The Celtics Offseason

GB5

New Member
Aug 26, 2013
675
going back to the Pels, if you really want to swing for the fences, and assume the following two things:

1. JB has to be the one to go, and
2. The Pels are entirely sick of the Zion nonsense,

is there a deal there to be made? I assume most on here would say no because Zion seems to have no interest in getting in shape and having an NBA career, but the talent level is something to dream upon, and yes the busT level is high.
It’s the type of deal that GM’s lose their jobs over.

I don’t think there is any way the Pels trade him. Even though he has been eating at the same buffet as Pablo Sandoval, he is the face of their franchise. I don’t think they can cut bait on him before he gives them something. But who knows what is going on internally with him and the club,

If I were the Celts, I would at least make the call. Jaylen would likely be pissed about being sent there..
 

lovegtm

Member
SoSH Member
Apr 30, 2013
11,996
Jaylen to the Knicks for Brunson+? Jaylen gets a big market that can feel confident re-signing him; the Celtics get a young primary creator on a great contract, and the flexibility to re-arrange the roster to turn some guards into wings.
 

BigSoxFan

Member
SoSH Member
May 31, 2007
47,085
Jaylen to the Knicks for Brunson+? Jaylen gets a big market that can feel confident re-signing him; the Celtics get a young primary creator on a great contract, and the flexibility to re-arrange the roster to turn some guards into wings.
Not sure Knicks do that but a reasonable idea. I don’t love exchanging Jaylen for a small scoring PG though.
 

Pablo's TB Lover

Member
SoSH Member
Sep 10, 2017
5,959
Not sure Knicks do that but a reasonable idea. I don’t love exchanging Jaylen for a small scoring PG though.
Agreed, wings are king in today's NBA. In order to play small ball, you do need guards that can reasonably guard a forward, forwards that can reasonably guard a center, etc. If I'm taking back a 6'2" or below player, I need a pretty big sweetener back from the other team as well.
 

CaptainLaddie

dj paul pfieffer
SoSH Member
Sep 6, 2004
36,684
where the darn libs live
Jaylen to the Knicks for Brunson+? Jaylen gets a big market that can feel confident re-signing him; the Celtics get a young primary creator on a great contract, and the flexibility to re-arrange the roster to turn some guards into wings.
No way. Brunson is fucking beloved in NY right now. He's probably the most universally loved player since... what, Melo? Ewing?

He's on a team friendly contract and his own father is on the coaching staff.

0.0005% chance the Knicks move Brunson.
 

Auger34

used to be tbb
SoSH Member
Apr 23, 2010
9,271
No way. Brunson is fucking beloved in NY right now. He's probably the most universally loved player since... what, Melo? Ewing?

He's on a team friendly contract and his own father is on the coaching staff.

0.0005% chance the Knicks move Brunson.
I think both teams say no to that trade.
 

NomarsFool

Member
SoSH Member
Dec 21, 2001
8,157
going back to the Pels, if you really want to swing for the fences, and assume the following two things:

1. JB has to be the one to go, and
2. The Pels are entirely sick of the Zion nonsense,

is there a deal there to be made? I assume most on here would say no because Zion seems to have no interest in getting in shape and having an NBA career, but the talent level is something to dream upon, and yes the busT level is high.
It’s the type of deal that GM’s lose their jobs over.

I don’t think there is any way the Pels trade him. Even though he has been eating at the same buffet as Pablo Sandoval, he is the face of their franchise. I don’t think they can cut bait on him before he gives them something. But who knows what is going on internally with him and the club,

If I were the Celts, I would at least make the call. Jaylen would likely be pissed about being sent there..
That's interesting. The Pels would likely need a haul to be able to sell that to their fans. So, we're talking Brown plus another player not named PP, and then some amount of FRPs. I wonder if Brown and Rob Williams (we're just swapping Williamson for Williams) and picks would get it done? Still seems unlikely, and I think it's actually a risky trade for Boston - but certainly an interesting one.
 

Average Game James

Member
SoSH Member
Apr 28, 2016
4,346
That's interesting. The Pels would likely need a haul to be able to sell that to their fans. So, we're talking Brown plus another player not named PP, and then some amount of FRPs. I wonder if Brown and Rob Williams (we're just swapping Williamson for Williams) and picks would get it done? Still seems unlikely, and I think it's actually a risky trade for Boston - but certainly an interesting one.
I think it's pretty hard to trade Jaylen plus a starter on a good contract plus multiple first round picks for a guy that has played 114 games in 3 years, but if the Celtics were comfortable enough with the medicals to pull the trigger the upside is pretty massive and they'd be getting Zion for $39 million/year instead of Jaylen for $59 million/year.
 

NomarsFool

Member
SoSH Member
Dec 21, 2001
8,157
I think it's pretty hard to trade Jaylen plus a starter on a good contract plus multiple first round picks for a guy that has played 114 games in 3 years, but if the Celtics were comfortable enough with the medicals to pull the trigger the upside is pretty massive and they'd be getting Zion for $39 million/year instead of Jaylen for $59 million/year.
If the deal is uncomfortable for both sides, it probably means it is at least somewhat feasible. NO is at least somewhat close to Atlanta, if that has any value to JB.
 

lovegtm

Member
SoSH Member
Apr 30, 2013
11,996
Not sure Knicks do that but a reasonable idea. I don’t love exchanging Jaylen for a small scoring PG though.
Yeah, fair. The thing I've been trying to solve for is exchanging Jaylen for a better primary offensive player, while also keeping the contract size in the 25% cap and under range. If you can do those two things, there are a LOT of good ways to fill out the rest of the roster around Tatum.
 

bosockboy

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 15, 2005
19,862
St. Louis, MO
That's interesting. The Pels would likely need a haul to be able to sell that to their fans. So, we're talking Brown plus another player not named PP, and then some amount of FRPs. I wonder if Brown and Rob Williams (we're just swapping Williamson for Williams) and picks would get it done? Still seems unlikely, and I think it's actually a risky trade for Boston - but certainly an interesting one.
Also if you believe Zion is sandbagging and not invested in New Orleans it makes a lot of sense.
 

nighthob

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 15, 2005
12,678
That's interesting. The Pels would likely need a haul to be able to sell that to their fans. So, we're talking Brown plus another player not named PP, and then some amount of FRPs. I wonder if Brown and Rob Williams (we're just swapping Williamson for Williams) and picks would get it done? Still seems unlikely, and I think it's actually a risky trade for Boston - but certainly an interesting one.
If that's the Pelicans' feeling for the NBA equivalent of the Sasquatch then they're stuck with that contract. There's no way I'd trade Brown for a guy that's a lead pipe cinch to play fewer minutes than Sam Hauser.
 

MillarTime

Member
SoSH Member
Oct 31, 2013
1,338
Jaylen to the Knicks for Brunson+? Jaylen gets a big market that can feel confident re-signing him; the Celtics get a young primary creator on a great contract, and the flexibility to re-arrange the roster to turn some guards into wings.
I would make this trade, but there is no way the Knicks are trading Brunson. In the grand scheme of things I think they are comparable players (obviously very different roles, but both are all-star caliber) but one is on an incredible contract and one will (arguably) be overpaid on his next deal. Sure, your defense suffers if you are Celts, but I think Brunson’s playmaking would go along way to solving their situational issues on offense (turn-taking between stars, getting bogged down, end of game issues, etc.). It would also take some pressure off of Tatum maybe even create easier looks for him. Plus he’s already got a proven track record in the playoffs.
 
Last edited:

Justthetippett

New Member
Aug 9, 2015
2,391
That's interesting. The Pels would likely need a haul to be able to sell that to their fans. So, we're talking Brown plus another player not named PP, and then some amount of FRPs. I wonder if Brown and Rob Williams (we're just swapping Williamson for Williams) and picks would get it done? Still seems unlikely, and I think it's actually a risky trade for Boston - but certainly an interesting one.
I wouldn't like this trade. Zion's potential is tantalizing but as others have said he's a huge injury risk and seems uninterested in mitigating that. Something Jaylen hasn't been. Including Williams and more assets makes it even worse.
 

Euclis20

Member
SoSH Member
Aug 3, 2004
8,014
Imaginationland
Beal had negative value basically the second he signed his contact, right? Adding in a mid level lottery pick isn't enough for him to net an impact player, let alone a 26 year old two way wing that just made all nba.

Edit - I'd expect Beal and the number 8 pick to net someone like Tobias Harris. They get a useful role player for a year, followed by major salary cap relief. Philly gets an oft injured all star level talent who might be a good fit with Embiid, if overpaid.
 

TripleOT

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 4, 2007
7,758
Why would they want Beal at all? He’s turning 30 and hasn’t been healthy in 4 years.
The Beal/Tatum connection. Beal is both a bucket and has the capacity to be a playmaker. If JB wants out, I’d might be convinced to take a shot with BB, even with that big contract. The number 8 pick should produce a rotation guy by his second year, if not immediatel. I’d ask for a pick swap and/or some 2nds.
 

kazuneko

Member
SoSH Member
Nov 10, 2006
2,816
Honolulu HI
I wouldn't like this trade. Zion's potential is tantalizing but as others have said he's a huge injury risk and seems uninterested in mitigating that. Something Jaylen hasn't been. Including Williams and more assets makes it even worse.
Totally. Huge injury risk is an understatement. The man has literally missed 65% of his games in his first four seasons. So yeah, for most of his career Zion has cost his team millions while producing nothing. I mean, sure, If Zion reaches his potential I guess that would be something, but I’m not sure why anyone would think that is likely to happen. Health doesn’t usually get better with age.
New Orleans would jump at the chance at trading him for JB. Can’t imagine the Cs would reciprocate their interest.

The Beal/Tatum connection. Beal is both a bucket and has the capacity to be a playmaker. If JB wants out, I’d might be convinced to take a shot with BB, even with that big contract. The number 8 pick should produce a rotation guy by his second year, if not immediatel. I’d ask for a pick swap and/or some 2nds.
I also think that number 8 pick might be a bit underrated. Isn’t this predicted to be one of the best drafts ever?
 

benhogan

Granite Truther
SoSH Member
Nov 2, 2007
20,111
Santa Monica
I'd expect Beal and the number 8 pick to net someone like Tobias Harris. They get a useful role player for a year, followed by major salary cap relief. Philly gets an oft injured all star level talent who might be a good fit with Embiid, if overpaid.
Exactly.
Beal + #8 gets you Harris & salary relief to rebuild. Not a bad fake trade

I could see Beal being better than Harden moving forward.
I'd tweak it to Beal + Gafford (Wiz need their picks to rebuild) with the 76ers having very few avenues (throw in Korkmaz/flotsam for $$$)
 

lovegtm

Member
SoSH Member
Apr 30, 2013
11,996
Exactly.
Beal + #8 gets you Harris & salary relief to rebuild. Not a bad fake trade

I could see Beal being better than Harden moving forward.
I'd tweak it to Beal + Gafford (Wiz need their picks to rebuild) with the 76ers having very few avenues (throw in Korkmaz/flotsam for $$$)
Beal pulling it together is one of Morey's only ways to salvage the Sixers. You offer him straight up for Harris, and tell Morey to figure out how to get a good return for Embiid if he doesn't want that, because that's the next step for Philly.
 

bigq

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 15, 2005
11,084
The universe will eventually succumb to heat death, but only long after our planet is consumed by our expanding sun.
Thanks for this. If the Celtics win this series I’m going to remember it as the Big Chill and the Heat succumbing to thermodynamic equilibrium.
 

benhogan

Granite Truther
SoSH Member
Nov 2, 2007
20,111
Santa Monica
Beal pulling it together is one of Morey's only ways to salvage the Sixers. You offer him straight up for Harris, and tell Morey to figure out how to get a good return for Embiid if he doesn't want that, because that's the next step for Philly.
Right, Morey's options are thin. He's done a decent job moving Simmons, drafting Maxey & adding Melton for flotsam.

I'd gamble on Philly Beal > Wizards Beal, it has to be downright deflating playing for DC
 

TomRicardo

rusty cohlebone
Lifetime Member
SoSH Member
Feb 6, 2006
20,607
Row 14
This thread has become two day old Sports Yelling.

Before you start talking about trading Brown take a long second and think what team is better off than the Celtics with Brown and Tatum in the East. Giannis and Jrue? Butler playing even less time next year and Bam? Embiid and Maxey? Brunson and Randle?

If you didn't like what you saw from the Celtics Game 1-3 in the ECF do you love Cleveland falling about against the Knicks?

Ok so even if you make an argument that like you like one of those matches, who is going to look better with Tatum that you can get with Brown over the next three years? 33 YO Lilliard? 30 YO Anthony Davis? If you say Zion, I am just going to laugh. Let's fix our inconsistency and lack of focus with a guy who no one ever knows is going to play.
 

chilidawg

Member
SoSH Member
Jan 22, 2015
5,934
Cultural hub of the universe
This thread has become two day old Sports Yelling.

Before you start talking about trading Brown take a long second and think what team is better off than the Celtics with Brown and Tatum in the East. Giannis and Jrue? Butler playing even less time next year and Bam? Embiid and Maxey? Brunson and Randle?

If you didn't like what you saw from the Celtics Game 1-3 in the ECF do you love Cleveland falling about against the Knicks?

Ok so even if you make an argument that like you like one of those matches, who is going to look better with Tatum that you can get with Brown over the next three years? 33 YO Lilliard? 30 YO Anthony Davis? If you say Zion, I am just going to laugh. Let's fix our inconsistency and lack of focus with a guy who no one ever knows is going to play.
Amen.
 

TripleOT

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 4, 2007
7,758
I too thought that the Cs trying to move on because of the first three games of the ECF was a big overreaction, but still participated in the exercise of finding a deal for JB. He might indicate that he wants to move on so he can be the man on a different franchise, and if so, discussing possible deals for him is a worthwhile discussion.
 

lovegtm

Member
SoSH Member
Apr 30, 2013
11,996
I too thought that the Cs trying to move on because of the first three games of the ECF was a big overreaction, but still participated in the exercise of finding a deal for JB. He might indicate that he wants to move on so he can be the man on a different franchise, and if so, discussing possible deals for him is a worthwhile discussion.
Yes, I think that both are true:
- they can absolutely win a title with JB
- a 35% contract for him would make team-building a lot tougher going forward
 

benhogan

Granite Truther
SoSH Member
Nov 2, 2007
20,111
Santa Monica
This thread has become two day old Sports Yelling.

Before you start talking about trading Brown take a long second and think what team is better off than the Celtics with Brown and Tatum in the East. Giannis and Jrue? Butler playing even less time next year and Bam? Embiid and Maxey? Brunson and Randle?

If you didn't like what you saw from the Celtics Game 1-3 in the ECF do you love Cleveland falling about against the Knicks?

Ok so even if you make an argument that like you like one of those matches, who is going to look better with Tatum that you can get with Brown over the next three years? 33 YO Lilliard? 30 YO Anthony Davis? If you say Zion, I am just going to laugh. Let's fix our inconsistency and lack of focus with a guy who no one ever knows is going to play.
I think most of these fake trade ideas are based on Jaylen Brown wanting to play elsewhere (ie he's pissed at Brad because of IME, the City of Boston isn't for him, etc)
or the Celtics' feel that 2nd team All-NBA is selling high prior to committing $300MM?

100% agree that KAT, Lilliard, Zion, AD are all suboptimal for numerous reasons. Much more interested in larger trades built around players like Bridges/Claxton, Bane/JJJ/Kennard, Garland/Allen/Mobley, Anunoby/Poeltl/Siakam

The Celtic's season will end over the next few days or weeks and the #1 NBA topic will be Jaylen Brown's contract & trade value. It's inevitable.

Not sure what Sports Yelling is, sounds really bad, but I don't think anyone should be ashamed of a thread that discusses the future of the Celtic's roster.
 

lovegtm

Member
SoSH Member
Apr 30, 2013
11,996
or the Celtics' feel that 2nd team All-NBA is selling high prior to committing $300MM?

100% agree that KAT, Lilliard, Zion, AD are all suboptimal for numerous reasons. Much more interested in larger trades built around players like Bridges/Claxton, Bane/JJJ/Kennard, Garland/Allen/Mobley, Anunoby/Poeltl/Siakam

The Celtic's season will end over the next few days or weeks and the #1 NBA topic will be Jaylen Brown's contract & trade value. It's inevitable.

Not sure what Sports Yelling is, sounds really bad, but I don't think anyone should be ashamed of a thread that discusses the future of the Celtic's roster.
The other question I have, after watching Tatum progressively solve Miami's defense and get comfortable picking apart all its looks, is at what point the Cs go all-in on a heliocentric Point Tatum.

You can invest in a secondary scorer to lead the bench and be the #2, but that's a $25-35M guy, not a $55-60M guy.
 

benhogan

Granite Truther
SoSH Member
Nov 2, 2007
20,111
Santa Monica
The other question I have, after watching Tatum progressively solve Miami's defense and get comfortable picking apart all its looks, is at what point the Cs go all-in on a heliocentric Point Tatum.

You can invest in a secondary scorer to lead the bench and be the #2, but that's a $25-35M guy, not a $55-60M guy.
Yep, was thinking the same... Pairing Point Tatum with some of the best spot-up 3pt shooters (3&D) could be attractive (ala Bron).

This team wins when it shoots 40% from 3
 

nighthob

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 15, 2005
12,678
or the Celtics' feel that 2nd team All-NBA is selling high prior to committing $300MM?
That has to be the part that Stevens is mulling, committing $100 million+ per year to two players in the de facto hard cap era means that you absolutely need to start hitting on rotation guys with those late first round picks. Now in another two years all the onerous secondary contracts (Brogdon, Smart, White, et al) will either be done or on their way out the door. But how do you replace those guys with 70% of the cap tied up in Brown & Tatum? So there’s something to be said for spreading Brown’s money between a couple of high level 3&D guys.
 
Last edited:

benhogan

Granite Truther
SoSH Member
Nov 2, 2007
20,111
Santa Monica
That has to be the part that Stevens is mulling, committing $100 million+ per year to two players in the de facto hard cap era means that you absolutely need to start hitting on rotation guys with those late first round picks. Now in another two years all the onerous secondary contractors (Brogdon, Smart, White, et al) will either be done or on their way out the door. But how do you replace those guys with 70% of the cap tied up in Brown & Tatum? So there’s something to be said for spreading Brown’s money between a couple of high level 3&D guys.
Feels like the new CBA was put in place so there would be only 1 Super Max per franchise. Kind of screwed the C's

Brad/Zarren are good at the roster-building game, so confident they got this, especially with Point Tatum still leaping.

Using Late Firsts, 2nds, & UDFA they need to turn Maine into a Miami Development Machine (no relation to Gloria Estefan).
Three 2-way contracts should be helpful.
 

nighthob

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 15, 2005
12,678
I’m kind of hoping that the heart issues lead to Keyontae Johnson going undrafted and ending up in Boston. Joe looks like a guy that can be a functional rotation guy (i.e. regular season) from day 1.
 

lovegtm

Member
SoSH Member
Apr 30, 2013
11,996
The hard cap means:
- no MLE
- no buyouts
- no trades taking on more money

Anything I'm missing?
Also you can't trade your first rounder 7 years out, to hamper AllThePickz star acquisitions.

I actually think that, in the Celtics particular case, these rules won't be as much of a hindrance as they would for other teams. It does make it important to re-sign Grant at a reasonable number, both for keeping a rotation player, and the salary slot.

Also obligatory: expecting a Heat blowout in Game 7; this thread is very relevant and the Cs are doomed.
 

slamminsammya

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 31, 2006
9,152
San Francisco
Also you can't trade your first rounder 7 years out, to hamper AllThePickz star acquisitions.

I actually think that, in the Celtics particular case, these rules won't be as much of a hindrance as they would for other teams. It does make it important to re-sign Grant at a reasonable number, both for keeping a rotation player, and the salary slot.

Also obligatory: expecting a Heat blowout in Game 7; this thread is very relevant and the Cs are doomed.
Yeah, I am actually not seeing this as such a restrictive thing. You still have Bird rights. Salary matching for trades is slightly more complicated but it isn't impossible. Buyout market usually makes no difference either, and I know they are bumping up the MLE but even at a 30% increase most MLE guys are JAG's.
 

lovegtm

Member
SoSH Member
Apr 30, 2013
11,996
Yeah, I am actually not seeing this as such a restrictive thing. You still have Bird rights. Salary matching for trades is slightly more complicated but it isn't impossible. Buyout market usually makes no difference either, and I know they are bumping up the MLE but even at a 30% increase most MLE guys are JAG's.
Right, the Celtics are less affected by this because:
- they already have 2 stars, meaning they only need to spend resources to fill roles
- filling roles is MUCH cheaper (in draft capital/$$) than finding stars
- they have tons of matching contracts and combinations thereof
- they own all picks and swaps except the 2028 top-1 protected

In practice, this means that the Celtics can take a lot of cracks at the Brad Special: send out salary+the coming year's pick for a key role player each year, and have swaps available to grease the skids when necessary, without triggering Stepien.

If sending out a 1st every year makes you nervous, keep in mind that Milwaukee hasn't really hit on a 1st in like a decade, and they're still good. GSW also whiffed on tons of high ones and won a title, LAL don't have any of their own 1sts on the roster, Denver's last 1st round rotation player was class of 2018 MPJ, etc.

If you have 2 core stars, all your picks, and a lot of matching salary, you can field a contender indefinitely in the post-KD-Warriors era.
 

mcpickl

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 23, 2007
4,546
The hard cap means:
- no MLE
- no buyouts
- no trades taking on more money

Anything I'm missing?
There are a few more if you're over the second apron

- no cash being sent out in trades
- no ability to trade your first round pick 7 years out
- if you're over the second apron twice more in the next four years, that pick drops to the end of the round
- you can not aggregate salaries to trade for a more expensive player. For example, can't trade two guys making 10M each for one guy making 15M, even though that cuts your salary.


A sneaky one they got in there for teams over the salary cap, if you aggregate salaries together and you are sending out more players than you are getting back, only one of your players can be a minimum contract. So, no Malcolm Brogdon trade.
 

Cellar-Door

Member
SoSH Member
Aug 1, 2006
34,458
A couple key new tax penalties you guys missed:
No aggregation of salary in traded
No cash in trades
Repeaters have their pick moved to the end of the round
Plus obviously the monetary punishment

It locks Repeaters into their roster basically, making it really hard to improve and setting up a truly ugly end
 

slamminsammya

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 31, 2006
9,152
San Francisco
The no aggregation does really hamper flexibility. Thanks for explaining y'all. Once you're over it sounds like there will be a lot of incentive to overpay your bird rights guys for trade flexibility since you can only downgrade a salary slot.

I'd also imagine teams below the apron will want to wait out aging cores that need to dump salaries. Like if golden state is gonna have their pick at the end of the first but also are bad they'll be incentivzed to give up Poole or someone for basically nothing purely to avoid the draft pick issue.
 

lovegtm

Member
SoSH Member
Apr 30, 2013
11,996
What is the best current source on the second apron new CBA? I was under the impression that

- you can only take back 110% in salary
- you can only take back < 100% if you are receiving a player who makes more than multiple aggregated players

However, I was under the impression that you can aggregate (for example) a $10M and $15M contract to take back a $22M one.

Would appreciate sources, since it's VERY possible that I am wrong; there was a lot of conflicting info in the post-negotiation reports.
 

Average Game James

Member
SoSH Member
Apr 28, 2016
4,346
A couple key new tax penalties you guys missed:
No aggregation of salary in traded
No cash in trades
Repeaters have their pick moved to the end of the round
Plus obviously the monetary punishment

It locks Repeaters into their roster basically, making it really hard to improve and setting up a truly ugly end
So does the draft pick penalty effectively devalue swaps in trades since you can’t even really hope for the complete blowup/injury season to sneak the swap into the lottery?
 

lovegtm

Member
SoSH Member
Apr 30, 2013
11,996
So does the draft pick penalty effectively devalue swaps in trades since you can’t even really hope for the complete blowup/injury season to sneak the swap into the lottery?
Yes, the idea is that teams will be less likely to accept pick-heavy deals from supertax teams, since the picks received will likely be end of the 1st round, and you can't bank on a Nets-style collapse to the top of the lottery.
 

lovegtm

Member
SoSH Member
Apr 30, 2013
11,996
Moving into prediction mode, as opposed to recommendation mode, I think the Cs end up supermaxing JB, but hold firm on no 5th year player option. That gives them 2023-24 at a fine tax number, they run it back with a contender, and still retain the ability to move Brown for a haul in summer of 2024 if things are looking bad roster/cap-wise. They'd be dealing an all-NBA player with 5 years of contract certainty, and somebody is going to go for that. The obvious candidate would be Cleveland in a Garland deal, if the Cavs thought Mitchell was walking otherwise in summer 2025.