The Pre-Game Thread: Wk.4 @ Chiefs

RedOctober3829

RedOctober3829

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How in God's name do the Pats try to stop the KC offense? Do they go lighter and dare them to run just like they did against Denver back in the day? Do they move Gilmore around depending on the situation? KC is just doing everything well right now. They are averaging 4.9 yards per carry and 292 yards per game in the air with 9 TDs in 3 games.

This may be how they deploy their secondary this week.
Hill--Jones and safety help
Watkins--Gilmore
Hardman--JMac
Kelce--in line you chip him with an end and Williams gets him after that. If he's split out, JC Jackson and Joejuan Williams double him.
CEH--either Phillips or Dugger

There also could be some exotic coverages like how the Pats doubled the check downs on Carr last week.

It is imperative that the ends do not come up the field too much and open up running lanes for Mahomes as well. The secondary better be also ready to cover the receivers for a longer time than a normal game. Mahomes dances and buys time for his WRs moreso than any QB in the league and can frustrate the hell out of any defense with his playmaking ability. It is going to come down to limiting their chunk plays and forcing FGs in the red area.

Offensively, this sets up well for the Pats. KC's defense is giving up 5.3 yards per carry(153 yards per game) and 373 total yards per game. KC is also very thin at cornerback going into this week. Bashaud Breeland is suspended and L'Jarius Sneed broke his collarbone against the Ravens. That forced Charvarius Ward to play on Monday with a broken hand. Rashard Fenton will have a bigger role and it is likely they will have to call up another rookie(BoPete Keyes) this week. Spags will undoubtedly mix up coverages and blitz packages to try to confuse Cam Newton as he always does.

The Patriots ST better be ready this week. KC is averaging 30 yards per kickoff return which is pretty insane.

Health wise for the Pats, Damien Harris/Gunner/James White all returned to practice today but Yodny Cajuste and Beau Allen did not.
 
BaseballJones

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Well last year they did a great job against KC's offense. They lost 23-16 but recall they literally were screwed out of a Harry touchdown in that game. The D gave up 346 yards - 271 passing, 75 rushing. KC ran 70 offensive plays, so they averaged 4.9 yards per play. That's a nice job by New England's defense.

This year so far, the Pats' pass defense has been MUCH worse than last year, so I don't have the same hope that they can contain KC's explosive offense. The key will be controlling the ball and controlling the clock, grinding out yards and points, and hoping the defense can come up with a few big plays.

Much easier said than done, but that's the formula.
 
cshea

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They also got screwed out of a TD on a Kelce fumbled. Gilmore would've walked in for a score but they originally ruled Kelce down by contact. That play took a touchdown away and required the Patriots to burn their final challenge. The ensuing drive was the Harry play. They settled for a FG.

I was furious. I am now just remembering the sequence.

Edit: And like 3 plays before the Kelce fumble they challenged the spot on a 3rd and 5. Can't remember if they had legit beef on this but it was a horrific 10 mintues of officiating.
 
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Kliq

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cshea said:
They also got screwed out of a TD on a Kelce fumbled. Gilmore would've walked in for a score but they originally ruled Kelce down by contact. That play took a touchdown away and required the Patriots to burn their final challenge. The ensuing drive was the Harry play. They settled for a FG.

I was furious. I am now just remembering the sequence.

Edit: And like 3 plays before the Kelce fumble they challenged the spot on a 3rd and 5. Can't remember if they had legit beef on this but it was a horrific 10 mintues of officiating.
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Yeah, that KC game was perhaps the most egregiously refereed game of the Belichick era. The sequence of blowing the Kelce fumble/Gilmore, followed by the terrible Harry OOB call that the Patriots couldn't challenge because the referees had been so incompetent earlier was infuriating. IIRC, the Harry call was particularly bad because the referee that had the best view originally ruled it a touchdown, but a second referee came in and overruled him. On the replay, not only did it show Harry clearly staying in bounds, it also showed that the referee he came in and made the OOB call was likely blocked from seeing the play correctly. That fucking sucked.
 
j-man

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here how u stop KC

1 play keep away get 4-6 yard plays
2 play 8-9 back some plays and press man on others
3 get turnovers
in order stop kelce'hill'ceh'hardman kelce is the key esp on 3rd down
4 spy the qb
5 run run run the ball their are betther at pass def than most think
 
Over Guapo Grande

Over Guapo Grande

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This is a legit question, not a baiting one. For people who watch more than 3 hours a week... is Mahomes the QB who will just accept running the ball all day faced with a 3-2-6 (Manning, Pay[me]tons) defense? Or will he get itchy and try to make a big play?
 
BigSoxFan

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RedOctober3829 said:
The most underrated part of Mahomes is his smarts. He’ll accept running the football.
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Yeah. Every time I watch the Chiefs, I keep waiting/hoping for Mahomes to make some mental errors and he really doesn’t. He is pretty much the perfect QB and may someday challenge Brady for the GOAT title.
 
Willie Clay's Big Play

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I haven’t followed it too much, either. I thought the point he was making was more about the talent than anything exotic the chiefs will draw up. So, yea you’re right.
 
SMU_Sox

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Front 7: Base nickel: have Wino (1) as one edge, Butler/Guy (2) and Cowart/Wise (3) as your 2 interior DL depending on the down, with Simon/Rivers/Calhoun (4) on the other end. I would then have 2 LBs: Bentley (5) and Phillips (6). I think you need Bentley to keep them honest. You go 4 DL 7 DBs and I worry they run right over you. Phillips at least is a hybrid type.

Coverage wise I'd stick Jon Jones/JMC (7) and DMC (8) on Hill, Dugger/JJW (9) on Kelce, Gilmore (10) on Watkins, Phillips can handle RB duty, Bentley can take middle zone and also try his best to spy on Mahomes, and JC Jackson (11) on their 3rd WR.

There is a photo floating out there with a 4 safety look: Phillips and Dugger in the Box, JJW as the overhang defender and DMC as a deep safety. Now I like that in theory on passing downs but on 1st or 2nd down I would worry that is WAY too light of a box. Also in that scenario they only had 3 on the DL - Wino, Wise, and Butler or Guy.
 
DJnVa

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Schofield is (was?) a SoSHer and he's not low info.

And that tweet is 100% a nod to BB coming up with something we don't expect.
 
Dogman

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I mean, he admitted it in his tweet "Hell if I know". Obvisouly low information is obvious.
 
Saints Rest

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SMU_Sox said:
Front 7: Base nickel: have Wino (1) as one edge, Butler/Guy (2) and Cowart/Wise (3) as your 2 interior DL depending on the down, with Simon/Rivers/Calhoun (4) on the other end. I would then have 2 LBs: Bentley (5) and Phillips (6). I think you need Bentley to keep them honest. You go 4 DL 7 DBs and I worry they run right over you. Phillips at least is a hybrid type.

Coverage wise I'd stick Jon Jones/JMC (7) and DMC (8) on Hill, Dugger/JJW (9) on Kelce, Gilmore (10) on Watkins, Phillips can handle RB duty, Bentley can take middle zone and also try his best to spy on Mahomes, and JC Jackson (11) on their 3rd WR.

There is a photo floating out there with a 4 safety look: Phillips and Dugger in the Box, JJW as the overhang defender and DMC as a deep safety. Now I like that in theory on passing downs but on 1st or 2nd down I would worry that is WAY too light of a box. Also in that scenario they only had 3 on the DL - Wino, Wise, and Butler or Guy.
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I’m not sure Bentley could effectively spy an OG.
 
DennyDoyle'sBoil

DennyDoyle'sBoil

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Willie Clay's Big Play said:
I’m also low info. Can you use “Roethlisbergering” in a sentence?
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I think I did. But I will try again.

“Now, I am virtually certain that Willie Clay’s Big Play is Roethlisbergering us.”

Assuming not, the explanation is that there is a SOSH tradition of referring to Ben Roethlisberger or posting his picture when someone misses the joke. As in:

WCBP: Here is this thing from twitter that suggests the Patriots are clueless and will have no answer for the Chiefs by a guy who must not be too smart.

Gullible SOSH: Schofield is a member here, he is pretty football savvy, and that isn’t what the tweet means.

WCBP: Inserts picture of Ben Roethlisburger to mean “that is the joke.”

At least that is what I thought you might be doing but now think it is all a big coincidence and, I hope you would admit, kind of funny.

And to anticipate a question, I have no idea how Ben Roethlisberger became a synonym for “that’s the joke” on SOSH. In thinking about it more, I regret my use of the word “Roethlisbergering” in a vague context given that Ben may very well be a rapist and so it now occurs to me I risked being misunderstood.
 
Saints Rest

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DennyDoyle'sBoil said:
I think I did. But I will try again.

“Now, I am virtually certain that Willie Clay’s Big Play is Roethlisbergering us.”

Assuming not, the explanation is that there is a SOSH tradition of referring to Ben Roethlisberger or posting his picture when someone misses the joke. As in:

WCBP: Here is this thing from twitter that suggests the Patriots are clueless and will have no answer for the Chiefs by a guy who must not be too smart.

Gullible SOSH: Schofield is a member here, he is pretty football savvy, and that isn’t what the tweet means.

WCBP: Inserts picture of Ben Roethlisburger to mean “that is the joke.”

At least that is what I thought you might be doing but now think it is all a big coincidence and, I hope you would admit, kind of funny.

And to anticipate a question, I have no idea how Ben Roethlisberger became a synonym for “that’s the joke” on SOSH. In thinking about it more, I regret my use of the word “Roethlisbergering” in a vague context given that Ben may very well be a rapist and so it now occurs to me I risked being misunderstood.
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Roethlisbergering a joke comes from a non-SOSH twitter feed from a few years back that fabricated weekly trash talk Facebook threads among all the NFL QBs, each of whom had a particular schtick. Big Ben’s schtick was to explain a painfully obvious joke that everyone obviously already got.

Here’s an example:
https://www.totalprosports.com/2013/12/31/nfl-quarterbacks-conversation-on-facebook-regular-season-round-up/
 
johnmd20

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DJnVa

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On field only--adding to the fact that Hoyer isn't Cam, this happened so late in the week that the game plan is either going to be really, really basic or Hoyer will set a career high in rushing yards.
 
nighthob

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DJnVa said:
On field only--adding to the fact that Hoyer isn't Cam, this happened so late in the week that the game plan is either going to be really, really basic or Hoyer will set a career high in rushing yards.
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Sooooooo... Seven years rushing?
 
RedOctober3829

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With Hoyer in tonight, I'd expect KC to play as many players as possible in the box and make Hoyer beat them with his arm. It would be very advantageous for Hoyer to come out of the gate with some success to loosen up the KC defense. With Spags, I also expect him to throw a bunch of different blitz packages at Hoyer to see if he can handle it. As I said in the game thread, this is as big of a reverse lock game as there ever will be. This game is all on the defense to keep it close.
 
TSC

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SoSH's Doug Neidermeyer
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What a massive disappointment that Stidham isn't playing this game.

If there was ever an opportunity to see if he has "it," this is it. Even WITH Newton the Pats were big underdogs. Throwing Hoyer out there is practically conceeded the game.
 
Royal Reader

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TSC said:
What a massive disappointment that Stidham isn't playing this game.

If there was ever an opportunity to see if he has "it," this is it. Even WITH Newton the Pats were big underdogs. Throwing Hoyer out there is practically conceeded the game.
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Seems an odd reaction. If there is one thing I think we can count on Bill Belichick to do, it is to pick the players most likely to win the specific game of football. It's a pretty bad sign in terms of Stidham's development that BB still trusts Hoyer more, but what can you do? We never had any evidence that Stidham was good enough to start in the league beyond a few media reports that the Pats liked him and some relatively promising preseason showings from last year. Feels like the median projection for Stidham's career right now has to be considerably worse than the career Hoyer has had.
 
TSC

TSC

SoSH's Doug Neidermeyer
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Royal Reader said:
Seems an odd reaction. If there is one thing I think we can count on Bill Belichick to do, it is to pick the players most likely to win the specific game of football. It's a pretty bad sign in terms of Stidham's development that BB still trusts Hoyer more, but what can you do? We never had any evidence that Stidham was good enough to start in the league beyond a few media reports that the Pats liked him and some relatively promising preseason showings from last year. Feels like the median projection for Stidham's career right now has to be considerably worse than the career Hoyer has had.
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My disappointment is less with Belichick and more with Stidham, I guess.
 
Royal Reader

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TSC said:
My disappointment is less with Belichick and more with Stidham, I guess.
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Yeah, that's fair. I'm listening to Tom Curran's Patriots talk pod at the moment. Perry's take seems to be that with Hoyer having taken the backup reps until Cam went out, it doesn't make sense to throw Stidham in, but they might have a more open competition between the two for Denver. We'll see. Certainly, I'm pessimistic about Jarrett until something on an actual field shows otherwise. Feels a bit like the Ryan Mallett discussions we used to have.
 
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