RedSox have been in serious trade talks with multiple teams about OF Andrew Benintendi

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sodenj5

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Dude’s development has absolutely stalled out here. Can’t imagine how much they would get back for him. His value would seem to be at an all time low.
 

The Gray Eagle

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If they're looking to trade for prospects, it looks like they aren't planning on trying to win this year.
And they will be trading him at the lowest his value has ever been.
 

chawson

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If they're looking to trade for prospects, it looks like they aren't planning on trying to win this year.
And they will be trading him at the lowest his value has ever been.
Not necessarily. There are some outfielders we could get back in a salary dump trade, like Upton and Brandon Marsh, or Bloom could sign Ozuna.
 

jon abbey

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Yeah, I'd be really really hesitant to draw conclusions about the macro approach at this point for most GMs in this especially unusual offseason. There are teams like the Padres and Mets obviously going for it, teams like the Pirates (not necessarily the Indians) who are selling whoever they can, but the majority of teams are still holding their cards close to the vest and seeing how things play out.
 

kyaces

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Cardinals looking for a lh bat for the outfield. Carlos Martinez and an outfielder such as Lane Thomas? Thomas hits RH and a good defender in CF.
 

BornToRun

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Cardinals looking for a lh bat for the outfield. Carlos Martinez and an outfielder such as Lane Thomas? Thomas hits RH and a good defender in CF.
Isn’t Martinez kind of a scumbag? I know we want to win but I also feel like this group here cares about that sort of thing at least to a degree.
 

nattysez

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(1) My avatar makes me sad.
(2) I really don't understand selling low on Benny unless they are convinced his value is only going to drop from here. I guess that's possible, but it seems unlikely.
 

nvalvo

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Grant Brisbee had a piece in the Athletic a week or two ago that raised the prospect of the Giants trading young catcher Joey Bart. Posey will be back, and they have another good catching prospect behind Bart in Patrick Bailey.

It included this section...

It’s more realistic to assume that the Giants are still at least a year away from challenging the Dodgers and Padres. They’ll shoot for .500 this year, then become big-market bullies in the offseason, making offers for Francisco Lindor, Javier Báez, Carlos Correa, Corey Seager and Trevor Story. If they sign all five, they’ll figure it out.

But the Giants still might contend this season. It’s not the likeliest scenario, but it’s a plausible one. It’s almost a cliché to mention all of the teams that contended a year sooner than expected, but the examples are all still relevant: the ’12 Nationals, ’15 Astros, ’15 Cubs, ’17 Twins, ’18 Braves, and the A’s in both 12 and ’18 all went from well under .500 to the postseason. Their eventual success was expected, just not that quickly. A team with a top-10 farm system can surprise like that, and the Giants have one.

That kind of team could use a little immediate help, then. While it’s fine to expect modest contributions from Bart in 2021 and more substantial ones after that, it might be advantageous to get someone who can help more in 2021. This is the part where I rattle off the names of players who might be absolutely untouchable, but if any of them were to be available, a prospect like Bart would be a part of the deal. We’re talking players like Andrew Benintendi, Joey Gallo, Sonny Gray, Matt Chapman or Ketel Marte.
Brisbee is mostly kept around because he's funny, but that's at least one observer who thinks Benintendi still has enough perceived value to fetch a high-end prospect like Joey Bart, BP's #25 prospect in the sport before 2020.

I'd do that deal in a heartbeat, and I wrote that before I checked the Trade Simulator, which... sees Benintendi having ~1/10 Bart's value. So maybe this says more about Brisbee as an analyst than anything else.

I guess my point is that I could see Benintendi being a tough player to value right now, so if a team still thinks of him as a top of the order contributor, there might be an opportunity to bring back a player whose years of control line up a bit better with when we're next expecting to be good.
 

jon abbey

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Also the Giants signed Curt Casali this week, making that a bit more possible.
 

Manramsclan

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I’ll wait for a non-Bowden source before reacting.
This was exactly my response. He has a long track record of throwing things at the wall, none of which ever really comes to fruition. I'll bet the Red Sox have been talking about all sorts of players and possibilities including dealing Benintendi but "serious talks" can be interpreted many, many ways.
 

NJ_Sox_Fan

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I cannot imagine any scenario where the Giants trade Bart for Benintendi, but if they would the Sox would be nuts not to do it
 

The Gray Eagle

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Because playing Benintendi regularly in CF in 2021 would indicate that they're trying to win this year, right?
Playing him in LF, or trading him for players who can help us this year, would indicate that. Trading him for prospects wouldn't.
 

scottyno

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Playing him in LF, or trading him for players who can help us this year, would indicate that. Trading him for prospects wouldn't.
He was a below average player 2 years ago and absolutely terrible last year, what if they trade him for prospects and sign another Pillar type guy for short money? Then they're likely just as good this year and they got a free prospect.
 

The Gray Eagle

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Since he's been so bad, who is trading prospects for him instead of just signing a Pillar type themselves?
 

Earthbound64

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If they're looking to trade for prospects, it looks like they aren't planning on trying to win this year.
Because playing Benintendi regularly in CF in 2021 would indicate that they're trying to win this year, right?
Playing him in LF [...] would indicate that.
You think he's more valuable in LF?...

Since he's been so bad, who is trading prospects for him instead of just signing a Pillar type themselves?
As of right now, no one.
 

DJnVa

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Since he's been so bad, who is trading prospects for him instead of just signing a Pillar type themselves?
2019 wasn't HORRIBLE (OPS+ of 100) and last year was 39 ABs in a weird ass year. He's not suddenly a .200 hitter.

Are we really thinking he stinks based of 39 ABs in 20COVID20?
 

Rich Garces Belly

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I can see the D’Backs having interest in him as Hazen was on the staff that drafted him. 2019 he was mediocre but from 2016-2018 he was above average at the plate and in the field. I just hope we are not trading him at his lowest point as he is a valuable piece who still has not reached his peak yet.
 

JBJ_HOF

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It makes the most sense if you are taking back some dead money too. Benintendi is worth like 5 million surplus value, take back a negative 5 or 10 million player, that equals a good but not elite prospect.
 
It makes the most sense if you are taking back some dead money too. Benintendi is worth like 5 million surplus value, take back a negative 5 or 10 million player, that equals a good but not elite prospect.
I seem to recall a trade where we took on "dead money" about 15 years ago, and it produced the 2007 World Series MVP, so maybe Chaim and company see something with similar such potential. Wishful thinking, but hey, it's a new year :)
 

chawson

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A risk with trading Beni is that he rebounds and the Yankees get him, because his hitting profile fits there.

If he’s being floated while his value is this low I think it’s because Bloom has a dead money left fielder coming via trade for a bigger player.
 

jon abbey

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A risk with trading Beni is that he rebounds and the Yankees get him, because his hitting profile fits there.
I don’t think you have to worry about this much, Hicks is under contract through 2025, Frazier 2024, Judge 2022, Stanton 2027, with Tauchman (3.8 bWAR in 2019 in just 296 PAs) under control through 2024, Florial waiting to blossom and Jasson Dominguez ready in maybe three years.
 

nvalvo

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I cannot imagine any scenario where the Giants trade Bart for Benintendi, but if they would the Sox would be nuts not to do it
It's less that I think that particular scenario is plausible, and more that I think that suggests that Benintendi's value is seen very differently across the industry.
 

Red(s)HawksFan

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I seem to recall a trade where we took on "dead money" about 15 years ago, and it produced the 2007 World Series MVP, so maybe Chaim and company see something with similar such potential. Wishful thinking, but hey, it's a new year :)
Difference being that taking that "dead money" MVP and the Cy Young caliber starter who came with him cost a top prospect (2006 Rookie of the Year) and a fairly good pitching prospect, not a struggling, arbitration-eligible corner outfielder.

But you think that keeping him and playing him in LF would indicate they were trying to win this year?
Kinda depends on how they fill CF, doesn't it?

One player and how the team decides to deploy him (play him, trade him, cut him) does not tell us anything about whether they're "trying to win" or not.
 

joe dokes

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The "selling low" trope should end. Other GMs either thinks he sucks, or thinks he'll rebound to being good and will make their offer accordingly.
If he had a really good year, every GM would either think he'll regress or that he's actually good and will make their offer accordingly.
The number of gms (including bloom) in each camp doesn't change much either way. It's not like gms just look at the back of a baseball card to make a deal. (Except maybe Bowden).
 

sodenj5

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The "selling low" trope should end. Other GMs either thinks he sucks, or thinks he'll rebound to being good and will make their offer accordingly.
If he had a really good year, every GM would either think he'll regress or that he's actually good and will make their offer accordingly.
The number of gms (including bloom) in each camp doesn't change much either way. It's not like gms just look at the back of a baseball card to make a deal. (Except maybe Bowden).
This is kind of an odd comment. If he had a year in 2020 in line with his first three seasons, he isn’t getting traded, or he’s getting traded for far more than a mid level prospect.

His value is undeniably lower now than it was after his rookie season. It’s possible this is the new norm for him, and the Sox are moving on and getting market value. But it’s also possible a player with his profile and pedigree bounces back and becomes a plus player at the big league level, in which case Boston would have... sold low on him.
 

woodros04!

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It's hard for me to imagine that it would be a good idea to trade him with his value so low. I suppose they may just be testing the waters to see what teams would give up for him. He is still too you young to give up on.
 

Max Power

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It could just be that he doesn't fit well into the team even if he were reaching his potential. Benintendi is a lefty hitting corner outfielder with middling power. They already have a far superior version of that in Verdugo. If they'd prefer to fill that spot with a mashing righty, he'd have to go regardless of how the last couple of years have gone.
 

chawson

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It could just be that he doesn't fit well into the team even if he were reaching his potential. Benintendi is a lefty hitting corner outfielder with middling power. They already have a far superior version of that in Verdugo. If they'd prefer to fill that spot with a mashing righty, he'd have to go regardless of how the last couple of years have gone.
This was always the case for Beni, Verdugo notwithstanding. He has a career 8% Fenway HR/FB vs. 10.4% away, and 25.5% pulled HR/FB vs. 37.5% away.

Beni was also fortunate because the Sox faced the 4th fewest left-handed pitchers over 2017-18, who he can’t really hit. They faced 4th most in ‘19, which partially exposed him. The right move was flipping him after 2018, when he could have fetched nearly anyone in the league.
 

grimshaw

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It could just be that he doesn't fit well into the team even if he were reaching his potential. Benintendi is a lefty hitting corner outfielder with middling power. They already have a far superior version of that in Verdugo. If they'd prefer to fill that spot with a mashing righty, he'd have to go regardless of how the last couple of years have gone.
Ya, I think he's a better fit virtually anywhere else. He's a tweener in the outfield, and plays in the smallest LF in baseball. And his power just doesn't translate in Fenway. If he's in a spacious left field with a shorter right field, he's a lot more valuable to that team. The Sox are still not in position to be dealing many prospects so he's someone who makes sense to move. Curious if they're looking for prospects or packaging him for an impact guy.

We can't be underestimating how much cheap players are worth now either given all the hemorrhaging of money league wide.
 
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joe dokes

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This is kind of an odd comment. If he had a year in 2020 in line with his first three seasons, he isn’t getting traded, or he’s getting traded for far more than a mid level prospect.

His value is undeniably lower now than it was after his rookie season. It’s possible this is the new norm for him, and the Sox are moving on and getting market value. But it’s also possible a player with his profile and pedigree bounces back and becomes a plus player at the big league level, in which case Boston would have... sold low on him.
Not if they sell him to a team that believes the latter.
I get that, as a factual matter, his value is low, but as a criticism of bloom selling him, I stand by my original point.
 

johnnywayback

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On the Baseball Trade Values site, Benintendi's median trade value is roughly that of Tanner Houck. Playing around with it, since someone mentioned the Cardinals, I found a return from St. Louis that would work according to this very rough metric: outfielder Jhon Torres and pitcher Tink Hence. If Bloom could sign Marcell Ozuna to play LF, that's a deal I'd do happily.

EDIT: Someone else pitched Benintendi to the Braves for Ender Inciarte, AJ Minter, and Kyle Wright. That'd work for me, too.
 

Danny_Darwin

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Doesn’t work on the trade value site, but I wonder about the idea of a Benintendi-Haniger deal as a “change-of-scenery” kind of thing. Haniger didn’t play last year and missed a lot of 2019, but he was still productive when he was out there.
 

BaseballJones

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I don't really know about Benny's spray chart or whether he's built to play in Fenway, but conceptually, he's exactly the kind of player the Sox should be pursuing - a young, currently undervalued asset for small dollars who has already demonstrated legit major league ability. That's not the kind of guy they should be trading away.
 

Dewey'sCannon

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A risk with trading Beni is that he rebounds and the Yankees get him, because his hitting profile fits there.

If he’s being floated while his value is this low I think it’s because Bloom has a dead money left fielder coming via trade for a bigger player.
I think this is probably the case - for example, if Bloom is talking to Cincy about a deal for Castillo, and we have to take Moustakas and/or Castellanos back, then I could see how Benny might be one of the (many) pieces going back, especially since he's from that area so maybe the Reds see that as a way to try to help offset the PR hit from trading Castillo.

Otherwise, i don't see that trading him when his value is low would net enough in terms of "prospects" to be worth it, even if we replace him with one of the FA OFs.
 

Sandy Leon Trotsky

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I think the best option regarding Benintendi is to proceed with him as either LF or CF to start the season and see where things are at the mid point. It doesn't make sense at this point to deal him while we only have one other serious starting OF. I do trust Bloom however and think he's just seeing what the interest could potentially be. Benintendi really has very little space to trend further downhill, and while other teams could possibly value him as a guy that could rebound to his potential when he first came up, getting more out of him than '20 and the second half of '19 would only bump his trade value up, no?
 

johnnywayback

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I don't really know about Benny's spray chart or whether he's built to play in Fenway, but conceptually, he's exactly the kind of player the Sox should be pursuing - a young, currently undervalued asset for small dollars who has already demonstrated legit major league ability. That's not the kind of guy they should be trading away.
Here's how I look at it. First, he's not actually that "young," in that he's got two years of team control left before free agency. And, importantly, those are two years in which the Red Sox can spend as much money as they want -- unlike most teams, they're rich, and unlike many of the rich teams, they're not worried about the luxury tax threshold in 2021 or 2022. Therefore, his contract status should be a far more valuable thing for other teams than it is for us.

On top of that, the free agent market is currently flooded with corner outfielders. And because of our financial situation, we should be willing to spend more freely over the next two years than other teams might -- meaning we should be willing to outbid on Ozuna or Rosario or whoever the front office likes.

So I would argue that trading Benintendi to fill other holes and/or get prospects who might make a cheap impact in 2023 and beyond, and then signing a more expensive free agent to play LF for two years, is exactly the kind of thing they should be doing.
 

Trlicek's Whip

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The "selling low" trope should end. Other GMs either thinks he sucks, or thinks he'll rebound to being good and will make their offer accordingly.
If he had a really good year, every GM would either think he'll regress or that he's actually good and will make their offer accordingly.
The number of gms (including bloom) in each camp doesn't change much either way. It's not like gms just look at the back of a baseball card to make a deal. (Except maybe Bowden).
And also: referring to it as "selling low" when referencing the 2020 season as if it was a perfectly healthy, traditional, and normal one is a bit disingenuous. I'm GM's that try to pass that off to each other in trade talks now aren't going to get that far with it as an argument.

Bloom can reel it back if he doesn't see offers he likes, and AB is still under team control, and other teams know he could be included in future offers which might be better if there's an AB rebound.
 

johnnywayback

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I think this is probably the case - for example, if Bloom is talking to Cincy about a deal for Castillo, and we have to take Moustakas and/or Castellanos back, then I could see how Benny might be one of the (many) pieces going back, especially since he's from that area so maybe the Reds see that as a way to try to help offset the PR hit from trading Castillo.

Otherwise, i don't see that trading him when his value is low would net enough in terms of "prospects" to be worth it, even if we replace him with one of the FA OFs.
Since I'm procrastinating by playing with that trade value simulator today, the site rates as fair a deal that would send Benintendi to CIN for Castillo and Castellanos....as long as we throw in Casas, Downs, and Verdugo. And, honestly, I'm not even sure the Reds would do that in real life.
 
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