Recommend me a laptop

twibnotes

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 16, 2005
20,232
If I do go mac book pro, is there any reason to go with the bigger hard drive? Seems like the price goes up a lot when you go from 128 GB to 256, and I already have an external HD with plenty of storage
 

Marceline

Well-Known Member
Lifetime Member
SoSH Member
Sep 9, 2002
6,441
Canton, MA
If you want to do the dual boot thing with Windows as some have mentioned above, you'd definitely want to go with 256. Otherwise, if you have an external drive, you probably would be fine with 128.
 

derekson

Member
SoSH Member
Jun 26, 2010
6,224
If I do go mac book pro, is there any reason to go with the bigger hard drive? Seems like the price goes up a lot when you go from 128 GB to 256, and I already have an external HD with plenty of storage
128 is probably enough unless you decide you definitely want to set up Bootcamp to dual boot Windows.

I'd recommend buying from B&H Photo unless you can find a better price. They usually have among the lowest prices as well as free shipping and no sales tax unless you're in NY.
 

twibnotes

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 16, 2005
20,232
This should be my last question...how important is it to buy a newer model with (with Retina display etc) and more what I assume to be ram? Older model is a good bit cheaper -->


Mac Pro 13" -->

2012 model:

2.5GHz processor
500 GB storage
4GB 1600MHz memory
Price = $1,033

Newer models (with Retina display)

2.7GHz processor
256 GB storage
8 GB 1866MHz LPDDR3 memory
Price = $1,409.

2.7GHz processor
128 GB storage
8 GB 1866MHz LPDDR3 memory
Price = $1,221

Considering I would also need to drop $150 for Microsoft office, the price looks like a huge premium vs buying a pc, especially for one of the newer models
 

Marceline

Well-Known Member
Lifetime Member
SoSH Member
Sep 9, 2002
6,441
Canton, MA
There is definitely a premium on the price if you go Mac. I wouldn't recommend getting something with only 4gb ram at this point.

I guess the other question is, would your wife be willing to switch to Windows? There are a number of great ultrabooks out there - I have an Asus Zenbook that I've been very happy with and cost about $800. The Dell XPS 13 also gets great reviews.
 

PedroSpecialK

Comes at you like a tornado of hair and the NHL sa
SoSH Member
Dec 12, 2004
27,164
Cambridge, MA
Starting a new job in a month and have been using my current work laptop for everything, so I'm gonna take the plunge and buy an at-home unit. Criteria I'm looking for:

>16 GB RAM
>1 TB Hard Drive
15.6" display or below
>4 hours battery on low performance
NVidia GTX 960M as baseline video card

I'll be using a dock at home with a monitor/keyboard/mouse... mainly looking at playing CS:GO, Football Manager 16, OotP, etc. Nothing super graphics-intensive but I'm looking for at least 4-5 years of performance.

Budget including monitor/keybord/mouse/dock purchases is around $1.8k. Seeing some laptops close on these for $1.2-$1.3k but wondering if anyone's had good experiences in this wheelhouse.
 

Couperin47

Member
SoSH Member
Starting a new job in a month and have been using my current work laptop for everything, so I'm gonna take the plunge and buy an at-home unit. Criteria I'm looking for:

>16 GB RAM
>1 TB Hard Drive
15.6" display or below
>4 hours battery on low performance
NVidia GTX 960M as baseline video card

I'll be using a dock at home with a monitor/keyboard/mouse... mainly looking at playing CS:GO, Football Manager 16, OotP, etc. Nothing super graphics-intensive but I'm looking for at least 4-5 years of performance.

Budget including monitor/keybord/mouse/dock purchases is around $1.8k. Seeing some laptops close on these for $1.2-$1.3k but wondering if anyone's had good experiences in this wheelhouse.
Well, considering your budget, you'll have no problem finding a solution, except I'm 95% sure nothing that meets those specs will actually run 4 hrs on battery (no matter what it claims).
 

mauf

Anderson Cooper × Mr. Rogers
Moderator
SoSH Member
How much do you value your marriage? I am not a Apple guy by any stretch of the imagination but I suspect that your transitioning to Apple will be better for your relationship than she transitioning to PC?
You haven't told us what the rationale is for wanting to go to one laptop for the two of you. Why not just stick with two and upgrade each when it's necessary?
These guys have bingo.

Buy your wife a new MacBook, then drop $400 on a cheap PC for your Excel needs. Go a little over budget in the name of marital harmony.
 

twibnotes

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 16, 2005
20,232
My wife does know how to use a pc so I'm leaning Dell Inspiron 15 7000 Intel 6th gen. 15" screen, good memory, well reviewed and about $500 cheaper than a 13" Mac Pro.

It is true my wife would prefer a Mac (and I'm curious myself) but I just can't bring myself to spend 500 more for a smaller screen and less memory.

Am I missing anything here? If one of you tells me the Mac will last many more years or have fewer issues, I'd have to think about it.
 

PedroSpecialK

Comes at you like a tornado of hair and the NHL sa
SoSH Member
Dec 12, 2004
27,164
Cambridge, MA
Well, considering your budget, you'll have no problem finding a solution, except I'm 95% sure nothing that meets those specs will actually run 4 hrs on battery (no matter what it claims).
Looks like this one may actually last that long, granted it's a user review so taking it with a big grain of salt (~5 hours):


For the price I'm digging that one... for a couple hundred more, this looks to be pretty high end:


Pretty much comes down to getting one with SSD vs. adding it later if needed.
 

wade boggs chicken dinner

Member
SoSH Member
Mar 26, 2005
30,494
Looks like this one may actually last that long, granted it's a user review so taking it with a big grain of salt (~5 hours):

Forget that, here's the Asus machine you should get (it's only sliiiiiightly outside your budget):




Asus ROG GX700. Liquid cooled, which allegedly maximizes the gaming performance, overclockability and thermal performance while fully utilizing the overclockable Intel K-Series Skylake processor, and the very first desktop GeForce GTX GPU in a notebook form factor – Nvidia GTX 980.

:love:

More realistically, there's this:

 

djbayko

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 18, 2005
25,895
Los Angeles, CA
Looks like this one may actually last that long, granted it's a user review so taking it with a big grain of salt (~5 hours):


For the price I'm digging that one... for a couple hundred more, this looks to be pretty high end:


Pretty much comes down to getting one with SSD vs. adding it later if needed.
Keep in mind that you're shopping for gaming laptops here, not necessarily "work" computers. But it sounds like you plan on keeping it mostly at home, in which case, what you're looking at is fine. These gaming laptops are bulky and on the heavy side, although much lighter and more compact than they used to be even just a few years ago. They make excellent desktop replacements due to their horsepower and specs, and as an added bonus they are fairly portable.

I am not a gamer, but I recently shopped for a gaming computer as desktop replacement because I wanted something top of the line that would last me for a number of years.

I've owned a couple ASUS laptops over the years, and you cannot go wrong with them. It's a good company with a reputation for quality and a strong community of geeky users who can help you outside of ASUS support if you have any issues. This time around, I looked at all available options, including MSi, and found that you just don't get the same specs for the $ as you do with ASUS.

Here is what I ended up buying over Christmas: ASUS G751VW-WH71 from B&H Photo It was on sale for $1199.99, and then a week later I got another $150 back from their price protection policy when it dropped down to $1049.99. I was originally going to buy it at it's full retail price of $1249.99, as it's still a great value. It comes with a secondary HD bay which will accept any SATA HDD or SDD or an M.2 PCIe SSD (even better). Buying a laptop like this without upgrading the HD to SSD is like buying a Ferrari with a Toyota Camry engine. I dropped a few extra bucks on a couple extra memory sticks (to upgrade from 16 to 32 GB) and a 256GB M.2 SSD, and I'm absolutely giddy over the results. The laptop literally starts up from a cold boot in about 2 seconds and I've yet to find any tasks I can throw at the machine to make it stutter for even a split second. Bonus: the original 1 TB hard drive is still installed as a slave drive for additional storage.

If having a screen 15.6" or less wasn't one of your requirements, then I'd tell you to grab that model and call it a day. I mean, I already did all of the comparisons for you 2 months ago :) If you want a 15.6", then it gets a little tricky. I originally bought a GL series (GL752), like the GL552 you list above, and I wasn't happy with it. My first issue was the manufacturing. The body is made of what feels like a cheap plastic, which gives is a light, but not sturdy feel. I'm sure it would last just fine as long as you gave it reasonable care, but the edges of the plastic body where the pieces came together wasn't tight and it dug into my wrists. Also, the trackpad is much cheaper than the one used in the G series and doesn't come with separate left/right mouse buttons (which I prefer). Second was upgradeability. While this model also has an M.2 PCIe SSD port, no one in the user community has successfully upgraded due to BIOS compatibility issues that haven't been fixed by ASUS yet. I found this out the hard way, returned the GL series and shopped for the G series (G751VW linked above) instead. Much like Apple laptops, the G series just feels extremely well made - the difference between the GL and G series is night and day. Third, and this was more of a nuisance than anything, but the power button is part of the keyboard and looks like a normal key. It's up in the corner of the keyboard, but where I'd expect the "End" button to be, so I kept hitting that key and shutting off my computer. It would only go into hibernate, and I could bring it back fairly quickly without losing any work, but totally annoying.

The problem is that, as far as I can tell, they don't sell ASUS G series models with 15.6" screens (e.g. G551VW) anymore, so you're stuck with buying a GL. Don't get me wrong, the GL551 is a great laptop - it just wasn't what I was looking for. If you want an M.2 SSD, you'll have to buy a model that comes with it factory installed since no one else has been successful. And I encourage you to go see and feel one in a brick & mortar store to make sure you're comfortable with the manufacturing and form.

Like I said, I did a lot of research before my purchase, so if you have follow-up questions, fire away.
 
Last edited:

PedroSpecialK

Comes at you like a tornado of hair and the NHL sa
SoSH Member
Dec 12, 2004
27,164
Cambridge, MA
This is all unbelievably helpful, thank you - will definitely look into a model where I can either boot from the existing SSD or add one myself.

In that vein, this one looks pretty awesome & ticks all the boxes... I'm willing to give a bit on the HD space as I can always store stuff on my external:

 

djbayko

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 18, 2005
25,895
Los Angeles, CA
This is all unbelievably helpful, thank you - will definitely look into a model where I can either boot from the existing SSD or add one myself.

In that vein, this one looks pretty awesome & ticks all the boxes... I'm willing to give a bit on the HD space as I can always store stuff on my external:

That brand and it's relative lack of history / reviews would make me nervous. Consider getting an extended warranty plan (I'd recommend that anyway), and give it a good test run before the return period expires. But yeah, t looks damn good on paper!

Note, that the SSD will be your traditional SATA interface, not M.2 PCIe, as you could get with the ASUS models, but if you don't have an M.2 today, then you won't miss the difference...going from mechanical HDD to any SSD is a humongous upgrade.
 
Last edited:

PedroSpecialK

Comes at you like a tornado of hair and the NHL sa
SoSH Member
Dec 12, 2004
27,164
Cambridge, MA
That brand and it's relative lack of history / reviews would make me nervous. Consider getting an extended warranty plan (I'd recommend that anyway), and give it a good test run before the return period expires. But yeah, t looks damn good on paper!

Note, that the SSD will be your traditional SATA interface, not M.2 PCIe, as you could get with the ASUS models, but if you don't have an M.2 today, then you won't miss the difference...going from mechanical HDD to any SSD is a humongous upgrade.
Thanks again for all the help & advice, it's been invaluable - I just pulled the trigger on this with a 250 GB M.2 SSD.

Can't wait to see how my CS skills have deteriorated since 1.6
 

djbayko

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 18, 2005
25,895
Los Angeles, CA
Thanks again for all the help & advice, it's been invaluable - I just pulled the trigger on this with a 250 GB M.2 SSD.

Can't wait to see how my CS skills have deteriorated since 1.6
Ouch...I wish you had checked back with me before purchasing, since I've been through all this pain recently.

First, as I tried to explain in my original post, this is the GL series that no one has been able to successfully custom install an M.2 SSD due to apparent BIOS incompatibility. The machine simply won't recognize the drive in Windows nor BIOS, no matter what you do. I'm talking the entire community of computer nerds over at the ASUS forums, some of whom have managed to talk to actual engineers at ASUS and determined that it's not possible. I too was unsuccessful.

Maybe your CS skills will bring you luck where everyone else has failed. Or maybe they've released a patch since I returned mine in late December.

However, I believe you have a second problem. That M.2 SSD has a SATA interface, and I'm pretty sure the laptop you purchased requires AHCI (assuming it would even work, which it doesn't). See the 2 indentations in the connector? That's the incorrect key. Your machine expects the single indented key of an AHCI drive. But watch out because other interfaces, such as NVMe, also have a single indentation in their key.

I hate to be the bearer of bad news. I know it's exciting to wait for a new laptop being shipped. But at least now, you can research to confirm what I say is true and either forge ahead or start considering what your next purchase might be.

PS: One more cherry on top of this shit sundae - contrary to widespread info on the web, the display on that model is not IPS. That may not be important to you though.
 
Last edited:

PedroSpecialK

Comes at you like a tornado of hair and the NHL sa
SoSH Member
Dec 12, 2004
27,164
Cambridge, MA
It appears my reading comprehension have deteriorated... haha, it's all good, that isn't a deal-breaker for me if I can't add an SSD, going from a home laptop purchased in 2008 to this should be a nice upgrade.

I figure ~$85 for a 250 GB M.2 SSD Samsung is a small enough investment that it's no big shakes if it doesn't work out, and I should be able to resell that. Just wish Amazon wouldn't display that alongside the GL552 as a 'users also frequently purchased' item.
 

djbayko

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 18, 2005
25,895
Los Angeles, CA
It appears my reading comprehension have deteriorated... haha, it's all good, that isn't a deal-breaker for me if I can't add an SSD, going from a home laptop purchased in 2008 to this should be a nice upgrade.

I figure ~$85 for a 250 GB M.2 SSD Samsung is a small enough investment that it's no big shakes if it doesn't work out, and I should be able to resell that. Just wish Amazon wouldn't display that alongside the GL552 as a 'users also frequently purchased' item.
I was looking at more recent posts for you, and I might be wrong about the M.2 SATA vs. AHCI thing. It appears that there are slightly different models of the GL552, so you might luck out and get a model that expects the SATA interface your ordered.

Good luck!
 

PedroSpecialK

Comes at you like a tornado of hair and the NHL sa
SoSH Member
Dec 12, 2004
27,164
Cambridge, MA
I was looking at more recent posts for you, and I might be wrong about the M.2 SATA vs. AHCI thing. It appears that there are slightly different models of the GL552, so you might luck out and get a model that expects the SATA interface your ordered.

Good luck!
Ah awesome, thanks - it says this in the description as well:

The slide-off upgrade panel offers instant access, fit an M.2 SSD, a bigger hard drive or upgrade memory.
 

nvalvo

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 16, 2005
21,480
Rogers Park
My wife does know how to use a pc so I'm leaning Dell Inspiron 15 7000 Intel 6th gen. 15" screen, good memory, well reviewed and about $500 cheaper than a 13" Mac Pro.

It is true my wife would prefer a Mac (and I'm curious myself) but I just can't bring myself to spend 500 more for a smaller screen and less memory.

Am I missing anything here? If one of you tells me the Mac will last many more years or have fewer issues, I'd have to think about it.
It will last literally twice as long, assuming no spills. My MacBook Pro is from 2010 and still entirely viable. The Dell doesn't have a chance at that kind of longevity.

Apple hasn't dropped any machines from new OS updates in three releases. Machines from like 2009 are still supported.
 

Couperin47

Member
SoSH Member
M.2 is just the form factor. Within the category of M.2, you have a variety of different interfaces with different keys. "M.2" is not enough information to determine which SSD is compatible.
M.2 is a 'standard' like the DB25 connector was...it's a complete mess...the standard is a blend of physical and electronic specs and half of the standard looks like it will never receive any meaningful implementations. My Thinkpad E531 uses one. Lenovo has already abandoned their use in most of their laptops. When they did use them it was M.2 2242 models (the 22 refers to the width of the module...always 22mm, the lengths range from 42mm to 80mm) which are the smallest and create a serious problem fitting 256 Gig onto such a small formfactor. This required memory on both sides of the tiny board, Lenovo placed it in a tiny compartment with virtually no ventilation and there are more than a few reports that 256 Gig models used in this situation have cooked themselves to death. I'm running a 120 Gig MyDigital model, so far without issues. So far M.2 has largely been a deserved flop.
 

ScubaSteveAvery

Master of the Senate
SoSH Member
Jul 29, 2007
8,329
Everywhere
Can anyone recommend me a laptop in the $500ish range? I will be primarily using it for internet browsing, word processing, and some basic video editing using Camtasia (nothing crazy - 30 second clips or so). I tried a Lenovo once through the outlet and had a terrible experience (hard drive failure then motherboard failure) that took 8 months to get a refund so I really am hesitant to use them again.
 

jtn46

Member
SoSH Member
Oct 10, 2004
9,757
Norwalk, CT
So I'm thinking of grabbing this Dell Inspiron 7000 the 500GB Samsung m.2 SSD and a 8GB stick of RAM (I'd buy the latter from Amazon or NewEgg, the Dell maybe from Best Buy because I have a $100 gift card burning a hole in my pocket and their credit card). I will game on it. There's no way I'm seeing that I can get anything else close to those specs for around $1k. Any reason this is a bad plan? I'm in no rush and will probably wait until my tax returns show up (doing my taxes this week).
 

Nick Kaufman

protector of human kind from spoilers
Lifetime Member
SoSH Member
Aug 2, 2003
13,410
A Lost Time
I just ordered a Samsung Ativ 9 ultralight laptop for my sister.

My sister isn't a heavy user. She needs something to do word processing, the occasional spreadsheets and power point presentations on top of the baseline emails and web-browsing. I like the fact that the laptop is aesthetically pleasing and I also love that it only weighs 2 pounds which is significant since she travels a lot. Moreover, I love the fact that its price dropped recently to $800 which is a far more appealing price point than the one it originally sold for, which was around $1300, i.e. $100 more than the Macbook for which is the Windows equivalent.*

Tech spec wise, I bought the version with 8GB of Ram and 256GB hard drive. My only concern is the Intel Core M processor. I like that it allows for a fanless design, but will it be enough? How many years can she squeeze from that processor? What do you think?

* I know that Blacken will say that the touchpad is terrible and the Macbook has a longer battery life, but I don't think this matters a lot.
 

IpswichSox

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 14, 2005
2,792
Suburbs of Washington, DC
I have a Samsung Series 9 from 2012, the predecessor of the Ativ 9. I've loved my Samsung, including build quality and performance. I travel with it every day, and it's been bullet-proof for me. I don't know if manufacturing or components have substantively changed since I bought mine, but I would recommend Samsung generally. (Battery performance is substantially less than an Apple though -- just depends on if the price difference is worth it.)
 

jtn46

Member
SoSH Member
Oct 10, 2004
9,757
Norwalk, CT
Skipped the Dell. Went with a refurbished Alienware 15R2. Coupon took 25% off so it was $1200 with taxes. Will add the Samsung drive too.
 

Nick Kaufman

protector of human kind from spoilers
Lifetime Member
SoSH Member
Aug 2, 2003
13,410
A Lost Time
I have a Samsung Series 9 from 2012, the predecessor of the Ativ 9. I've loved my Samsung, including build quality and performance. I travel with it every day, and it's been bullet-proof for me. I don't know if manufacturing or components have substantively changed since I bought mine, but I would recommend Samsung generally. (Battery performance is substantially less than an Apple though -- just depends on if the price difference is worth it.)
Thank you. I am expecting it any day now and hopefully everything is going to be alright.
 

Nick Kaufman

protector of human kind from spoilers
Lifetime Member
SoSH Member
Aug 2, 2003
13,410
A Lost Time
So I finally got it and played with it over the weekend. I am still concerned about processor speed, what is the ceiling for this device and how long it remains serviceable. My guess is that if you just want to keep it for office work, a long time.

But I love, love, love the small factor. It's light. You can get it on the couch, no problem. The Core M means there's no fan on it and thus no irritating fan noise. But the thing I am genuinely floored about is the quality of the screen. With a 2560x1600 resolution is amazing. I can't stop watching it. At the same time, I upgraded from a 19 inch 1360x768 monitor on my desktop to a 21 inch 1080p IPS one - which shouldn't be a slouch- and the laptop is still killing it.
 

derekson

Member
SoSH Member
Jun 26, 2010
6,224
1080p on 21" is still fairly low DPI by today's standards (especially for mobile devices). I've only been using a MacBook Pro for the last few years, but if I were to buy a desktop display I'd want a 24" 4K display to run at HiDPI.

I was pleasantly surprised when I got the MBP with the "Retina Display" that it significantly reduced my eye strain when I use the laptop for ~6 hour sessions.
 

JakeRae

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 21, 2005
8,125
New York, NY
1080p on 21" is still fairly low DPI by today's standards (especially for mobile devices). I've only been using a MacBook Pro for the last few years, but if I were to buy a desktop display I'd want a 24" 4K display to run at HiDPI.

I was pleasantly surprised when I got the MBP with the "Retina Display" that it significantly reduced my eye strain when I use the laptop for ~6 hour sessions.
We're you using an IPS display prior? IPS is a must for eye strain reduction. I'm not sure ultra high pixel counts are too. I could be wrong.
 

Nick Kaufman

protector of human kind from spoilers
Lifetime Member
SoSH Member
Aug 2, 2003
13,410
A Lost Time
We're you using an IPS display prior? IPS is a must for eye strain reduction. I'm not sure ultra high pixel counts are too. I could be wrong.
My 21 inch monitor is an IPS and it gave me enormous eye strain. I ve toyed with the settings for 10 days now and may be just may be it's gotten better since I lowered the level of blues. It's my understanding that IPS tends to have a blue hue.
 

Nick Kaufman

protector of human kind from spoilers
Lifetime Member
SoSH Member
Aug 2, 2003
13,410
A Lost Time
1080p on 21" is still fairly low DPI by today's standards (especially for mobile devices). I've only been using a MacBook Pro for the last few years, but if I were to buy a desktop display I'd want a 24" 4K display to run at HiDPI.

I was pleasantly surprised when I got the MBP with the "Retina Display" that it significantly reduced my eye strain when I use the laptop for ~6 hour sessions.
Yeah, I was very resistant to change, because I don't think I need a larger size monitor and also because many windows programs don't deal well with high DPI settings. One thing that surprises me is this: Companies tend to push large monitors while supplying small laptops with insane hi res screens. And yet you cannot really find many options for hi res monitors for sizes bellow 21 inches. I guess there's more money in them for larger monitors. I would have said that that's where the market is, but most people still have monitors smaller than 24-21 inches.
 

Couperin47

Member
SoSH Member
My 21 inch monitor is an IPS and it gave me enormous eye strain. I ve toyed with the settings for 10 days now and may be just may be it's gotten better since I lowered the level of blues. It's my understanding that IPS tends to have a blue hue.
If you're running any version of Windows, search on cleartype (it varies where they bury this routine in 7, 8 or 10) and run the cleartype adjustment routine which can improve the clarity of how your monitor renders text. This can make a big difference.
 

Nick Kaufman

protector of human kind from spoilers
Lifetime Member
SoSH Member
Aug 2, 2003
13,410
A Lost Time
Thanks, that's one of the things I ve tried already and it might be the one making the difference, as the past 24 hours I haven't experienced the kind of eye strain I had before. I can positively say it's not the blue hues, as I increased the blue levels back to default and I don't have a problem.
 

derekson

Member
SoSH Member
Jun 26, 2010
6,224
I believe the increased clarity of text on the high DPI screen is what made the difference in eye strain for me. My previous laptop was a MacBook Air with a DPI of 130 or so which isn't even low. I think my iMac was something like 108.

My understanding is that the pixelated edges of the text cause the eyes to constantly refocus slightly trying to bring them into focus which causes the eye strain.
 

NJ_Sox_Fan

Member
SoSH Member
Jan 2, 2006
10,736
NJ
I need a new laptop. I don't want to spend the money on a mac book.

I will mainly use this laptop to browse the interwebs, do some work on (excel, accessing my work server from home) and probably store pictures, etc on.

I want a large screen. Enough ram that I can play some games if I want.

I was looking at some of the laptops on the hhgreg site ... Asus or Toshiba. Any good?

Basically I just want to avoid buying a piece of shit.
 

Couperin47

Member
SoSH Member
Toshibas presence in the laptop market has been shrinking for years, unfortunately for good reason. Asus has some very attractive machines at low price points but they are not rugged, I'd place them a half notch below the mainstream Dell/HP stuff. OTOH the Thinkpads from Lenovo are definitely better built than the average. For reference:
http://outlet.lenovo.com/outlet_us/laptops/#facet-1=1,2,3,4&facet-2=1&facet-5=5&facet-6=2

At this time the Lenovo Outlet has refurb E550 Thinkpads for under $450 and each includes a 15.5" screen, decent i5 dual core cpu, Intel 5500 graphics, 500 Gig 7200 rpm HD and a full DVD burner. The 4 Gig ram can easily be supplemented by a 2nd 4 or 8 Gig stick which takes 2 mins to install. (A single 8 Gig SODIMM DDR3 1600 stick will run you $32 at Newegg today, and on sale even less). The optical drive can be removed and with the addition of a blank caddy ($25 at eBay), you can install any 2nd HD or full size SSD if you have no need of the optical drive. Despite one person here who, evidently, had a bad experience, everyone else who I know has bought from the Outlet has received a machine indistinguishable from brand new, including the full year warranty.
 

NJ_Sox_Fan

Member
SoSH Member
Jan 2, 2006
10,736
NJ
Does Dell still make decent stuff? I literally have not owned a laptop now for about 8 years.
 

Nick Kaufman

protector of human kind from spoilers
Lifetime Member
SoSH Member
Aug 2, 2003
13,410
A Lost Time
The XPS 13 is supposedly one of the best laptops in the market. To be honest, I saw it yesterday on BestBuy and I didn't like the fit and finish of the thing. Or may be it was because it was a display model.
 

Max Power

thai good. you like shirt?
SoSH Member
Jul 20, 2005
7,878
Boston, MA
It may have been a display model issue. The XPS 13 and 15 are really nice. Dell's business laptops are solid, so any Latitude is generally good. Their Inspiron and Vostro lines are significantly lower quality.
 

DanoooME

above replacement level
SoSH Member
Mar 16, 2008
19,831
Henderson, NV
Am I better off buying a Windows 8.1 machine and upgrading to Windows 10 or just get one that starts out as a Windows 10 machine? I'd rather not do the upgrade if I can avoid it and there doesn't seem to be a great selection on the Lenovo Outlet of Windows 10 machines.
 

Couperin47

Member
SoSH Member
Am I better off buying a Windows 8.1 machine and upgrading to Windows 10 or just get one that starts out as a Windows 10 machine? I'd rather not do the upgrade if I can avoid it and there doesn't seem to be a great selection on the Lenovo Outlet of Windows 10 machines.
If you get a machine with 8.1 you then have the choice to get or avoid 10, if you get something with 10 you have no choice. Not only do you have months to decide, but I assure you, if you want 10, MS will start nagging you to upgrade within days of your first boot up. What downside makes you apprehensive about getting 10 via the upgrade route ? Anything at the Outlet will be fully compatible with 10, no worries there.
 

DanoooME

above replacement level
SoSH Member
Mar 16, 2008
19,831
Henderson, NV
If you get a machine with 8.1 you then have the choice to get or avoid 10, if you get something with 10 you have no choice. Not only do you have months to decide, but I assure you, if you want 10, MS will start nagging you to upgrade within days of your first boot up. What downside makes you apprehensive about getting 10 via the upgrade route ? Anything at the Outlet will be fully compatible with 10, no worries there.
Just concerned about screwing up the upgrade on a new computer. I've been a Windows 7 guy for a long time and resisted going to 8, so I figured I could just jump to 10 seamlessly and that might be more advantageous. I don't know if it's smart to skip 8 completely so I don't have to deal with 2 different new OS.
 

Couperin47

Member
SoSH Member
Just concerned about screwing up the upgrade on a new computer. I've been a Windows 7 guy for a long time and resisted going to 8, so I figured I could just jump to 10 seamlessly and that might be more advantageous. I don't know if it's smart to skip 8 completely so I don't have to deal with 2 different new OS.
No difference jumping from 7 or 8.1 to 10. If you do it immediately after you get something new, especially if before you load a ton of programs, the resulting 10 Registry will be indistinguishable from a 'clean' install. Keep the following in mind: everyone who is getting a 'free' 10 is doing an upgrade from 7 or 8. There is a complete version of Classic Shell for 10 which will allow you to make 10 very close to whatever look and style and features of 7 you may be more comfortable with. If you don't care that you pretty much will not be able to easily control updates and being dragged into whatever future MS dictates, the current big drawback is that the native browser Edge is barely half complete, still has no addons available and things that most people consider essential are unlikely to be here before the end of the year...essentially install something else you like/use for now. I prefer Palemoon, a fork and evolution of what Firefox was before it decided to become a Chrome clone. Alternatively, if you are OK with a Chrome (webkit engine) browser, the latest version of Opera is an excellent choice: it is disconnected from Google, does not data mine and track everything you do, is compatible with all Chrome addons and also supports it's own addons and allows somewhat more customization than Chrome.