Nope, not intentionally omitting anything. I just looked it up and saw he played 25 games a freshman. I'm sure the torn labrum didn't help, but it's not like he lit the world on fire in 25 games. Regardless, I could make the same point with Buddy Hield's 7 ppg at Oklahoma as an 18 year old. Dunn was just the first upperclassman that came to mind.
Believe the original injury was in 2012 and then he came back and played 25 games his frosh year. Then, clearly re-aggravated it and missed a lot of time his soph year.
Doesn't make sense for the Lakers. With two guys in the draft with star potential, if you're lucky enough to get a top 2 pick you don't trade it for quantity.
Does that mean the Celtics can't trade it? Right now, they have right to swap picks with Brooklyn next year. If they trade next year's first round pick, does the receiving team not also gain the right to swap it for Brooklyn's pick?
They can't acquire the rights to swap their pick but they can acquire the Celtics pick and in turn swap that pick. Not sure of the exact protocol but they can trade the asset of the swap. It just has to be the Celtics pick that is swapped.
Putting aside the aforementioned pick swap issues, the most important 2 elements for LA are:
If I had to lay money I'd bet against Boston trading for a pending free agent whose college coach is standing on Boston's sideline.
I don't know much about Bender but these recent reports of his leaping ability and lack of athleticism are very troubling. If those are true then I wouldn't touch him with the 3rd pick. Go Murray or Dunn instead
Well, I mean, he just averaged a shade over 15. He's essentially one made FG a game away from it.
I mean, yes, Harden and Butler are going to be expensive, but that's because they're legitimately NBA alphas. Middleton is just one of the other guys on the floor. Probably near the top of that tier of players, but still just one of the other guys on the floor. So giving up multiple players in that class, along with high lottery picks and other picks just to say "We got the taller Avery Bradley" is a waste of resources. Those sorts of players you should be looking to steal before they turn into 16 p/g guys (Jae Crowder is a shining example).
The cap rise from 16-17 to 17-18 will definitely not be gigantic like this summer, and the market this offseason will reset expectations for a guy like Hayward. In other words: I honestly don't think the Cs will have the room to make him a reasonable offer (barring deep discount). In principle, it might be better to trade for the Bird rights on the very good player.
1. Dunn's strength isn't in his scoring. It is his elite passing and defense.
The cap is slated to increase another $18-$19 million between '17 and '18. Boston will have plenty of room for Hayward unless they're maxing out ET.
What are you talking about? As cap rises, so rises the average contract. 19M in 2018 is basically the same as 9M in 2014. Avery Bradley is pissed about his current contract for this reason*. Second, we have no idea what will happen this offseason in terms of contracts and movement. No matter what, it's going to be unprecedented. Assuming there'll be space left is capital-a asinine.
UT wants a point guard. Maybe offer 3 and Rozier for Hayward /12. They can grab Dunn, use Exum as a combo
I think you may be confused about how this works. In order for Boston to sign non-MLE free agents this summer they need to be below the cap, yes? This summer the cap is jumping to $89 million, about $18-$19 million or so past its present point. This same process will be repeated the following summer when the cap projects to go from $89 million to $108 million (I've heard from a couple of people that it's expected that the '17 BRI numbers will be so large that it will probably top $110 million, but let's leave that aside for the moment). In order for Boston to not have max money position available in the summer of '17 they will need to have the entirety of this summer's $89 million tied up in long term deals.
As I stated, the point was that holding an 18 year old's production on one of the best teams in Europe against him simply doesn't make sense. There are plenty of fair criticisms to be made of Bender. That he only averaged 2 points a game as a 17/18 year old against competition far better than what a Kris Dunn or Buddy Hield faced at that age isn't one of them.
I think everyone will need to accept that Hayward is getting maxed out in the current environment. Boston may or may not be the team to do it, but my point was that there is no earthly reason to use trade assets on a player that would likely just sign with the Celtics next summer anyway. And it is only with a max deal that Bird Rights have any impact whatsoever, so if Zenter is proposing a sub-max contract for Hayward, and he would accept one from the Celtics, there's zero reason to trade for him because the Bird Rights are irrelevant. And if he's proposing a sub max deal then the Celtics would have ample room for the contract given that the jump next summer will likely be even larger than this summer's (contra his earlier claims).
It has nothing to do with the irrationality of the market, as of today the Celtics have a little over $30 million in 2018 commitments, they are literally not able to break into much of their 2018 cap space thanks to existing 2017 contracts. However, if they do tie up $40+ million per year in Turner and Sullinger, then they probably will be a little more limited next summer.
We shall see - I think you underestimate how irrational this market will be, and overestimate Hayward's enthusiasm about playing for a guy he played under for 2 seasons... 7-9 years ago.
Proper management of the salary cap is imprudent? That will be news to the Celtics front office, who are generally regarded as some of the best cap managers in the business, and yet were somehow so bad at their jobs that they left themselves with $40 million to spend this summer.
We'll see. I expect some free agents to tie up easily 30+M this season because the marketplace is crazy. I expect JR Smith to get no less than 12M/yr.
No, I'm saying your approach - reserving cash for a future offseason - is imprudent and not proper cap management...
Thing is that Boston is unlikely to add more than one free agent because their roster is already full of rookie scale players and reasonably priced vets. To be brutally frank, I'm not expecting more than one major free agent signing from them this summer. And if Horford is non-committal when they talk to him, I fully expect them to roll over the cap space a year, find a bargain basement signing for the 4/5, like Larry Sanders, and then wait to strike next year. Again, they have no way of spending all $75+ million in '18 cap money unless they trade Crowder, Thomas, Bradley, et al for future picks, which I really doubt happens.
Take it up with Boston's front office as they did exactly that last summer when the free agent pickings were slim. They brought back the existing roster with a team friendly 1+1 deal for Jerebko and added Amir Johnson on the same sort of deal so as to roll their cap space to this summer. Now that this summer's market looks to be fizzling, I expect them to do the exact same thing again, run back the existing roster while adding a player on a team friendly 1+1 deal and waiting for next summer to make their move.
Again, Boston went into 2015 with the cap cleared for the summer market with the expectation of making a run at Kevin Love. When they couldn't close on anyone, they deliberately chose to leave themselves room this summer for two max deals. But with the preliminary indications being that the big names are going to extend for a year and wait for the even bigger cap leap next year, I'm expecting Ainge to do exactly as he's been doing for the last two years.
Given that the Celtics have done the exact opposite of what you keep insisting is "prudent" I still can't help but think you're confused as to how this works. Hayward + #3 is always better than just Hayward. And, to be brutally frank, given Utah's love of white stars, #3 probably isn't enough to get the deal done. Better to simply wait and let Brad Stevens recruit his former star next summer, and then just sign him outright, as they'll have plenty of cap space to do it, even if they abandon their recent cap management and follow your more "prudent" plan.Bird rights are less restrictive because you don't have to worry about the cap at all. Being a good cap manager is about knowing how to avoid getting boxed in by circumstance, not simply having money lying around.
and
This could be true but everything I have read states the exact opposite. With so much money in the game and the impending salary cap increase, it's more likely that true max value players will be more valuable than ever and players not nearly worth the max (cough*HarrisonBarnes*cough) will get basically max contracts because they became free agents at the perfect time.
I have read a lot about how max-money contracts signed today won't be crippling in 2 years because of the higher cap, which is making teams today more willing to hand out max deals. That's your Harrison Barnes example. I don't think you'll see that behavior continue in two years, when the higher cap is the new normal.
Yeah, the pending cap jump into the $112-$120 million range is a boon for the Harrison Barnes of the world as it reduces the penalty for signing them to a max deal.
