The Bomb: Brady & Tyms Beautiful Connection

Ed Hillel

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Stitch01 said:
I'd be more excited if he ran anything but 9 routes but that was awesome
He's been with Brady for a week, so let's give him some time. He'd have had another huge catch if Brady hadn't overthrown him early. He's coming down with a jump ball there, especially since the defender hadn't turned around.
 

riboflav

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They haven't had a guy like Tyms in five seasons. I don't give a fuck if he runs the 9 route all year.
 

lostjumper

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There isn't another WR on the roster that can do that. It immediately gives the Pats an option they haven't had, and it also means defenses have to prepare for something other that the 8 yard pass to edelman/gronk
 

Stitch01

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Ed Hillel said:
He's been with Brady for a week, so let's give him some time. He'd have had another huge catch if Brady hadn't overthrown him early. He's coming down with a jump ball there, especially since the defender hadn't turned around.
Yeah that play was awesome and then can use a guy like that in the offense. No doubt. His role is just limited until he can run the whole route tree.
 

Stitch01

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I don't mean to come across as shitting on him, he's a great story and adds something to the offense, but I don't see him playing in most two and three WR sets this season. If he could do that I'd be ridiculously pumped instead of being happy to add a complimentary piece/ dimension. Its similar to with Tim Wright, nice piece for this year but complimentary.
 

Morgan's Magic Snowplow

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Stitch01 said:
I don't mean to come across as shitting on him, he's a great story and adds something to the offense, but I don't see him playing in most two and three WR sets this season. If he could do that I'd be ridiculously pumped instead of being happy to add a complimentary piece/ dimension. Its similar to with Tim Wright, nice piece for this year but complimentary.
At this point, barring injuries, Gronk, Edelman, Lafell, and a RB are going to be playing the vast majority of snaps. I think Tyms is basically a guy that rotates into that 5th skill position slot, along with Develin, Wright, Amendola, and Dobson. Tyms is pretty one-dimensional but gives the defense something different to think about and hopefully helps open up stuff underneath if opposing safeties have to respect the go route.
 

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riboflav said:
 
It was his first game. Calm down.
I like his you're telling people to calm down after announcing Tyms as a more exciting debut than Revis (unless 6 weeks is sooooo long ago) and telling haterz to suck it.

It was 1 catch. Hope he can continue to add that dimension. But calm down.
 

Stitch01

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Morgan said:
At this point, barring injuries, Gronk, Edelman, Lafell, and a RB are going to be playing the vast majority of snaps. I think Tyms is basically a guy that rotates into that 5th skill position slot, along with Develin, Wright, Amendola, and Dobson. Tyms is pretty one-dimensional but gives the defense something different to think about and hopefully helps open up stuff underneath if opposing safeties have to respect the go route.
Totally agree with all of that. Happy to have him providing value, just trying to say that a complementary role is the right expectation IMHO
 

riboflav

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amarshal2 said:
I like his you're telling people to calm down after announcing Tyms as a more exciting debut than Revis (unless 6 weeks is sooooo long ago) and telling haterz to suck it.

It was 1 catch. Hope he can continue to add that dimension. But calm down.
 
Suck it, hater.
 

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Stitch01 said:
I'd be more excited if he ran anything but 9 routes but that was awesome
More importantly than him just running 9 routes was that Brady threw him the damn ball.  And he came down with it enough to let Brady know that it isn't a wasted down.  I can't remember the play, but there was another play the analyst commented that Tyms caused enough concern with the defense that he freed up the eventual ball receiver (I don't know if it was play design or it was Tyms skillset that caused the concern - but I'll take it). 
 
I'm really looking forward to him getting more familiar with the full play tree and see him on the field in a 12 package... Gronk, Wright, Tyms and Edelman would seem to put a serious strain on the defense if Tyms is for real.
 
Yes, it is one game - but this is what he showed in the pre-season as well.  I think he is for real, and he has a skill set that seems available (beyond suspensions) in game as well as in practice... a skill set we haven't seen on the field in a couple of years.
 

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Dogman2 said:
On both deep throws, he had a CB and a S with him.
 
Obviously the great catch is the key thing, but just that he was able to attract double (or triple) coverage deep multiple times is exciting in and of itself.
 

lambeau

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Tyms was the top-rated receiver in the league in the preseason, mostly on intermediate routes. I think he will get a lot of work in 3 WR sets, ahead of Dobson and Amendola.
I think we may have had a clue to Dobson's disfavor when he jumped offsides and was immediately replaced by LaFell, who picked up the first down when the play was rerun.
Amendola may just be too much like Edelman. Tyms is as big as LaFell and Dobson, and seems to have an uncanny ability to catch a contested ball.
 

riboflav

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RetractableRoof said:
More importantly than him just running 9 routes was that Brady threw him the damn ball.  And he came down with it enough to let Brady know that it isn't a wasted down.  I can't remember the play, but there was another play the analyst commented that Tyms caused enough concern with the defense that he freed up the eventual ball receiver (I don't know if it was play design or it was Tyms skillset that caused the concern - but I'll take it). 
 
I'm really looking forward to him getting more familiar with the full play tree and see him on the field in a 12 package... Gronk, Wright, Tyms and Edelman would seem to put a serious strain on the defense if Tyms is for real.
 
Yes, it is one game - but this is what he showed in the pre-season as well.  I think he is for real, and he has a skill set that seems available (beyond suspensions) in game as well as in practice... a skill set we haven't seen on the field in a couple of years.
 
Tyms disrupted the Bills secondary on the Edelman DPI in the end zone.
 

Stitch01

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RetractableRoof said:
More importantly than him just running 9 routes was that Brady threw him the damn ball.  And he came down with it enough to let Brady know that it isn't a wasted down.  I can't remember the play, but there was another play the analyst commented that Tyms caused enough concern with the defense that he freed up the eventual ball receiver (I don't know if it was play design or it was Tyms skillset that caused the concern - but I'll take it). 
 
I'm really looking forward to him getting more familiar with the full play tree and see him on the field in a 12 package... Gronk, Wright, Tyms and Edelman would seem to put a serious strain on the defense if Tyms is for real.
 
Yes, it is one game - but this is what he showed in the pre-season as well.  I think he is for real, and he has a skill set that seems available (beyond suspensions) in game as well as in practice... a skill set we haven't seen on the field in a couple of years.
I'll still be (pleasantly) surprised if he plays much in the 12 this year
 

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The Bomb: Brady & Beautiful Tyms Connection
By Mark Schofield
 
Tom Brady Can’t Throw Deep.”
That phrase has become conventional wisdom over the last few seasons as Brady’s statistics on deep throws have declined. In 2013, he connected on 46% of throws 11-20 yards, 22% of passes 21-30 yards, and at a 25% clip on bombs more than 31 yards downfield. But maybe the problem wasn’t Brady.
Early in the 3rd quarter in Buffalo, Tom Brady connected with Brian Tyms on perfect a 43-yard touchdown pass to stake New England to a 19-7 lead. On this 1st and 10 play the Patriot quarterback sets up under center using 12 personnel. The offense employs a tight slot formation to each side of the field, with Tyms on the outside to the left:
 
 
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lambeau

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LaFell is pretty solid as WR #2--he has about 282 yards, but on only 15 receptions in basically three games(--Sanders has 435 yards, but he's been Manning's top target with 35 receptions).
LaFell is not only a top blocker, but has been top 5 over the past couple of years in YAC/reception. But as now, he's always been a #3 target.
Despite our slow start, Gronk, Edelman, and LaFell have 81 receptions for 1033 yards; Denvers top receivers, J Thomas, D Thomas, and Sanders, have 90 receptions for 1241 yards.
With Tyms as a "vertical threat" (Revis' term) plus Amendola and Dobson in reserve, the receiving corps is looking up.
 

Stitch01

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Oh Brady was for sure a big part of the problem. This was nice to see for one play though.

EDIT: not sure why the other thread needed to be locked, can we move the Tyms posts over here at least please? Is this the thread for all things Tyms even unrelated to this play and past week 6 now?
 

soxfan121

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Stitch01 said:
Oh Brady was for sure a big part of the problem. This was nice to see for one play though.

EDIT: not sure why the other thread needed to be locked, can we move the Tyms posts over here at least please? Is this the thread for all things Tyms even unrelated to this play and past week 6 now?
 
Done. 
 
Tyms and Browner are now wildly divergent topics and Skrub likes new threads.
 

Laser Show

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I'm a little confused. If Tyms is so talented, why was he available this offseason? Why is he on his 4th team?
 

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Laser Show said:
I'm a little confused. If Tyms is so talented, why was he available this offseason? Why is he on his 4th team?
 
I'm not yet sold on Tyms, but my guess is the off-field stuff did not endear him to a lot of teams.
 
But it's worth mentioning that guys like Kurt Warner and James Harrison were castoffs, too.
 

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Devizier said:
 
I'm not yet sold on Tyms, but my guess is the off-field stuff did not endear him to a lot of teams.
 
But it's worth mentioning that guys like Kurt Warner and James Harrison were castoffs, too.
 What off field stuff?  I couldn't find anything negative in a Google search outside of this year's suspension for Adderall which he claims he has been taking since he was 9.
http://www.boston.com/sports/football/patriots/extra_points/2014/08/brian_tyms_4-game_suspension_for_testing_positive.html
 

Laser Show

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norm from cheers said:
 What off field stuff?  I couldn't find anything negative in a Google search outside of this year's suspension for Adderall which he claims he has been taking since he was 9.
http://www.boston.com/sports/football/patriots/extra_points/2014/08/brian_tyms_4-game_suspension_for_testing_positive.html
And the suspension didn't get handed down until Pats training camp.

I mean I'm encouraged by what I've seen. Just curious why people are this excited about the guy.
 

riboflav

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It's the combination of not only Tyms's ability but the fact that the Patriots have been in desperate search of a receiver who can stretch the field (and have failed in finding one so many times) for several years. He had three defenders minding him for chrissakes and still got a TD. Imagine what that would do for Edelman and Gronk further upfield. It's really been the one missing element for years now. Just last week, we had to listen to Dilfer throw dirt on this offense, even after their performance against Cincy, because they can't throw deep and eventually that'll be their fatal flaw. 
 
Also, Tyms's ability (and desire) to go get the ball instead of waiting for it seems to separate him from all the other failures that come through Gillette. Honestly, I'm not sure what he has to do to make some fans believers. 
 

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Laser Show said:
And the suspension didn't get handed down until Pats training camp.

I mean I'm encouraged by what I've seen. Just curious why people are this excited about the guy.
Go back and read the binky thread, people were showing their love (and why) there...  
 
But for me, in a nutshell:  He is extremely quick and seems to be able to able to get off press coverage at the line.  He has size and an ability to fight off the hand checking while running his route.  He has an enormous vertical leap and the ability to fight for the ball in contested situations.  He actually catches the ball when it is in his direction.  I don't have the numbers on his wing span but his catch radius seems larger than other receivers.  He seems like a receiver that Brady can't overthrow.  He adds a vertical dimension to the offense that has been missing (in a consistent way) for years now.
 
He seems like he can deliver on the promise that Dopson shows, that Thompson showed.  If all he does is force the defense to defend him with quantity - the holes/seams he opens for the other receivers is worth its weight in gold.
 
I know I seem like I'm all in on him (and about his physical tools I am), but he's showing things that I just haven't seen since... well in years.  I love the slot receivers that are dependable and the [SIZE=13.63636302948px]binky of the [/SIZE]QB - but those guys get packed in if the defense isn't stretched or threatened vertically.  I think he is able to do that - in a consistent way.
 
My only concern is the one voiced by others in this and other threads - does he have a reliable mental makeup?  Can he learn the route trees and sight adjustments?  Can he earn (via practice performance) [SIZE=13.63636302948px]consistent reps on [/SIZE]the field on game day?  I sure as hell hope so - he's got the potential to be a game changer.
 

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riboflav said:
It's the combination of not only Tyms's ability but the fact that the Patriots have been in desperate search of a receiver who can stretch the field (and have failed in finding one so many times) for several years. He had three defenders minding him for chrissakes and still got a TD. Imagine what that would do for Edelman and Gronk further upfield. It's really been the one missing element for years now. Just last week, we had to listen to Dilfer throw dirt on this offense, even after their performance against Cincy, because they can't throw deep and eventually that'll be their fatal flaw. 
 
Also, Tyms's ability (and desire) to go get the ball instead of waiting for it seems to separate him from all the other failures that come through Gillette. Honestly, I'm not sure what he has to do to make some fans believers.
I mean, again, he's going to play like 12 snaps a game. Not sure he's really the piece that makes the offense go. He got less PT than Dobson yesterday. I'm not the world's biggest LaFell guy obviously, but he's earned the starting role in the two receiver sets and they're still going to play Amendola in a bunch if there WR sets in this offense when they don't want the third guy to run deep.
 

riboflav

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Stitch01 said:
I mean, again, he's going to play like 12 snaps a game. Not sure he's really the piece that makes the offense go. He got less PT than Dobson yesterday. I'm not the world's biggest LaFell guy obviously, but he's earned the starting role in the two receiver sets and they're still going to play Amendola in a bunch if there WR sets in this offense when they don't want the third guy to run deep.
 
Sure, but he's only had one week of practice. Maybe he only plays 10-15 snaps this season but that does't mean that's his ceiling. 
 
Physically, he was in the top-5 for all WRs at his pro day in shuttle run, 40-yd dash, bench press reps, and vertical leap. You combine that with the fact that he can actually catch the ball, that's what we've been looking for.
 
As for why did other teams let him go if he's so good... I'm not sure. I know the Steelers wanted Vrabel back. I know the Jets wanted Woodhead back. Heck, even though they received a draft pick, I'm sure the Dolphins wanted Welker back. If Brady had gone to any of another 15-20 teams, no way he survives two training camps. All in all, it happens. 
 

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riboflav said:
It's the combination of not only Tyms's ability but the fact that the Patriots have been in desperate search of a receiver who can stretch the field (and have failed in finding one so many times) for several years. He had three defenders minding him for chrissakes and still got a TD. Imagine what that would do for Edelman and Gronk further upfield. It's really been the one missing element for years now. Just last week, we had to listen to Dilfer throw dirt on this offense, even after their performance against Cincy, because they can't throw deep and eventually that'll be their fatal flaw. 
 
Also, Tyms's ability (and desire) to go get the ball instead of waiting for it seems to separate him from all the other failures that come through Gillette. Honestly, I'm not sure what he has to do to make some fans believers. 
Getting a second catch would be nice.
 

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riboflav said:
Sure, but he's only had one week of practice. Maybe he only plays 10-15 snaps this season but that does't mean that's his ceiling. 
 
Physically, he was in the top-5 for all WRs at his pro day in shuttle run, 40-yd dash, bench press reps, and vertical leap. You combine that with the fact that he can actually catch the ball, that's what we've been looking for.
 
As for why did other teams let him go if he's so good... I'm not sure. I know the Steelers wanted Vrabel back. I know the Jets wanted Woodhead back. Heck, even though they received a draft pick, I'm sure the Dolphins wanted Welker back. If Brady had gone to any of another 15-20 teams, no way he survives two training camps. All in all, it happens.
He's not young for a first year WR, but sure, possible he makes a leap next year. I wouldn't bet on him having a better career than David Givens, or probably even Aaron Dobson, but he has tools so it possible it clicks.
 

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My wildly optimistic scenario is a receiver the Patriots had in 2007 ...
 
Donte Stallworth (minus the killing a dude part).
 

Laser Show

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riboflav said:
As for why did other teams let him go if he's so good... I'm not sure. I know the Steelers wanted Vrabel back. I know the Jets wanted Woodhead back. Heck, even though they received a draft pick, I'm sure the Dolphins wanted Welker back. If Brady had gone to any of another 15-20 teams, no way he survives two training camps. All in all, it happens. 
 
All the scouting-type information is great - it's making me even more excited about him (great post RetractableRoof). But I think this is the kind of answer I was looking for. I'm just trying to understand how a player with this skill set and this perfect fit for the Pats' offense slipped through the cracks.
 

( . ) ( . ) and (_!_)

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Laser Show said:
 
All the scouting-type information is great - it's making me even more excited about him (great post RetractableRoof). But I think this is the kind of answer I was looking for. I'm just trying to understand how a player with this skill set and this perfect fit for the Pats' offense slipped through the cracks.
He also for lack of a better word could have been a douchebag when he first got into the league. I'm sure getting cut and facing your football mortality has different effects on different people. If it got Tyms to straighten out and fly right then so be it, it's the Pats gain.

I have nothing to back this up, just speculating.
 

Laser Show

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( . ) ( . ) and (_!_) said:
He also for lack of a better word could have been a douchebag when he first got into the league. I'm sure getting cut and facing your football mortality has different effects on different people. If it got Tyms to straighten out and fly right then so be it, it's the Pats gain.

I have nothing to back this up, just speculating.
 
If anyone else hasn't seen it, I found this article in the binky thread, linked to by dynomite.
http://m.sfgate.com/49ers/article/Rookie-wideout-Tyms-runs-toward-future-3791826.php
 
Definitely worth a read. He had about the worst upbringing you could possibly have (abusive parents, multiple foster homes) and barely played in high school. And it does mention he had some anger issues in college. No wonder he went undrafted. Based on what was posted there, I'm guessing most of this isn't news to a lot of people, but I had no idea. Pulling hard for him now.
 
As far as my questions about him slipping through the cracks, yet being a perfect fit for this offense - well here's the money quote:
 
He didn't wear shoulder pads until his senior year at Dillard High in Fort Lauderdale, Fla., and spent two years at Tallahassee (Fla.) Community College, which doesn't have a football program. After a redshirt season at Florida A&M, he played about 10 snaps a game as a junior and had seven catches. He collected 38 receptions for 538 yards as a senior while still learning the nuances of the position.
"It was like bringing a baby into the world," Tyms said of his redshirt season. "The only thing I knew how to do was go deep. That was it. I could run past somebody and jump up and grab a ball. They told me to run a go and I'm like 'OK, I'm on my horse.' But anything else where I had to fit inside a coverage, slip under somebody ..."
 
 

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He's a great story, the Moss celebration is awesome and fun, and he competes like hell for the ball in the air.  Really hope he grows into something special.