I don’t follow the NFC much, but Detroit was a 3 win team in 2021. Then, I believe, 9-8 the next year and then 12-5 and of course this season.
How did they achieve such a revival?
How did they achieve such a revival?
So, how did the Lions turn things around?
- Thread starter NomarsFool
- Start date
Not to mention a great decision to trade Matt Stafford when they did, and ending up with:
QB Jared Goff
CB Ifeatu Melifonwu (2021 3rd-round pick)
WR Jameson Williams (2022 1st-round pick)
DL Josh Paschal (2022 2nd-round pick)
RB Jahmyr Gibbs (2023 1st-round pick)
TE Sam LaPorta (2023 2nd-round pick)
DT Brodric Martin (2023 3rd-round pick)
QB Jared Goff
CB Ifeatu Melifonwu (2021 3rd-round pick)
WR Jameson Williams (2022 1st-round pick)
DL Josh Paschal (2022 2nd-round pick)
RB Jahmyr Gibbs (2023 1st-round pick)
TE Sam LaPorta (2023 2nd-round pick)
DT Brodric Martin (2023 3rd-round pick)
So....
Traded their star QB for a highly drafted pretty good QB, two 1sts and a 3rd.
Hired an all new coaching staff.
Drafted a franchise tackle in the 1st, some solid to very good defenders rounds 2-4, and then got a #1 WR in the 4th.
2022- drafted a franchise EDGE at #2, a WR at #12, good starting S in the 3rd
2023- nailed two 1sts (RB, LB) and two 2nds (TE, S)
Add in that their best players from the previous regime developed, and they kept their good O-linemen from that period....
So yeah, it was mostly trading a really valuable asset for a lot more high draft picks, then having a really good 3 year run of drafts with those extra picks.
When they used the 1st on a RB a couple of years ago I remember being like "lol same old Lions" but it seemed to work out ok for them. (I think most people thought it was a stupid pick, tbh.)
And that was after they signed David Montgomery from Chicago. So they made this big FA move at RB, and then drafted Gibbs in the first round on top of it. And both are tremendous.
For all the wishcasting about landing Ben Johnson, seems like we should be hoping to poach Brad Holmes instead.
According to Ben Volin, it’s because Campbell goes for it on fourth down, showing he “trusts his players” and is “aggressive.”
Forget that the Pats have a rookie quarterback, a ruinous offensive line, a defense that gives up huge chunk plays and would come up short in most of those situations. Forget that coming up short that these games would mean the games would almost instantly go from competitive to blowouts in a heartbeat. Forget that Maye would be wearing those losses and failures around his neck while he is also trying to learn to lead the team. We’d be “aggressive” and that’s what counts.
It’s a lot easier to trust your players when you have an roster worthy of your trust. The Lions turned it around and were able to be super aggressive on fourth down because they had the personnel that could win matchups. Even when they were 3-14 they were led by a Super Bowl quarterback in Goff.
I love the Lions and Campbell is a fun coach for that roster. But when people argue that the Pats have “nothing to lose” by adopting the philosophy of going for it from their own 39 in the first quarter like the Lions, it’s as if they think the biggest difference between a team that is winning and one that is rebuilding is confidence and a can-do attitude.
Forget that the Pats have a rookie quarterback, a ruinous offensive line, a defense that gives up huge chunk plays and would come up short in most of those situations. Forget that coming up short that these games would mean the games would almost instantly go from competitive to blowouts in a heartbeat. Forget that Maye would be wearing those losses and failures around his neck while he is also trying to learn to lead the team. We’d be “aggressive” and that’s what counts.
It’s a lot easier to trust your players when you have an roster worthy of your trust. The Lions turned it around and were able to be super aggressive on fourth down because they had the personnel that could win matchups. Even when they were 3-14 they were led by a Super Bowl quarterback in Goff.
I love the Lions and Campbell is a fun coach for that roster. But when people argue that the Pats have “nothing to lose” by adopting the philosophy of going for it from their own 39 in the first quarter like the Lions, it’s as if they think the biggest difference between a team that is winning and one that is rebuilding is confidence and a can-do attitude.
Probably worth noting Campbell started 4-19-1 with Detroit (including a 29-0 loss to the Zappe Patriots) before things clicked. He was on the hot seat midway through his 2nd year and thought of as a doofus.
33-9 including the playoffs since.
33-9 including the playoffs since.
Meh, this is revisionist history. Goff was a salary dump who was seen as THE reason a dominant team didn't win the SB (which they immediately did with Stafford) and the Lions had the lowest projected win total in the league Campbell's first year. The situation was not all that dissimilar, it was a bad roster that performed poorly. We can debate whether establishing a culture of aggressiveness is good or bad, but the Lions were no better positioned to succeed on-field (off-field they had extra picks coming) than this NE team.
I'd also say there is a prety big gap between "go for it from your own 39" and where the Patriots philosophy has been.... the Patriots have had I believe 6 non-garbagetime go for it situations where going for it increased WP by at least 1.... they went for it only once. They are if not the most conservative team in the league, for sure bottom 2-3.
Smart front office that acquired much better talent and paired them with good coaching.
This shit isn't rocket science, as much as people make it out to be.
This shit isn't rocket science, as much as people make it out to be.
It’s amazing what a dominant offensive line can do for a running game, a QB’s confidence, and an ability to hide some of your defense’s weaknesses by controlling the game.
Yeah, I think the key things are:
For the Pats, I wish there had been someone they could have traded to get extra first rounders but there wasn't really that option for them unless they dealt #3 last year. Maybe they can try that this year. And, if Strange was an all-pro maybe you start seeing the line coming together, but that's looking like a probably not.
I would say that good offensive linemen usually have very long productive careers, and don't become FAs often, so it's rarely a wasted pick if you draft one high even if your offense is still rebuilding. They really need to get those picks right and make them.
- Great offensive line built through the draft with largely high picks:
- Decker drafted 1.16 in 2019
- Glasgow drafted 3rd round in 2016
- Ragnow drafted 1.20 in 2018
- Sewell drafted 1.7 in 2021
- Zeitler signed as FA this year
- Stafford trade which added extra high picks and didn't create a hole at QB
- Having some great drafts at the right time and not missing with many 1s
For the Pats, I wish there had been someone they could have traded to get extra first rounders but there wasn't really that option for them unless they dealt #3 last year. Maybe they can try that this year. And, if Strange was an all-pro maybe you start seeing the line coming together, but that's looking like a probably not.
I would say that good offensive linemen usually have very long productive careers, and don't become FAs often, so it's rarely a wasted pick if you draft one high even if your offense is still rebuilding. They really need to get those picks right and make them.
I don't believe the trust the players nonsense. But I do believe in math, so if you do the math involving the benefit from gaining a down and scoring the points and the costs of giving the other team favorable field position if you fail and you reach the conclusion that going for it on the fourth down is the play having more expected points, that's what you do. I haven't followed the NFL in years, but I am surprised that this hasn't caught on and NFL coaches AFAIK still remain pretty conservative on the whole. To me that's the equivalent of going for a strategy of going for 3pointers and dunks that took a while to get widespread in basketball.