Exactly. You want to kill that much time you need to make first downs. I know we all like Jimmy G but he played like shit in the
Edit: He only played like shit in the 4th Q, nvm.
Super Bowl LIV: Chiefs vs 49ers Game Thread
- Thread starter Ale Xander
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Edit: He only played like shit in the 4th Q, nvm.
Shanahan, after hiding Jimmy all postseason, put it all on his shoulders in the 4th quarter of the Super Bowl. It made no sense whatsoever. This is definitely on Shanahan. Jimmy didn't help him, but Shanahan knew full well that Jimmy wasn't fully to be trusted; why else sit on the ball at the end of the first half?
Stupid, mindless bewildering coaching. I don't see how anyone could possibly think this guy's ever going to win anything.
They weren't really running the ball well last night, because KC was trying to take it away. They had six guys up on the line of scrimmage on that second down play. I just watched it again, and I think the slant to Kittle (which Jimmy threw) was open ... but man, Deebo Samuel is uncovered in the right flat. No one followed his motion at all. Garoppolo might want that one back.
Also, the Niners can move on from Jimmy this offseason and save 22.5 million on the cap; I believe the contract has outs like that. Will make for VERY interesting watching especially if Rivers, Brees and (gulp) Brady become available.
Jimmy was horrible last night, and he's already 28 years old, coming off a major injury, and is unlikely to improve. I don't think he's going to be good enough to be a top-tier franchise QB.
Going back to my post of Jones as MVP: he plain-ass swatted two passes back into JG's face, really should have caught one of them, and tipped another, all in the fourth quarter- and pressured JG every dropback.
Maybe if your QB keeps getting his passes deflected at the LOS, you go to Plan B.
Maybe if your QB keeps getting his passes deflected at the LOS, you go to Plan B.
But he didn't. As pointed out above, he missed many other open throws. He was awful. Shanahan was the biggest reason they lost the like but Jimmy was the second largest. And it's fair to doubt his abilities to win one going forward given his age and that they had to hide him to even get this far.
I agree. The clock killing is part of it (and yes, they could have either killed it or at least put KC in a very tough spot with a few first downs and a score), but the primary reason to run is that was their best shot at moving the ball. Mostert and Coleman averaged 5.1 yards a carry.
Of course, even that was a terrible play call. It's 3rd and 10 find something short and either pick up the 1st of making it a manageable 4th down. Instead, you are left with a 4th and 10 and the Chiefs bring the house. Even if they score there you left alot of time for Mahomes.
Watching this game made me really appreciate the Pats more, they really are thinking on another level.
Why was it inevitable? Did Jeff Hostetler make any big plays against Buffalo? That was the blueprint.
Let's look at the drives.
After the 2nd interception:
Mostert runs for 6, then Kittle reception for 12 yards. But then Moster for 1 yard, an incomplete, a false start and... 3rd and 14.
KC scores a TD.
Mostert for 5 then an incomplete to Kittle and a pass on 3rd and 5. It falls incomplete. Passing on 3rd and long is not a bad idea. Execution here is the culprit not play calling.
After KC takes the lead:
The drive was rocking until Jimmy G makes poor decisions on who to throw to and Chris Jones takes over the LoS. Jimmy G had Sanders open deep and misses him. I'm sorry but he HAD him if he executes.
If you want to quibble with that drive it is why did you call 3 straight passing plays at the 49? But that's super nitpicky to me especially when guys were getting open in the passing game but Jimmy G and the OL didn't come through.
Respectfully agree to disagree @Smiling Joe Hesketh
I think this was an execution and not a coaching problem.
After the 2nd interception:
Mostert runs for 6, then Kittle reception for 12 yards. But then Moster for 1 yard, an incomplete, a false start and... 3rd and 14.
KC scores a TD.
Mostert for 5 then an incomplete to Kittle and a pass on 3rd and 5. It falls incomplete. Passing on 3rd and long is not a bad idea. Execution here is the culprit not play calling.
After KC takes the lead:
The drive was rocking until Jimmy G makes poor decisions on who to throw to and Chris Jones takes over the LoS. Jimmy G had Sanders open deep and misses him. I'm sorry but he HAD him if he executes.
If you want to quibble with that drive it is why did you call 3 straight passing plays at the 49? But that's super nitpicky to me especially when guys were getting open in the passing game but Jimmy G and the OL didn't come through.
Respectfully agree to disagree @Smiling Joe Hesketh
I think this was an execution and not a coaching problem.
I agree with both halves of this: Shanny called a poor game at the biggest moments and that (and Mahomes being so good) forced them to rely on Jimmy, who was not close to being up for the task.
Would have been a tough play but I wonder how things shake out if Kwon makes this play:
Had it in his hands with potential to return it. This possession ended with a pick anyways but making that play would have put them in great position to extend the lead.
- 1st & 10 at KC 46
(15:00 - 4th) P.Mahomes pass incomplete short left to T.Hill (K.Alexander).
Had it in his hands with potential to return it. This possession ended with a pick anyways but making that play would have put them in great position to extend the lead.
This is it right here. You can't do this. You can't pass on 2nd and 5. You can't decide, after hiding your QB all postseason, to suddenly turn around and say, "OK, you're Dan Marino." On 3rd and 10 why is Jimmy throwing deep at all? Get the first down, not launch 60 yard bombs. That was monumentally dumb.
It was a huge coaching problem, and then compounded by an execution problem. Shanahan and Jimmy both stunk, but Shanahan's the guy in charge.
I think you can run it there if you only need a FG, but not down four needing a TD. You might need a lot of time and your timeouts closer in.
So run another jet sweep. And with 2nd and 5, you dont need 4ypc to get another 1st down.
My friend asked me before the game whether I’d rather have gone to the game and see SF lose, or stay home and see them win. It was an easy decision, and not one I considered before going.
I agree with the criticism, but advocating for SF to move on from the both of them as a result seems like an overreaction.
KC had six on the LOS. They were trying to take away the run and force the ball into Jimmy's hands. It worked; SF did not run the ball well, especially in the second half.
Yeah but they made their first down two plays before on 2nd and 4 and a pass to Kittle. Respectfully I don't think asking him to throw on 2nd and a mere 5 is asking much. Plus they were loading up the box at that point. I am going to rewatch it sometime when I get home today because I am pretty sure he had people open on 2nd and 3rd down on that series.
Yeah, it amazes me that coaches STILL play conservatively in the playoffs - heck even Belichick has fallen prey to this, especially recently (to some degree this was due to their shitty offense, but still). This was especially bad given KC's ability to quickly come back from much larger deficits - how exactly did Shanahan think the decision-making at the end of the half there was going to benefit their team?
Exactly. Someone, maybe the honey badger, said so last night. They were going to sell out against the run and try to force SF to win by passing it. It is harder to win if you are prone to be more one-dimensional or imbalanced in the NFL. We've seen that bite Baltimore, Minnesota, and the Titans alone in the playoffs this year.
Edit: Well you can be one-dimensional and I phrased that like talk radio so I cleaned it up.
The point is to win the SB. I don't believe that either Shanahan or Garoppolo are remotely up to the task. Denver figured this out a few years ago with John Fox, he simply wasn't good enough. Neither is Shanahan. Lynch can either deny reality or accept it.
even with KC stacking I thought SF had some good runs. Or at least use play action. Jimmy was inconsistent on anything medium-length or longer.
the more I think about it SF played right into KC's hands, when they had KC on the ropes already with Mahomes having a poor game, and let them off the hook.
the more I think about it SF played right into KC's hands, when they had KC on the ropes already with Mahomes having a poor game, and let them off the hook.
SF got a C+ Chiefs performance and blew it.
It’s as bad a last 7 minutes as you can have.
Prior to that I would have bet my life Saleh guaranteed himself a head coaching gig next offseason. Fell apart in epic fashion.
It’s as bad a last 7 minutes as you can have.
Prior to that I would have bet my life Saleh guaranteed himself a head coaching gig next offseason. Fell apart in epic fashion.
maybe I'm talking out of my ass but that seemed to go away in the 4th quarter
That's not how this works. The Pats gave up 41 to the Eagles to lose a SB and yet Matt Patricia got a HC gig anyway.
Honestly I'd rather have Saleh be HC for SF than Shanahan. Because while they had defensive struggles, the play calling and decisions made by Shanahan completely hamstrung them. KC outscored HOU 51-7 after falling behind 24-0, you knew at some point they'd make a run last night. SF's failures were on the offensive side of the ball at the end of the first half and in the 4th quarter.
And this was Shanahan's second kick at the can and he showed he's learned nothing over the years.
That's an interesting one. Will be good to follow for sure! I think you might be right about Jimmy but Shanahan is a good coach IMO. He has his faults but he's had a great run this year. I think he's made the absolute most of his roster minus the last 7 minutes of last night. He's had a lot of success offensively through the years. He's young too. Who knows. Will certainly be fun to follow and see how it plays out.
Sure, but I can't get over that he pulled the same crap last night that he did in SB 51. Head coaches are weird, egomaniacal beasts; he really thought he was making good decisions last night even as the rest of the country facepalmed.
I think he stinks. Sean McVay was supposed to be the next hot thing too and he collapsed magnificently this year. Shanny's more likely to do that than to win a SB.
The last two SBs the original McVey and one of the next McVeys were outcoached by two geezers. Next year BB comes back to outclass Matt LaFleur.
It definitely went away after KC had the lead because obviously they weren't running, and they weren't using it on 3rd and medium-to-long because obviously they weren't running, but they used it basically as much as they could use it (including on the second down play that everyone hates).
Most accurate prediction of the thread.
Rereading the thread today, this was the outcome that I didn't realize I was rooting for until I read this. It's a shame we weren't treated to a nice rhyme of history.
Nick Bosa talking trash while the 49'ers were at 97% Win Expectancy.
Nick Bosa at the end of the game:
Poor Nick Bosa doesn't get to eat Big Macs at the WH and horse around with Trump
Nick Bosa at the end of the game:
Poor Nick Bosa doesn't get to eat Big Macs at the WH and horse around with Trump
Attachments
I love a good SJH rant as much as anybody (we got into it over Mookie late last week) but I don't think it is accurate to say the country was facepalming over Shanahan's playcalling. On the previous drive (after the pick, at 20-10), the Niners ran for 6 yards on 1st down, then completed a 12 yard pass to Kittle. On the next drive, they started out running for 5, then throwing incomplete to Kittle. Throwing on 2nd and favorable isn't some awful playcall. If Shanahan made mistakes last night they had absolutely nothing to do with how he lost SB51. Jimmy was something like 20-26 until they fell behind. It wasn't like they were hiding him all game, he was completing passes pretty much all game. I think getting upset over that single playcall is foolishness. I would have liked to see a run, but I can't kill that playcall.
I do think he should have tried to run the ball from the 49, however.
I do think he should have tried to run the ball from the 49, however.
And this, the worst take of the lot. The same has been said about so many ultimately-successful coaches in this league. Anyone remember what was said about Pete Carroll when he was on his way out of Foxborough? Or about Andy Reid before, um, last night? Can't win the big one! Always finds a way to mismanage the game!
Past results are not a guarantee of future results, but they're the single best predictor of them. If your teams win a whole lot of regular season games, especially consistently, you're probably a strong contender in the playoffs. Doesn't guarantee you anything, that's how probabilities work.
Based on what I saw of their respective coaching work, I'd bet Shanahan gets back to this stage before McVay does. He got beat by some all-time Brady/Belichick witchcraft and then by a league MVP playing on a rookie contract. Happens. They were close games. It's not like the 80s Broncos going up against a series of pre-salary-cap superteams and getting blown the fuck off the field.
A friend in Kansas City ... Missouri (just in case the president is reading) ... offers this description of the watch party
Somehow it was 68 degrees here today. They opened the downtown watch party at 10 a.m. Fans started camping out at 5 a.m. so they could be first in line and get a good spot.
They ran out of beer ... by noon. Seriously.
The fans spilled out onto the streets outside the Sprint Center area, and they closed three city blocks and brought in large screen TVs and food trucks.
That filled up, and by 1:30 or 2 p.m. fans were tailgating on the rooftops of nearby buildings.
Somehow it was 68 degrees here today. They opened the downtown watch party at 10 a.m. Fans started camping out at 5 a.m. so they could be first in line and get a good spot.
They ran out of beer ... by noon. Seriously.
The fans spilled out onto the streets outside the Sprint Center area, and they closed three city blocks and brought in large screen TVs and food trucks.
That filled up, and by 1:30 or 2 p.m. fans were tailgating on the rooftops of nearby buildings.
Imagine posting this and then not learning from last night's game about Shanahan.
He's a shitty coach who called a shitty game and it's the second time it's happened and at this point he'll never learn. He's now been key parts of team that have blown the largest and second largest leads in SB history. His teams have been outscored 46-0 in the 4th quarter of those games.
Be sure to remind me if he does in the future, but I'm confident you won't have to do that. If I owned the 9ers I'd replace him with Saleh tomorrow.
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What I saw was SF with a bunch of opportunities in the final quarter to make a play to significantly increase their chances of winning.... and on most they failed. Gotta win the whole game, not just the first 50 minutes.
Apparently he had three key pressures in a row at the end of the game to help seal the deal.
They last ran Samuel on the 3rd play of the 2nd half.
I think that was, again, a case of Shanahan overthinking it or outsmarting himself.