SBLII: What Did the Butler Do?

djbayko

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In Bill we trust but if he sat Butler just to make a point I really don't respect that. It's about winning and not anything else. You don't damage your chances of winning to make a point. It's not fair to the other players.
It's really difficult to question the decision when the same coaching philosophy has lead to 8 SB appearances and 5 championships. I hate to say "in Bill we trust" in all circumstances...but how do you not? Maybe if he wasn't such a hard ass on things like - whatever this was - we wouldn't be enjoying the same level of success.
 

moondog80

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Sep 20, 2005
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BB is lying.

Edit: Butler wasn't great this year but if anyone thinks he is suddenly behind Jonathon Bedemosi in the depth chart then they are incredibly gullible.
BB would not be afraid to say it was disciplinary if that was the case.
 

Ed Hillel

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BB would not be afraid to say it was disciplinary if that was the case.
I doubt he’d tell Butler pregame he wasn’t playing at all if it wasn’t discipline. Starting maybe, but does he walk up to a player and say something like that?
 

ifmanis5

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It's impossible to believe that Butler not playing gave them a better chance of winning considering how badly that defense was shredded all game.
 

DeJesus Built My Hotrod

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It's really difficult to question the decision when the same coaching philosophy has lead to 8 SB appearances and 5 championships. I hate to say "in Bill we trust" in all circumstances...but how do you not? Maybe if he wasn't such a hard ass on things like - whatever this was - we wouldn't be enjoying the same success.
Its almost like people have a sense of entitlement here. And I don't think its out of bounds to question why Butler didn't play. Its entirely fair. But if you are asking me to choose between shitting all over BB for something we have very limited information on or giving him the benefit of the doubt, I am opting for the latter.

Some people here didn't live through the lean years with this franchise and many of us who did that I will take a night like tonight over those seasons anytime. This team was once the laughingstock of the league. Even with tonight's bitter defeat, they are still the gold standard.
 

Ralphwiggum

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Why dress him if he’s not going to play? And how does Bademosi get on the field before Butler?

I don’t know. I have to imagine that is the end for Butler in New England and honestly it ending that way is one of the sadder parts of tonight’s loss. The beginning of Malcom Butler’s story in New England was amazing, I hate to see it end with him stapled to the bench for unknown reasons.
 

Jnai

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No one knows anything right now.

You people really think BB is going to cut off his nose to spite his face? Christ, how long have you been watching this team?
Well, I don't know what went on, but the guy benched one of his most important offensive players because of a foot joke interview.
 

wiffleballhero

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Its almost like people have a sense of entitlement here. And I don't think its out of bounds to question why Butler didn't play. Its entirely fair. But if you are asking me to choose between shitting all over BB for something we have very limited information on or giving him the benefit of the doubt, I am opting for the latter.

Some people here didn't live through the lean years with this franchise and many of us who did that I will take a night like tonight over those seasons anytime. This team was once the laughingstock of the league. Even with tonight's bitter defeat, they are still the gold standard.
Fair enough, except that unless illness or injury explain his benching (both of which are easy enough to mention and neither of which explain his ST play) this is still a crazy move.
 

j44thor

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Look, we are going to know real soon but if this is BB being a Alpha a hole I don't really know what to say. How fucking stupid can a smart person be?
Didn't he bench Seymour for missing practice after his father died as a coaching decision?
 

Reardons Beard

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Its almost like people have a sense of entitlement here. And I don't think its out of bounds to question why Butler didn't play. Its entirely fair. But if you are asking me to choose between shitting all over BB for something we have very limited information on or giving him the benefit of the doubt, I am opting for the latter.

Some people here didn't live through the lean years with this franchise and many of us who did that I will take a night like tonight over those seasons anytime. This team was once the laughingstock of the league. Even with tonight's bitter defeat, they are still the gold standard.
This all day, night, and every Sunday.
 

drbretto

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Apr 10, 2009
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I'm not upset about the game and totally want to trust BB, but the part bugging me is why deflect the question? If it was for football reasons, wouldn't he just say what it was? There's no need to deflect that one otherwise.

I want to give the benefit if the doubt but it definitely looks weird.
 

Sportsbstn

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Bill just made a bad call not starting butler. He made an inexcusable one watching Rowe get repeatedly torched and still not changing Rowe out
 

Smiling Joe Hesketh

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You mean the guy who benched prime Wes Welker for a whole drive in the playoffs because of some shitty jokes in a press conference? That guy?
Yes that guy. You think he's going to hold Butler out of the fucking entire Super Bowl? You're high. I'm assuming it was a matchup concern, but who knows. I do know I'm not going to assume that the greatest coach in NFL history suddenly became an idiot overnight.
 

DeJesus Built My Hotrod

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I'm not upset about the game and totally want to trust BB, but the part bugging me is why deflect the question? If it was for football reasons, wouldn't he just say it?

I want to give the benefit if the doubt but it definitely looks weird.
I agree that its a mystery but BB deflecting is nothing new. As we all know, they actively control information in the Patriots organization. I wouldn't be surprised if we don't get the real story or we just get Butler's side of things. Its clear he was upset before the game because he knew this was his last game with the team. That makes me sad given what he did for this franchise Superbowls and regular seasons as well.
 

88 MVP

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Yes that guy. You think he's going to hold Butler out of the fucking entire Super Bowl? You're high. I'm assuming it was a matchup concern, but who knows. I do know I'm not going to assume that the greatest coach in NFL history suddenly became an idiot overnight.
A matchup concern? So Butler was a worse matchup against the entire Philly depth chart? Couldn’t make the field in sub packages? Nonsense
 

Byrdbrain

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I'm not shitting on Belichick at all but he is lying if he says playing Butler 0 plays on defense was purely a football decision.
Obviously from Butler's reaction before the game he knew he was benched.

Greg A. Bedard‏Verified account @GregABedard 4m4 minutes ago
Rowe said it was a surprise to him that he started and that Butler had been practicing in the packages during the week
 

Smiling Joe Hesketh

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A matchup concern? So Butler was a worse matchup against the entire Philly depth chart? Couldn’t make the field in sub packages? Nonsense
I'm assuming it was size/height.

Look, I don't understand it either, and it obviously didn't work out, but goddamn people, 5 Super Bowls and 3 more appearances besides should be a good indication he knows what he's doing.
 

Ralphwiggum

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But how does he play zero snaps on defense. There wasn’t one sub package, nickel or dime look where he could have seen the field? Johnson fucking Bademosi was out there.

There’s something else going on, there just has to be. Maybe Butler deserved it, but to play the vast majority of defensive snaps all year long and then to suddenly not see the field at all on defense is crazy.
 

j44thor

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Yes that guy. You think he's going to hold Butler out of the fucking entire Super Bowl? You're high. I'm assuming it was a matchup concern, but who knows. I do know I'm not going to assume that the greatest coach in NFL history suddenly became an idiot overnight.
Is Butler better than Richards? Simple fucking question. If yes then Bill is being disingenuous, not the first time.
 

kelpapa

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Yes that guy. You think he's going to hold Butler out of the fucking entire Super Bowl? You're high. I'm assuming it was a matchup concern, but who knows. I do know I'm not going to assume that the greatest coach in NFL history suddenly became an idiot overnight.
I don't agree with SJH often, but I do here. I am not ready to rip on the greatest coach of all time until I hear more information.
 

Sportsbstn

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I'm assuming it was size/height.

Look, I don't understand it either, and it obviously didn't work out, but goddamn people, 5 Super Bowls and 3 more appearances besides should be a good indication he knows what he's doing.
I hear you, but it’s not like he inactivated Butler. Rowe was horrendous and yet he stuck with him all game. It was a poor coaching performance. Doesn’t mean he isn’t great, but was far from it tonight
 

Smiling Joe Hesketh

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Is Butler better than Richards? Simple fucking question. If yes then Bill is being disingenuous, not the first time.
I'm not the coach and I'm not a football expert. If BB, who's the greatest coach of all time, says for this game that Richards should play and Butler should not, I'm not in a position to question it.

He's not perfect, but I'm assuming he wants to win the SB almost as much as people on this board do.
 

Byrdbrain

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Is Butler better than Richards? Simple fucking question. If yes then Bill is being disingenuous, not the first time.
Obviously overall yes Butler is better than Richards, however Richards is a different player so it certainly could be that Richards might play more in a specific game but Butler isn't all that different from Bademosi and there is no reason why Bademosi would play and Butler wouldn't.
 

rodderick

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I'm not the coach and I'm not a football expert. If BB, who's the greatest coach of all time, says for this game that Richards should play and Butler should not, I'm not in a position to question it.

He's not perfect, but I'm assuming he wants to win the SB almost as much as people on this board do.
You realize that when you argue every decision he makes should go unquestioned you're pretty much saying he's perfect, right?
 

wiffleballhero

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I'm not the coach and I'm not a football expert. If BB, who's the greatest coach of all time, says for this game that Richards should play and Butler should not, I'm not in a position to question it.

He's not perfect, but I'm assuming he wants to win the SB almost as much as people on this board do.
Oh Christ, true enough, but that does not explain zero defensive snaps. I mean, seriously, he benched him for reasons unknown. Listening to the pressers it is obvious now that he was not benched for health reasons.
 

The Napkin

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My biggest question I suppose would be people are saying all week in practice he was in the normal packages. If was a football reason why not practice and prepare that way? Did the matchup change last night?
 

lexrageorge

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Welker’s discipline was only 1 drive, and his benching had nothing to do with the numerous fiasco plays that befell the Pats that day. IIRC, Seymour was benched for a quarter; Adalius Thomas was simply left inactive. So I’m not convinced Butler’s benching was disciplinary.

Don’t know the reasons, and even if I did, I’m not sure I would agree with them. Could have been injury or illness or matchup related. But even so, it was hardly the fireable offense some here are making it out to be.
 

Ed Hillel

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Maybe the Eagles were taping all our practices and Bill tried to throw in a wrinkle and it backfired.
 

Ralphwiggum

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I am a “trust BB” guy to the end. It just doesn’t add up that Butler couldn’t get on the field at all the entire night.