Roger Angell, once again, has written a beautiful little essay, that not only reports on the scene, but captures the essence of the game.
The Silence of the Fans
- Thread starter Rochacha75
- Start date
It would be great if the Red Sox would take the lead in eliminating (or cutting down) all the noise and distractions at the park and allowing fans to concentrate on the game.
All of the extraneous additions seem like an admission - whether they realize it or not - that the game on the field is not enough to hold fans' attention.
Edit: Cafardo, of all people, has actually written some good stuff about this issue.
All of the extraneous additions seem like an admission - whether they realize it or not - that the game on the field is not enough to hold fans' attention.
Edit: Cafardo, of all people, has actually written some good stuff about this issue.
In reality, it's not. People today don't go to the Red Sox to watch the game, they go to GO to Fenway Park. Times have changed.joyofsox said:
Well, I guess I'm just yelling at a cloud.PC Drunken Friar said:
But would anyone stay away from Fenway if there wasn't excess noise and music and commercials?
Would any potential ticket buyer say, you know, Fenway doesn't blare pop music between innings anymore, I'm not going to buy any tickets?
Most people have become used to the noise and pointless distraction, but I doubt there would be a huge outcry if it was toned down.
A lot of this, I think, started in the minor leagues when some clubs decided that they needed to attract young fans and started the between-innings games. Mascots began to abound and multiply. The music volume was pumped up; Noooise! Clap Your Hands, Stomp Your Feet began appearing on the ever-increasing installation of video scoreboards. If it worked for one club, another was sure to adopt it. But to get the kids there, you had to get the parents bringing them, so clubs began trying to make things a family affair. The Kiss Cam, the Dance Cam. In-between-innings amusements began to include adults.
In the mid-90s our group had its annual baseball weekend centered on the Central Division of the Midwest League and I recall reading about the owner of one of the league's clubs bragging about how his team set an attendance record (over 500,000) when probably no more than 30% of the people leaving a game knew who won.
edit: Glad I wrote that before reading Angell's piece.
In the mid-90s our group had its annual baseball weekend centered on the Central Division of the Midwest League and I recall reading about the owner of one of the league's clubs bragging about how his team set an attendance record (over 500,000) when probably no more than 30% of the people leaving a game knew who won.
edit: Glad I wrote that before reading Angell's piece.
joyofsox said:
Compared to other parks I've been to Fenway has a very small amount of extraneous crap going on. Try going to a game at Citi or YS, for example.
Nearly the entire bleachers and much of the rest of the park would be very sad if there was no "Sweet Caroline".
I say eff 'em, but that's just the way it is.
I say eff 'em, but that's just the way it is.
I just sat in the bleachers at Petco and it was horrible. I felt like I needed hearing protection.
First inning, no one on, and the PA is roaring "make some noise!" About what?
Then, t-shirt gun people rocket stuff into the stands.
It didn't seem to me like anyone was really into any of it. In fact, it seemed liked people wanted to talk and couldn't hear one another.
But they must do some fan surveys and such, right? This board is clearly not the mainstream.
And my kids really do like Slugger when we hit the Sea Dogs game...
First inning, no one on, and the PA is roaring "make some noise!" About what?
Then, t-shirt gun people rocket stuff into the stands.
It didn't seem to me like anyone was really into any of it. In fact, it seemed liked people wanted to talk and couldn't hear one another.
But they must do some fan surveys and such, right? This board is clearly not the mainstream.
And my kids really do like Slugger when we hit the Sea Dogs game...
One time during a UFC broadcast the announcers mics died but the sounds of the cage and arena were still audible, that was great. I wish that option existed for televised baseball games. Muting isn't really the same thing. Live sporting events are sensory assault. The Bronx is really terrible for this. Fenway isn't good bet better than YS. Dodger stadium 10 years ago wasn't bad to my recollection.
Lose Remerswaal said:
No doubt. I was at Tuesday's game and the four seats in front of ours were empty until about 7:45 (only the 3rd/4th inning thanks to the long bottom of the 2nd and top of the 3rd). Then the ticket holders showed up and spent maybe a total of 15 minutes in which all four were seated. The rest of the time one or two or three or all of them were up to get more beer, more snacks, to make a bathroom run, who knows. And when they were in their seats, they were buried in their phones texting or facetiming or taking and posting selfies (at least 50 between the four phones). None of them paying attention to the game whatsoever. When did they leave? Bottom of the eighth, of course. There's no doubt in my mind the only thing that kept them there that long was the anticipation of singing Sweet Caroline.
I was very tempted to ask them if they got their tickets for free because $65 plus who knows how much in beer (5-6 X whatever the cheap swill goes for) seems like an awful lot of money to spend to hang out for two hours doing things you could do at home or in a bar for far less. These were all 20-somethings so I assume they're not rolling in disposable income or anything. Blew my mind.
Overall though, I didn't feel like Fenway was an assault on the senses with the extraneous stuff. I think the volume on the music could be dropped a tad, but that's really the only "crime" against the old school baseball experience. I mean, the worst pandering to the casual fan/kids was the stupid Wally dance thing and Sweet Caroline, and it was ALL isolated in the between inning breaks. The only arguably "distracting" thing during the game itself was the walk-up music.
I don't mind music between innings, and I actually enjoy Sweet Caroline when I'm at the ballpark (shut up, I just do.) What drives me nuts is when teams play the stupid Day-O and Charge and We Will Rock You noises incessantly during every 10 second break in play. I hate it on TV and I especially hate it in person. Unless things have changed or my memory is worse than I think, they don't do a lot of that stuff in Fenway, for which I am thankful. In fact, if I ever had a chance to speak with a member of the ownership group or FO that's something I'd want to tell them.
I do like when teams are clever with music or video clips. I noticed during the long review of the play where the Jay's catcher apparently wasn't blocking X from reaching the plate that they were playing "Time," which gave me a chuckle. At another game--and probably another ballpark, though I don't remember where--a manager came out to relieve the starter during a rough inning and the scoreboard played a scene from one of the Toy Story movies with Woody shouting "It's gone! My arm is completely gone!" That stuff cracks me up. Day-O? Annoying, unoriginal, and pointless.
I do like when teams are clever with music or video clips. I noticed during the long review of the play where the Jay's catcher apparently wasn't blocking X from reaching the plate that they were playing "Time," which gave me a chuckle. At another game--and probably another ballpark, though I don't remember where--a manager came out to relieve the starter during a rough inning and the scoreboard played a scene from one of the Toy Story movies with Woody shouting "It's gone! My arm is completely gone!" That stuff cracks me up. Day-O? Annoying, unoriginal, and pointless.
Tharkin said:
Whoever runs the Fenway music has a sense of humor. When Marco Estrada was brought into the game the other night, they played the theme from CHiPs as he warmed up.
I echo the thoughts that Fenway is on the low scale of bells and whistles. And the vast majority of it does occur between innings, ala Sweet Caroline, and really, who cares about non-game time music, etc. But one thing I was disappointed to hear was the inception of the kid zone, or whatever it's called, down in the concourse area. I was first introduced these friggin' things about 10 years ago at Minute Maid park in Houston. When visiting my brother and his family, we would often take my at the time 6-7 year old nephew to Astros games. We would always have to stop at his kid zone/arcade area, so he could play video games, throw pitches into a net, romp around a little mock base-path area, etc. Inevitably, when game time would come around, he would not want to leave the kid zone, and raise absolute holy hell about it. From what I witnessed, he wasn't alone. Hate that Fenway felt the need to provide a similar distraction. If you want raise new generations of fans, how about having them in the stands, watching the actual game.
More generally, I don't quite grasp the current need in our culture to have every luxury and comfort amenity involved in every activity. All for comfortable seats and a good variety of concessions. But amusement parks, swimming pools, Palm Steakhouses, meh.
Edit: Unless of course someone wants to invite me to catered luxury box. Then I'm a complete hypocrite, and will gladly partake.
More generally, I don't quite grasp the current need in our culture to have every luxury and comfort amenity involved in every activity. All for comfortable seats and a good variety of concessions. But amusement parks, swimming pools, Palm Steakhouses, meh.
Edit: Unless of course someone wants to invite me to catered luxury box. Then I'm a complete hypocrite, and will gladly partake.
Rochacha75 said:
I love keeping score. Can't be at a game without my (home-made) score sheet, clip board, and mechanical pencil. If you look at vintage photos of fans in the stands, you will see a significant percentage with heads down, pencil on paper. People came to experience the game. (Keeping score keeps you in the game like no other extra-game experience.)
And this is what MLB is missing, somehow: how to truly market the game (as opposed to the ballpark experience) to the next generation. When my dad took me to Rochester Red Wing games as a kid, too young, really, to sit still for nine innings, there was nothing for me to do, but watch the game. And surrounding me? The role models all-around? Adults watching the game.
The one place for following a game that has remained pure over the years is radio. They just haven't figured out how to F that up. Can't shoot tshirts through it, or have a kiddie pool beside it. And can't show video of some shirtless fat guy to mock during a "slow" inning. Just the game. Give me Joe & Dave and a score sheet, anyday.
After the '94-'95 strike a decision was made at some level in the majors to get more balls to the fans, so foul balls that didn't leave the playing field, third out balls were tossed into the stands or handed to fans. My wide and I were at Camden Yards for a game shortly after play resumed, in the almost empty lower deck in left, well before the game started. She was getting her scorecard ready and I was reading the scorecard magazine when I happened to glance up to see a ball about three feet from our heads. I managed to get the ball deflected a bit so neither of us got injured but her glasses got knocked off and broken.
The club had some intern or ballboy out there throwing balls to fans. No warning. Guess who didn't pay to get the glasses fixed.
When I was a kid I followed most of the games on radio and I always kept score. I kept that up until more recent years when I could simply get the result from the web. My wife still scores games. I taught her how and now the only time that I score is when I temporarily take over her card (which I once did for Bill James).
One of the bid disappointments in my life is that my folks sold the homestead when I was stationed overseas and I lost the hundreds of Red Sox games that I had scored as I was growing up (My sister did save my baseball cards, though).
The club had some intern or ballboy out there throwing balls to fans. No warning. Guess who didn't pay to get the glasses fixed.
When I was a kid I followed most of the games on radio and I always kept score. I kept that up until more recent years when I could simply get the result from the web. My wife still scores games. I taught her how and now the only time that I score is when I temporarily take over her card (which I once did for Bill James).
One of the bid disappointments in my life is that my folks sold the homestead when I was stationed overseas and I lost the hundreds of Red Sox games that I had scored as I was growing up (My sister did save my baseball cards, though).