Red Sox in season discussion

Sandy Leon Trotsky

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I don’t think anyone here thinks the Sox have done a great job developing pitchers. That said…. They’ve figured out other ways to win and to acquire pitchers.
Bloom is doing a great job acquiring cost controlled pitchers, no doubt, and I think over the next 3 years we’ll start seeing more homegrown talent there.
Winchester Guy’s complaints ^^^^ are pretty silly and narrow.
 

Petagine in a Bottle

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Isn’t it worth noting that the payroll problems brought on by the contracts they gave Price and Sale made it so they had to make difficult decisions regarding Betts and others, though? Acquiring top shelf pitching via free agency and trade is incredibly expensive and risky. E-Rod is one of the best FA pitchers and he won’t come cheap - and he’s hardly elite. I don’t think it’s controversial to say that the best teams almost always have excellent pitching, whereas you can find teams that have a good offense but aren’t good teams.

With the shifts in the game, though, it’s not all about starters and relievers are more important that ever- but again, developing a lot of those guys helps and the Sox haven’t really been able to do that, hence having to bring in guys like Ottavino, Robles, and the like who tend to not be very good. But finding Whitlock was a boon, a good probably just needs 3x of him.
 

jon abbey

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Obviously it helps payroll flexibility if you draft/develop/acquire pre-arb contributors, but just as obviously, it doesn't matter much if those are pitchers or position players. The more cost-controlled guys you have, the less you have to (over)spend to fill in holes.
 

Petagine in a Bottle

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Highest paid pitchers in 2021…this seems like pretty good rationale for why you want to develop your own, and spend the big $$$ on hitters.

Cole 36.0
Scherzer 34.5
Verlander 33.0
Strasburg 32.0
Price 32.0
Bauer 31.3
Kershaw 31.0
Sale 30.0
Greinke 29.0
DeGrom 28.1
 

scottyno

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Highest paid pitchers in 2021…this seems like pretty good rationale for why you want to develop your own, and spend the big $$$ on hitters.

Cole 36.0
Scherzer 34.5
Verlander 33.0
Strasburg 32.0
Price 32.0
Bauer 31.3
Kershaw 31.0
Sale 30.0
Greinke 29.0
DeGrom 28.1
The top 5 highest paid batters this year includes Trout (injury) and Cabrera and Pujols (suck). It's better than the pitching after that, but not that much better, especially since most of the guys on this pitching list are old and near the end of what was already a successful contract.
 

EricFeczko

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E5 Yaz

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Isn’t it worth noting that the payroll problems brought on by the contracts they gave Price and Sale made it so they had to make difficult decisions regarding Betts and others, though? Acquiring top shelf pitching via free agency and trade is incredibly expensive and risky. E-Rod is one of the best FA pitchers and he won’t come cheap - and he’s hardly elite. I don’t think it’s controversial to say that the best teams almost always have excellent pitching, whereas you can find teams that have a good offense but aren’t good teams.

With the shifts in the game, though, it’s not all about starters and relievers are more important that ever- but again, developing a lot of those guys helps and the Sox haven’t really been able to do that, hence having to bring in guys like Ottavino, Robles, and the like who tend to not be very good. But finding Whitlock was a boon, a good probably just needs 3x of him.
The point is, and what our now-vacationing lurker couldn't grasp, is that these things neither exist in a vacuum nor do they develop immediately.

Bloom had to find stop-gap players while rebuilding and evaluating the system while beginning to reverse the prospect drain from the DD years. That the Red Sox performed as well as they did this season is nothing less than a minor miracle.

Sure, the Dodgers can devote nearly their entire draft to pitching ... because they have a major league roster and minor league system chock full of young everyday talent.

Claiming Bloom has failed after two years on the job simply displays a lack of understanding about the job he inherited and the moving pieces he needed to address.
 

E5 Yaz

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They have won 4 World Series in 17 years without developing much in the realm of starting pitching. That's pretty good, I guess.
But wouldn't you rather have a steady stream of young bullpen arms and no titles?
 

Petagine in a Bottle

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Oh, totally agree. Bloom has already landed Whitlock, and to a lesser extent, Pivetta, which is such a massive ROI. You need to acquire pitching talent, don’t necessarily need to draft or develop it. And Bloom has only had 2 drafts, only one of them normal, and the early returns are pretty promising. I agree that you can’t fault him for the system not having much pitching talent in the minors, yet. So 100% on the same page.
 

Yelling At Clouds

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Highest paid pitchers in 2021…this seems like pretty good rationale for why you want to develop your own, and spend the big $$$ on hitters.

Cole 36.0
Scherzer 34.5
Verlander 33.0
Strasburg 32.0
Price 32.0
Bauer 31.3
Kershaw 31.0
Sale 30.0
Greinke 29.0
DeGrom 28.1
I don’t think it’s really wise to evaluate any of those deals based on 2021 alone. Certainly the respective teams would do the Scherzer, Kershaw, and Verlander deals again, though, and probably deGrom also.

EDIT: or what @scottyno said
 

thehitcat

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The Red Sox have big decisions and changes to be made... in 2023. For 2022, I expect Bloom will follow through on the long-term plan based on an improving farm system.

The Red Sox have long-term answers at 1B and 2B in Casas and Downs, so they will probably make due with Dalbec and Arroyo for 2022, either full-time or as halves of a platoon. Bogaerts and Devers hold down SS and 3B for one more year before Bogaerts can opt out and the big calls need to be made. Cora obviously trusts Vazquez, so I think the club will pick up Vazquez' option. Plawecki is a cromulent backup, and won't cost much. LF Verdugo, CF Hernandez and RF Renfroe are all cheap and locked in for 2022.

Martinez will probably opt out, and not be re-signed. I suspect that Bloom and Cora would prefer to rotated position players through the DH spot rather than signing a full-time DH.

Farewell to Santana and Shaw.

Starting rotation: Eovaldi, Sale, Pivetta, Whitlock and Houck. Edro's return depends on the asking price. Farewell to Richards and Perez.

Bullpen: Barnes, Brasier, Sawamura, Hernandez, Taylor and Davis return. Valdez rides the shuttle again. Farewell to Ottavino and Robles, who will cost more than Bloom wants to pay relievers.

Needs:

1) LHB for 1B. Schwarber improved in the field with time, so if he is interested in returning as a DH-1B-LF, Bloom will probably make a strong bid.

2) a utility infielder and platoon partner for Arroyo. Iglesias might sign on for old times' sake. He obviously loves playing in Boston, the city loves him in return, and he won't cost much. Still, Bloom doesn't strike me as the sentimental type, and he can probably find a LHB 2B to platoon with Arroyo. Arauz will ride the shuttle for one more year.

3) 2 starting pitchers for depth, possibly including Seabold.

4) 2 high-quality relievers. Bullpen was the weak spot of the 2021 Red Sox, and all of Bloom's dealing never quite fixed that.
I like your ideas and would like to subscribe to your newsletter @Sprowl I think this is the perfect offseason. If Chaim executes on this it puts us in a great spot for next season and the seasons to come. Yes it's not sexy but it brings back a good corps and leaves us roster flexibility for the inevitable ups and downs of our young players and pitchers.
 

Petagine in a Bottle

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I don’t think it’s really wise to evaluate any of those deals based on 2021 alone. Certainly the respective teams would do the Scherzer, Kershaw, and Verlander deals again, though, and probably deGrom also.
I think that’s fair. Where it probably gets risky is having two of those deals on your staff at the same time - tying up $60m per in two starting pitchers can really complicate your team planning- saw it happen with the Sox with Sale and Price, the Nats with Strasburg and Corbin (even though Scherzer was still effective).
 

scottyno

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I think that’s fair. Where it probably gets risky is having two of those deals on your staff at the same time - tying up $60m per in two starting pitchers can really complicate your team planning- saw it happen with the Sox with Sale and Price, the Nats with Strasburg and Corbin (even though Scherzer was still effective).
Or the 2021 Dodgers who have 4 (3.5 really) of those players and exactly 1 of them is kind of available right now
 

Petagine in a Bottle

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Or the 2021 Dodgers who have 4 (3.5 really) of those players and exactly 1 of them is kind of available right now
Yeah, kind of a weird case since they are only paying half of Price’s salary, and have deferred Scherzer’s. But I guess having a huge payroll overall and having guys like Buehler, Urias, Muncy, etc dramatically over perform their salaries helps.
 

billy ashley

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Looking over the list of those prospects a couple pieces of context:

Ty Buttrey actually retired due to him not enjoying his career.

https://www.si.com/mlb/2021/04/04/ty-buttrey-angels-pitcher-unexpectedly-retires-mlb#:~:text=ANAHEIM, Calif.,and less of a game.

He had plenty to offer as a MLB quality reliever. The Angels got kind of unluckyhere.

I think the analysis above dismisses the impact of Yoan Moncada, who is a borderline star given his defense and OBP. He is a hell of a good player. Kopech was also filthy this year. He has a significant injury risk, but there is a reason he's been so highly regarded.

I'm more than fine with the Sale trade (I don't think we needed to include Basabe and Diaz) but we shouldn't dismiss how good of pieces we traded for Sale. Sale has totally been worth it, though. The Sox won a WS because of that trade. You do it again, every time. Plus, Moncada, as good as he is, was somewhat redundant because of Devers.
 

jtn46

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The Sox pitching is still ranked in the bottom half of mlb, at 16th place in ERA. Sox wasted over $20M on Richards, Perez, and Ottavino, that could have been used to secure quality bullpen depth.

Re trades, Sox traded the best RF in baseball and didn't get back any pitching. Re draft, Bloom didn't draft any pitcher with Sox early picks in both years. Instead he drafted a second middle infielder after drafting a middle infielder with 1st pick in both years, rather than taking the best pitching prospect. The fact is no pitcher drafted by Bloom in 2 years is even ranked as a top 10 soxprospect, let alone a top 100 minor league prospect by BA.

Championship teams are built on pitching depth. Bloom has yet to prove he can build pitching depth in Sox organization.
If Leiter were there at 4 Bloom likely would have drafted him, but Mayer falling to us was in June a terrific outcome, had he drafted based on a more immediate need the Sox could have ended up punting the pick to 2022 as the Mets did drafting Rocker. We don’t know the future, maybe there will be 12 former-GM’s working at Amazon warehouses because they passed on 7-time Cy Young winner Andrew Painter, but with the information we had in June and have now picking Mayer over the pitchers drafted after the Sox pick was a relative no-brainer. Prospects can always be traded to fill known needs, so if the Sox lack pitching in the near future badly enough they can spin Mayer or Yorke.
 

ookami7m

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Always helpful to look back at those prospects that Dombrowski traded:
...

Ty Buttrey (Kinsler): Hasn't pitched since 2020 and will be 30 soon.
Buttrey actually retired from organized baseball during the 2020 season (beginning of the year I think) as he had lost the passion for the game.
 

Sandy Leon Trotsky

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Seems obvious but the best balance here is clearly to buy out arb years and get a long term contract getting the players best years (hopefully not getting TJ surgery years) whether they were “developed” in the Sox system or brought in via trade or Rule-5.
Assuming that the players are amenable to that- Mookie wasn’t. X was. Hopefully Devers will be.
Maybe after two more years Houck and Whitlock are a dominant starting combo and sign 8 year deals at a great value foregoing their arb earning years and FA time.
I think Severino did this (and now 2+ years of being a small to zero impact player due to injuries though)
 

oumbi

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Need a real starter. We cant pretend Sale will come back as vintage Chris Sale. Cant depend on Eovaldi.

Id resign Erod if hell take reasonable money.

I think JD is a better talent than Schwarbz, not sure what to do there honestly.

I think Chaim surprises us
I am not exactly sure what you mean by "can't depend." Are you referring to his health? He did start 32 games in 2021, which is pretty good. Are you referring to his ability be an effective pitcher? If so, please show us what data/information do you have that show this is in question for next year.
 

Ale Xander

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I expect JD to re-up so Kyle is probably gone unless they can deal Dalbek for a pitcher or a pair of prospects
Would like to Houck get a starter role
Would like to see Whitlock get the high leverage role but closer is ok too.
Pivetta as a 5th starter
Garrett the dicks and Perez probably gone
I’d like Arroyo to get the first shot at 2nd with Iglesias backing up MIF or winning the job at 2nd from Arroyo

sign Devers to a set of Brinks trucks (my #1 priority)

Get Chris Sale a nutritionist so he doesn’t look like an actor from a Sally Struthers commercial

Bring back Erod unless they make the aforementioned Dalbek trade
 

DeadlySplitter

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Schwarber's career line: .237/.343/.493/.836

Even if JD opts out I don't think Schwarber is returning. Those numbers show he walks and has pretty good power, but I don't think that's a long-term top of the order hitter. No good defensive position really hurts as well, we're lucky there was only one catastrophic play at 1B in the playoffs from him.
 

InsideTheParker

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Who knows what goes on behind the scenes, but IMO Bloom needs to sit down with Cora and develop some sort philosophy that embraces the teaching and execution of solid fundamental baseball. This was not a good defensive team, piss poor base running decisions that was often excused as being "aggressive", The Jekyll/Hyde approach at the plate between patience and first pitch swinging and the inability to drop a bunt when the situation calls for it are all facets of the game that need improvement. Sure this team went to the ACLS despite struggling in the areas I've mentioned, but I think aside from roster changes there needs to be a commitment to playing better, fundamental baseball.
How about getting somebody like this guy: https://www.nytimes.com/2021/10/22/sports/baseball/ron-washington-atlanta.html?

Within minutes, they were off to the grassy area in front of the dugout, each on his knees and facing the other from only a few feet away: Washington, 69, with his ever-present fungo bat, bouncing one-hoppers at Albies, 24, who was signed as an international free agent from Curaçao.

“That’s every day,” Atlanta Manager Brian Snitker said. “Every day. But you know what, you’ll drive yourself crazy if you don’t have that attitude every day in this sport. These guys have fun playing. It’s awesome.”
The results have been evident as Atlanta flourished in September and October, with Washington getting some acclaim for waving runners in successfully while the group of infielders he coaches plays airtight defense.
Six infielders — first baseman Freddie Freeman, Albies, shortstop Dansby Swanson, third baseman Austin Riley and the backups Ehire Adrianza and Johan Camargo — each work with the coach before batting practice. The sessions, according to Washington, last 4 minutes 35 seconds, during which he briskly hits 95 one-hoppers to each player. So 570 one-hoppers daily in around a half-hour of work.
The idea, as Washington hits to a variety of angles on both sides of each player, is to simulate the last hops of ground balls. “Because that’s the only hop that matters,” said Washington, who has long been regarded as one of the game’s best infield coaches.

“When you have a 69-year-old man out there outworking us, it makes us all want to work harder and that’s the key,” Freeman said. “We have a routine every single day. It’s just to wake your hands up, to make sure everything’s going right.”
 

E5 Yaz

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Getting back to the need for "speed," or at least the ability to run the bases well.

Schwarber is slow
Keekay can move
Devers is about average
X is about average
JDM is slow
Verdugo can run, although his judgement can be off
Renfroe is average for the type of player he is
Arroyo is slow
Vazquez/Plawecki are slow
Dalbec is also slow

Even if their batting approach would modify to emphasize contact along with power, this isn't a lineup that could take advantage of that change. They're not a first-to-third offense. They lead or are near the top in doubles, because Red Sox teams always are due to the ballpark, not stretching hits to the gap.

This athletic shortcoming also shows up on defense, examples of which we all can remember.

It really comes down to what sort of lineup the organization wants to field. But saying we'd want Arroyo and/or Schwarber back basically leads them into the same direction they are now.
 

InsideTheParker

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Getting back to the need for "speed," or at least the ability to run the bases well.

Schwarber is slow
Keekay can move
Devers is about average
X is about average
JDM is slow
Verdugo can run, although his judgement can be off
Renfroe is average for the type of player he is
Arroyo is slow
Vazquez/Plawecki are slow
Dalbec is also slow

Even if their batting approach would modify to emphasize contact along with power, this isn't a lineup that could take advantage of that change. They're not a first-to-third offense. They lead or are near the top in doubles, because Red Sox teams always are due to the ballpark, not stretching hits to the gap.

This athletic shortcoming also shows up on defense, examples of which we all can remember.

It really comes down to what sort of lineup the organization wants to field. But saying we'd want Arroyo and/or Schwarber back basically leads them into the same direction they are now.
How would you evaluate Iggy? Is he also slow? (I have no idea, just asking.)
 

amRadio

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Always helpful to look back at those prospects that Dombrowski traded:

Logan Allen (Kimbrel): ERA+ of 70 for the Indians in 2021. Is still only 24, but has yet to show anything at the major league level.

Carlos Asuaje (Kimbrel): Last major league at bat in 2018. Currently in Dodgers AAA affiliate.

Javy Guerra (Kimbrel): 25 career major league innings for the Padres. Shown nothing yet and is 26.

Manuel Margot (Kimbrel): Was my Portland binkie for a while. Regular outfielder for the Rays this past season, although a career OPS of 0.694 and has been consistently close nearly every season.

Jonathan Aro: Out of baseball.

Anderson Espinoza (Pomeranz): Actually started 20 games for the Padres minor league system this past year, with meh results. Has yet to throw a major league inning and will soon turn 24.

Victor Diaz (Sale): Out of baseball

Luis Basabe (Sale): 14 at bats in the major leagues. Looks to be a career minor leaguer at this point.

Michael Kopech (Sale): Was a good bullpen piece for the White Sox this season, but we are still talking 83 career innings at the major league level. Probably the one with the most potential among this entire group.

Juan Moncada (Sale): Has become an everyday infielder, but I doubt anyone would take him over Bogaerts or Devers.

Mauricio Dubon (Thornburgh): Has become a useful utility player for the Giants. Josh Pennington and Yeison Coca have yet to make the majors.

Santiago Espinal (Pearce): Has become a role player for the Blue Jays.

Jalen Beeks (Eovaldi): Had one good year for the Rays (2019), hasn't pitched much since due to injury.

Ty Buttrey (Kinsler): Hasn't pitched since 2020 and will be 30 soon.

Williams Jerez (Kinsler): Minor leaguer at age 30

Beating a dead horse, but this is why I love this website. What a great post.
 

allmanbro

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I'm especially interested to see what they do to improve the defense. It's not an easy problem, given their current personnel. Here's how I'd imagine a relatively conservative strategy to that end:

- I would be interested in shopping Dalbec and Renfroe if you can get anything worthwhile for them, and then try to replace them with better defenders (probably most likely trade Dalbec and platoon Renfroe)
- Take a shot again on a couple Marwin Gonzalez/Danny Santana type supersub candidates, and hope one works out better than those two did (and if so, consider using them as a late inning defensive replacement for Devers/Xander sometimes - I realize this is tough if you want to keep them happy, but if JD leaves, they can move to DH instead of taking them out entirely)
- Kiké's flexibility between CF and 2b is hugely helpful, because I think you can roll with Arroyo at 2b to start, and hope at least one of Arroyo or Duran looks like a starter with Kiké filling the other spot, and the already mentioned super-subs as backup plans.

Of course it's possible we see some much bigger moves as well. I don't think it impacts the way the team itself operates, but it seems worth noting that the success this year likely buys some patience with the media/fanbase if the team does things that are unexpected/unconventional or if the team takes a step back next year.
 

BaseballJones

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Boston players due to be free agents:
- Ottavino ($9m in 2021, FA in 2022)
- Rodriguez ($8.3m in 2021, FA in 2022)
- Iglesias ($3.5m in 2021, FA in 2022)
- Robles ($2m in 2021, FA in 2022)

Boston players with options:
- Vazquez ($6.25m in 2021, $7m team option in 2022)
- Richards ($8.5m in 2021, $10m team option in 2022)
- Schwarber ($7m in 2021, $11.5m mutual option in 2022)
- Perez ($4.5m in 2021, $6m team option in 2022)
- Martinez ($19.35m in 2021, $19.35m player option in 2022)

Due increases in pay:
- Barnes ($4.5m in 2021, $8.12m in 2022)
- Devers ($4.58m in 2021, arbitration in 2022)
- Renfroe ($3.1m in 2021, arbitration in 2022)

Intriguing MLB FAs:
1b Freddie Freeman
1b Anthony Rizzo
SS Carlos Correa
SS Marcus Semien
SS Trevor Story
IF Chris Taylor
SS Corey Seager
3b Kris Bryant
OF Jorge Soler
SP Kevin Gausman
SP Max Scherzer
SP Justin Verlander

And a ton of RP.
 

BaseballJones

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I don't see them picking up Richards' option, and I don't think they'll re-sign Ottavino. Perez is possible only because he doesn't really cost much for a guy who gives you innings.
 

Petagine in a Bottle

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Semien and Baez seem like interesting targets because they could play 2b and then be Bogaerts insurance for when he opts out, but sounds like Baez is likely to re-up with the Mets and Semien seems interested to go west. Freeman and Belt are intriguing but seem very unlikely to leave ATL and SF, respectively.

Feels like if they were going to bring back E-Rod, there’d be more talk around it, imagine the $$$ gets crazy. Really tough to know what they do this off-season, Bloom has no track record in a normal year.
 

effectivelywild

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I don’t think anyone here thinks the Sox have done a great job developing pitchers. That said…. They’ve figured out other ways to win and to acquire pitchers.
Bloom is doing a great job acquiring cost controlled pitchers, no doubt, and I think over the next 3 years we’ll start seeing more homegrown talent there.
Winchester Guy’s complaints ^^^^ are pretty silly and narrow.
I would also argue that the Sox lack of success with drafting and developing pitchers is an argument for why they shouldn't start investing a lot of high draft picks on them. If you're bad at something, it is not usually a good idea to keep doing it. Using the Dodgers as an example, I think it's easy to make the correlation vs causation mistake there.
The Dodgers have been good at developing pitching and they have invested a lot of draft capital in pitching. Now, you can argue that they are good at developing pitching because they invest a lot of high draft picks on pitchers. But you could just as easily argue that the Dodgers draft a lot of pitchers because they are good at developing pitching. If you're a business, and you're good at something, keep doing it!
Yes, obviously it would be better if the Sox would improve their ability to develop pitching prospects, but that's not going to happen overnight. And if I'm taking a look at the Sox organization as a whole and noting that it has historically been bad at developing pitching, maybe instead I think about "why is it that the organization has struggled to develop pitching?" If the answer isn't "Not drafting good pitchers," then the last thing you want to do is waste a bunch of draft picks on pitching. I feel like if we've learned anything from the analytic-friendly teams out there (such as the Tampa Bay and Oakland), its that you try to find something you're good at and then try to use that edge---the "surplus value"---to benefit the team.
 

InsideTheParker

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By the way, mlbn had a nice discussion led by Brian Kenny which emphasized how well the Sox did this year, crediting Bloom's signings, including Alex Cora.
 

nighthob

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The Sox pitching is still ranked in the bottom half of mlb, at 16th place in ERA. Sox wasted over $20M on Richards, Perez, and Ottavino, that could have been used to secure quality bullpen depth.
Boston took Ottavino from New York to acquire a pitching prospect, isn’t that what you want them doing?

Re trades, Sox traded the best RF in baseball and didn't get back any pitching.
The Dodgers weren’t willing to part with any pitching in exchange for Betts. They were willing to acquire a RP with a bad elbow and throw him in, Boston took a 2B prospect instead. Graterol has been a good reliever to date, but the elbow means that he has no upside as a starter. All told they’re better off with Downs. Especially if Yorke continues to destroy pitching as the youngest player in his league. Because then Downs becomes one of the most valuable trade chips in baseball.

Re draft, Bloom didn't draft any pitcher with Sox early picks in both years. Instead he drafted a second middle infielder after drafting a middle infielder with 1st pick in both years, rather than taking the best pitching prospect. The fact is no pitcher drafted by Bloom in 2 years is even ranked as a top 10 soxprospect, let alone a top 100 minor league prospect by BA.
In baseball you always draft the best available player. Unless you’re a small market team looking to save some cash. There’s nothing wrong with drafting a potentially elite SS after trading for a MI prospect and drafting a 2B. In two years Bloom has brought in 2 top 100 prospects via the draft and by the end of next year that will be at least three with Blaze Jordan blasting his way on to the list.

Championship teams are built on pitching depth. Bloom has yet to prove he can build pitching depth in Sox organization.
In the last year and a half he added Nick Pivetta and Jason Whitlock to the big league roster and Connor Seabold and Josh Winckowski to the system. He’s done exactly what you’re saying he hasn’t. You can acquire pitching in more ways than simply drafting it.
 
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curly2

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In the last year and a half he added Nick Pivetta and Jason Whitlock to the big league roster and Connor Seabold and Josh Winckowski to the system. He’s done exactly what you’re saying he hasn’t. You can acquire pitching in more ways than simply drafting it.
No wonder they couldn't hit the vaccine threshold. :)
 

BaseballJones

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In the last year and a half he added Nick Pivetta and Jason Whitlock to the big league roster and Connor Seabold and Josh Winckowski to the system. He’s done exactly what you’re saying he hasn’t. You can acquire pitching in more ways than simply drafting it.
No wonder he's down on the Sox' pitching acquisitions!!
 

nighthob

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That’s what I get for typing responses on two board simultaneously. You should have seen what I did to Ousmane Dieng’s name on the other board (and as that was a ‘22 NBA draft thread I was actually paying more attention there). Poor Garrett ending up associated with Jason Whitlock (why I had him on the brain I have no idea, I almost never read him).
 

cantor44

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While I know there are no sure things, the surest things the Red Sox have in the minors are Casas, Yorke, and Meyer. And their best young major leaguer is Devers. Doesn't give a lot of room on the infield for long term signings:

Casas up late 2022 or certainly early 2023.
Yorke might well be blazing his way through the minors a la Devers/X/Betts, and be up mid 2023.
Meyer, less intel, but if the scouting is correct, could be 2025 or sooner.

Sooooo .... this makes me feel the team should be disinclined to extend X now or if he opts out after 2022 (and insists on staying at short with any new long term deal), and be disinclined to sign any of the FA shortstops long term.

In that regard, given his age, maybe Semien would take a shorter term deal for big bucks? Would be great to have him, especially if he isn't gonna block any of the guys above.

I'd offer Schwarber a short term deal and see if he bites. If JD opts in, you just gotta rotate and rest between Verdugo/Renfroe/JD/Schwarb/Dalbec ... that's okay - we're all complaining about the depth. If Casas has knocked the door down mid season, you make a trade.

If they could nab Semien (maybe that's wishful thinking), then Arroyo could be infield utility - he'd be a nice piece off the bench. Or, consider Iglesias for that spot.

Offer long term deal to Devers.

ERod, yes, but only on a short term deal. He's too mercurial to commit to long term.

Whitlock and/or Houck to rotation.

Then, two blue chip bullpen pieces.
 

Bob Montgomerys Helmet Hat

has big, douchey shoulders
Lifetime Member
SoSH Member
While I know there are no sure things, the surest things the Red Sox have in the minors are Casas, Yorke, and Meyer. And their best young major leaguer is Devers. Doesn't give a lot of room on the infield for long term signings:

Casas up late 2022 or certainly early 2023.
Yorke might well be blazing his way through the minors a la Devers/X/Betts, and be up mid 2023.
Meyer, less intel, but if the scouting is correct, could be 2025 or sooner.

Sooooo .... this makes me feel the team should be disinclined to extend X now or if he opts out after 2022 (and insists on staying at short with any new long term deal), and be disinclined to sign any of the FA shortstops long term.

In that regard, given his age, maybe Semien would take a shorter term deal for big bucks? Would be great to have him, especially if he isn't gonna block any of the guys above.

I'd offer Schwarber a short term deal and see if he bites. If JD opts in, you just gotta rotate and rest between Verdugo/Renfroe/JD/Schwarb/Dalbec ... that's okay - we're all complaining about the depth. If Casas has knocked the door down mid season, you make a trade.

If they could nab Semien (maybe that's wishful thinking), then Arroyo could be infield utility - he'd be a nice piece off the bench. Or, consider Iglesias for that spot.

Offer long term deal to Devers.

ERod, yes, but only on a short term deal. He's too mercurial to commit to long term.

Whitlock and/or Houck to rotation.

Then, two blue chip bullpen pieces.
It's Mayer. You have to get that right.
 

jmanny24

Member
SoSH Member
Feb 6, 2003
584
I've seen that Chaim can now go after Tampa personnel if he wants. Is there anyone specific we think he will/should target?