Women's World Cup 2019
- Thread starter InstaFace
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Sweden seem a little out of ideas at the moment.
Which of course means they are about to score.
(I got all that from bluffball.)
Which of course means they are about to score.
(I got all that from bluffball.)
They were going to get a tall team no matter who won this game. I don't think it affects the US too much either way.
Not sure why the Dutch had so many people attacking with 2 minutes left and a goal lead. Gave up a dangerous breakaway and had to concede the corner.
Unclear who it advantages, anyway, when it comes to height. Quickness, partly helped by not being as big, can be its own advantage. Neither team's offense is predicated on headers off crosses, and neither team has a huge defender like Renard that presents a big aerial advantage on either end.
You don't often see a game still going in the 128th minute.
And that's it, the Dutch advance to play for the title.
And that's it, the Dutch advance to play for the title.
I'm not sure the Dutch had the better of play across 120 minutes, but you also can't say that goal was against the run of play given the last 15' of regular time and the way AET started.
It was a weird game. I thought it was even and maybe even a slight nod to Sweden until about the 75th minute, when the Dutch kind of took over. I thought the game kind of changed when Beerensteyn come into the game, though I think it didn't necessarily have anything to do with her it was just right about the same time.
Is there a good reason why the men's Copa America and Gold Cup Finals are being played the same day as the World Cup Final? I understand the men's summer window for tournaments is relatively short, but the same day? They couldn't have staggered them by a week?
I believe the official explanation is "clerical error."
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/06/07/sports/womens-world-cup-preview.html
Given that Motagliani put on the last Women's World Cup, and that final was played on July 5th, it seems unlikely that he would suddenly forget that July 7th might conflict with this year's tournament.
Sunday is going to kill me between cup finals and nationally televised domestic games.
11am: WWC final
2pm: Atlanta vs. NYRB
4pm: Copa America final
6:30pm: NYCFC vs. Portland
9pm: Gold Cup final
I'm not ready.
For fans, it makes for a fun day. I think it's more the idea that in a lot of parts of the world, rather than having a rare opportunity for the women to be undisputed front page news, the media focus will get divided between the 3 games.
It just adds to the perception that FIFA and the regional federations don't consider the women's game to be a high priority.
I gotcha.
Then again, in many parts of the world, I'm not sure the Gold Cup matters, but yeah, there's gonna be ink spilled on the US/Mexico game no matter the outcome.
And selfishly, although Sunday will be fun, I do wish the tourneys were going all summer.
Then again, in many parts of the world, I'm not sure the Gold Cup matters, but yeah, there's gonna be ink spilled on the US/Mexico game no matter the outcome.
And selfishly, although Sunday will be fun, I do wish the tourneys were going all summer.
You never know about follow-through on women's soccer proposals from the sport's leadership, but a women's Club World Cup is on the table. It would be pretty cool: the NWSL is generally acknowledged as the best women's league on the whole, but the top Euro clubs are probably superior to any individual NWSL team. Lyon is utterly dominant in France and a heavyweight in Europe, but after the top ~5 clubs in France, AFAIK the league is mostly semipro and poses no real challenge to the big clubs.
https://twitter.com/pkedit/status/1147136734209236992
Paul Kennedy
@pkedit
Infantino's proposals for women's soccer .
1. Club World Cup. "ASAP
2. World League (Nations League concept
3. Increase teams from 24 to 32
4. "Prize money": Double. He referred to current $50M (which is prize money+expenses+money to clubs
5. Investment: Double to $1B.
9:34am · 5 Jul 2019
Hearing talk that they want to make the move to 32 teams by the next tournament in 2023, even if they have to re-open bidding that's in progress. The favorites are Japan and Australia, so I don't think either of them would really have an issue with the increased size.
I like 32 teams more than 24 so we can get rid of 3rd place teams qualifying, and simply have the top 2 from 8 different groups advance, but there's no way at this point there are 32 teams capable of being competitive at this level. As we saw from Thailand, it's questionable whether there are even 24. If they really do this for 2023 I hope we see serious investment from more countries to allow a few more teams to make a Netherlands-like jump.
I like 32 teams more than 24 so we can get rid of 3rd place teams qualifying, and simply have the top 2 from 8 different groups advance, but there's no way at this point there are 32 teams capable of being competitive at this level. As we saw from Thailand, it's questionable whether there are even 24. If they really do this for 2023 I hope we see serious investment from more countries to allow a few more teams to make a Netherlands-like jump.
On the one hand, this will allow some countries to make no additional investment and still tout that their women made the World Cup. But in the long run I have to think the increased exposure will bring pressure and incentives to up the support for women. Here’s hoping.
If they expand to 32 teams by 2023, there will be some bumps along the way and a few lopsided group stage scores, but I think there will be a lot more positives than negatives. I think exposure at the World Cup level can be leveraged into increased interest and investment in a variety of countries.
There's the Thailand example, but this WWC has actually been more competitive than most. The pool of halfway decent NTs is getting deeper and should continue to do so.
There's the Thailand example, but this WWC has actually been more competitive than most. The pool of halfway decent NTs is getting deeper and should continue to do so.
Should be a great match tomorrow, though I’ve see a report that the daytime temperature in Lyon could hit 88 with plenty of humidity. This will be a real test of everyone’s fitness.
Rapinoe and Lavelle have proclaimed themselves ready to go. If they truly are, it is hard to see either starting on the bench. Assuming Ertz stays at the base of the midfield - which she should against an attack as excellent at the Netherlands - I’d prefer to see Horan start along with Lavelle.
But the key for the US is how Ertz-Dahlkemper-Sauerbrunn manage the heart of the defense. I’ve seen too many good looks from opponents who have split the CBs this tournament. They need to lock that down tomorrow, force the Dutch to play from wide and shoot from deeper.
Rapinoe and Lavelle have proclaimed themselves ready to go. If they truly are, it is hard to see either starting on the bench. Assuming Ertz stays at the base of the midfield - which she should against an attack as excellent at the Netherlands - I’d prefer to see Horan start along with Lavelle.
But the key for the US is how Ertz-Dahlkemper-Sauerbrunn manage the heart of the defense. I’ve seen too many good looks from opponents who have split the CBs this tournament. They need to lock that down tomorrow, force the Dutch to play from wide and shoot from deeper.
It’s fascinating how similar to 2018 this is for England. They played similarly, maybe less reliance on set pieces but knocking out a Scandi team in the quarters and that same feeling of getting found out by a quality team in the semifinal. The only difference is people expected the Lionesses to do something, and the knowledge gap in the women’s game has caused people to think England are some VAR decisions away from being World Champions rather than clearly the fourth best side in France.
So, I've put some thought into this. IMO, the standard should be "# of teams who can give a top team a good game and won't get embarrassed". Every single knockout game this time around has been tight as nails (England-Cameroon and Germany-Nigeria were 3-0, but neither underdog was punchless), so clearly there are 16. Even in the group stage, the only team that really didn't appear to be on this level was Thailand (-19 GD). Next-worst were Jamaica (-11), South Africa (-7) and South Korea (-7). So you've got somewhere around 20-23 teams who can compete and make it "look like football" on TV. Given another 4 years, I'd expect there to be no embarrassments playing in a 24-team Finals. But today, we're talking about some of these teams that are barely teams (Jamaica and Thailand subsist on the kindness of strangers), with no investment made in them by their FAs, much less being staffed by professionals. Without that changing - or additional countries choosing to invest at least somewhat, maybe send some of their girls to NCAA programs - I'm not sure why we'd expect more teams to acquit themselves credibly.
After all, where are these additional teams going to come from? How many other respectable Women's National Teams are there who didn't make it to this WWC? I just went and took a deep-dive...
TLDR:
The following teams who didn't make the 2019 WWC would be decent bets not to embarrass themselves at a WWC level:
- UEFA (5): Wales, Switzerland, Denmark, Iceland, Belgium
- CONCACAF (2): Mexico, Costa Rica
- AFC: none
- CONMEBOL (1): Colombia
- CAF: (1) Ghana
- OFC: none
My conclusion is, unless the vast majority of those new bids go to UEFA (spoiler alert: they won't), there will be a lot more lopsided results in a 32-team WWC. But you could probably get pretty close if you designed it right. I'd much rather have 20 or 22 auto-bids, and then the remaining 2-4 determined by a big inter-continental tournament prior to the WWC, because that'd be awesome. That's how I hope they do it for the men's WC too.
Anyway, here's my survey of the state of women's international football:
UEFA: Qualifiers were, 7 groups of 5 played home-and-home 8-game pools; group winners qualified, and 4/7 group runners-up made the playoffs for the 8th bid. Netherlands were edged by Norway in their group (the Dutch actually had the better GD), and then won two two-legged matches 4-1 to take the single playoff bid to the WWC. The other group runners-up look like several might not be out of place at the WWC, and even some 3rd-place teams likewise:
- Wales took a point off England on the road, and also at Russia (both scoreless draws). They've had no success internationally, have failed to qualify for Euros all 7 times they've tried, but did play the Algarve Cup 7 times from 2002-2013. Their roster has 5 players at EPL clubs, 1 NWSL, and most of the rest at Cardiff City Ladies.
- Russia scored a goal against England (the only one yielded in 8 matches) but had poor defense throughout. They've made Euros in 5/6 tries since 1997, notching their first match win most recently (2017). They qualified for the 1999 and 2003 WWCs, but not before or since. They've been entering the Algarve Cup recently, so at least they're trying if they're not succeeding. The players look to be less professional; 1 at Anderlecht, 2 in France, the rest local.
- Switzerland split two games against Scotland in their WCQ group, but had a scoreless draw at Poland while Scotland took a wild 2-3 affair there (see next), so they were second despite the better GD. Beat Belgium in the playoffs but lost the finals to Netherlands. They qualified for the 2015 WWC, the 2017 Euros (first time ever qualifying), and their roster is mostly professional (Portland Thorns, Chelsea, West Ham, Wolfsburg, Atleti, etc).
- Poland led Scotland 2-0 at home after 66' following a scottish O.G. (Scotland then put in 3 at 78', 80' and 90' to earn the points that eventually qualified them). They have never qualified for a major tournament but were the runners-up at this year's Algarve Cup. Their captain is the GK for PSG, they have a defender at Juventus and 3 players in Germany, and the rest play for 2 semipro polish clubs.
- Ireland finished 3rd behind Norway and eventual playoff winners Netherlands in their group, earning a draw at the Netherlands which was the difference in direct qualifying vs playoffs for the Dutch. They had a highly credible defense, but lack any scoring threat against legit sides (scoring aggregate of the 4 matches vs Norway & Netherlands was 0-5). They have a midfielder who plays for the NC Courage and have plenty of representation at EPL ladies' sides, but they are extremely young up front. They've never qualified for a major tournament and haven't even entered the Algarve Cup.
- Denmark made the WCQ playoffs, partly because some of the points they dropped were a home draw to the 5th team in their group (Croatia); however, they lost in the first playoff round to the Netherlands. They have deep history as a team, having made 4 of the first 5 WWCs (made the QFs in '91 and '95), the Olympics in 1996, and were serious contenders at the Euros for most of the last 20 years (runners-up in 2017), along with being an annual presence at the Algarve Cup. Clearly, they get plenty of FA support. Their squad is deeply experienced and mostly if not fully professional.
- Ukraine made the Euros in 2009, and beat Sweden 1-0 in WCQ (!) this time around, but otherwise have little success now or in the past. Their squad appears to be mostly semi-pro / rec-club players.
- Iceland had a shock win at Germany in qualifying, but a pair of 1-1 draws against Czech Republic kept them out of the playoffs. They have never made a world cup but made the last 3 Euros, reaching the QFs in 2013, and entering the Algarve Cup every year since 2007. Their squad has a lot of international playing experience; they have two NWSL players, 3 other players for decent squads (PSV, Leverkusen, Wolfsburg), and the rest are mostly at local semi-pro clubs.
- Czech Republic traded 1-1 draws vs Iceland in qualifying, but otherwise have lacked any recent results worth mentioning. They came close to qualifying for 2007 and 2011 WWCs but otherwise show no signs of being deeply supported; their roster is almost entirely players on the ladies' squads of Sparta Praha and Slavia Praha. (fun fact: there are 5 American women playing for Sparta Praha)
- Belgium traded 2-1 results with Italy, but drew at home to Portugal, sending the Italians through. They lost the first round of the playoffs to Switzerland on away goals. Historically they were good in the 80s but then poorly supported and staffed up until 2011, when the Belgian FA changed and they got a lot better. They did respectably in 2015 WCQ and then made the 2017 Euros, notching a win over Norway. Their roster is mostly at Gent and Anderlecht but they have 2 EPL forwards, 2 Fiorentina defenders, and other players at decent squads (PSG, PSV, Lille).
- Portugal, despite founding and hosting the annual Algarve Cup, has only made one major tournament (2017 Euros, where they beat Scotland and lost 2-0 to both Spain and England). They have a young midfielder on the Orlando Pride, and have about 6 other players on legit EU clubs (Atleti, Wolfsburg, Man City, Milan etc). Historically you wouldn't call them "well-invested-in", but they may be on the rise.
- Austria did OK against Spain in qualifying, but took no points and also dropped points to Serbia, costing them any shot at the playoffs. The 2017 Euros were the first major tournament they'd ever made, and they made the semifinals - winning their group by tying both Switzerland (!) and France (!!!), thumping Iceland, and then downing Spain on penalties after 120 scoreless minutes. They lost those semifinals in penalties against Denmark, after another scoreless draw. Their squad appears mostly- if not fully-professional, with their captain playing midfield for Arsenal and their goalie having just been sold from Bayern to Arsenal.
CONCACAF: The Women's Championship served as qualifier, with 8 teams playing for 3.5 bids. The shock was Jamaica, a rag-tag squad actively opposed by their own FA, qualifying by beating Costa Rica in the group and then Panama (in penalties) in the 3rd place match. Other credible squads out there include:
- Panama got 4th in the tournament, which sent them to a 2-legged playoff with Argentina. They drew the home leg but lost the away leg 4-0. They had never gotten anywhere close to a WWC, and had only entered 4 Gold Cups / CONCACAF Championships previously, failing to qualify for one and losing in the group stage in the others. Their team appears semi-pro / rec level.
- Mexico is, in general, an embarrassment to an otherwise prominent FA. Their 2-0 loss to Panama kept them out of this WWC, and they have made 3 prior WWCs (1999, 2011, 2015) without notching any wins. In the 7 prior Gold Cups, they'd gotten 3rd 4 times, and 2nd twice, including the semifinal win over the USWNT in 2010 that almost kept us out of the 2011 WWC. Their squad mixes a few NWSL players (sometimes including Katie Johnson) with several NCAA players, a few more EU-based players, and mostly Mexican club teams - so it's mostly-professional.
- Costa Rica did poorly this time around but is generally a well-run team. They made the 2015 WWC and earned a point against Spain and South Korea, then lost 0-1 to Brazil, quite a respectable showing. In previous Gold Cups, they've generally run ~4th, but were runners-up in 2014 and 3rd in 1998. They don't play WWC-level competition that often in friendlies, but did get one draw in two matches in Chile, and generally beat the teams they should beat. Their squad has 3 Spain-based players, one call-up who plays for Sky Blue FC, and a talismanic 22yo striker who plays for Reims.
- T&T is a fixture at the Gold Cup, capable of holding their own at that level, but never seriously contending for a WWC spot. They got thumped in last year's Gold Cup, and generally get thumped going against bigger teams. Their squad has a few peripheral European-based players but none at big clubs, and one NCAA player. It's hard to squint and see them developing much from that, but their FA deserves credit for making them a consistent international presence at a mid-tier level.
AFC: The Women's Asian Cup served as qualifier, 8 teams playing for 5 bids. This does not appear a very deep confederation, as beyond the stalwarts (Japan, Australia, China, South Korea) their next-best is generally Thailand, and Thailand beat the Philippines 3-1, beat Jordan 6-1, and Vietnam's aggregate score was 0-16. IOW, there's not a deep bench:
- Philippines have been decently organized since the 80s and play a lot of matches but have seen almost no success. They have never qualified for the WWC, generally get thumped in the Women's Asian Cup, and even in the AFF Championship (contested by ASEAN countries) they finished in the group stage, all 9 times they've entered. Their squad is all-domestic semi-pro, including several at the awesomely-named OutKast FC.
- Iran's team was re-founded post-revolution in 2005, and they've never had a result against a WWC-grade team even in a Friendly. They did hold Ukraine to a scoreless draw at home in 2017 though. They've never qualified for a major tournament and have really never come close.
- Taiwan made the 1991 WWC, though not since, and was very strong in the 70s through the 90s. Their fortunes plummeted after 2001, and they have not qualified to contest the final round of WWC qualification (the Women's Asian Cup) since 2008. They have two players who might be professionals.
- Vietnam is perhaps the lone contender to rise to the level of the AFC stalwarts; although they've never made the WWC or Olympics, they've been a game from qualifying a number of times since 1999, and dominate other southeast Asian countries. Prior to 2018, although they may have lost to the teams that routinely claim the AFC's WWC bids, those scores were generally pretty respectable. Their team is 100% domestic, almost certainly not professional, and despite being organized and supported, seems a long way from being in a position to move up a tier. But they're way closer than most AFC countries.
- India has, despite having over a billion people, generally alternated between having and not having a women's national football team. They were good in the 70s and 80s when independently managed, but once absorbed into their local FIFA-affiliate FA, the team stagnated. There are now a number of semi-pro women's clubs that offer some hope, but all but 4 players on the roster play for one of 2 domestic clubs.
CONMEBOL: They get 2.5 bids for 10 member nations today, decided via the Copa America Feminina. Most teams date only to the mid-to-late 90s. Brazil has only once failed to win this tournament (in 2006 when it was won by hosts Argentina, with Brazil qualifying in 2nd), and Argentina and Colombia have generally been the other WWC-level teams, with Chile behind them.
- Colombia beat Chile in qualifying group stage, but then drew 0-0 in a final-round rematch, while Chile beat Argentina which was enough for Chile to take 3rd, make the playoff (which they won over Panama) and leave Colombia 4th and out. But Colombia made both the 2011 and 2015 WWCs, beating France in the latter before losing to the USWNT 2-0 in the R16. They are clearly WWC-worthy, despite only a few players employed abroad.
- Ecuador qualified for the 2015 WWC, where they got absolutely rocked (10-1 to Switzerland, 6-0 Cameroon, 1-0 Japan) and finished 24th out of 24. They have generally competed well within CONMEBOL, just not recently. They're a frequent guest team for the CONCACAF Gold Cup. The team has at least a handful of professionals.
- Uruguay has never qualified for the WWC but has done moderately well in qualifying, including finishing 3rd in 2006 when there were 2 bids. They don't play very many matches, and the squad appears to be semi-pro at best.
CAF: Africa gets 3 bids for their 24 participating countries, decided at the 8-team Women's AfCON. Nigeria is the continental superpower, with South Africa, Cameroon and Ghana being the other contenders; Equatorial Guinea also won WAfCON when hosting in 2008 and 2012. So among non-qualifiers for 2019, you've got:
- Ghana made the WWC in 1999, 2003 and 2007, beating only Australia once there, but holding their own each time. This time around, they lost a decisive match to Mali, who ultimately finished 4th; they also drew Cameroon. They have a few players at places like Rayo Vallecano.
- Mali has made 7 of the last 9 WAfCONs, and took 4th in the most recent. Although coming from one of the world's poorest nations, they appear at least moderately well-organized, and some of their key players play abroad for Malaga, Besiktas, and second-division French clubs.
- Equatorial Guinea is the only team other than Nigeria to have won the WAfCON, though it did them no good as it was in the off-years from the WWC cycle. They made the 2011 WWC, ending with 2 GF, 7 GA, and 0 points... and might have made 2019 if they hadn't been banned for fielding ineligible players. They have a number of players in the Spanish second division, two in the Primera, one at Lille... they might be able to make noise, but who really knows how good they are when not fielding ineligible players?
- Cote D'Ivoire made the 2015 WWC, and got their asses handed to them (0-10 to Germany, followed by two respectable losses to Thailand and Norway). They then failed to qualify for either of the last two WAfCONs. They have a decent amount of international professionals on their roster, but about half appear to be semi-pro local clubs. However, CdI has a substantial and growing women's youth program, so the attitudes are right and the trend is in the right direction - even if they're nowhere near WWC quality today.
OFC: The less said about the OFC the better (New Zealand excepted). They have 1 bid through the OFC Women's Nations Cup, generally contested by between 3 and 5 teams, though in 2010 and 2018 it was a semi-proper 8-team tournament. Taiwan won twice, then left for the AFC; Australia then won 3 of the next 4, then left for the AFC. Since then, New Zealand has not failed to win the contest (by scores of 7-0, 11-0, 3-0 and 8-0), and the only other team of note is Papua New Guinea, who was on the other end of 3 of those final losses. PNG did actually play the USWNT once (lost 5-0, not too bad considering), but has never played any other team of note (unless you count 8 beatdowns by Australia by a cumulative 0-68 score).
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So overall, there is definitely a bullpen of sorts, but the majority of it is still in UEFA. There are teams that are developing and professionalizing, but are nowhere near ready for this level of competition. But if you look again at that summary above, you can see a path to get to a 32-team WWC that won't have any deserved snickers made about any of the teams, and that's impressive. Will FIFA take that path? Absolutely not. But it's probably there for the taking, and the reality of the female-footballin' world may catch up sooner than we realize.
North Korea made several WWCs in a row until they were banned from Canada 2015, after several players failed PED tests during the 2011 tournament.
Well enough about the future (for now), let's talk about the present. TODAY'S THE DAY
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kkSZ-Aycxw0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kkSZ-Aycxw0
Have a feeling ratings for this final will be sky high, surprising some who aren’t paying any attention.
The Dutch national team tweeted a cool video celebrating Alex Morgan.
https://twitter.com/oranjevrouwen/status/1147799918058229760?s=21
https://twitter.com/oranjevrouwen/status/1147799918058229760?s=21
If the women win the world cup today and the men best Mexico to win the Gold Cup, would that be the best day in US soccer history?