Red Sox Rumors - Just Kidding

[manny]

Have there even been rumors from somewhat credible sources that they're in on Correa? I've seen reports they're in on Swanson but nothing on Correa. That said, Correa's market seems to have been developing slower, Boras probably waiting for musical chairs to sort out on other SS.

There were rumblings that there will be a trade coming. Is Reynolds the best hitter that has been rumored to be available? Reynolds seems like a better bet than Bogaerts offensively going forward. How would people feel about something like trading for Reynolds, signing someone like Iglesias, and signing Senga? Seems like that would be a pretty solid squad going into next season? Of course depends who goes out for Reynolds but assume it's not Mayer, Bello, Casas, Ceddanne.

 

[soxhop411]

Have there even been rumors from somewhat credible sources that they're in on Correa? I've seen reports they're in on Swanson but nothing on Correa. That said, Correa's market seems to have been developing slower, Boras probably waiting for musical chairs to sort out on other SS.

There were rumblings that there will be a trade coming. Is Reynolds the best hitter that has been rumored to be available? Reynolds seems like a better bet than Bogaerts offensively going forward. How would people feel about something like trading for Reynolds, signing someone like Iglesias, and signing Senga? Seems like that would be a pretty solid squad going into next season? Of course depends who goes out for Reynolds but assume it's not Mayer, Bello, Casas, Ceddanne.

Most of the players signed by the sox this week came out of nowhere, (no rumors, Leaks etc)....
take Masataka Yoshida for example

 

[CoffeeNerdness]

They’re also operating in a Scott Boras PR fantasy world where he would’ve taken the same contract as Jose Altuve back in March.

What's the benefit to Boras by being the source in an article that makes Bloom look terrible? Bloom is going to panic now and throw stupid money at Correa?

 

[BringBackMo]

Alex Speier doesn't put his name to stuff that isn't credible. He is not some hot take artist who put stuff out there to generate clicks.

Right. I am ask skeptical as they come when we're talking Boston sports media figures. But Speier is the gold standard. When he reports something, it's pretty safe to bank on it.

 

[SemperFidelisSox]

The Cubs have been linked to Swanson and his fiancé plays for the Chicago Red Stars.

 

[ehaz]

Have there even been rumors from somewhat credible sources that they're in on Correa? I've seen reports they're in on Swanson but nothing on Correa. That said, Correa's market seems to have been developing slower, Boras probably waiting for musical chairs to sort out on other SS.

There were rumblings that there will be a trade coming. Is Reynolds the best hitter that has been rumored to be available? Reynolds seems like a better bet than Bogaerts offensively going forward. How would people feel about something like trading for Reynolds, signing someone like Iglesias, and signing Senga? Seems like that would be a pretty solid squad going into next season? Of course depends who goes out for Reynolds but assume it's not Mayer, Bello, Casas, Ceddanne.

Reynolds is intriguing and would replace some or all of Xander's offensive production. But the Pirates are going to ask for a ransom. They immediately said they're not going to trade him and even if you view that as a negotiating ploy, he's under contract for 3 more seasons. I don't see that trade happening without Casas/Bello and at that point you're just creating more holes in a roster that's already rife with them.

Also, I have no idea how to evaluate Reynolds. Is he a top-10 MVP candidate like in 2021 (6 WAR, .385 wOBA) or just a really good outfielder/borderline All Star like in 2022 (3 WAR, .349 wOBA)? At least with guys like Burnes and Bieber, you know for sure what you're getting when gutting the farm.

 

[Salem's Lot]

What's the benefit to Boras by being the source in an article that makes Bloom look terrible? Bloom is going to panic now and throw stupid money at Correa?

Preemptive strike in case the Red Sox PR team tries to paint the player in a negative light on the way out of town, like they have done in the past with people leaving the organization.

 

[VORP Speed]

What's the benefit to Boras by being the source in an article that makes Bloom look terrible? Bloom is going to panic now and throw stupid money at Correa?

Boras has a longstanding feud with the Rays organization and everyone in it. He, as you might expect, hates their approach and rails against them at every opportunity. He can't really do anything to them because they don't need him, but taking advantage of an opening to anonymously shiv Bloom when he's looking weak and there's this brewing anti "Tampa North" sentiment in Boston wouldn't exactly be out of character for Boras. Much better for him to have Dombrowskis vs Blooms in place at the richest teams.

 

[manny]

Reynolds is intriguing and would replace some or all of Xander's offensive production. But the Pirates are going to ask for a ransom. They immediately said they're not going to trade him and even if you view that as a negotiating ploy, he's under contract for 3 more seasons. I don't see that trade happening without Casas/Bello and at that point you're just creating more holes in a roster that's already rife with them.

Also, I have no idea how to evaluate Reynolds. Is he a top-10 MVP candidate like in 2021 (6 WAR, .385 wOBA) or just a really good outfielder/borderline All Star like in 2022 (3 WAR, .349 wOBA)? At least with guys like Burnes and Bieber, you know for sure what you're getting when gutting the farm.

I hear you. I'd actually be open on Casas (probably in the minority) but not Bello. I do wonder how the Pirates may view Houck who seems more expendable given some of the bullpen moves this offseason.

Also, Burnes and Bieber do not belong in the same class IMO. Burnes is worth gutting the farm, not Bieber given his age, second half, and metrics. Would be nice to think Sox would absorb some of Yelich contract to get Burnes cheaper but if they're not willing to sign good guys for those prices, are they going to take on a mediocre guy? And then Bloom does not seem like a gut the farm type of GM. That's why I'm thinking someone like Senga or maybe Rodon is the best they will do.

 

[cornwalls@6]

I don’t think that’s realistic as a Boras client. He was going to test the market, did, and now we adjust.

Exactly. The overwhelming majority of Boras guys go to free agency. There is a narrative that goes back to Lester, that the FO screws up every negotiation. I don't think they did a thing wrong here. They know he was going to test the market, made a baseline starting offer, stayed in the game, when the offers were way over the top, they declined to match. Wisely, IMO.

 

[8slim]

Ten years ago they held onto Betts, Bradley, Bogaerts, and then later Devers. They were building to the 2018 season. When that core was ready, they added Sale, Kimbrel, Martinez, and other pieces. If Bloom is thinking the same way, then we hold onto the guys who will be the core of the next great team (Bello, Casas, and the guys in the BA top ten), and then add a couple of big contracts as needed. Bogaerts at 11/280 would undermine that strategy. I don't know if this is how Bloom is thinking, but I hope so, and evidence points that way.

The Padres may be very good in 2023, but they will likely pay a price down the road.

Well, 2018 is when it paid off, but 3/4ths of those guys were playing everyday in 2015, and making the playoffs in 2016-17. Then that core was broken up starting in 2019. They never reached the "dominance" stage of the post I responded to. I'm assuming Bloom isn't planning on have the current minor leaguers win a title in 2027, and then break them up in 2028.

 

[Daniel_Son]

So then, no rumors, just this thread getting bumped again and again with people saying the same things about the same topics as in 3 other threads.

EDIT: Here's one, the Sox are in on Swanson and/or Zunino:
https://www.mlb.com/news/aaron-judge-xander-bogaerts-deals-wrap-winter-meetings?partnerID=mlbapp-iOS_article-share

Zunino is a bit interesting. He was pretty bad last year but had a really good 2021 in which he hit 30+ home runs. Maybe he could be a DH option?

 

[grepal]

Have there even been rumors from somewhat credible sources that they're in on Correa? I've seen reports they're in on Swanson but nothing on Correa. That said, Correa's market seems to have been developing slower, Boras probably waiting for musical chairs to sort out on other SS.

There were rumblings that there will be a trade coming. Is Reynolds the best hitter that has been rumored to be available? Reynolds seems like a better bet than Bogaerts offensively going forward. How would people feel about something like trading for Reynolds, signing someone like Iglesias, and signing Senga? Seems like that would be a pretty solid squad going into next season? Of course depends who goes out for Reynolds but assume it's not Mayer, Bello, Casas, Ceddanne.

Do the Sox have enough to get Murphy and Reynolds? BTW, I would hesitate to throw Yorke in any such trade unless we got another major leaguer who improves the team. Perhaps a better bullpen arm or a shortstop?

 

[CoffeeNerdness]

Preemptive strike in case the Red Sox PR team tries to paint the player in a negative light on the way out of town, like they have done in the past with people leaving the organization.

Would the Padres lower their offer if Halloran torched Bogie on the way to Cali? I don't get it-- they already made their money and probably want to keep a top payroll team not pissed off. If he's so Machiavellian that he's trying to get Bloom fired by turning the fan base against him then that's a pretty wild angle. As others have noted; Speier being on the byline suggests that the sources are coming from inside the house.

 

[chawson]

Zunino is a bit interesting. He was pretty bad last year but had a really good 2021 in which he hit 30+ home runs. Maybe he could be a DH option?

I think he'd be the short-side of the catching platoon, at least initially. He's a tremendous pitch framer (or was in 2021), and he absolutely annihilated left-handed pitching to the tune of an .342/.419/.868 line over 129 PAs.

It'd be an interesting tandem if it works, with Zunino hitting moon blasts and McGuire slicing his little frisbee shots over the infielders' heads.

 

[soxhop411]

Boras has a longstanding feud with the Rays organization and everyone in it. He, as you might expect, hates their approach and rails against them at every opportunity. He can't really do anything to them because they don't need him, but taking advantage of an opening to anonymously shiv Bloom when he's looking weak and there's this brewing anti "Tampa North" sentiment in Boston wouldn't exactly be out of character for Boras. Much better for him to have Dombrowskis vs Blooms in place at the richest teams.

also has a "feud" with the dodgers (really its the dodgers who wont deal with Boras clients)

Ken Rosenthal’s Athletic notes column from Monday morning was full of juiced-up nuggets for Dodgers fans, once again winking at the team’s potential pursuit of Jacob deGrom/Justin Verlander by reminding everyone how much Andrew Friedman’s group loves short-term, high-AAV deals (Verlander and the Dodgers are reportedly meeting this week).

Equally as important, though, Rosenthal colored in the unofficial line in the sand between Friedman and Boras, noting that the two sides haven’t done business on a multi-year deal since … ever.

The last Boras-Dodgers “mega-contract” was a relatively tame pact for Hyun-Jin Ryu back in 2012 under previous stewardship. LA bid for Gerrit Cole back in 2019, but reportedly came up well short.

https://dodgersway.com/2022/11/29/dodgers-scott-boras-relationship-julio-urias-extension-poison/

 

[absintheofmalaise]

Would the Monster help or hurt him? If he needs to stay in RCF to not become pull happy, that may not play well in Fenway.

Here's what his 2022 batted ball chart would look like at Fenway. The one on the right is Truist. Looks pretty good for 81 games at Fenway. More doubles and home runs. He also had 18 steals in 2022. No idea how the no shift and larger bases will help add to that total.

 

[VORP Speed]

also has a "feud" with the dodgers (really its the dodgers who wont deal with Boras clients)



https://dodgersway.com/2022/11/29/dodgers-scott-boras-relationship-julio-urias-extension-poison/

Yes, it's all related. Boras can't get to Vito or Michael, so he's trying to take out Fredo.

 

[BringBackMo]

Yes, it's all related. Boras can't get to Vito or Michael, so he's trying to take out Fredo.

This hurt.

 

[sezwho]

I don't know if I totally buy this "disrespected.... poisoned the well...." bullshit. The team you're playing for offers you what you perceive to be a low offer prior to Free Agency where you see other players you feel you're at least as good as get more. So what? Say no and that you feel you deserve more. Are these players that butt-hurt by a low offer that they can't get over it? Fuck that. Seriously. I don't want these overly sensitive athletes then. They're STILL being offered millions more than 99.999% of us will see in our lifetime to play a game...... I know it's relative but I just don't get this "poisoned/disrespected" bullshit and then feeling like you're going to "get them" back by going elsewhere. I run a small construction company and after I put in some time putting a bid together and the client says, "oh... that's thousands more than I can pay" I just say okay.... let's start again. Here's my value and where can we meet on this? If they're freaking shitsticks.... then sure. But offering less than perceived self-worth isn't being an asshole, it's just business for fuck sake.

I think its just as silly that you dismiss it.

An agent's greatest fear (after performance and legal issues) is the client signing a hometown discount: thats the threat to maxing revenue. Dropping an craptastic offer plays right into the hands of the agent. Yes, Scott Boras FA anyway for X.

In any case, I think it impacted Lester but I don't think it impacted X. No I don't have inside info.

 

[brandonchristensen]

When Correa eventually signs, his one year 'prove it' season is going to pay off. Judge holding off also paid off. Xander had a pretty down year for him, his power was way down, and it paid off huge.

So 2021 was the year to sign people long term it seems.

 

[Red(s)HawksFan]

When Correa eventually signs, his one year 'prove it' season is going to pay off. Judge holding off also paid off. Xander had a pretty down year for him, his power was way down, and it paid off huge.

So 2021 was the year to sign people long term it seems.

Before the new CBA, which is probably the biggest reason none of them were signed then (well, technically Bogaerts was signed long term).

 

[ehaz]

When Correa eventually signs, his one year 'prove it' season is going to pay off. Judge holding off also paid off. Xander had a pretty down year for him, his power was way down, and it paid off huge.

So 2021 was the year to sign people long term it seems.

Yep. Easier to say this in hindsight, but they should've just spent all this luxury tax space a year early if they hated long-term deals so much. Gausman at 5/$110M and Freeman at 6/$160M look like two of the better contracts in baseball right now.

I'm still optimistic about the Story deal. Even if he doesn't get completely back to his 2016 - 2020 offensive numbers, he's an easy 5 WAR player if healthy with a dash of positive regression.

 

[54thMA]

I don't know if I totally buy this "disrespected.... poisoned the well...." bullshit. The team you're playing for offers you what you perceive to be a low offer prior to Free Agency where you see other players you feel you're at least as good as get more. So what? Say no and that you feel you deserve more. Are these players that butt-hurt by a low offer that they can't get over it? Fuck that. Seriously. I don't want these overly sensitive athletes then. They're STILL being offered millions more than 99.999% of us will see in our lifetime to play a game...... I know it's relative but I just don't get this "poisoned/disrespected" bullshit and then feeling like you're going to "get them" back by going elsewhere. I run a small construction company and after I put in some time putting a bid together and the client says, "oh... that's thousands more than I can pay" I just say okay.... let's start again. Here's my value and where can we meet on this? If they're freaking shitsticks.... then sure. But offering less than perceived self-worth isn't being an asshole, it's just business for fuck sake.

Tremendous.

It's business, it's nothing personal, but the players make it personal and shame of them for doing so.

In my business, someone comes to me with a collection they want to sell; I run the numbers, come up with a fair number and offer it..............it's up to them to either take it or counter offer.

It's called a NEGOTIATION.

I don't start with my best offer, we go back and forth; if we can't agree on a number that we are both happy with, then both parties walk away, no harm, no foul.

I'm not going to pay 20K for a collection that in my mind is worth 22K, I have a number I won't go past and that's that, nothing ventured, nothing gained.

If another dealer wants to overpay, then have at it; just like if another team wants to overpay, then have at it.

I think the timing of this is what's bothering people from what I gather, a day after Quasimodo agreed to stay a Yankee.

Good for him; good for them, best of luck to both parties.

 

[JM3]

Yep. Easier to say this in hindsight, but they should've just spent all this luxury tax space a year early if they hated long-term deals so much. Gausman at 5/$110M and Freeman at 6/$160M look like two of the better contracts in baseball right now.

I'm still optimistic about the Story deal. Even if he doesn't get completely back to his 2016 - 2020 offensive numbers, he's an easy 5 WAR player if healthy with a dash of positive regression.

It's kind of insane how good of a season Gausman had last year while allowing a .364 BABIP (next worst in the league was .329 by Jose Berrios).

 

[grimshaw]

With Nimmo off the board, that Yelich contract isn't looking too bad now if the Sox want to pivot to the trade market.

 

[Tokyo Sox]

Most of the players signed by the sox this week came out of nowhere, (no rumors, Leaks etc)....
take Masataka Yoshida for example

Well not nowhere nowhere:

http://sonsofsamhorn.net/index.php?threads/lets-sign-some-hitters.37903/post-5245024

See the 2nd tweet. That was on November 1st. While other teams were discussed as potential good fits, the Sox were one of the few directly linked in this way, at least that I saw.

 

[mikcou]

Yep. Easier to say this in hindsight, but they should've just spent all this luxury tax space a year early if they hated long-term deals so much. Gausman at 5/$110M and Freeman at 6/$160M look like two of the better contracts in baseball right now.

I'm still optimistic about the Story deal. Even if he doesn't get completely back to his 2016 - 2020 offensive numbers, he's an easy 5 WAR player if healthy with a dash of positive regression.

He's an easy 5 win player who has had 1 5 fWAR (6 in 2019) season and 2 bWAR (6 in 2018 and 7 in 2019) in his 7 year career? Who now has an elbow injury that seems to preclude him from playing shortstop and whose bat has declined?

There's a reason that he only got $140M last offseason - he's a good (and maybe very good) player, but not an elite player. The $140M pricing wasn't just the lockout - the Rangers offered the same amount to him before signing Marcus Semien.

Edit: To be clear, I think the deal is quite reasonable for what he is likely to be - one or two four win seasons and a few three win seasons. There's enough there to get the 15-17 wins over the course of 6 years to make the deal worth it. I just think the idea that hes a clear 5 win player as far fetched given his career and his recent performance with the bat.

 

[67YAZ]

The Cubs have been linked to Swanson and his fiancé plays for the Chicago Red Stars.

Re: Mal Pugh - we’ll see how long she is for Chicago. First, under the new CBA the USWNT no longer tops up salaries for players on the national team. The NWSL salary cap also increased, but it’s clear that for elite talent, like Pugh, there will be much more lucrative playing contracts at the top European clubs than in the NWSL near term. Increased endorsement opportunities from staying in the States might make up the difference, but that’s for the agents to figure out & advise.

Second, the Red Stars are up for sale because their owner was found to have known about and tolerated all manners of abusive behavior by their manager for a decade. No one will blame Red Stats players for wanting to leave right now.

Finally, Bears fans were sure JJ Watt was coming to town because his wife is also on the Red Stars. Yeah, didn’t quite work out.

 

[Pozo the Clown]

The Cubs have been linked to Swanson and his fiancé plays for the Chicago Red Stars.

...the Red Stars are up for sale...

Sam Kennedy can inform the Swansons that the Fenway Sports Group is looking to purchase the Red Stars and relocate them to Boston. Who would ever question that?

 

[BaseballJones]

With Nimmo off the board, that Yelich contract isn't looking too bad now if the Sox want to pivot to the trade market.

The contract might not be bad, but the production is.

2018-2019: 1063 ab, 80 hr, 207 rbi, .327/.415/.631/1.046, 171 ops+, 1 hr every 13.3 ab
2020-2022: 1174 ab, 35 hr, 130 rbi, .243/.358/.388/.745, 107 ops+, 1 hr every 33.5 ab

 

[soxhop411]

Well not nowhere nowhere:

http://sonsofsamhorn.net/index.php?threads/lets-sign-some-hitters.37903/post-5245024

See the 2nd tweet. That was on November 1st. While other teams were discussed as potential good fits, the Sox were one of the few directly linked in this way, at least that I saw.

But thats kind of my point. No “mainstream” reporter even had a whiff of this signing until it happened.

shows that the FO does not leak who it actually targets

 

[soxhop411]

Well not nowhere nowhere:

http://sonsofsamhorn.net/index.php?threads/lets-sign-some-hitters.37903/post-5245024

See the 2nd tweet. That was on November 1st. While other teams were discussed as potential good fits, the Sox were one of the few directly linked in this way, at least that I saw.

And its not just this season. Last season as well. most of the trades made were not heavily reported until it was done (or pretty much a done deal)

and i am perfectly fine with having a FO that does not publicly leak its targets

 

[Sad Sam Jones]

At least with guys like Burnes and Bieber, you know for sure what you're getting when gutting the farm.

With Bieber you're getting nothing, because there's absolutely no chance Cleveland is trading their ace this winter. The youngest team in baseball just won the AL Central and are favorites to repeat. The only thing they lost was their tandem of banjo-hitting catchers. They already addressed their biggest weakness by signing Josh Bell to a short-term contract. They are taking advantage of their window and aren't considering blowing a huge gaping hole in the top of their rotation right now. No one in NE Ohio is having that conversation, so stop believing random clickbait idiots with no sources and no insight.

If they decide they can't resign Bieber or that it's not in their best interest, they'll trade him to a National League team next winter. They aren't the Rays shipping guys out to avoid their arbitration years. They only trade guys early if they've burned too many bridges (Bauer) or when a team offers a half-dozen players for a mid-rotation guy (Clevinger). They've done well with that approach, because when someone offers them Alex Verdugo for their homegrown star, Antonneti turns them down, waits and then trades that star for Andres Gimenez.

 

[Tokyo Sox]

and i am perfectly fine with having a FO that does not publicly leak its targets

Yeah no argument with that, for sure. To be clear since the sourcing was in Japanese on that tweet from November, it's safe to assume it was someone in Yoshida's camp or some other source onshore here, rather than from the Sox FO so, that supports your overall point.

 

[cantor44]

Tremendous.

It's business, it's nothing personal, but the players make it personal and shame of them for doing so.

In my business, someone comes to me with a collection they want to sell; I run the numbers, come up with a fair number and offer it..............it's up to them to either take it or counter offer.

It's called a NEGOTIATION.

I don't start with my best offer, we go back and forth; if we can't agree on a number that we are both happy with, then both parties walk away, no harm, no foul.

I'm not going to pay 20K for a collection that in my mind is worth 22K, I have a number I won't go past and that's that, nothing ventured, nothing gained.

If another dealer wants to overpay, then have at it; just like if another team wants to overpay, then have at it.

I think the timing of this is what's bothering people from what I gather, a day after Quasimodo agreed to stay a Yankee.

Good for him; good for them, best of luck to both parties.

But there IS a psychology to this, in fact. A baseball player is a human being, and not an inanimate object. And in Bogaerts' case, a human being who had done a lot for the organization - been a model citizen, a leader, a winner, an all-star, and a fan favorite. AND, a guy still in his prime (albeit perhaps towards the back half) . Like any human being, I'm sure he wanted the FO to acknowledge that - to acknowledge what he has meant to this era of the Red Sox. The 2021 off-season offer they made to him WAS in fact, relative the going rate, disrespectful. I suspect that felt alienating to him.

Remember it's all relative. YES, he makes millions, more that the vast majority of people in human history, etc., but that's not quite the point. In the world Xander lives and breathes in, that's not what he sees.

Imagine if you work some corporate job, a flush Fortune 500 joint, you've been with the company ten years, by all accounts everyone KNOWS you're the best at what you do within the company, and you play by all the rules, universally loved. Then they bring a new guy, external hire, who isn't quite as good as you, pay him more with a long commitment, and offer you a token raise at the same time. You might be thinking, "What the fuck is going on around here?" And your co-workers who've been in there with you for a while, would be muttering the same thing to themselves.

It would have been prudent for the Red Sox brass to have read the room better. And not negotiate in the same formulaic way that you negotiate for pipe fittings. Because if they had made a more respectful aggressive offer from the get go in 2021, it WOULD NOT have meant they would have then had to go to 11-years. THAT would NOT have been the eventuality. In fact, if they had made an offer close to what they got to in 2022, a year earlier, I suspect Bogaerts would have taken it. I can't know that, but that's my suspicion.

But it is a false choice to suggest the Sox had to choose between letting Xander go, or giving him an 11-year contract. Yes, that was true December, 2022, and at that point, yeah, probably should let him walk. But that would not have been true in December of 2021. And then and there, an earnest negotiation that was somewhat more oriented to the PERSON, in his full context, would likely have been more effective.

 

[jon abbey]

But there IS a psychology to this, in fact. A baseball player is a human being, and not an inanimate object. And in Bogaerts' case, a human being who had done a lot for the organization - been a model citizen, a leader, a winner, an all-star, and a fan favorite. AND, a guy still in his prime (albeit perhaps towards the back half) . Like any human being, I'm sure he wanted the FO to acknowledge that - to acknowledge what he has meant to this era of the Red Sox. The 2021 off-season offer they made to him WAS in fact, relative the going rate, disrespectful. I suspect that felt alienating to him.

Remember it's all relative. YES, he makes millions, more that the vast majority of people in human history, etc., but that's not quite the point. In the world Xander lives and breathes in, that's not what he sees.

Imagine if you work some corporate job, a flush Fortune 500 joint, you've been with the company ten years, by all accounts everyone KNOWS you're the best at what you do within the company, and you play by all the rules, universally loved. Then they bring a new guy, external hire, who isn't quite as good as you, pay him more with a long commitment, and offer you a token raise at the same time. You might be thinking, "What the fuck is going on around here?" And your co-workers who've been in there with you for a while, would be muttering the same thing to themselves.

It would have been prudent for the Red Sox brass to have read the room better. And not negotiate in the same formulaic way that you negotiate for pipe fittings. Because if they had made a more respectful aggressive offer from the get go in 2021, it WOULD NOT have meant they would have then had to go to 11-years. THAT would NOT have been the eventuality. In fact, if they had made an offer close to what they got to in 2022, a year earlier, I suspect Bogaerts would have taken it. I can't know that, but that's my suspicion.

But it is a false choice to suggest the Sox had to choose between letting Xander go, or giving him an 11-year contract. Yes, that was true December, 2022, and at that point, yeah, probably should let him walk. But that would not have been true in December of 2021. And then and there, an earnest negotiation that was somewhat more oriented to the PERSON, in his full context, would likely have been more effective.

The complicating factor here is that in Dec 2021 he looked like a major defensive liability, so that’s a lot harder to commit to long-term. If he had played defense in 2021 like he did in 2022, I think there’s a much better chance BOS signs him long-term a year ago as you say.

 

[Eddie Bressoud]

When Jansen and Yoshida are officially added, it looks like Sox will need to clear 2 spots on 40 man roster. End of Jeter Downs era, or a trade to make space?

 

[Petagine in a Bottle]

When Jansen and Yoshida are officially added, it looks like Sox will need to clear 2 spots on 40 man roster. End of Jeter Downs era, or a trade to make space?

I think Kelly and Ort would be the first to go. They probably need to trade a few from the Seabold, Winckowski, Crawford, etc group. After that, Park probably goes if they add a SS. But yeah, Downs spot certainly could be in jeopardy before long.

 

[chawson]

I think Kelly and Ort would be the first to go. They probably need to trade a few from the Seabold, Winckowski, Crawford, etc group. After that, Park probably goes if they add a SS. But yeah, Downs spot certainly could be in jeopardy before long.

Kelly is here to stay, I think. May not open the year on the 26 but he's very solid.

 

[Rice4HOF]

The complicating factor here is that in Dec 2021 he looked like a major defensive liability, so that’s a lot harder to commit to long-term. If he had played defense in 2021 like he did in 2022, I think there’s a much better chance BOS signs him long-term a year ago as you say.

The problem is that his defensive "improvement" was a mirage that does not look like will be sustainable next year. He was a plus defender (5 OAA) on the 1st base of second base when in the shift, but still negative on the traditional 3rd base side. So without the shift he's still a defensive liability, and the shift ban will be in place starting next season.
Fangraphs article with details

 

[adcasaletto]

Rodon looking for 7 years.
https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2022/12/carlos-rodon-rumors-seven-year-deal-luxury-tax-yankees-red-sox.html

 

[E5 Yaz]

Rodon looking for 7 years.
https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2022/12/carlos-rodon-rumors-seven-year-deal-luxury-tax-yankees-red-sox.html

Loved this line

Reporter Marino Pepénsays the Red Sox are interested, though the extent of interest isn’t clear.

 

[adcasaletto]

Loved this line

Reporter Marino Pepénsays the Red Sox are interested, though the extent of interest isn’t clear.

They'll "be in on him"

 

[Pozo the Clown]

They'll "be in on him"

Without question. But will they achieve that all-important "momentum?"

 

[adcasaletto]

Without question. But will they achieve that all-important "momentum?"

I'm not sure, but "heavy discussions" are almost guaranteed....

 

[chrisfont9]

Apropos of nothing, Rodon turns 30 tomorrow. At least it makes it easy to claculate which out years in his eventual contract we should get mad about.

 

[chawson]

Carlos Rodón seeking a seven-year deal, per Susan Slusser of SF Chronicle.

Man, that Chris Sale contract is looking better every day!

 

[KillerBs]

Bloom offered 2/32 and is waiting to hear back.

 

[E5 Yaz]

No one reads threads anymore