Rebirth of a Sale, man
- Thread starter reggiecleveland
- Start date
It’s not a question of pissing away a lead. It’s a question of ensuring 3 quality starts in the next two weeks, saving the bullpen and getting yourself quicker to a point where you can just shut things down and rest people. The 116 wins business exists only in these threads — I’m rather certain the RS want no part of that.
And pokey is right. If the injury were phantom, they would not have brought him back for one start. It makes no sense.
Unless your definition of "legitimate" is unique, I'm not sure how you can say that.
It wasn't a phantom injury, maybe?
Like, he was hurting. They put him on the DL. He felt a bit better, so they tried him out. He was awesome, but it still hurts, so they're shutting him down again.
Like, one way of looking at this is to say, OMG they had to do it again! THIS IS BAD!! Another is to follow DRS's lead and think, so they're following the same protocol as last time, that went OK but there was still discomfort, so they're staying with their plan.
I doubt it’s imaginary but maybe a little nagging plus a little convenient would be my uneducated guess.
Hurt, not injured. Fair enough.
But the notion that this is protective bubble wrap and nothing more or, even more laughably, they want to look at other guys, please ...
It's not a phantom injury.
It's a little bit of inflammation/soreness he could pitch through but there's zero reason to.
I'm not concerned in the least, and I'm glad they're being upfront and proactive about small things like this.
Obviously, it makes sense to be more concerned that when he came back and we hoped he was healed.
But it doesn't necessarily to be more worried than the last time he was on the DL. They took him off, found out where he was, and put him back on. And where he was pretty ok for a disabled guy.
I definitely agree it's a thing. I'm just hopeful what we've seen is that they're doing this like pros and that it's not a new injury.
Like, maybe we're just so unused to seeing what a real rehabilitation from injury properly and professionally conducted would actually look like that we can't identify it anymore?
I agree with that. I'm taking issue with the notion that this is simply manipulating the 10-day DL to get him extra rest down the stretch. Obviously, none of us can make more than an educated guess as to the severity of the problem, but I think that for the most part we can agree that it's not just an attempt to keep him fresh under the guise of an injury.
I don't think they would have brought him back last time if it was a manipulation, so yeah. Like, if they did that, it would be reckless and reverse my entire assessment. So yeah--I think they're just playing this by the book. Which is odd that that looks so weird to us, but that's another thread.
The hope is it’s somewhere in the middle. Mild, nagging shoulder that they will take zero chances with. Seems like he wouldn’t be able to pitch like he did Sunday if he’s seriously injured.
From the horse’s mouth (figuratively, Teixeira is retired):
Sounds, again, like just an abundance of caution.
Why does my brain insist on reading this in Mike Ehrmantraut’s voice. I’m going to hope that it’s the Sox just insisting that for once in his career Sale is ready for October, but it’s hard to see the collar cutter willingly sit if he feels he can go. Maybe Cora is much more persuasive than his predecessors?
To me, if it's to be believed (HA!), it's not so much an abundance of caution so much as they are evaluating not based on his performance but on his post-start recovery time.
This is a plan targeting the playoffs.
I mean he certainly didn't appear to have any ill effects from his previous DL stint, although it was against the Orioles.
Hopefully it's what others have said and it's a plan for the playoffs.
Hopefully it's what others have said and it's a plan for the playoffs.
One sanguine explanation for why Sale was allowed to make his start against Baltimore was simply that the odds of the Red Sox winning the division were a bit lower before the 4-game sweep of the Orioles.
Now, with 39 games to play, a magic number of 30, a high 90% chance of taking the division, and news of Judge being on the DL a bit longer, it might be a no-brainer to rest Sale with shoulder soreness. In addition, I wonder if this will conveniently allow Sale to miss the Indians series. And when Houston comes to town, I wonder if he'll conveniently miss them, as well.
Lastly, I personally love that this team's mettle has been tested and honed by having it deal with the adversity of DL stints for Pedroia, EdRo, Wright, Mookie, Pedroia again, Vazquez, EdRo again, Sale, Devers, Swihart, Kinsler, Devers again, and Sale again.
Now, with 39 games to play, a magic number of 30, a high 90% chance of taking the division, and news of Judge being on the DL a bit longer, it might be a no-brainer to rest Sale with shoulder soreness. In addition, I wonder if this will conveniently allow Sale to miss the Indians series. And when Houston comes to town, I wonder if he'll conveniently miss them, as well.
Lastly, I personally love that this team's mettle has been tested and honed by having it deal with the adversity of DL stints for Pedroia, EdRo, Wright, Mookie, Pedroia again, Vazquez, EdRo again, Sale, Devers, Swihart, Kinsler, Devers again, and Sale again.
Going on the DL twice for a shoulder issue a year away from FA , and perhaps risking his chance to win the CYA is not in Sales interests unless he is really hurt. I believe there is an issue here
His shoulder didn't feel as good as it should have as soon as it should have after his last start.
He said so. That's an issue. He's on the DL. I don't think we need Scotland Yard.
The one thing giving me pause in potentially agreeing with you is the degree to which the pen has been taxed lately because the team won’t stop winning. Merely skipping starts doesn’t allow them to bring in some relief to the guys in the pen who have been working theirs butts off to close out all these wins.
Doesn't this strike people as the logical evolution of the use of the 10-day DL for a prone-to-fatigue starter? They haven't had this shiny roster toy but for a year - I think they've just figured out how to finesse it with a white lie to skip a start while maintaining maximal roster flexibility.
Yet there are those saying it is a phantom DL so Sherlock must speak out. We agree, there is an issue. Scotland Yard may stand down
That is essentially what the Dodgers were accused of doing last year. It’ll be interesting to see how teams game this (if indeed they are) going forward.
Wouldn’t Sale and/or his agent be against this, as it raises the perception that he’s an injury risk? Unless he wants to admit to colluding to circumvent the DL rule?
I'm not too concerned with the actual injury. I don't believe in conspiracy theories or think there's a designed plan going on. My main concern is - how do we make sure Sale is 100% ready to go for the playoffs? By 100%, I mean no pitch count limits. It doesn't seem like it, but we're getting down to the nitty-gritty. Every day out is another that he'll need to build the arm strength back up.
I don't care if he doesn't throw another regular season game this year as long as the rehab plan gets him back to 100% by game 1. I don't want to see him throwing a playoff game with a pitch limit.
I don't care if he doesn't throw another regular season game this year as long as the rehab plan gets him back to 100% by game 1. I don't want to see him throwing a playoff game with a pitch limit.
This feels like some weird prank where the Red Sox decide to be totally transparent just to see how the fan base reacts.
We had a test run in April when Price had a case of carpal tunnel and people here were convinced that the club was messing with us and TJ surgery was imminent.
Sale may very well have a “fragile” label on him even if he does turn into a playoffs hero.... not many teams will ever have the same cushion the Sox do right now, and thereby the luxury they are (or are they???) afforded with Sale. He may always be considered a bit of a late season risk.
That said.... what’s the ETA for Rodriguez returning?
That said.... what’s the ETA for Rodriguez returning?
It will a negotiation point to be sure. I do think that October ending will bear heavily on the outcome.
I still wonder about Steven Strasburg’s early extension with the Nationals. Was it a Jason Varitek situation where Scott Boras deferred to the client? Or were Stras and Boras in terror that a shoulder or elbow would sink them? Maybe both.
That's odd because 538's system, from what I hear, does not take injuries into account.
It could be the fact that a Wildcard game between Yankees and Astros is much more likely. Playing the winner of that is quite the reward for having the best record!
Who are those and what’s their affiliation with the team? There’s “those” that say the Democrats are running a pedo ring out of a pizza parlor...
And that X was done for the year, and that Sale’s TJ was imminent last time. It’s almost as if “those” could learn something from history.
I’m going with the MLB version of the Hellenic Flu, just because I don’t want to really contemplate the alternative.
I think one thing you have to give this year’s team credit for is how they have handled injuries. Guys have gotten regular and generous amounts of rest. The team hasn’t hesitated to DL guys when they are dealing with an issue. And other than Pedroia, no one has been rushed back (and there’s probably an argument to be made that even then, Pedey’s return to the DL was more a function of his unprecedented surgical procedure in ballplayers than anything the team did to accelerate his timetable).
None of which is to say that Sale isn’t more seriously hurt than he’s letting on – or that the Sox’s medical team is infallible. And certainly the 10.5 game cushion gives them flexibility few other teams can afford. But maintaining player health is one area where I trust the team’s judgment implicitly.
None of which is to say that Sale isn’t more seriously hurt than he’s letting on – or that the Sox’s medical team is infallible. And certainly the 10.5 game cushion gives them flexibility few other teams can afford. But maintaining player health is one area where I trust the team’s judgment implicitly.