As someone who spent multiple days in the hospital with a Tachycardia after getting COVID in August 2020 (AKA pre-vaccine), a condition that reappeared in May and now has me on multiple maintenance meds daily, I really have a lot of trouble with the "vaccine is bad for your heart" takes.
The answer to both of these posts is simple. This forum is about the Red Sox and this discussion is about how the team is affected by things like choosing to not get vaccinated with the knowledge that the player would not be able to play in Toronto. If that player can be expected to be a net positive contributor, that hurts the team.
Don't they? What are their options? IMO it's not artificial, it's very real. Hence the angst about this.
Nice try. Morons, because without any good documented reason, they are actively hurting their teams competitive chances. This isn't about "views", it's about what priority these morons put on fulfilling their end of very lucrative contracts, and their obligation to do everything in their power to compete and give their team the best chance for success. To say nothing of the priority they put on their own health, and that of their families and communities. In all cases, it's obviously very low. So yeah, I think that makes them, objectively, morons.
I'd like to think that I would end up there, but I'll probably end up rooting for them anyway. And just disliking them while I do.
I can't tell if you're being sincere but I'll treat it as a sincere miscommunication between us. I see it as an artificial competitive disadvantage because it is one that was created by players' decisions not to do a simple thing that (absent an unlikely medical condition) their doctors would have recommended that they do. They aren't missing these guys because they are sick or hurt, or out on bereavement or paternal leave; they are missing them because of their choice.
On the brighter side, it will be that much easier to root for the guys that are allowed to play in Canada. And when the non vaxxers are eventually dealt, allowed to walk or let go there will be less tears shed.
Why is a player subjected to a rule that what they feel is best for their body and personal well-being is a detriment to the team?
The rule for this forum is that the conversation will focus on baseball issues or it will not include you.
Undoubtedly true. But I guess the reason I am angry about it is in the case of the Red Sox, as with all other cubs, it is a completely avoidable, self-inflicted wound. And while(strictly from a fan perspective) I don't much care how other teams are affected by the restrictions in Toronto, if it potentially costs the Sox a playoff spot by a game or two, I think those that decided not to compete should be called out for their selfishness and stupidity.
That's fair, but I wasn't the one who brought it up. You have others attacking players because of "non-baseball" decisions yet they don't get the same warning?
No, because the player has no ability to affect or change Canada's laws and rules. They absolutely have the ability to get vaccinated to ensure they are available to compete.
Where is Sprowl's scythe when it's needed most? This guy would be more at home at Sons of Gehrig38
The topic can be discussed without straying from baseball issues.
Thanks AR. Just saw the reports.
Happy to take this to PM, but how do you know this? It's very possible this player was advised by their doctor not to be. Those people do exist.
I, and I think most posters here frustrated by potential absences, would be fine if they have a legitimate medical reason preventing them from getting vaccinated. Bad luck in that case, but it's what it is. My understanding is that such instances are exceedingly rare (especially for someone so healthy as to be a professional athlete), so I assume that the decision not to get a shot boils down to (imho, incredibly misinformed) "personal choice".
You're right they could have, but chose not to just like so many others in every walk of life. We don't have to like it, but it's something that lives among us. Why do we expect it to be any different in MLB than it is in many (if not most) other work places? I may have misconstrued your use of artificial. I agree about the disadvantage seeing it as unnecessary rather than artificial and FWIW "just because other teams are" really doesn't address anything I posted.
Because the reasons not to get vaccinated are vanishingly small and if any of these players had one (let's say a very rare severe documented allergy), they would be able to get an exemption.
I've no issue with any of this and hate the idea of the season possibly going down to the last week with a playoff spot at stake and a series scheduled in Toronto. It's just my own personal take that I'm not going to get worked up over it. For over two years now the effects of this pandemic has affected us all in many ways similar as well as unique. Much of that I have had little control over. I do have control over my fandom of this team and while there are always going to be things that I don't like about certain aspects of the game, the team or certain players, I choose not to let this particular issue suck the joy out of this season.
Respectfully, I disagree with the bolded. I took your post to mean (in large part) that you aren't going to get worked up over missing some players in Toronto because the same is true for other teams. My point was and is that other teams missing players in Toronto didn't mean the Sox had to and doesn't excuse these Sox players' choices which will cause them to miss the games in Toronto. If the Sox had no unvaccinated players (like Texas apparently), they might have enjoyed something of an advantage over other AL East teams in Toronto. It's possible that how each of the AL East contenders play in Toronto might be the difference in reaching the playoffs this year and missing players will almost certainly impact these teams' performance there. I'm fairly sure you and I agree on all of that. I think you may be more resigned to the reality of anti-vax intransigence and less willing to let it bother you. Frankly, I wish I could be that way.
I agree I will probably still root for the team, in spite of the selfish anti vaccination players who are CHOOSING to take off critical series against division rivals.
I may be wrong, but was it Rizzo in the past few weeks who made a comment something like "It won't be an issue." when asked about this?
Not even as a comparison with the vaccines, but what evidence is there or has there ever been that recommended doses of creatine are harmful? Everything I’ve ever read claims it’s the safest supplement out there - along with protein powders and multivitamins.
Good god, just imagining that scenario has me absolutely heated. There's a decent chance it could come down to that second-to-last series in Toronto - that MLB projection that came out a few weeks ago had a 4-way tie in the division to end the season.
I know that Creatine is generally safe when taken within recommended doses. I'm sure you know that there aren't a ton of studies that have looked at long-term creatine use, particularly when combined with other stuff professional athletes take.
This one reason why I think Rizzo is vaccinated. Yankees were cool with giving him two years, so I think they knew his status and that he wouldn't be missing 9 games a year in TOR and potentially playoff games.
For purposes of this thread, the money is irrelevant to me (except insofar as it preclude acquiring more talent). The bigger and more important the contributor, the more annoyed I will be that they chose to be ineligible to play in Toronto. I wouldn’t miss Shaw or Brasier (who I suspect won’t be making the trip) but I would miss Xander and Whitlock.
