Trade deadline

bosockboy

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I think this is a real possibility. Duran has until Arroyo is ready to come off the IL (or Schwarber if Arroyo is first) to show he can hit at the major league level. If not, they send him down and have him on the playoff roster for speed off the bench.
Yep I think this is the answer.
 

soxin6

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Friedman is emulating Tampa with the Dodgers, only with a big fucking budget. Bloom right now is Friedman in 2015 or so.
You do realize that Friedman would likely have been fired if the Dodgers hadn't won the WS last season. That team has been stacked for years and only has last year's championship for a 60game season without road/home games in the playoffs to show for it. Big market teams don't wait forever to win.
 

moondog80

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But I'm talking about one specific part of the job, which is what this thread is about - a pressure trade deadline as a buyer. It's not something he's had to do and may have been overmatched..just my opinion.
I don't know what this means. There was a deal on the table but he took too long to make up his mind? There was a good 1B option available, but he was on Texas and he never evaluated it because he was going through the teams alphabetically and ran out of time? One of the other GMs was aggressive with him and he got intimidated?
 

geoduck no quahog

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I'm not being lazy - Is there a stat that projects how many additional "wins" some of these trades translate to? Particularly Tampa, NYY and Toronto...

(Dodgers could be interesting also)
 

canyoubelieveit

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It's funny...if they managed to pull off a trade for Cron I would have been okay with that, even though he's injured, because it would mean that they had a plan for an adequate bat on 1B once he's able to play again...but that's essentially what we already have in Arroyo, right? So maybe there is a plan after all and no trades were worth it. Really curious what they're expecting from Arroyo for the rest of the year. I'm not convinced that a single fluke injury means he's not more than capable of playing the position without wrecking himself.

If he can stay healthy (big if) and if he can play an adequate 1B (big if), I still love the idea of Arroyo being our 1B.
 

Red(s)HawksFan

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You do realize that Friedman would likely have been fired if the Dodgers hadn't won the WS last season. That team has been stacked for years and only has last year's championship for a 60game season without road/home games in the playoffs to show for it. Big market teams don't wait forever to win.
Receipts please.
 

John Marzano Olympic Hero

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I think that it's okay to be disappointed with what the Red Sox did (or didn't do) today and not be labeled a pink hat.

A week ago the Red Sox needed a first baseman, bullpen help and probably a starter. We were told how much the minor league system has improved in the 18 months since Bloom has been here and that he was probably going to do something because the Sox are in danger of losing valuable (?) minor leaguers this winter at Rule V draft.

Maybe Davis and Robles (AKA the Hamburgler, Robles Robles) are valuable arms. Maybe Schwarber takes to first base in the middle of a pennant race. Seems like we brought more questions than answers. But if you can say that you're happy with Bloom has done this week, IDK, I guess we look at baseball teams differently. I'd like for my GM to go for it when he has a team that looks special.

Edit: also add in the fact that pretty much every other team around us got better and it was a bummer of an afternoon.
 

BringBackMo

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The bolded is just not tue. The dudes the SFG traded to get Bryant are #9 and #30 in their system according to MLB. We could have totally beaten that if we wanted.
Yup. And a clearly competent baseball executive did not want to. You can continue to insinuate that he’s not up to running a big-market team, as you did yesterday in this thread, or you can ask yourself what else might be informing his decision-making. As I said yesterday, when you were upset that the Yankees had made their big splash and that Bloom’s lack of big-market experience was a problem:

“This is the kind of deal you can make only after you have spent a few years investing in the minor leagues, creating redundancies throughout your system so you can trade away some good prospects and still be flush with many other good prospects. That is what allowed Cashman to swing a deal that the analysts say represented excellent value for the Rangers, and that the posters here say represented a heist because the Yankees didn't give up their best prospects. Which is to say that this is precisely the kind of deal that I think Bloom envisions making two years from now, when the Sox system is much deeper than it is today.

For what it's worth, Andrew Friedman, who served as a kind of mentor to Bloom, also had no track record of running a big market team before he was hired by the Dodgers. Since taking over in LA in 2014, he has created a blueprint for how to build and maintain a perpetually loaded farm system while competing each year for championships. My sense is that Bloom has been paying attention.”
 

OurF'ingCity

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Friedman is emulating Tampa with the Dodgers, only with a big fucking budget. Bloom right now is Friedman in 2015 or so.
The is 100% on point except I'd say it's more like 2016. Looking at Friedman's career trajectory with the Dodgers, 2015 was all about jettisoning overpaid, underperforming players and restocking the farm system. In 2016, he made some shrewd, below-the-radar signings/trades for guys like Maeda, Rich Hill, and Josh Reddick but no huge splashes. In 2017 he was more aggressive at the deadline, getting Yu Darvish among others. And then they have basically been super aggressive since then. And the Dodgers' farm system was in better shape when he joined than the Sox' was after Dombrowski.

So if Bloom is still mostly looking for bargain-basement types in two years or so, yeah, he should get some criticism. At some point, he is going to have to make some big signings and some big trades. But there simply is no evidence yet that he isn't capable of doing that.
 

cantor44

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Look, this is a VERY peculiar time for the organization. Because, they are rebuilding, BUT they are winning now, AND ... they have a core with an expiration date of 2022 (X will opt out, so might Sale, Eovaldi, Erod, Vazquez up, JD probably gone after this year ...). Some guys might be resigned and others not. Some FA brought in ... but the transition that's coming will require some good players producing brought up through the system, ready to go in 2023. And right now, the Sox don't have many guys like that who can meet that timeline. If they had twice as many of that kind of guy as they have now, Scherzer or Berrios would be on the team ....but they don't, so they had to hang on to Duran, Casas, Houck, Seabold given what is right around the bend.... We simply couldn't compete for the best players during deadline 2021.

I think if the Sox had been playing .500 ball this would be easier to digest. But the team is existing within a fraught paradox of rebuilding/but at the end of era with a great core ... coming off a last place season with low expectations/having the best record in the league ...of needing to GFIN/but not having the farm to put them over the top.

This is a year of cognitive dissonance for this organization. No easy solutions.

THAT SAID - it is perplexing that a mid-rotation arm, or quality set up man wasn't acquired. The Sox DO have the pieces for that kind of acquisition, and with the poor starting pitching and fraying bullpen, the clear need. You think Bloom could have done better than a dude with a 4.91 era ....
 

BigSoxFan

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I think that it's okay to be disappointed with what the Red Sox did (or didn't do) today and not be labeled a pink hat.

A week ago the Red Sox needed a first baseman, bullpen help and probably a starter. We were told how much the minor league system has improved in the 18 months since Bloom has been here and that he was probably going to do something because the Sox are in danger of losing valuable (?) minor leaguers this winter at Rule V draft.

Maybe Davis and Robles (AKA the Hamburgler, Robles Robles) are valuable arms. Maybe Schwarber takes to first base in the middle of a pennant race. Seems like we brought more questions than answers. But if you can say that you're happy with Bloom has done this week, IDK, I guess we look at baseball teams differently. I'd like for my GM to go for it when he has a team that looks special.
And neither opinion is wrong. It'd be nice if multiple reasonable viewpoints would be accepted. We may not all agree but every poster has the right to be heard without being mocked as a WEEI caller as long as they're posting in good faith. I haven't agreed with all of the Bloom takes here but I don't feel the need to shout them down at every turn either.

In general, I think he did ok. Did I want more? Sure. We all did. Do I understand his rationale? Sure. He held the line and we may very well benefit in the long-term from the deals he didn't make. We may also get tantalizingly close to a WS and lose out because another impact guy acquired this deadline burns us. We'll just have to see it play out.

To quote the great Pete Carroll, I'm "pumped and jacked" for this stretch run.
 

Mystic Merlin

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I think that it's okay to be disappointed with what the Red Sox did (or didn't do) today and not be labeled a pink hat.

A week ago the Red Sox needed a first baseman, bullpen help and probably a starter. We were told how much the minor league system has improved in the 18 months since Bloom has been here and that he was probably going to do something because the Sox are in danger of losing valuable (?) minor leaguers this winter at Rule V draft.

Maybe Davis and Robles (AKA the Hamburgler, Robles Robles) are valuable arms. Maybe Schwarber takes to first base in the middle of a pennant race. Seems like we brought more questions than answers. But if you can say that you're happy with Bloom has done this week, IDK, I guess we look at baseball teams differently. I'd like for my GM to go for it when he has a team that looks special.

Edit: also add in the fact that pretty much every other team around us got better and it was a bummer of an afternoon.
I think you feel better about their prospect pool and the quality of their MLB roster, and what adding another big talent (not sure why Schwarber is being discounted by many) would actually mean to their playoff chances, than I do.

I’m certainly not pumping my fist, mind you, but ultimately I do not think they have a great and deep farm system yet that can absorb the kinds of trades the Yankees and Dodgers made. I certainly don’t see a litany of guys I’d shudder to lose in the Rule V.
 

Detts

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I’m an Indiana grad. I am an old fart that has the privilege of watching a lot of their sports on the BTN. .

Schwarber was an average catcher that hit bombs at IU. He hit a home run over the freaking CF wall at Louisville.

First base is a b I t c h…catcher is worse.
 

Just a bit outside

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He doesn’t walk for awhile because of the hamstring.

In all seriousness, I’m a bit frustrated too, but what deals could the Sox have gotten in and matched the prospects that were actually taken. Seems our farm just wasn’t there yet.
The one they may have been able to match is for Bryant. Jimenez plus a lower prospect would be similar to what the Giants traded for him.
 

DJnVa

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Everyone loves to talk about Tampa, but y'all really wanna trade the LITERAL championship success the Red Sox have had for a few 90 win seasons that fall short of the playoffs, one playoff series that extended beyond the Division Series the last 10 seasons, and I guess some fun prospects?
Then stop saying they should emulate Tampa and talk more about the Dodgers, I’m sick of hearing that the Boston fucking Red Sox should try and act more like a team that has had one successful postseason push in a decade and it was during a write-off season

How about taking a break? You're vomiting all over this thread and if you keep going, that's pretty much going to be your rep here.
 

Van Everyman

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It also sounds like Bloom thinks Schwarber is going to be utilized well by Cora whether or not the 1B thing works out with him.
 

John Marzano Olympic Hero

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I think you feel better about their prospect pool and the quality of their MLB roster, and what adding another big talent (not sure why Schwarber is being discounted by many) would actually mean to their playoff chances, than I do.

I’m certainly not pumping my fist, mind you, but ultimately I do not think they have a great and deep farm system yet that can absorb the kinds of trades the Yankees and Dodgers made. I certainly don’t see a litany of guys I’d shudder to lose in the Rule V.
I think that Schwarber is a fine depth move (if you watch Merloni's dog walking video from earlier today, I echo his thoughts -- which is god damn scary) but I don't know how good I feel about him learning to play first base in the middle of a pennant race. That seems like the type of thing that can bite a team in the ass at the worst possible time.

I am not a prospect hound, but from what I've read; the Sox have a lot of "interesting" guys in their minor leagues that a few writers have said could go in the Rule V draft. Are they slam dunk prospects? Probably not, but if they're good enough to last a year on a big league roster, they should have some value, no?

And as far as the starters go, I mean, if we're really pinning our hopes on a Chris Sale who is coming back from Tommy John surgery as our big addition, okay, I love the Lasso optimism, but I'd want a little more assurance than that going into a postseason series, wouldn't you?

Could all of these acquisitions and returns hit? Sure. That would be great. I hope like hell that it happens, but that's an awful lot of hope to place on these two relievers finding lightning, Sale's arm to be tip-top and Schwarber to turn into Dave Stapleton (I'm not even asking for Eyechart, Mattingly or Keith Hernandez).
 

Bosoxman2004

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At the end of the day the price for BOTH rentals and players with multiple years of control was not conducive to Bloom's obvious plan and what the owners brought him in for, that being to build a sustainable winner. The moves he made will improve this year's team without mortgaging the future. How many of Chaim's moves have to work out before we as a fanbase finally give him the benefit of the doubt. I, for one, believe he is the right guy for this franchise to bank on the future!
 

Rovin Romine

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I think that Schwarber is a fine depth move (if you watch Merloni's dog walking video from earlier today, I echo his thoughts -- which is god damn scary) but I don't know how good I feel about him learning to play first base in the middle of a pennant race. That seems like the type of thing that can bite a team in the ass at the worst possible time.
Well, if they reasonably think he can do it, and acquired him to do so. . .sure, let's see what happens. Gives them a "break glass" catcher as well, so maybe Wong gets sent down.

Honestly though, it feels like the "Schwarber at first" announcements are something of a Plan B in action.
 

Detts

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At the end of the day the price for BOTH rentals and players with multiple years of control was not conducive to Bloom's obvious plan and what the owners brought him in for, that being to build a sustainable winner. The moves he made will improve this year's team without mortgaging the future. How many of Chaim's moves have to work out before we as a fanbase finally give him the benefit of the doubt. I, for one, believe he is the right guy for this franchise to bank on the future!
Welcome to the team.
 

ehaz

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I‘m disappointed they weren’t able to do more but the Schwarber deal was fantastic. In a market where Kimbrel is going for Madrigal + and a few months of Baez cost the Mets their former first round prep OF (who is their #5 prospect), Bloom got Schwarber for a low A ball lottery ticket with an elbow injury.

Schwarber is streaky but he’s one of a handful of guys that can singlehandedly win you a series. He hit .400 in the WS practically playing on one knee.
 

OurF'ingCity

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And as far as the starters go, I mean, if we're really pinning our hopes on a Chris Sale who is coming back from Tommy John surgery as our big addition, okay, I love the Lasso optimism, but I'd want a little more assurance than that going into a postseason series, wouldn't you?
I mean, it’s always nice to go into the postseason feeling like you’re a clear favorite but if the playoffs started today, would the Sox - even without Sale and Schwarber - really be that big of an underdog? I get the 1B and the rotation are weak spots, but people seem to be forgetting that they’ve managed to acquire the second best record in the AL even with those weak spots.
 

BigSoxFan

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I‘m disappointed they weren’t able to do more but the Schwarber deal was fantastic. In a market where Kimbrel is going for Madrigal + and a few months of Baez cost the Mets their former first round prep OF (who is their #5 prospect), Bloom got Schwarber for a low A ball lottery ticket with an elbow injury.

Schwarber is streaky but he’s one of a handful of guys that can singlehandedly win you a series. He hit .400 in the WS practically playing on one knee.
Yup. Schwarber deal turned the tide for me. He could easily be a top 3-4 deadline bat down the stretch. His June run was about as good as it gets. Just have to hope he can get his timing back (and health).
 

Scoops Bolling

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Yup. Schwarber deal turned the tide for me. He could easily be a top 3-4 deadline bat down the stretch. His June run was about as good as it gets. Just have to hope he can get his timing back (and health).
And if you're believer in clutch, he's got a helluva track record in that regard.
 

John Marzano Olympic Hero

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I mean, it’s always nice to go into the postseason feeling like you’re a clear favorite but if the playoffs started today, would the Sox - even without Sale and Schwarber - really be that big of an underdog? I get the 1B and the rotation are weak spots, but people seem to be forgetting that they’ve managed to acquire the second best record in the AL even with those weak spots.
IDK. Have you seen the way Perez, Pivetta, Richards and Rodriguez pitched in the last month? Right now it's Eovaldi and pray for a monsoon. Their pen has been a real saving grace for this team. I think that the Sox would be definitive underdogs against the White Sox, the Astros and the A's. Probably the Rays too.

I get that they have the second best record in the league and they've been a real joy to watch play, but I think some pitching and a first baseman would have gone a long way in evening those odds.
 

Cesar Crespo

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Yup. Schwarber deal turned the tide for me. He could easily be a top 3-4 deadline bat down the stretch. His June run was about as good as it gets. Just have to hope he can get his timing back (and health).
If he has a good run, can play 1st base decently well and enjoys his time here, I wonder if there's any thought to bringing him back. No idea what kind of contract he is looking at.
 

Cesar Crespo

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IDK. Have you seen the way Perez, Pivetta, Richards and Rodriguez pitched in the last month? Right now it's Eovaldi and pray for a monsoon. Their pen has been a real saving grace for this team. I think that the Sox would be definitive underdogs against the White Sox, the Astros and the A's. Probably the Rays too.

I get that they have the second best record in the league and they've been a real joy to watch play, but I think some pitching and a first baseman would have gone a long way in evening those odds.
Sometimes all you need is the bullpen though.
 

BigSoxFan

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If he has a good run, can play 1st base decently well and enjoys his time here, I wonder if there's any thought to bringing him back. No idea what kind of contract he is looking at.
You’d have to think there would be as long as the demands aren’t outrageous. 29 next March so there is some good production remaining for him. Always a streaky player but not many guys are even capable of the stretch he recently had.
 

NJ_Sox_Fan

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I think Bloom is doing a fine job, and was a great hire, and he appears to be doing a great job setting the team up for the future.

My gripe with today (or the deadline period in general) was not that they couldn’t outbid some of these other teams with far better farm systems, because I agree in general that rebuilding the farm is a must, plus they just don’t have the pieces to compete with some of the trades that were made.

My gripe is that (unexpectedly) this team is a legit WS contender, and I think they have enough pitching issues that any reasonable mid rotation guy could have been huge, or one elite pen guy.

IF Sale comes back and is great, and if ERod stops being horrible, maybe they don’t need anything. But that is 2 of many IF’s. I just think when you’re close to winning a WS you have to go for it and worry about another year another year.

Perhaps there was not anyone available of interest though beyond Scherzer and Berrios and Kimbrel.
 

Detts

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IDK. Have you seen the way Perez, Pivetta, Richards and Rodriguez pitched in the last month? Right now it's Eovaldi and pray for a monsoon. Their pen has been a real saving grace for this team. I think that the Sox would be definitive underdogs against the White Sox, the Astros and the A's. Probably the Rays too.

I get that they have the second best record in the league and they've been a real joy to watch play, but I think some pitching and a first baseman would have gone a long way in evening those odds.
The Edro thing is a big problem for me. COVID is no joke. Sale is the big gamble.
 

RG33

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I think Bloom is doing a fine job, and was a great hire, and he appears to be doing a great job setting the team up for the future.

My gripe with today (or the deadline period in general) was not that they couldn’t outbid some of these other teams with far better farm systems, because I agree in general that rebuilding the farm is a must, plus they just don’t have the pieces to compete with some of the trades that were made.

My gripe is that (unexpectedly) this team is a legit WS contender, and I think they have enough pitching issues that any reasonable mid rotation guy could have been huge, or one elite pen guy.

IF Sale comes back and is great, and if ERod stops being horrible, maybe they don’t need anything. But that is 2 of many IF’s. I just think when you’re close to winning a WS you have to go for it and worry about another year another year.

Perhaps there was not anyone available of interest though beyond Scherzer and Berrios and Kimbrel.
If Sale isn’t 80+% of his former self and EDro doesn’t figure shit out, none of this matters. It seems likely that Chaim knows that, knows that it is a pretty big bet, and therefore did not want to mortgage top 10 propsects in a rebuilding system when the team needs everything to go right to be legit WS contenders.