Stanley Cup Final

OfTheCarmen

Cow Humper
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Jul 18, 2007
4,278
Why the hell did not a single official actually signal a goal for a puck literally stuck inside the net?
 

Salem's Lot

Andy Moog! Andy God Damn Moog!
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Jul 15, 2005
10,748
Gallows Hill
How did Wes McCauley not see that enter the net? What the fuck is he looking at? Complete incompetence from a veteran official. And this is the best they have to offer? Fucking laughable.
 

Ale Xander

killed off Vin Scully
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Oct 31, 2013
51,395
Man I’m bad luck for TBL. Get back from Tears for Fears, turn on ESPN and Avs score in 5 seconds
 

TFP

Dope
Dope
Dec 10, 2007
19,739
How did Wes McCauley not see that enter the net? What the fuck is he looking at? Complete incompetence from a veteran official. And this is the best they have to offer? Fucking laughable.
8 out of 10 skaters, including all of the players closest to it, didn’t realize it either.
 

DennyDoyle'sBoil

Found no thrill on Blueberry Hill
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Sep 9, 2008
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Stamkos saw it and I think was thinking about trying to knock it away but then left it there and may have actually been the one that pointed it out to Byram.
 

TFP

Dope
Dope
Dec 10, 2007
19,739
Stamkos saw it and I think was thinking about trying to knock it away but then left it there and may have actually been the one that pointed it out to Byram.
Stamkos and Byram were the 2 guys in my post who knew it was in. Stamkos was definitely trying to find a discrete way to pull it out but knew it was futile. Byram came flying up the ice to point out it was in.
Was he onsides??
Yes.
 

DennyDoyle'sBoil

Found no thrill on Blueberry Hill
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Sep 9, 2008
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Was he onsides??
Yeah. Bang bang but he was on I think.

I’m a broken record but Tampa can only compete against the Avs if they clog up the neutral zone. Guys just getting free runs. That play where Landeskog went 180 feet in a straight line early in OT probably should have ended it. This series has been entirely contested between the blue lines. When the Avs are allowed to patrol it they dominate.
 

MiracleOfO2704

not AWOL
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Jul 12, 2005
7,428
The Island
I’m a broken record at this point, but since August 2020, the Lightning have played nearly 210 games. Even with so many HoF-caliber players in their primes, that is a ton of hockey in such a compressed timeframe.
 

Dummy Hoy

Angry Pissbum
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Jul 22, 2006
7,707
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Not sure there's a team in the NHL that enjoys playing the victim more than the Lightning

Edit: and Joe Smith, while (by all accounts) a very nice guy and a solid writer, has a irritating blind adherence to all things Lightning.
 
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lexrageorge

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Jul 31, 2007
15,036
I've always thought officials let this go all the time as long as the player is close (within a couple of feet) to the bench and the player has zero impact on the play. I've certainly seen this many times before and it seldom gets called unless a puck hits the skate of the player heading to the bench or something. Maybe the Lightning should try playing at least a fraction of the game in the Colorado zone next time there's an overtime.
 

Dummy Hoy

Angry Pissbum
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Jul 22, 2006
7,707
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Yes, shit happens. Sucks for Tampa, we're all shedding tears.

Tampa has zero ground to stand on with their whataboutery...as @Murby pointed out above they've benefitted from the same missed call quite recently (twice that series I believe).
 

TSC

SoSH's Doug Neidermeyer
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Oct 25, 2007
11,107
Between here and everywhere.
They can show a million angles, including one where MacKinnon is riding his stick like a pony while winking at Cooper on the bench, and I won’t care.

Had nothing to do with the play, was in the process of getting off the ice, and fuck Tampa and Cooper for whining.
 

DeadlySplitter

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Oct 20, 2015
28,106
I would never want to see that called in a Final OT game, myself. Just found it amusing Cooper whined about it instead of doing a proper PC.
 

Ferm Sheller

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Mar 5, 2007
15,367
Maybe Tampa can find an unfair loophole that will ensure that gets called next time.

Fuck them. LOL boo hoo.
 

Zososoxfan

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Jul 30, 2009
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FWIW, other than Coop, I haven't heard many fans here in TB complaining about the TMM. Like others have said, Mac was heading to the bench and wasn't involved in the play. I don't know if Kadri got an extraordinary advantage by going on early, but it seemed like a sloppy change and the refs had put the whistles away at that point. Good goal, but what a weird ending to one of the best games I've watched in a long time. Two excellent teams going at it full-tilt in a back-and-forth game. Worthy opponents these two.

TB's chances at this point rely on Point coming back and being effective, their stars playing up to their abilities, and Vasi stealing at least a game and more likely 2. TB's depth players like Paul, Nash, Rutta, and Maroon are playing pretty well. I don't think it's fair to expect much more of Hagel, Colton, Bellemare, Bogosian. Cirelli really got cooking these last few games, but Killorn and McDonagh have been particularly bad. Perry and to a lesser extent Stamkos have been quiet. Kuch has been alright, but the Bolts need some scoring from him with Point out.

If Cernak can't go on Friday, then Point almost needs to come back into the lineup because TB will be icing Cal Foote as the 6th defenseman, and Coop already looks hesitant to ice Bogosian as much as he has (over 18 mins last night). Long odds for sure, but TB has the talent, moxie, and goalie to do it.
 
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NYCSox

chris hansen of goats
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May 19, 2004
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The only team I could see pulling off this comeback is Tampa but it likely requires Vas to have an out of body experience. Which of course he is certainly capable of doing.
 

durandal1707

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Apr 18, 2007
4,434
Not sure there's a team in the NHL that enjoys playing the victim more than the Lightning
The league's regularly rewarded such griping, so I really can't fault that Cooper keeps going back to that well. I hate it, but it's a large part of why the Bruins under Cassidy rarely got the benefit of the officiating. They took Bruce's refusal to call them out as tacit approval.

I’m a broken record at this point, but since August 2020, the Lightning have played nearly 210 games. Even with so many HoF-caliber players in their primes, that is a ton of hockey in such a compressed timeframe.
This seems to be the major factor in this series. The Bolts last night came out flying, but quickly became very conservative with the lead. With less mileage I believe they'd be more aggressive and keeping pace with the Colorado, but its pretty clear that the Avs have more energy and endurance right now. The Lightning seemed to concede that in OT last night, and went back to the "pack it in and pray for a counterattack" strategy.


The only team I could see pulling off this comeback is Tampa but it likely requires Vas to have an out of body experience. Which of course he is certainly capable of doing.
What feels far more likely is that Kuemper could let in a bunch of softies like he did in Game 3. By no means is Tampa out of it, but I think they're going to need some serious underperformance from the Avalanche.
 

54thMA

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Aug 15, 2012
9,396
Westwood MA
"My heart breaks for the players because we probably still should be playing."

Not from the footage I saw in overtime, Colorado dominated the overtime period.

Naturally it's hockey and all it would have taken is a Tampa shot on net getting tipped, deflected or taking a funny bounce and Tampa wins, but they were getting blown off the ice in overtime.

Colorado is a wagon, that team is loaded.
 

cshea

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Nov 15, 2006
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Is this provable somehow or just a common gripe?
I get that it was a complaint for some, but I thought he was fine. He called them out during the Capitals series last year, multiple times, (when they were winning so nobody paid attention), and again during the Islanders series (when they were losing, and thus he got mocked). I get the "shrug and smirk" thing he did on the bench when a bad call went against us rubbed some the wrong way, but I don't subscribe to the criticism that he didn't call officals out.
 

DennyDoyle'sBoil

Found no thrill on Blueberry Hill
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Sep 9, 2008
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I don't think I've ever seen a too many men called for that kind of play. If the five foot rule was enforced, it would happen every change.

If you glide to the closest door and take a straight line and don't get involved in active play, you're fine. Especially in periods where your bench is the one further from the defensive zone and you skate to the defensive end door.

It does not appear that Tampa committed any defensive resources to McKinnon.
 

Zososoxfan

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I get that it was a complaint for some, but I thought he was fine. He called them out during the Capitals series last year, multiple times, (when they were winning so nobody paid attention), and again during the Islanders series (when they were losing, and thus he got mocked). I get the "shrug and smirk" thing he did on the bench when a bad call went against us rubbed some the wrong way, but I don't subscribe to the criticism that he didn't call officals out.
I think it's the SCF against the Blues that most people point to. I certainly do. The Bruins were substantially the better team, their coach started barking, the subsequent game (either G5 and/or G6) got officiated very differently, and we don't need to discuss what happened in G7. Bruce was mum throughout, perhaps said something understated before G7.
 

durandal1707

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Apr 18, 2007
4,434
It's definitely a subjective thing and would be tough to prove conclusively, and if folks want to write it off as that, that's fair.

But it sure seems like Cooper rides the refs constantly, and the Lightning frequently find themselves the beneficiaries of calls/non-calls. The whole offsides challenge in Game 3 of this series is a good example, where the Tampa bench was given an excessive amount of time to decide if they wanted to challenge. Off the top of my head, I'm reminded of the times the Bruins faced them in the playoffs, one where McAvoy was tackled by a Bolt which immediately led to a Stamkos GWG, and a late-game Marchand breakaway that was disrupted by obvious hooking with no call made.

Honestly, if NHL officiating was really committed to impartiality and actively resisted media pressure, I think Cassidy's approach would be just right. He calls out the egregious cases and moves on. The problem, of course, is the NHL doesn't operate that way, instead the Berubes of the world can win a SCF game with their presser histrionics. And if your coach isn't willing to engage in that, then your team is at a disadvantage in this league.
 

cshea

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I think it's the SCF against the Blues that most people point to. I certainly do. The Bruins were substantially the better team, their coach started barking, the subsequent game (either G5 and/or G6) got officiated very differently, and we don't need to discuss what happened in G7. Bruce was mum throughout, perhaps said something understated before G7.
Cassidy was not mum. Berube's comments were after game 3, when the Bruins went 4-5 on the PP. They lost game 4 and Cassidy said:

https://nesn.com/2019/06/bruce-cassidy-makes-interesting-points-in-response-to-craig-berubes-ref-complaints/

“I found it interesting, I fully expect, you have the best refs and you go through the process. I would expect they wouldn’t get baited into somebody’s comments,” Cassidy told reports. “They should be better that. If they did, I certainly didn’t expect them to. They should have a degree of professionalism. Call the calls that they see.”

“The night before (Game 3), I found it odd — we killed five power plays,” he said. “We scored on our four, and one (St. Louis penalty) was in the final minute, which was inconsequential. One was on them that they got called for it wasn’t an infraction — they got called for a bench minor for (unsuccessfully) challenging an offsides — so really there’s a couple they could look at that affected the game. I think one in the first period, one in the second … hopefully, they didn’t get caught up in it. (In Game 4), I thought the call on (Connor) Clifton was a head-scratcher. (Vladimir) Tarasenko went to reverse hit him, and I don’t think there was any contact to the head. It was his own hit, maybe, leading with it. So I don’t know where that call came from. That’s the only one I was unhappy with.
Then we had the game 5 Acciari fiasco, to which he replied:

https://www.masslive.com/bruins/2019/06/boston-bruins-coach-bruce-cassidy-rips-officials-for-critical-non-call-in-game-5-loss-we-thought-we-got-screwed.html

“Their player was on his way to the box. It was right in front of the official. It’s a slew foot. Our guy was gone. The spotter took him out of the game for a possible concussion,” Cassidy said. “It was blatant. A big effect on the game. The National Hockey League is taking a black eye from the officiating in these playoffs and here’s another one. I thought it was a great hockey game. That call, and there was time, but it really made it difficult for us to get the win tonight. I’m disappointed ... It was egregious. But we’re moving on, getting ready for Game 6.”
He's definitely on the passive agressive side of things (and really, Berube's original comments were just that...why are we getting called for penalties all of a sudden? shrug) and wonders aloud instead of being more direct, but I just contend that the perception that he didn't work officals and just stuck his head in the sand and said "have to play through it" every singe time is factually incorrect.
 

Zososoxfan

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Jul 30, 2009
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Cassidy was not mum. Berube's comments were after game 3, when the Bruins went 4-5 on the PP. They lost game 4 and Cassidy said:

https://nesn.com/2019/06/bruce-cassidy-makes-interesting-points-in-response-to-craig-berubes-ref-complaints/



Then we had the game 5 Acciari fiasco, to which he replied:

https://www.masslive.com/bruins/2019/06/boston-bruins-coach-bruce-cassidy-rips-officials-for-critical-non-call-in-game-5-loss-we-thought-we-got-screwed.html



He's definitely on the passive agressive side of things (and really, Berube's original comments were just that...why are we getting called for penalties all of a sudden? shrug) and wonders aloud instead of being more direct, but I just contend that the perception that he didn't work officals and just stuck his head in the sand and said "have to play through it" every singe time is factually incorrect.
That's what I get for relying on my faulty memory. Do you agree that Butch is more reserved with his in-game criticism? I can't think of many instances in the playoffs where he was hollering from the bench.

That old Krejci video did make me nostalgic for Clod. Not with respect to Butch, but just generally. He's a funny-looking guy and was a great coach for that team.