The Ringer

Leather

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I think that's it--which I think does support the point. He doesn't like superhero movies, that's fine, but he doesn't seem to be someone who could add a lot of nuance to a discussion of superhero movies.
I think Holmes was so overwhelmingly, pathetically, intent on just slobbering all over the movie (and being unable to restrain his excitement at being able to talk about it), that even having Simmons there simply to say "Jesus, it wasn't THAT good." would have been an improvement. I don't know if Lathan asked to have Holmes on to pair with him this episode, but there were multiple times in the last third of the episode where he felt compelled to cut Holmes off with a declaratory "Huh" and then change topics. Not even a "That's interesting!" just a "Ok, you have to stop your bullshit now it's embarrassing." He tries to sugar coat it at first (when Holmes reveals his abject ignorance by implying Titanic launched James Cameron's career), but near the end even he gave up.

Maybe the issue isn't the need for Simmons so much as Holmes was the worst movie podcast co-host I think I've ever heard.
 

Shelterdog

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Yeah. That pod could have used someone like Fennessy, who I think would have cranked down the fanboyism and also could have reeled in some of the factual errors pointed out upthread. Although adding Bill would have inevitably led to something about re-casting Michelle Pfeiffer as Aunt May or something .
There's also just generally kind of a problem with discussion of superhero movies. Any discussion with someone who hates superhero movies as a genre is kind of a waste of time but I personally find a Mallory pod where she talks about how brilliant black widow is or whatever to be a similar waste of time

I think Holmes was so overwhelmingly, pathetically, intent on just slobbering all over the movie (and being unable to restrain his excitement at being able to talk about it), that even having Simmons there simply to say "Jesus, it wasn't THAT good." would have been an improvement. I don't know if Lathan asked to have Holmes on to pair with him this episode, but there were multiple times in the last third of the episode where he felt compelled to cut Holmes off with a declaratory "Huh" and then change topics. Not even a "That's interesting!" just a "Ok, you have to stop your bullshit now it's embarrassing." He tries to sugar coat it at first (when Holmes reveals his abject ignorance by implying Titanic launched James Cameron's career), but near the end even he gave up.

Maybe the issue isn't the need for Simmons so much as Holmes was the worst movie podcast co-host I think I've ever heard.
There's a really funny bit in between meals by AJ Liebling (like page 1-2) where he says, in essence, the first requirement of being a good food critic is a big appetite so you've had a chance to eat enough meals to have something worthwhile to say.

Maybe Holmes has worthwhile things to say about comic books, literature, tv, etc but he doesn't have much to say about movies.
 

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There's a really funny bit in between meals by AJ Liebling (like page 1-2) where he says, in essence, the first requirement of being a good food critic is a big appetite so you've had a chance to eat enough meals to have something worthwhile to say.

Maybe Holmes has worthwhile things to say about comic books, literature, tv, etc but he doesn't have much to say about movies.
The irony here is that Holmes is the guy who usually hates everything. But his nickname is Coke Baby Chuck on the Ringerverse because his takes are crazy.
 

shlincoln

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I wouldn't say Charles hates everything, he's just generally more critical than people like Mallory or Van who are both exceptionally Pollyanna'ish when it comes to this stuff.
 

Leather

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There's also just generally kind of a problem with discussion of superhero movies. Any discussion with someone who hates superhero movies as a genre is kind of a waste of time but I personally find a Mallory pod where she talks about how brilliant black widow is or whatever to be a similar waste of time
I say this as someone who enjoys occasionally eating at McDonalds, and watching (many, but not all) Marvel movies with my kids: People want to enjoy Superhero movies the same way they want to enjoy eating at McDonalds. They like it and want to be left alone for liking it, even if they know that it's not fine dining/great cinema or whatever; that's not why they are there. The upshot is that subjecting a Superhero movie (or McDonalds) to the same scrutiny one would a Tom Hanks drama or new steakhouse is regarded as unfair because "They aren't trying to be like that!" Either a critic likes a Superhero movie, treats it with kid gloves, or they are accused of missing the point. It's trying to have it both ways.

It's sort of a weird place for the dominant cultural phenomenon of our time to be, but it certainly mirrors some of the less great aspects of our society, and I wonder how much Disney has paid PR people on social media to keep it going (see, reaction to Scorsese, Martin).
 
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shlincoln

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So I finally found the time to listen to the Spider-man rewatchable, and I just have to circle back to something
I mean, at one point Holmes blathers about how Spider Man set the template for modern superhero movies by introducing a character, how he gets his powers, and what's important to him in the first 40 minutes (note: this is also called a standard first act and was used in Super Man and Batman), and then in the next sentence says that he tried to watch a Tom Holland SM movie and his wife was confused because there were aliens and backstory right at the beginning (which is the *opposite* of how he described the original Spider Man first act) and concludes: "So yeah, Spider Man set the template for the next 20 years!"

Simmons is good in those situations because he isn't afraid to call a sort of time out and say "Wait, what?"
His point, which is correct, is that to someone coming in cold to Spider-Man, the Raimi movie is the better starting point. The backstory he's talking about with Homecoming isn't Spider-Man backstory, it's MCU backstory. Homecoming opens with a scene set immediately after the first Avengers movie dealing with the clean up for the Battle of New York. After that it launches into a retelling of Captain America Civil War from Pete's perspective. Homecoming skips over all the traditional explanations of what exactly a Spider Can, which works for it because it's part of the MCU, and there's no need to trod that ground again. However, for someone coming in cold to the idea of someone who can catch thieves just like flies, the Raimi movie is what you should watch.

tl;dr I thought Charles was fine, I wish he had gone even further comparing the movie to the Ultimate Spider-Man comics actually. And I don't think it would've been improved by Simmons calling them both nerds for liking kids stuff like comic book movies.
 

Leather

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Fun Rewatchables today on A League of Their Own with Bill and Mal.
Yeah. Solid episode. Although Bill’s “My daughter will have her own podcast someday because she didn’t like a terrible character [and not because I’m her dad and will inevitably give her one when she wants one]” was… something.
 

cromulence

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We've got a new Simmons Pronunciation on the Austin Powers Rewatchables. It's quick, so I had to go back and make sure I'd heard it right - "faux" is "faw" (when he mentioned Ming Tea). At least this one isn't an English word.
 

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I caught up on the last couple of the original sixty over the weekend. The faw finale, Would?, was fantastic. This podcast is neck-and-neck with The Rewatchables as my favorite.
It was. And all of these episodes are at least great,(except for the 2nd half of the REM one, which was absurd and offensive) but I absolutely loved the Fiona Apple one. The Sarah McLachlan riff about the dogs was just so past the point of funny and into the realm of genius that it makes me grateful I have been alive at the same time as Rob Harvilla. And then he dug into Apple and it was epic.
 

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It was. And all of these episodes are at least great,(except for the 2nd half of the REM one, which was absurd and offensive) but I absolutely loved the Fiona Apple one. The Sarah McLachlan riff about the dogs was just so past the point of funny and into the realm of genius that it makes me grateful I have been alive at the same time as Rob Harvilla. And then he dug into Apple and it was epic.
Harvilla is just the goddamned best. I have ZERO notes. He is the perfect person to be doing what he's doing.
 

8slim

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It was. And all of these episodes are at least great,(except for the 2nd half of the REM one, which was absurd and offensive) but I absolutely loved the Fiona Apple one. The Sarah McLachlan riff about the dogs was just so past the point of funny and into the realm of genius that it makes me grateful I have been alive at the same time as Rob Harvilla. And then he dug into Apple and it was epic.
Agree completely about the Fiona Apple episode.

Also, Jay Caspian Kang is a terrible person. It didn’t surprise me at all that he ruined that episode.
 

Spelunker

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Harvilla is just the goddamned best. I have ZERO notes. He is the perfect person to be doing what he's doing.
When it's all said and done I want to rip all the episodes and keep them uploaded somewhere safe so I can always have them. They may be my favorite thing.
 

Leather

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We've got a new Simmons Pronunciation on the Austin Powers Rewatchables. It's quick, so I had to go back and make sure I'd heard it right - "faux" is "faw" (when he mentioned Ming Tea). At least this one isn't an English word.
Simmons leading off the recasting ideas with recasting a fucking FEMBOT was peak Bill. I have seen that movie 30 times and I never once gave a shit who played the Fembots; the whole point is that they are attractive in a cliche'd, anonymous, way.

Also him saying that the Bond parody angle has aged poorly is kind of missing the whole point of the movie. It's like saying Anchorman has aged poorly because nobody remembers the 70s anymore. But he had previously stated he never watched the Connery Bond movies so it's just classic Simmons solipsism.
 

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Cindy Margolis, who played the lead fembot, was the most downloaded woman on the internet at the time and was considered to be a big deal. She was, as Sean said, a second rate Pam Anderson, but if Pam Anderson read for Vanessa Kensington, which she did, she wasn't going to settle for a non-speaking part. Margolis was about as good a get as they could for that role back then.
 

Leather

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Cindy Margolis, who played the lead fembot, was the most downloaded woman on the internet at the time and was considered to be a big deal. She was, as Sean said, a second rate Pam Anderson, but if Pam Anderson read for Vanessa Kensington, which she did, she wasn't going to settle for a non-speaking part. Margolis was about as good a get as they could for that role back then.
I mean, she was fine! She did the job! She was gorgeous in a very purposefully generic (blonde, big boobs, legs) way! What advantage is there to recasting her to Ali Larter?

Full disclosure: I always got Ali Larter confused with Ali Landry, the Doritos girl.
 

Red(s)HawksFan

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I mean, she was fine! She did the job! She was gorgeous in a very purposefully generic (blonde, big boobs, legs) way! What advantage is there to recasting her to Ali Larter?

Full disclosure: I always got Ali Larter confused with Ali Landry, the Doritos girl.
Felt like Bill just wanted to be able to "Holy Crap, that's..." a fembot.
 

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Sean’s “Why don’t we just cast Helen Mirren?” was great. Awesome episode
I'm not the hugest Fennessey fan, but they really need either him, Chris, or Van on any Rewatchables pod that Bill is hosting, because they're the only ones who seem to be comfortable calling out Bill when he's fully into his idiocy. Both he and Chris seem to be all in on calling out Bill on his absurd recasting suggestions, which often involve casting an A-List actor in a role with only one or two lines.

And to bring this full circle, Myers himself mocked this idea in Wayne's World 2, when Wayne calls for a better actor to be called in to do the scene in which a gas station attendant directs Wayne and Garth to the church at which Cassandra is getting married, and the original actor walks off and Charlton Heston comes in and delivers a real "actorly" performance of the three or four lines giving them directions.

Myers intended that as a joke, but clearly Bill watched that scene and thought, "They should always do that!"
 

TheGazelle

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Sean’s “Why don’t we just cast Helen Mirren?” was great. Awesome episode
That was beautiful. Agreed with Remagellan above that these pods need some combo of CR/Van/Fennessy to reign in BS. CR and Fennessy recently have been really funny ribbing Simmons on all sorts of shit. I liked how Fennessy alluded to Bill's Diane Keaton take ("Kay Corleone sucks") when Bill randomly attached Ethan Embry's performance in Can't Hardly Wait.
 

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That was beautiful. Agreed with Remagellan above that these pods need some combo of CR/Van/Fennessy to reign in BS. CR and Fennessy recently have been really funny ribbing Simmons on all sorts of shit. I liked how Fennessy alluded to Bill's Diane Keaton take ("Kay Corleone sucks") when Bill randomly attached Ethan Embry's performance in Can't Hardly Wait.
Poor Ethan Embry, he caught a fusillade of bullets out of nowhere.
 

Marciano490

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On what premise? That’s an all time great nerd finally gets dream girl he pined for throughout high school performance.

That was a great movie (as I recollect it). Aman-duhhhh.
 

allstonite

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On what premise? That’s an all time great nerd finally gets dream girl he pined for throughout high school performance.

That was a great movie (as I recollect it). Aman-duhhhh.
Simmons said he didn’t like him in that movie. Simmons has famously bad casting takes. He’s perfect in that role and it is a great great movie.
 

jezza1918

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Embry was in Empire Records, White Squall, That Thing You Do! (a movie i dont actually enjoy but still), Vegas Vacation, and Can't Hardly Wait between 1995-1998. Simmons discusses hot streaks from actors all the time...for a significant portion of people born between circa '79-85 or so, that is one hell of a hot streak. I find most Simmons content a blast to listen to, but I can't tell if he is trolling 90% of the time with his casting takes or serious, either way they are awful.
Who thinks Ethan Embree sucks? Somebody. More like….nobody!
Also, this is really well done.
 

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Simmons said he didn’t like him in that movie. Simmons has famously bad casting takes. He’s perfect in that role and it is a great great movie.
Now remember Simmons and Russillo had some complaints about Karate Kid because Danny La Russa isn't cool enough to have dated Ali Mills and that the part could/should have been played by someone cooler/less goofy. Which like, holy shit, way to misunderstand the movie or dating or anything, and also way to be stuck in a high school mentality about life.
 

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The 60 Songs That Explain the 90s episode on Bonnie Raitt's "I Can't Make You Love Me."

Run, don't walk.
Indeed. Truly exceptional.

I don't know how Rob keeps topping himself. He's been putting up 50/20/12 lines for months. But the Raitt episode was really a treat.
 

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Indeed. Truly exceptional.

I don't know how Rob keeps topping himself. He's been putting up 50/20/12 lines for months. But the Raitt episode was really a treat.
The more autobiographical the episode is, the better it is.

I still love the anecdote in the "All the Small Things" episode about his friend putting underwear on his head and repeatedly saying "I'm immature!" after being dumped.
 

johnmd20

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The more autobiographical the episode is, the better it is.

I still love the anecdote in the "All the Small Things" episode about his friend putting underwear on his head and repeatedly saying "I'm immature!" after being dumped.
Yes, he got into Raitt just about as deep as you can go considering the length of the episodes. It was illuminating. And hilarious, of course.
 

johnmd20

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Boy did I pick the wrong episode of 60 Songs that Explain the 90s to introduce this podcast to my wife. That first 20 minutes of the Jane's Addiction episode was pretty bad. Man, just terrible bass lines. My wife was just like, "I don't know what he's talking about but I am out." It was hard to argue with her, this was Jay Caspian Kang shitting on REM during the REM episode bad.

I ended up just stopping and going back to the Fiona Apple episode because my wife is a big fan of hers. I should have started with that one. It was great to listen to again. And while my wife isn't agog with the podcast(yet) at least she is no longer out.
 

tbb345

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Is anyone else on here a Mismatch listener? I’ve been a listener basically since it started and man is Chris Vernon getting exponentially more annoying.

For some reason he’s a complete Heat homer (He’s on of the old school guys who is all in on”heat culture”) and has been annoyingly wrong about the Celtics all year. Because he has been so wrong about them (and because he gets shit for it), he’s turned into a Celtics troll.

I listened to the episode just released and one of the first things he’s talking about is how the Celtics are so much better because they don’t have Josh Richardson? It’s just comically stupid
 
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JCizzle

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Is anyone else on here a Mismatch listener? I’ve been a listener basically since it started and man is Chris Vernon getting exponentially more annoying.

For some reason he’s a complete Heat homer (He’s on of the old school guys who is all in on”heat culture”) and has been annoyingly wrong about the Celtics all year. Because he has been so wrong about them (and because he gets shit for it), he’s turned into a Celtics troll.

I listened to the episode just released and one of the first things he’s talking about is how the Celtics are so much better because they don’t have Josh Richardson? It’s just comically stupid
I really enjoy the show, but I normally take Verno with a grain of salt. I think he views KOC as a huge Celtics homer for some reason and tries to needle him. If anything, I find that KOC and Russillo almost go out of their way to critique the Celtics to not come off as homers, but whatever on that.

In situations where I disagree with Verno he can be grating (as you mentioned), but it pays off when he nails something like Gobert and just craps all over KOC playing the straight analyst. KOC without someone like him kinda comes off as Zach Lowe, who I also really enjoy, but don't find myself catching many of his podcasts because they can be a tad too dry.
 
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tbb345

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What, you didn’t like his ‘Robert Williams can’t handle the pressure’ take?
That one was a doozy. He also conveniently forgot to mention the games where Butler completely disappeared in his commentary.

Vernon was one of the people touting how the Celtics playing the Nets was completely vaccination based. Completely ignored all of the talk about “not running” and not backing down…if the Heat did the same thing he would have had an orgasm for the length of the pod talking about how they were “dogs” and “there for it”. He also would have said “heat culture is real folks” at least 5 times
 

Spelunker

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I've decided that Wos is a podcast mini Stephen A. Smith, both in hot takes but also the exact same patter. He's awful. I would really like to enjoy the Ringer NBA podcast, but he kills it for me.
 

kenneycb

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I really enjoy the show, but I normally take Verno with a grain of salt. I think he views KOC as a huge Celtics homer for some reason and tries to needle him. If anything, I find that KOC and Russillo almost go out of their way to critique the Celtics to not come off as homers, but whatever on that.

In situations where I disagree with Verno he can be grating (as you mentioned), but it pays off when he nails something like Gobert and just craps all over KOC playing the straight analyst. KOC without someone like him kinda comes off as Zach Lowe, who I also really enjoy, but don't find myself catching many of his podcasts because they can be a tad too dry.
It’s interesting because I’m listening to the Press Box’s interview with KOC now and the first thing he talks about is how he’s no longer a Celtics fan. Not much to do with anything but I’m happy to pimp any Bryan Curtis-led interview.
 

Kliq

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I enjoy the mismatch a lot. Vernon and KOC have great chemistry, particularly for people who disagree a lot. Vernon is the more old fashioned sports radio personality while KOC is the new-wave analytics driven reporter. It's a good pairing because they are nice counters of one another. KOC uses data and analysis to counter Vernon's hot takes, and Vernon can reel in KOC a bit when he starts projecting too much and getting a little impractical.

Also his Tennessee accent his pleasing to my ears.

If you ever want to laugh, Google Chris Vernon and see what he looks like. One of the biggest examples of "that voice doesn't match their body" I can think of.
 

johnmd20

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If you ever want to laugh, Google Chris Vernon and see what he looks like. One of the biggest examples of "that voice doesn't match their body" I can think of.
Holy crap. That is a literal LOL moment for you because you hit this one perfectly.
 

Pablo's TB Lover

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If you ever want to laugh, Google Chris Vernon and see what he looks like. One of the biggest examples of "that voice doesn't match their body" I can think of.
In the spirit of Dan Le Batard's bit, Chris Vernon looks like the guy in your foursome who takes the golf cart stunts a little too far and ends up tipping it over.
 

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Just started this week's 60 songs. Rob says, "And now, let me tell you all a little something about what it was like to be a 16 year old boy in 1994" and then the opening bass line of The Offspring's "Bad Habit" kicks in. I know this show is always a nostalgia trip, but I WAS a 16 year old boy in 1994 and my 17 year old buddy had just acquired a 1988 maroon Ford Tempo with a droopy ceiling liner (standard on 80s Tempos) and a pioneer tape deck with a removable face plate and we WORE THAT TAPE THE FUCK OUT, especially that song. I still get an emotional jolt when I hear that song (or one of the lesser played songs off of RATM's debut). I couldn't relate more to Harvilla.

edit: LOL. apparently his Chrysler LeBaron had the same feature!
 
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Kliq

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The Ringer's wrestling content is extremely bad. I can't believe people listen to Peter Rosenberg and the Cheap Heat pod and think that is good content that should be promoted on the site.
 

luckiestman

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The Ringer's wrestling content is extremely bad.
If you think they’re is a market for it, start a competitor. Pro wrestling is enough of a niche subculture that you could probably promote it on the largest forums and get a following. BJJ podcasts exist and that sport has a way smaller potential audience.