center fielder. He's been hurt, but it was also predictable that he might regress to the mean this year. Verdugo is a career .766 OPS hitter (104 OPS+) - while he's a tick down, his numbers don't suggest he collapsed or anything, they're in the ballpark of his mean.
That is - even with a less blunt take than I offered, the outfield is still unequivocally worse than when Bloom took over.
Bloom has built this team on players with potential - young guys that may improve like Cordero, and older guys who've been hurt, who might see a return to form - like Wacha. The only blue chip player in his prime he's acquired and signed is Story (and even there, Story, as a hitter, is likely past his prime). And Story likely is an Xander replacement, another step down.
So, eventually, Bloom's gotta get some all-star caliber players who are healthy and in their prime ...or the team will keep getting worse.
Sale was a free agent after 2019, they couldn't wait to see how he did in 2019 and then offer an extension, at that point he'd be listening to offers from every team. They took a calculated risk, because if he'd had a repeat of 2017/2018 in 2019 he would have got a lot more than they extended him for. The Sox will also never admit it, but at the time they extended Sale they probably knew Mookie was likely gone, or at least was going to go to free agency and there wasn't going to be an extension, they tried to extend him before moving on to X and Sale.Yes, but Sale often faded at the end of seasons. And the shoulder injury in 2018 should have been a yellow flag for the team. They had to protect him in the post season to some extent (and kudos to him for bringing it, when it wasn't 100%). The prudent thing would have been for them to see how he performed in 2019 before offering the extension - they had him for another year on a team favorable contract - there was no rush, ESPECIALLY considering a Betts extension was looming.
Frankly, the role of closer is as important as at least a number 2 starter in my opinion. IMO with a very good closer and 1 excellent setup man the Sox would be in the top wc position. Whitlock is a very inexpensive option for that roll. That's a key due to the sunk cost in Barnes on the books for 2023.It is, but I and others firmly believe that Whitlock's best use would be as the multi-inning weapon out of the bullpen that this FO loves to deploy. His stuff has shown to be much better as a reliever(which admittedly every pitcher's stuff should be). I think they should keep him in the bullpen and try to find SP help.
So what type of return can the Sox expect for JD. Good average power numbers are very disappointing. Eovaldi likely fetches something good, Vazquez, I would try to re-sign as he is probably the best we could hope for via free agency or trade and better than anyone who will come up from our farm in at least the next 2 years. I think we ask Bogey what it will take and if we don't want to pay it we trade him. He could fetch quite a bit from a good team. We may be able to bring him back or sign one of the crop of free agents available next year. I would do all I could to trade Trevor Story, but I might wait to see who loses out in the shortstop derby this off season before doing so, but if the right deal came to the Sox by 8/2 I would jump on it. As much as I think the Sox still have a chance, likely not a great chance, but a chance nonetheless to make the expanded playoffs I just do not see them going real far. If all we get are draft picks for Bogey, Eovaldi and maybe JD if we offer him, I think we will regret the decision to stick it out for one or two potential playoff rounds.I think it'd take a lot of good luck to be honest. Pivetta was pitching above his head. While I don't think he's as bad as he's looked the last 2.5 games or as bad as his first 4 games, I also don't think he's as good as he was in the games in between. He's tremendously valuable as he's likely going to be able to consistently hit 200 innings at around a 4.2 ERA with some great stretches and some shitty stretches. Eovaldi will need to return and pitch like we hope Sale should. Generally they need a lot of good luck and I think more than other teams. Counting on Sale to be Chris Sale might be folly but the team put $30M on it and have to continue to play that card. Despite what others want here.... there's no way to "plan for Sale to be out". And, in fact, I think Bloom did, with Hill and it worked out as well as possible and things were lining up- Sale was coming back just as Hill went down. Now if Sale can't come back for the rest of the season, I think it's foolish to expect Hill and Wacha to pitch as well as they have or to expect Pivetta to do that. Or expect Paxton to be a savior.
The general plan for what I could tell, after Sale went down... was to hang in as long as possible until the end of June and be within a few games of a Wild Card. Great. They did that and it was, despite some terrible play and some horrible streaks, some impressive play above expectations to me. Things were looking good despite injuries to half the team but with the injury to Sale it really broke the plan (more like Plan C) down. They're now looking at Plan D- which to me should seriously consider selling off half the team. I would NOT deal Devers or X though despite the fact that they could net a great return. Those two need to somehow in some way be on the team for the next 5 years at least.
Plan A- Of course... no injuries. Every team has to look at the start of the season like this. Every player who is healthy through the prior season that didn't need offseason surgery should be in the plan and built around.
Plan B- Assume that injury prone players- especially your stars- may likely be out. That's Chris Sale and Eovaldi. Despite what others here think, Bloom did a great job in this department. Wacha may have been ERod's replacement, but Hill and the AAA guys have filled in nicely for Sale and Eovaldi up to a point.
Plan C- Your star players underperform. Up for debate, but JDM, Story and X are all there underperforming to me... your hope is that role players step it up. Didn't happen other than Vazquez. This is the one area I do think Bloom did a poor job. I don't know why but JBJ should have been a defensive back up and that's that. First base is a mess and I do think that Bloom could have and should have signed Schwarber and I don't see how Story would not have been able to been signed also. Bloom made some questionable moves that didn't cost much but in aggregate were more than Schwarber's money. Basically Plan C to me is hope for the best. They hit this point and it's falling apart due to luck and injuries and poor management.
Plan D- Blow it up with some sense of the future. JDM, Eovaldi, Vazquez all should be dealt IMO.
I’d be quite happy to make it to the ALCS…. Of course I’d rather not be there at all if it means losing to the MFY’s…. But a competitive ALCS would be okay with me.So what type of return can the Sox expect for JD. Good average power numbers are very disappointing. Eovaldi likely fetches something good, Vazquez, I would try to re-sign as he is probably the best we could hope for via free agency or trade and better than anyone who will come up from our farm in at least the next 2 years. I think we ask Bogey what it will take and if we don't want to pay it we trade him. He could fetch quite a bit from a good team. We may be able to bring him back or sign one of the crop of free agents available next year. I would do all I could to trade Trevor Story, but I might wait to see who loses out in the shortstop derby this off season before doing so, but if the right deal came to the Sox by 8/2 I would jump on it. As much as I think the Sox still have a chance, likely not a great chance, but a chance nonetheless to make the expanded playoffs I just do not see them going real far. If all we get are draft picks for Bogey, Eovaldi and maybe JD if we offer him, I think we will regret the decision to stick it out for one or two potential playoff rounds.
Why would you want to trade Story? He's been perfectly fine. I also doubt you're getting much for JD right now since for a DH he's been pretty bad for almost the last 2 months.So what type of return can the Sox expect for JD. Good average power numbers are very disappointing. Eovaldi likely fetches something good, Vazquez, I would try to re-sign as he is probably the best we could hope for via free agency or trade and better than anyone who will come up from our farm in at least the next 2 years. I think we ask Bogey what it will take and if we don't want to pay it we trade him. He could fetch quite a bit from a good team. We may be able to bring him back or sign one of the crop of free agents available next year. I would do all I could to trade Trevor Story, but I might wait to see who loses out in the shortstop derby this off season before doing so, but if the right deal came to the Sox by 8/2 I would jump on it. As much as I think the Sox still have a chance, likely not a great chance, but a chance nonetheless to make the expanded playoffs I just do not see them going real far. If all we get are draft picks for Bogey, Eovaldi and maybe JD if we offer him, I think we will regret the decision to stick it out for one or two potential playoff rounds.
I doubt the Sox would get much but I also wouldn’t be shocked if a few teams saw adding his potential as the missing piece. He could end his career back in Houston.Why would you want to trade Story? He's been perfectly fine. I also doubt you're getting much for JD right now since for a DH he's been pretty bad for almost the last 2 months.
“On July 18, 2017, the Tigers traded Martinez to the Arizona Diamondbacks for Dawel Lugo, Sergio Alcántara, and Jose King.”I doubt the Sox would get much but I also wouldn’t be shocked if a few teams saw adding his potential as the missing piece. He could end his career back in Houston.
The Marlins? Minnesota?
Edit- I meant to add “and bidding his trade value up to a top ten prospect “
Yeah you’re right. About the only thing that actually returns a haul is pitching. Eovaldi is probably a tier below the “haul” tierI don’t think a Bogaerts rental would bring much back either, I think of Machado to the Dodgers which was a disappointing return both then and now (possibility and reality).
Phillies called up a rookie to DH that's crushing the ball so far, and also have Schwarber who probably shouldn't be playing the field. I don't think they need another guy who can't play the field.With Harper out a long while, JDM could be a fit in Philadelphia, reunited with Dombrowski for the third time. In the event of a Xander trade, he'd be an obvious upgrade over Didi there too.
Darick Hall had a nice first handful of games but he’s 7 for his last 32 with a very bad K/BB rate and doesn’t play at all against lefties. He’s not a prospect. But you’re right that that team is a ridiculous stew of DHs.Phillies called up a rookie to DH that's crushing the ball so far, and also have Schwarber who probably shouldn't be playing the field. I don't think they need another guy who can't play the field.
#RedSox announce roster moves: - Rafael Devers (right hamstring inflammation) to the IL - Jaylin Davis selected to the active roster - Kiké Hernandez (hip) transferred to the 60-day IL
He's going to waive it to go to a playoff team, then hit FA without draft compensation.Let’s not forget that Bogaerts has a full No Trade clause.
Well, when you start with Devers and Story, with Arroyo and Kike' in reserve, you aren't anticipating all four to go down to injurySo I guess 2b/3b is now covered by a mix of Downs, Dalbec, and Sanchez. JFC.
Why do we think he will want to uproot his life for a few months and then hit the market? To help out the Sox? He already has won 2 World Series, so he's less likely to ring chase, and maybe he and Boras are concerned about a terrible playoff slump hurting his value.He's going to waive it to go to a playoff team, then hit FA without draft compensation.
Because hitting free agency without draft pick compensation helps him out with free agency. Further I don't think there are many mlb players who think I have x number of rings. I don't want anymore.Why do we think he will want to uproot his life for a few months and then hit the market? To help out the Sox? He already has won 2 World Series, so he's less likely to ring chase, and maybe he and Boras are concerned about a terrible playoff slump hurting his value.
I'm not sure it's a foregone conclusion he waives the NTC
I don’t think players think like that - what if I have a horrible slump- but for two months, would you rather be in a playoff race or not? If he’s at the point where he’s sick of the organization and realizes he’s gone (not saying he is), I imagine he may be happy to get out of town asap. In these situations, don’t players usually waive the NTC? A chance at postseason money and losing draft pick compensation are incentives too.Why do we think he will want to uproot his life for a few months and then hit the market? To help out the Sox? He already has won 2 World Series, so he's less likely to ring chase, and maybe he and Boras are concerned about a terrible playoff slump hurting his value.
I'm not sure it's a foregone conclusion he waives the NTC
Presumably they did an MRI on his thigh and he has some degree of hamstring strain, though when I hear of people having back pain and then shortly thereafter hamstring issues you wonder if it's all really the same thing.
It just might be indeed. I think they should sell, now, and sell hard. Everyone avail on ML squad except Devers, Houck, and Whitlock. Bloom's nibbling approach ain't working. Time for a major reset, a la Cubs leading to 2016 and White Sox a few years ago. Just let it rip. Live through a couple losing seasons in the hopes of building the next great core. Supplement with FA when the time is right. Maybe this was his plan all along ...but damn, we had to live through 3 years of purgatory before it was implemented.Either way, that might be the final nail in the coffin for the season.
2 wins from the world series last year is an interesting definition of purgatoryIt just might be indeed. I think they should sell, now, and sell hard. Everyone avail on ML squad except Devers, Houck, and Whitlock. Bloom's nibbling approach ain't working. Time for a major reset, a la Cubs leading to 2016 and White Sox a few years ago. Just let it rip. Live through a couple losing seasons in the hopes of building the next great core. Supplement with FA when the time is right. Maybe this was his plan all along ...but damn, we had to live through 3 years of purgatory before it was implemented.
Right? I mean, they were an inning from going up 3-1 to Houston in the ALCS, for crying out loud. This year has been a disappointment for sure but a ton of things have gone wrong. And they’re still in the mix for the playoffs, even after all this.2 wins from the world series last year is an interesting definition of purgatory
Agree on all, but you wonder if last year was a bit of Fool’s Gold. They overachieved and might have set up some unrealistic expectations this year.Right? I mean, they were an inning from going up 3-1 to Houston in the ALCS, for crying out loud. This year has been a disappointment for sure but a ton of things have gone wrong. And they’re still in the mix for the playoffs, even after all this.
All while considerably improving the entire organization. This is what a rebuild looks like when you’re the Red Sox instead of the Royals. They are already building their next great core, but they're doing it while still being competitive.
This seems rational, yet the venting we've witnessed the past two weeks would seem to indicate this view is not widespreadThey overachieved and might have set up some unrealistic expectations this year.
That's the narrative - but I have yet to see anyone remotely justify that. In reality, their win total reflected the talent on that club, strong beginning, August lag, and strong end.Agree on all, but you wonder if last year was a bit of Fool’s Gold. They overachieved and might have set up some unrealistic expectations this year.
Not only regular season; they probably had no business beating the Rays but were hot at the right time. Winning two playoff rounds has more to do with setting up expectations, particularly to casual fans who start watching late September.That's the narrative - but I have yet to see anyone remotely justify that. In reality, their win total reflected the talent on that club, strong beginning, August lag, and strong end.
I can only recommend you make an effort to watch both the regular and post season - it's well worth it. The Sox played a spirited series against the Rays, with a single convincing win for each, and a pair of tight games. The key contributors for the Sox (on both sides of the ball) were the same key contributors throughout the regular season.Not only regular season; they probably had no business beating the Rays but were hot at the right time. Winning two playoff rounds has more to do with setting up expectations, particularly to casual fans who start watching late September.
I watch probably 140 of the 162, but thanks.I can only recommend you make an effort to watch both the regular and post season - it's well worth it. The Sox played a spirited series against the Rays, with a single convincing win for each, and a pair of tight games. The key contributors for the Sox (on both sides of the ball) were the same key contributors throughout the regular season.
(PS - the Rays finished the season 3-3 v HOU and NYY. It's not like they were some kind of team of destiny the Sox somehow managed to get lucky against.)
I’m not sure how they overachieved. Their playoff run was better than their playoff seeding but they were a good team last year.Agree on all, but you wonder if last year was a bit of Fool’s Gold. They overachieved and might have set up some unrealistic expectations this year.
Exactly this. Often when people say “You are what your record says you are” I think they mean it as a slight, usually to point out that a team with a mediocre record is a mediocre team.I’m not sure how they overachieved. Their playoff run was better than their playoff seeding but they were a good team last year.
I agree with this. It's not unlike the 2013 team. They didn't over-achieve that season, they were a very good team. However, they were also a franchise in transition from one "core" to the next that very much caught lightning in a bottle when pretty much every single acquisition they made worked out incredibly well. That set a bar for the following couple seasons that was difficult, maybe impossible to clear given what they were trying to do from a long term perspective. Obviously we don't know where they're going in the near future, but we might find it looks very similar in retrospect when we're a few years down the road (though I really hope the similarities don't include back to back last place finishes this time around).I’m not sure how they overachieved. Their playoff run was better than their playoff seeding but they were a good team last year.
Me neither but a last place finish could mean a record above .500 and in the WC hunt the entire season. Could be missing the playoffs by a game.I really hope the similarities don't include back to back last place finishes this time around.
Except what we've been seeing for a considerable length of time now doesn't bode well for a .500 finish one way (keeping people around and making no significant additions) or the other (fire sale).Me neither but a last place finish could mean a record above .500 and in the WC hunt the entire season. Could be missing the playoffs by a game.
That's fair. But it's going to be a possibility in future seasons too if the Orioles happen to be good.Except what we've been seeing doesn't bode well for a .500 finish one way (keeping people around and making no significant additions) or the other (fire sale).
Today's lineup? Signed last year? This is peak SOSH bullshit argumentation.Two players with an OPS+ of 100 or greater in todays lineup; both are free agents after the season. 0 starters with a 100 or better ERA+ signed past this year. So, I struggle with “the future is bright, great core” stuff;
Because that doesn't fit his narrative.Today's lineup? Signed last year? This is peak SOSH bullshit argumentation.
Why not actually look at the players in the org who will be here next year and assess that?
Or he might want to try to read the post. Its not referring to signed last year. Its signed past this year.Because that doesn't fit his narrative.