Yoan Moncada to be called up on Friday

soxfan121

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Hopefully it will take a few weeks for pitchers to get a book on him. He might be better in the short term than you think.
I would guess that opposing teams are going to give him the steady diet of off-speed and breaking slop that most young players get fed in their first exposure to the big leagues.

We should be prepared for him to swing and miss, a lot. Hopefully, a couple pitchers are dumb enough to throw him a hittable fastball. I kinda doubt it, though.

Hopefully, he doesn't go 0-for-the rest of the season and can make use of this experience next season in the minors.
 

shaggydog2000

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Frankly, no matter what he does now, I don't expect Moncada to break camp with the big club next season. He does have more developing to do (just as Bogaerts did and Ellsbury as well). I think they'll want to give that time to him while Sandoval gets the first crack at his old job, with Shaw likely in the mix at both first and third, not to mention Holt as well.

That won't stop the hue and cry from the WEEI callers and some folks here demanding Moncada be in the lineup from day one. And if they get their wish, I don't expect it to be sunshines and rainbows.
Even if he looks great in a certain controlled set of situations, from the descriptions I've read and the data that you can look at, he needs to work on his right handed swing and cut down on strikeouts. I don't see him improving those two things in the majors during a playoff race, so I'd agree that he should be back in AA or more likely be sent to AAA to start next year. If things go well he could be up in just a few months. He also may need work on base stealing technique. He certainly has shown already that the power and speed are both for real. I can understand why they brought him up, but I am a bit surprised since it's seems there are still things he really could work on, unlike with Benintendi who just seemed ready.
 

wilked

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I think we need to dial back the expectations level a bit. Major League pitching will be a little more difficult for a guy who likes to swing hard at everything than it is at A & AA. Lots of potential but let's give the kid a little breathing room to grow. Benintendi is a different type of hitter than Moncada so up front let's not compare the two. Okay that being said wishing him the best and let's have some fun.
I am not expecting much...would just like to see him do as well or better than the Yankees recent callup, Gary Sanchez
 

Cesar Crespo

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Even if he looks great in a certain controlled set of situations, from the descriptions I've read and the data that you can look at, he needs to work on his right handed swing and cut down on strikeouts. I don't see him improving those two things in the majors during a playoff race, so I'd agree that he should be back in AA or more likely be sent to AAA to start next year. If things go well he could be up in just a few months. He also may need work on base stealing technique. He certainly has shown already that the power and speed are both for real. I can understand why they brought him up, but I am a bit surprised since it's seems there are still things he really could work on, unlike with Benintendi who just seemed ready.
A bunch of his CS in Salem were actually SBs. Plus that seems like something you could work at at the ML level. I wouldn't be totally surprised if he was on the playoff roster as our pinch runner, at least not now. I didn't think he would be called up this year.
 

shaggydog2000

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A bunch of his CS in Salem were actually SBs. Plus that seems like something you could work at at the ML level. I wouldn't be totally surprised if he was on the playoff roster as our pinch runner, at least not now. I didn't think he would be called up this year.
I was more thinking that he stole a lot less in AA (although his ankle injury may have had something to do with that), and the comments I saw also suggested he had gotten by in Salem much more on raw speed than timing and technique. I have no concerns that he'll run the bases well, eventually be a good base stealer, and that ML instruction will help him improve, I would just expect it would be a bit easier to practice stealing in AA and AAA early next year than in the majors. Just like with hitting lefties and improving contact rate. He just seems to have to stuff that is best polished in the minors.
 

MyDaughterLovesTomGordon

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Probably arguing semantics, but Shaw played parts of 3 seasons in Portland and 2 seasons in Pawtucket. His ascend was anything but rapid. Especially compared to the other guys you named. Maybe you meant his results, in which case I agree. Of course the more he is exposed, the more he is looking like the guy we thought he was.
Mostly I just meant this spring. I was not anticipating him being an everyday player out of spring training, and I was actually shocked, even with his decent finish to last season, that so many people assumed he'd be a regular contributor. I believe I was mocked for expressing disbelief even.

But he always seemed like a nobody in Portland. JAG.
 

grimshaw

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I have concerns about the k rate as do others, but one guy you can look at who had an immediate impact with that weakness is David Dahl.

Dahl was at 29% in AA and 27% for the minor league season before moving to the majors where he is dominating at age 22. Dahl is still at 25% in MLB but is also a great base runner and can more than hold his own in the field.

Moncada has still been a .395 on base guy despite all the k's - I'm sure in some instances being pitched around, but I think he'll find his way on base enough to make pitchers antsy. It won't be fun for pitchers, assuming Yoan bats 9th - for him to be dancing around on first in front of the top 3 of the order.

Then again - he could also be Joc Pederson who had 4 hits in 38 PA with 11 whiffs after obliterating AAA (with a 29% k-rate)in 2014.
 
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Cesar Crespo

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I was more thinking that he stole a lot less in AA (although his ankle injury may have had something to do with that), and the comments I saw also suggested he had gotten by in Salem much more on raw speed than timing and technique. I have no concerns that he'll run the bases well, eventually be a good base stealer, and that ML instruction will help him improve, I would just expect it would be a bit easier to practice stealing in AA and AAA early next year than in the majors. Just like with hitting lefties and improving contact rate. He just seems to have to stuff that is best polished in the minors.
I think pretty much every player in the history of forever stole less in AA than A, and for the reasons you state. I'd be more concerned about the success rate. 9/13 isn't so hot but small sample.
 

djhb20

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Kris Bryant also had K rates around 25-30 in AA and AAA, and he's done fine. It's been a round 25 in the majors, and he's done fine. Of course, I'm not saying that he'll be Bryant, but there are enough examples on each side that we shouldn't look at that K rate and determine he won't be good early.
 

LynnRice75

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A day game - followed by a day off - followed by a West Coast start. Argh. We are waiting way too long for the Moncada Era to begin.
 

Sampo Gida

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Kris Bryant also had K rates around 25-30 in AA and AAA, and he's done fine. It's been a round 25 in the majors, and he's done fine. Of course, I'm not saying that he'll be Bryant, but there are enough examples on each side that we shouldn't look at that K rate and determine he won't be good early.
Bit more complex for a switch hitter. Moncada is 24% from the left side and 30% from the right side (with little power) this year. I expect he will be starting mainly against RHP'ers in September
 

Al Zarilla

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I would guess that opposing teams are going to give him the steady diet of off-speed and breaking slop that most young players get fed in their first exposure to the big leagues.

We should be prepared for him to swing and miss, a lot. Hopefully, a couple pitchers are dumb enough to throw him a hittable fastball. I kinda doubt it, though.
Mookie is still getting fastballs, some even on the inner half of the plate, which everybody knows by now he destroys. Not as many, granted. As for the breaking stuff, some turn into hangers, which can be sent a long way too. We shall see.
 

Toe Nash

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I don't understand the level of concern with his K rate. The minor league season is basically over and neither Portland nor Pawtucket is in playoff position, so he can't "continue his development" there for more than a few days. He is also going to the AFL so he'll get more practice time there against lower competition. Basically this is time when he'd otherwise be not on any team when he can get a taste of the majors and receive instruction from the best coaches and players in the organization.

If he completely sucks he goes back to AA next year (he would probably do that anyway). If he does well he helps the team at a currently bad position. If he does look really bad, he'll mostly sit on the bench and will still get the benefit of the experience. And it's only 29 games so the level of harm he can do to the team or himself is limited.
 

Spelunker

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I don't understand the level of concern with his K rate. The minor league season is basically over and neither Portland nor Pawtucket is in playoff position, so he can't "continue his development" there for more than a few days. He is also going to the AFL so he'll get more practice time there against lower competition. Basically this is time when he'd otherwise be not on any team when he can get a taste of the majors and receive instruction from the best coaches and players in the organization.

If he completely sucks he goes back to AA next year (he would probably do that anyway). If he does well he helps the team at a currently bad position. If he does look really bad, he'll mostly sit on the bench and will still get the benefit of the experience. And it's only 29 games so the level of harm he can do to the team or himself is limited.
Is the concern over stunting his development, or over whether he's going to be effective and help the team? I don't think people are saying he shouldn't be up, just that he might not be as useful right now as we'd hope. Him being up, if only for the experience, seems like a no brainer.
 

uk_sox_fan

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Basically this is time when he'd otherwise be not on any team when he can get a taste of the majors and receive instruction from the best coaches and players in the organization.
No problem with the main thrust of this post but I've noticed quite a few people saying that the parent club would have the 'best coaches in the organization' (also came up when talking about him learning base-stealing skills and 3b defense). My question is whether that would really be the case. I would think that the parent club coaches would be adept at helping veterans break out of slumps, come up with strategies against opponents based on scouting reports, managing egos and (ahem) in-game strategy. But I would think that the best coaches in the organisation for learning basic and new advanced baseball skills would be in the minors. These guys would be good at that too, of course, but why wouldn't you put your best 'teachers' down a few levels in the org?
 

Buzzkill Pauley

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Is the concern over stunting his development, or over whether he's going to be effective and help the team? I don't think people are saying he shouldn't be up, just that he might not be as useful right now as we'd hope. Him being up, if only for the experience, seems like a no brainer.
For me, it's a combination of stunting his development and him not being as effective as he's been hoped.

I mean, Farrell has directly compared Moncada's call-up to those of Ellsbury in 2007 (.361/.390/.536 from 9/1 to end of season), and Bogaerts in 2013 (.296/.412/.481 in 2013 postseason). Those aren't big shoes to fill, right?

But Ellsbury already had 401 PA in AAA, while Bogaerts had 256 in AAA plus another 259 in AA the same season. Moncada's had only 207 PA in Portland, and although he's done wonderfully with them, he only has 854 PA playing professional baseball overall.

But hey, 2007 and 2013 were both championship seasons.
 

joe dokes

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For me, it's a combination of stunting his development and him not being as effective as he's been hoped.

I mean, Farrell has directly compared Moncada's call-up to those of Ellsbury in 2007 (.361/.390/.536 from 9/1 to end of season), and Bogaerts in 2013 (.296/.412/.481 in 2013 postseason). Those aren't big shoes to fill, right?

But Ellsbury already had 401 PA in AAA, while Bogaerts had 256 in AAA plus another 259 in AA the same season. Moncada's had only 207 PA in Portland, and although he's done wonderfully with them, he only has 854 PA playing professional baseball overall.

But hey, 2007 and 2013 were both championship seasons.

I think you're setting the bar too high. If either Hill or Shaw had been doing anything close to what they were doing on July 1, then I doubt we'd be having this conversation. Meanwhile, 250/300/350 would be better than what they've gotten out of 3B for the last month. Moncada is filling *those* shoes, not the ones of Ellsbury or Bogaerts. Maybe he will, maybe he wont. But I don't see how his development will be stunted by the time here, when there's no place else to play after Monday anyway.
 

HomeRunBaker

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I think you're setting the bar too high. If either Hill or Shaw had been doing anything close to what they were doing on July 1, then I doubt we'd be having this conversation. Meanwhile, 250/300/350 would be better than what they've gotten out of 3B for the last month. Moncada is filling *those* shoes, not the ones of Ellsbury or Bogaerts. Maybe he will, maybe he wont. But I don't see how his development will be stunted by the time here, when there's no place else to play after Monday anyway.
Is "stunting development" even a thing? Exposing a young player to a talent level that he is projected to excel against in certain matchups is all upside to me......how does this hurt the player? That doesn't make any sense in this instance.
 

nothumb

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Is "stunting development" even a thing? Exposing a young player to a talent level that he is projected to excel against in certain matchups is all upside to me......how does this hurt the player? That doesn't make any sense in this instance.
I don't know if there's a widely understood empirical basis for this concern - I expect not - but I think there are lots of anecdotal examples of prospects being "rushed," struggling, and then either figuring it out, or not. Whether they would have reached a higher ceiling or developed more quickly without skipping levels is sort of unknowable, and thus grounds for endless, ardent debate.
 

Mugsy's Jock

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Wow, I just lost a long post speculating on Moncada's uniform number. Believe me, you would've loved it.

Has it been revealed yet?
 

Hee Sox Choi

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This is the perfect 6-game stretch to bring up Moncada. These are the next six starters we face, all Rs, all pretty weak sauce:

- Andrew Triggs
- Zach Neal (now Daniel Mengden)
- Kendall Graveman
- Edwin Jackson
- Paul Clemens
- Jarred Cosart

P.S. - We need to win all/most of these games with these pitching matchups against these bad teams.
 
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DeadlySplitter

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This is the perfect 6-game stretch to bring up Moncada. These are the next six starters we face, all Rs, all pretty weak sauce:

- Andrew Triggs
- Zach Neal
- Kendall Graveman
- Edwin Jackson
- Paul Clemens
- Jarred Cosart

P.S. - We need to win all/most of these games with these pitching matchups against these bad teams.
i'm expecting either 3-3 or 4-2 with this team.
 

Georgy Zhukov

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Holy Shit! I'm super excited about this.

I wish we had a flame throwing reliever that can get batters out to call up as well.
 

AlNipper49

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He'll be the most exciting (and similar) hitter, and most similar (and exciting) personality, since Manny was here.
 

nvalvo

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Chiming in from Germany to remind people that he had a very different split in A Ball, and that the samples are tiny on his numbers v LHP in Portland. So who knows?
 

NoXInNixon

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I really hope the Sox aren't that short-sighted where because Shaw happened to have a good night last night they then continue to play him, after 2 months of him batting .217.
Not to mention that the entire offense had a great night. Maybe the Oakland pitchers just sucked and my mother could have gone 3 for 6.
 

Byrdbrain

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Farrell already announced Moncada was playing so the only reasonable options are to sit Shaw, Hanley or Ortiz. Hanley had a good night as well and Ortiz isn't sitting against a no name right hander. Shaw will get some other opportunities but I don't think it will be tonight.
 

Savin Hillbilly

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The wrong side of the bridge....
Shaw's game last night was like the first-boyfriend character in a romcom who takes the heroine for granted until she dumps him for the hero, and then turns up on the eve of her wedding to make an impassioned speech about how he's changed.
 

Snodgrass'Muff

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Shaw's game last night was like the first-boyfriend character in a romcom who takes the heroine for granted until she dumps him for the hero, and then turns up on the eve of her wedding to make an impassioned speech about how he's changed.
I'm gonna go out on a limb and guess you don't watch many romcoms.
 

joe dokes

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I really hope the Sox aren't that short-sighted where because Shaw happened to have a good night last night they then continue to play him, after 2 months of him batting .217.
I think the likelihood of that is close to zero.

Shaw had dabbled in left field. I wonder if there is any chance he gets a spot start out there tonight.
LF is where RedSox go to die. Do you hate him that much?
 

NDame616

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Farrell already announced Moncada was playing so the only reasonable options are to sit Shaw, Hanley or Ortiz. Hanley had a good night as well and Ortiz isn't sitting against a no name right hander. Shaw will get some other opportunities but I don't think it will be tonight.
Sitting Hanley for Shaw would be even worse. Hanley is batting .315 and OPS'ing north of .900 since August 1. Unlike Shaw, Hanley has proven to be a viable major league hitter for a pronounced period of time in recent memory, and there is much more of a chance that Hanley continues to hit well, than Shaw.
 

Al Zarilla

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Sitting Hanley for Shaw would be even worse. Hanley is batting .315 and OPS'ing north of .900 since August 1. Unlike Shaw, Hanley has proven to be a viable major league hitter for a pronounced period of time in recent memory, and there is much more of a chance that Hanley continues to hit well, than Shaw.
.963 August and 1.250 September! ;)

We're talking about John Farrell here though, who may be conflicted between what he himself said about Moncada's playing time before last night's game, and Shaw's night (hey, a new shiny.).
 

grimshaw

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I still see Shaw on the bench tonight. They just had an off day and have another coming up so I don't think anyone really needs another day of rest. I doubt he'd just be thrown into that huge outfield but could see it maybe in Fenway if at all.
 

Harry Hooper

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This is silly. Farrell was probably one of the loudest voices in the organization advocating bringing Moncada up.
 

Byrdbrain

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Other than one slam at Farrell that I assume was mostly in jest no one is disagreeing that Moncada will play tonight. One person said Shaw would without specifying who else would sit but pretty much everyone else disagrees with that.
Really not all that much silliness at all.