The College Football Playoff

SemperFidelisSox · Dec 4, 2022

Conference championship games are pointless in the playoff era. Ohio St benefited from sitting at home.

Awesome Fossum · Dec 4, 2022

Clearly we need third place conference games like at the World Cup. Then we'll know if Ohio State could have beaten Illinois.

Ale Xander · Dec 4, 2022

This is complete bullshit for Georgia
They should be playing TCU

Ale Xander · Dec 4, 2022

SemperFidelisSox said:
Conference championship games are pointless in the playoff era. Ohio St benefited from sitting at home.

Worse than pointless

pointless would be if they didn’t matter

this is worse

Awesome Fossum · Dec 4, 2022

idk, I don't really feel like Georgia "deserves" anything more than Michigan. They both went undefeated. This isn't the NFL; they didn't earn the right to play the weaker opponent on the field or anything.

Ferm Sheller · Dec 4, 2022

Putting the issue of "fairness" aside, am I the only one who thinks a Michigan v OSU rematch would have been more compelling? I mean, those two teams are bitter rivals -- what could be more exciting than to ensure that they match up in the playoffs?

EvilEmpire · Dec 4, 2022

Ferm Sheller said:
Putting the issue of "fairness" aside, am I the only one who thinks a Michigan v OSU rematch would have been more compelling? I mean, those two teams are bitter rivals -- what could be more exciting than to ensure that they match up in the playoffs?

Well, it will be much, much better if they can meet in the final.

Ferm Sheller · Dec 4, 2022

EvilEmpire said:
Well, it will be much, much better if they can meet in the final.

Understood, but that's far from a sure bet.

Ale Xander · Dec 4, 2022

Really really hoping for a TCU Georgia Championship.

54thMA · Dec 4, 2022

When did TCU change their name?

Bullfrogs?

And yes, conference championship games are pointless, USC got hosed, tOSU benefits.

54thMA · Dec 4, 2022

JFK35 said:
Screwed up on the name …

But USC didn’t get hosed. They had 1 loss before this weekend. As did Ohio State. Ohio State lost to a much better team. USC got a chance to earn their way in and didn’t take it.

They lost largely thanks to their QB getting injured and playing on one leg, they were up 17-3 before he got hurt. Granted their defense was terrible as well, but him getting hurt was a big blow to their chances to win the game.

kenneycb · Dec 4, 2022

What about the first time they lost to Utah?

Sad Sam Jones · Dec 4, 2022

USC lost because their defense wouldn't be able to stop a junior high team and there's no justification for allowing them to play for a championship without also allowing the 3-loss team that beat them twice the same opportunity.

Ohio State is in because their only loss was against a much better opponent than any other 1 or 2 loss team had. They played their conference championship game two weeks ago. Anyone who thinks they shouldn't be in because they didn't get to beat up on Purdue last night just wanted to see them get screwed over for playing in the B1G 10 East. As much as I hate Michigan, I'd make the same argument for them if the roles were reversed.

The Social Chair · Dec 4, 2022

The USC defense was horrible all year but it didn't matter because their offense was unstoppable. After the Williams injury and subsequent loss they didn't deserve to be in the top 4.

They probably would have made the playoffs if they threw the title game by sitting their starters out. There was no incentive to win that game.

kenneycb said:
What about the first time they lost to Utah?

2 outrageous roughing the passer penalties handed Utah 14 points in a game that was decided by 1 point.

View: https://mobile.twitter.com/TrevorMBooth/status/1581446132378390529

Ale Xander · Dec 4, 2022

Sad Sam Jones said:
USC lost because their defense wouldn't be able to stop a junior high team and there's no justification for allowing them to play for a championship without also allowing the 3-loss team that beat them twice the same opportunity.

Ohio State is in because their only loss was against a much better opponent than any other 1 or 2 loss team had. They played their conference championship game two weeks ago. Anyone who thinks they shouldn't be in because they didn't get to beat up on Purdue last night just wanted to see them get screwed over for playing in the B1G 10 East. As much as I hate Michigan, I'd make the same argument for them if the roles were reversed.

Did they beat any good teams besides Penn State?

JMDurron · Dec 4, 2022

Georgia is playing their game in Atlanta. Let’s not weep for them just yet.

SoxJox · Dec 4, 2022

Ale Xander said:
This is complete bullshit for Georgia
They should be playing TCU

I never get sentiments like this. In the end, if UGA is the top dog, they demonstrate that regardless who they play.

Awesome Fossum · Dec 4, 2022

Georgia is obviously better than Michigan, therefore it's unfair that they have to play a team Michigan just beat by 22 on the road?

Awesome Fossum · Dec 4, 2022

Applying the 2024 format:

#1 UGA vs winner of #9 KSU at #6 Tennessee
#8 Utah vs winner of #16 Tulane at #3 TCU

#7 Clemson vs winner of #11 PSU at #4 Ohio State
#2 UM vs winner of #10 USC at #5 Alabama

I guess the arguments here would be who deserves the bye (Utah or KSU) and who deserves the final at large spot (PSU or Washington).

snowmanny · Dec 4, 2022

JFK35 said:
That’s not the point. They demonstrated in the regular season they were the best in the nation - they should get rewarded for that. Michigan gets a bye into the title game while Georgia has to go toe to toe with a soft but very talented Ohio State team. And yes it’s in Atlanta and yes Georgia will win but it’ll take a toll that playing TCU wouldn’t

That's not the point. TCU had one loss in their conference championship game and Ohio State lost at home to not make their conference championship. Why should an Ohio State university leapfrog a team with the same record when they didn't play?

I notice that so far nobody has said it is unfair to Ohio State. Is it "bullshit" they have to play Georgia instead of Michigan?

I mean it's arguing about nothing.

edit - also it is all USC's fault

Ale Xander · Dec 4, 2022

Awesome Fossum said:
Georgia is obviously better than Michigan, therefore it's unfair that they have to play a team Michigan just beat by 22 on the road?

Les temps des ordures (le fin de match) faire plus du travail ici.

snowmanny · Dec 4, 2022

Awesome Fossum said:
Applying the 2024 format:

#1 UGA vs winner of #9 KSU at #6 Tennessee
#8 Utah vs winner of #16 Tulane at #3 TCU

#7 Clemson vs winner of #11 PSU at #4 Ohio State
#2 UM vs winner of #10 USC at #5 Alabama

I guess the arguments here would be who deserves the bye (Utah or KSU) and who deserves the final at large spot (PSU or Washington).

Wait - the 7&8 seeds get a bye?

B H Kim · Dec 4, 2022

snowmanny said:
Wait - the 7&8 seeds get a bye?

Top four conference champs get the byes.

Bob Montgomerys Helmet Hat · Dec 4, 2022

snowmanny said:
Wait - the 7&8 seeds get a bye?

Yeah, that can't be right

EDIT--ah, that is right

Awesome Fossum · Dec 4, 2022

Yes, only conference champs get byes.

snowmanny · Dec 4, 2022

Awesome Fossum · Dec 4, 2022

Ale Xander said:
Les temps des ordures (le fin de match) faire plus du travail ici.

The fact that there even was garbage time says it all.

Michigan has already beaten Ohio State. If UGA is so obviously superior to Michigan, they can beat Ohio State too.

Ale Xander · Dec 4, 2022

Awesome Fossum said:
The fact that there even was garbage time says it all.

Michigan has already beaten Ohio State. If UGA is so obviously superior to Michigan, they can beat Ohio State too.

If you're going to use the transitive property, then Tulane deserves to be in.

Awesome Fossum · Dec 4, 2022

You won't get any arguments from me there.

snowmanny · Dec 4, 2022

Ale Xander said:
If you're going to use the transitive property, then Tulane deserves to be in.

The only teams that deserve to be in are Michigan and Georgia. It's a flawed format. Perhaps you never noticed that before and thus the outrage?

Ale Xander · Dec 4, 2022

snowmanny said:
The only teams that deserve to be in are Michigan and Georgia. It's a flawed format. Perhaps you never noticed that before and thus the outrage?

I have. I outrage often.

Sad Sam Jones · Dec 4, 2022

Ale Xander said:
Did they beat any good teams besides Penn State?

Why would they even need a "besides Penn State"? That's a much bigger accomplishment on their resume than anything USC or Alabama has. Penn State is #9. USC beat #17 Oregon State by a field goal. Alabama beat #21 Texas by 1 point after they knocked the Longhorns' starting QB out of the game. Ohio State's 2nd highest ranked opponent they beat was #19 Notre Dame... by the same margin as USC (and again, better than anything Alabama can claim).

It doesn't matter if you want to look at losses or best wins, Ohio State is clearly ahead of those two.

BaseballJones · Dec 4, 2022

Awesome Fossum said:
Applying the 2024 format:

#1 UGA vs winner of #9 KSU at #6 Tennessee
#8 Utah vs winner of #16 Tulane at #3 TCU

#7 Clemson vs winner of #11 PSU at #4 Ohio State
#2 UM vs winner of #10 USC at #5 Alabama

I guess the arguments here would be who deserves the bye (Utah or KSU) and who deserves the final at large spot (PSU or Washington).

That makes no sense to me. Why would #8 Utah get a bye while #3 TCU doesn't? Why would #7 Clemson get a bye while #4 OSU doesn't? Conference champs?

EDIT: Sorry, answered already. But that still doesn't make sense. Bizarre to have a #8 seeded team get a bye instead of the #3 seeded team. Just seed Utah #3 or whatever.

Awesome Fossum · Dec 4, 2022

I'm just using this year's CFP rankings. I'm sure they'll give Utah the "4 seed" so the bracket makes sense visually.

Awesome Fossum · Dec 4, 2022

I'm also pretty sure that just as we've seen the committee avoid a UM/OSU rematch this year, they'd massage things so that we wouldn't get a OSU/PSU rematch in the first round. Probably by ranking OSU ahead of TCU!

SoxJox · Dec 4, 2022

JFK35 said:
That’s not the point. They demonstrated in the regular season they were the best in the nation - they should get rewarded for that. Michigan gets a bye into the title game while Georgia has to go toe to toe with a soft but very talented Ohio State team. And yes it’s in Atlanta and yes Georgia will win but it’ll take a toll that playing TCU wouldn’t

I'm sorry. That IS the point. The teams will put up or shut up. Give it a break. Do we really want to split hairs about the microscopic differences at this point? First, we all argue about the top 4. Then we argue about pairing of the top 4. Jeeeeeezzzzzeeeeez.

Argumento indefincemo.

Average Reds · Dec 4, 2022

Awesome Fossum said:
I'm also pretty sure that just as we've seen the committee avoid a UM/OSU rematch this year, they'd massage things so that we wouldn't get a OSU/PSU rematch in the first round. Probably by ranking OSU ahead of TCU!

It’s worth noting that they did the same sort of manipulation of seedings last year.

Going into conference championships, Georgia was 1, Michigan was 2 and Alabama was 3.

Georgia lost to Alabama and Michigan crushed Iowa. Logically, that would have dictated Michigan as 1, Alabama as 2 and Georgia as 3. But - as they stated at the time - the committee pushed Alabama ahead of Michigan to avoid having the two SEC teams meeting in the first round.

Getting Georgia instead of Cincinnati hurt Michigan last year. Playing TCU instead of OSU (probably) helps them this year. No idea if their approach is correct, but it’s consistent.

Ale Xander · Dec 4, 2022

Average Reds said:
It’s worth noting that they did the same sort of manipulation of seedings last year.

Going into conference championships, Georgia was 1, Michigan was 2 and Alabama was 3.

Georgia lost to Alabama and Michigan crushed Iowa. Logically, that would have dictated Michigan as 1, Alabama as 2 and Georgia as 3. But - as they stated at the time - the committee pushed Alabama ahead of Michigan to avoid having the two SEC teams meeting in the first round.

Getting Georgia instead of Cincinnati hurt Michigan last year. Playing TCU instead of OSU (probably) helps them this year. No idea if their approach is correct, but it’s consistent.

Even accepting the implied assumption that the B1G is on the same level as the SEC over the recent past, the drop down from 2 to 3 is much greater this year than last.

nolasoxfan · Dec 4, 2022

Ale Xander said:
If you're going to use the transitive property, then Tulane deserves to be in.

Now we're talkin'!

Average Reds · Dec 4, 2022

Ale Xander said:
Even accepting the implied assumption that the B1G is on the same level as the SEC over the recent past, the drop down from 2 to 3 is much greater this year than last.

I wasn’t implying any such thing. Simply stating what the committee does and why, which has nothing to do with implied assumption of conference quality.

Awesome Fossum · Dec 4, 2022

edit: nvm

nolasoxfan · Dec 4, 2022

BaseballJones said:
That makes no sense to me. Why would #8 Utah get a bye while #3 TCU doesn't? Why would #7 Clemson get a bye while #4 OSU doesn't? Conference champs?

EDIT: Sorry, answered already. But that still doesn't make sense. Bizarre to have a #8 seeded team get a bye instead of the #3 seeded team. Just seed Utah #3 or whatever.

~~To make sure conference championships are somewhat relevant~~.
N/m. You answered your own question .

BaseballJones · Dec 4, 2022

nolasoxfan said:
~~To make sure conference championships are somewhat relevant~~.
N/m. You answered your own question .

To me they're still relevant by the fact that they still get into the playoff. I mean, if you're an 8-4 team that manages to win their conference championship, they make it into the playoff, even though they really aren't that good. It's like in the NCAA basketball tournament, conference championships matter a ton for mid-major conferences, because not winning the conference means you likely don't even make the NCAA tourney. Besides, winning your conference is a heck of an accomplishment on its own.

Ale Xander · Dec 4, 2022

FBS Playoff should really be this:

#4 SEC plays #5 SEC (So perhaps Ole Miss v. LSU?)

Winner plays Georgia
#2 SEC (Alabama) plays #3 SEC (Tennessee)
Two winners play each other for the title.

CFB_Rules · Dec 4, 2022

BaseballJones said:
That makes no sense to me. Why would #8 Utah get a bye while #3 TCU doesn't? Why would #7 Clemson get a bye while #4 OSU doesn't? Conference champs?

EDIT: Sorry, answered already. But that still doesn't make sense. Bizarre to have a #8 seeded team get a bye instead of the #3 seeded team. Just seed Utah #3 or whatever.

Yeah guys, the top 4 conference champs get byes because they are automatically seeded 1-4. So now the conference champ games matter again.

So it would be (numbers are seeds, not ranking):

#4 Utah awaits the winner of #12 Tulane @ #5 TCU
#3 Clemson awaits the winner of #11 Penn State @ #6 Ohio State
#2 Michigan awaits the winner of #10 USC @ #7 Alabama
#1 Georgia awaits the winner of #9 Kansas State @ #8 Tennessee

EDIT: Looking at the above, conversations in later years are going to be heavy on which conference champion is ranked 4th highest vs 5th highest. KSU being one spot behind Utah drops them from getting a bye to going on the road to Tennessee.

The College Football Playoff

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