The Lakers Reality Show

bosockboy

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There’s one face saving move available. Turn the whole franchise over to Riley.
Credibility, history with LBJ, and massive PR value. Let him hand pick his coach.
 

Kliq

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There’s one face saving move available. Turn the whole franchise over to Riley.
Credibility, history with LBJ, and massive PR value. Let him hand pick his coach.
Eh, I feel like this is part of the problem. The Lakers are banking on some legend from the past to swoop in and save the day for them because they are the Lakers, dammit. Is there any recent evidence to suggest Riley is even a good team-builder anymore? He's capped Miami out with okay players and missed the playoffs in a weak conference; has he done anything really good since LeBron decided to go to South Beach?
 

bankshot1

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Should the Lakers trade LeBron and rebuild?

If KI bolts Boston, could the Montagues and Capulets find common ground and do a deal?

If the Celts have the best assets for AD, they probably have the best assets for LeBron.

Or is this heresy?
 

nighthob

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There’s one face saving move available. Turn the whole franchise over to Riley Pitino. Credibility, history with LBJ, and massive PR value. Massive entertainment value. Let him hand pick his coach.
Fixed that for you.
 

DisgruntledSoxFan77

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Should the Lakers trade LeBron and rebuild?

If KI bolts Boston, could the Montagues and Capulets find common ground and do a deal?

If the Celts have the best assets for AD, they probably have the best assets for LeBron.

Or is this heresy?
3 team trade where the Celtics get LeBron and LA gets Davis, perhaps?
 

bankshot1

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3 team trade where the Celtics get LeBron and LA gets Davis, perhaps?
I was thinking of a direct Celt-Laker deal, and if then LA wanted to deal with NO, they could.

The thought (and admittedly its a long shot) was is AD as potentially a 1 year rental (he's a FA in '20) as attractive as LeBron for his last 3 years. And I assume the cost in terms of players and draft picks might be similiar.

I assumed something like Tatum, Gordo, (it passed the Trade Machine) and 3 1s (including the Memphis pick) for the Lakers.
 

DisgruntledSoxFan77

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I was thinking of a direct Celt-Laker deal, and if then LA wanted to deal with NO, they could.

The thought (and admittedly its a long shot) was is AD as potentially a 1 year rental (he's a FA in '20) as attractive as LeBron for his last 3 years. And I assume the cost in terms of players and draft picks might be similiar.

I assumed something like Tatum, Gordo, (it passed the Trade Machine) and 3 1s (including the Memphis pick) for the Lakers.
I would be against Tatum for LeBron just because of age. I would prefer to trade Jaylen because he has one fewer year of control
 

soxhop411

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According to Vincent Goodwill of Yahoo Sports, Rambis was once again a point of contention, this time with Tyronn Lue, who chose to remain unemployed rather than employ the former Lakers and Knicks assistant coach:
And what’s worse, asking Lue to take on Rambis as an assistant, a no-no according to sources close to Lue, feels like the Lakers want their walls bugged and feared a LeBron takeover — as if Lue would allow himself to be used as a puppet.
Lololololokoool. The Rambis family tried to force Kurt Rambis on Lue.
https://www.silverscreenandroll.com/2019/5/9/18563878/lakers-rumors-kurt-rambis-linda-tyronn-lue-jeanie-buss-rob-pelinka-luke-walton-coach
 

Marciano490

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How does the Rambis family have an ownership stake? Did he buy in after playing or his family independently wealthy?
 

maufman

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I would be against Tatum for LeBron just because of age. I would prefer to trade Jaylen because he has one fewer year of control
We would all prefer to trade Jaylen and keep Tatum, but the rest of the league isn’t dumb. They know Jaylen will never be more than a good complementary player, and that he’s going to get paid next summer. In the unlikely event the Lakers decide to move LeBron, they will have better offers than Jaylen + picks.

Tatum + picks might be a different story, especially if the Knicks’ pick isn’t top-3.
 

E5 Yaz

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This is probably fodder for it's own thread by now, but why would this current version of the Celtics want LeBron? His need-desire-demand to have nearly every offensive set run through him seems counter to the style of play Stevens employs?
 
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RetractableRoof

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This is probably fodder for it's own thread by now, but why would this current version of the Celtics want LeBron? His need-desire-demand to have nearly every offensive set run through him seems counter to the type of style of play Stevens employs?
+1
 

bankshot1

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Approaching this from a Devil Advocate POV, (but also having several reservations-but having some fun with it as a Celts-Lakers mega-trade seems highly improbable), and with also having an affinity for a mostly home-grown approach to team-building, IMO the "current version" of the Celtics seems somewhat up in the air.
KI seems half-way out the door, Gordo looks broken, AD could be a 1-year rental and cost a big chunk of our tradeble assets, while LeBron might, on the right team, with the right mix of players, (Horford, Jaylen, Smart, some guy who can hit a 3) still be a formidable player, who could end his career as a mentor/force/still top-5 player, with a title or two to burnish his resume and claim to GOAT.

And as a trade versus FA, this would allow Ainge leeway to perform some roster alchemy.

And LBJ experienced a shit-show in LA and has spoken highly of Coach Brad.
 
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Sep 10, 2017
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This is probably fodder for it's own thread by now, but why would this current version of the Celtics want LeBron? His need-desire-demand to have nearly every offensive set run through him seems counter to the style of play Stevens employs?
Nevermind that he is turning 35 this coming season having played his first NBA game in 2003. James also works out like a freak (albeit just based on his social media videos which may or may not be real life). You have to think the wear and tear catches up sooner rather than later. Maybe not a flipped switch, but within a year or two we may suddenly start to realize, "wait, LeBron isn't a top 5-10 player anymore?"
 

NYCSox

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Nevermind that he is turning 35 this coming season having played his first NBA game in 2003. James also works out like a freak (albeit just based on his social media videos which may or may not be real life). You have to think the wear and tear catches up sooner rather than later. Maybe not a flipped switch, but within a year or two we may suddenly start to realize, "wait, LeBron isn't a top 5-10 player anymore?"
Yup. And a declining LeBron will likely be even more insufferable than the current version. Hard pass.
 

shawnrbu

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Former assistant under Jimmy O’Brien, the forefather of today’s NBA. Vogel must have made a good impression on LeBron when he coached him at the 2014 All Star Game.
 

DeJesus Built My Hotrod

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How Jason Kidd, a serial domestic abuser, keeps getting jobs is beyond me. And he is now working for a female boss too.
 

lovegtm

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Imagine after all of this laughing and roasting, the Lakers roll out LeBron, Davis and Kyrie next year?
I mean, that would definitely turn the tables on the laughter. But what are they trading for AD? Ingram and Ball's value is significantly lower than it was even at the deadline.
 

nighthob

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I mean, that would definitely turn the tables on the laughter. But what are they trading for AD? Ingram and Ball's value is significantly lower than it was even at the deadline.
Yeah, unless the Lakers fuck us by landing a top 2 pick (well, unless Memphis lands #4 in that scenario) there’s no way they have the assets to trade for Davis.
 

Big John

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When Pitino hired former Kentucky student manager Frank Vogel as his video coordinator, who would have known that Frank was on a path to greatness?
 
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DeJesus Built My Hotrod

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I swear, reading page three (as IF points out), you would have thought the Celtics were essentially screwed for the next few years.

Also, I don't understand how anyone can think that Davis wants to stick around in New Orleans, even with Williamson. Zion may well be decent in his rookie year but the odds don't favor it or at least not enough to move the needle to contender. Meanwhile, Davis would be languishing for yet another year with no shot to contend.

I agree with the others that this broke really well for Boston. Griffin has every incentive to add other young pieces around Williamson and build from there. If he goes the Boston route, he gets Tatum plus the Memphis pick. The risk is that he somehow values whatever the Knicks or Lakers throw at him more.

But if he has a chance to get Tatum plus another valuable pick versus some combo of Frankie Ntilikina, Knox, DSJ or Ball, Kuzma and Ingram, I suspect the Boston package still wins. Tatum is a better player than any of those guys and has some star power to sell to the local fanbase. The other guys are potentially decent players but their star potential is fairly low.

As a side note, I disagree that New Orleans is a bad place for Williamson. Griffin is a smart basketball guy and will build around him. Meanwhile the fans have to be feeling psyched even with Davis likely gone. They have an exciting future now and a potential contender in the next three to five years.
 

nighthob

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if they trade for Beal or sign a comparable max guy in free agency (harris, butler, kemba) and then fill out the roster with 1 year contracts they're not going anywhere in the west next year, then it's hoping that in 2 years Lebron is still Lebron, that's a big gamble to take if they have the chance instead to add 2 max guys this summer
If Donovan Mitchell can lead the Jazz to the playoffs, then I think that James and Beal can manage the trick in LA.

I agree with the others that this broke really well for Boston. Griffin has every incentive to add other young pieces around Williamson and build from there. If he goes the Boston route, he gets Tatum plus the Memphis pick. The risk is that he somehow values whatever the Knicks or Lakers throw at him more.

But if he has a chance to get Tatum plus another valuable pick versus some combo of Frankie Ntilikina, Knox, DSJ or Ball, Kuzma and Ingram, I suspect the Boston package still wins. Tatum is a better player than any of those guys and has some star power to sell to the local fanbase. The other guys are potentially decent players but their star potential is fairly low.
Tatum might be better than any one of Knox, Smith, or Barrett. But all three? With Mitch Robinson and draft picks to toss in if they need further sweeteners? New York’s godfather offer is going to be tough to beat.
 

Captaincoop

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The #3 or #4 pick has real value that I think we're understating here.

That pick in either the LA or NY package is going to be the best single asset available from New Orleans' perspective.

Tatum + the Memphis pick + the Sac pick + Smart is a really nice group of assets, but if I'm the Pelicans, #3 plus Knox and Mitchell Robinson plus Dennis Smith is very competitive with that, if not better. Same for #4, Kuzma, and whatever LA can add.

I know that sitting here in May, people are calling this a 2 man draft, but remember - that is never actually the case. You would have to go back at least a decade to find a draft where no Jayson Tatum caliber player is available after #3 - frankly, I can't find a single draft like that, and I stopped looking at 2009.

Sure, teams miss on picks every year, but by draft day, there will be a guy at #3 or #4 that New Orleans loves, and there will 100% be someone available at that point in the draft who will be as good or better than Tatum and will be cheap and under team control for two more years. It doesn't matter if NO is right about who that guy is - just that they believe they are.
 

Eddie Jurak

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The #3 or #4 pick has real value that I think we're understating here.

That pick in either the LA or NY package is going to be the best single asset available from New Orleans' perspective.

Tatum + the Memphis pick + the Sac pick + Smart is a really nice group of assets, but if I'm the Pelicans, #3 plus Knox and Mitchell Robinson plus Dennis Smith is very competitive with that, if not better. Same for #4, Kuzma, and whatever LA can add.
I think your larger point is correct, but I'm not sure why you think Kuzma is such as asset. Isn't he just a one-way, relatively inefficient, volume scorer?
 

wade boggs chicken dinner

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The #3 or #4 pick has real value that I think we're understating here.

That pick in either the LA or NY package is going to be the best single asset available from New Orleans' perspective.

Tatum + the Memphis pick + the Sac pick + Smart is a really nice group of assets, but if I'm the Pelicans, #3 plus Knox and Mitchell Robinson plus Dennis Smith is very competitive with that, if not better. Same for #4, Kuzma, and whatever LA can add.

I know that sitting here in May, people are calling this a 2 man draft, but remember - that is never actually the case. You would have to go back at least a decade to find a draft where no Jayson Tatum caliber player is available after #3 - frankly, I can't find a single draft like that, and I stopped looking at 2009.

Sure, teams miss on picks every year, but by draft day, there will be a guy at #3 or #4 that New Orleans loves, and there will 100% be someone available at that point in the draft who will be as good or better than Tatum and will be cheap and under team control for two more years. It doesn't matter if NO is right about who that guy is - just that they believe they are.
While you are correct is that there are always players that develop into stars after the #1 and #2 pick, the issue is picking them. No one was picking Giannis at #3.

Here is a list of #3 draft picks: http://bkref.com/tiny/RS1J5. If you sort by WS/48, JT is 28th out of 72, and we all agree that it is likely that JT is going to get better. JT is a really good result for a #3 pick, particularly when there isn't a no-brainer pick like McHale or Jordan, Cousy, or Horford available.

Particularly in this day and age when teams are likely drafting 19 year olds at #3, there's a really good chance of picking someone worse than JT at #3, and I think lots of GM would rather have JT for the next 6 years (rest of his contract plus extension) than roll the die on a player, especially in what most consider to be a weaker draft.
 

amarshal2

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I think your larger point is correct, but I'm not sure why you think Kuzma is such as asset. Isn't he just a one-way, relatively inefficient, volume scorer?
You couldn’t be bothered to look up his stats before posting?

He’s a poor 3pt shooter but he’s averaged .533 from 2 his first two years. That’s better than D-Wade from an efficiency standpoint.

There’s plenty of reasons to discount the comparison I just made (lack of any other plus skills) but like Malcolm Brogdon, he’s underrated around here.
 

Devizier

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You couldn’t be bothered to look up his stats before posting?
His oRTG (accounting for shooting efficiency, turnovers, offensive rebounding) was 105 against a league average of 110. It should be noted that Tatum was 107 last season (he was at 111 last year).

Both of those pass the eye test to me. The big difference is that anyone holding Tatum would/should expect more improvement given the ~3 year age difference.
 

mcpickl

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I think Beal is also very underrated on this board. The fact that he’s mentioned with Kemba and Tobias Harris as comparables is where I’m going with this. He’s a legit 5-tool stud in this league.
Is one of the 5 tools defense? Because Beal doesn't play it.