Potential Trade Deadline Targets

Adrian's Dome

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First he’s much better defensively than Lin because he’s a generational defensive talent, no slight on Lin there. And his OPS is 30 points higher than JBJ, who most everyone on here values tremendously.
First, that defensive difference in that small of a time frame is meaningless, as once again, it's too small of a sample to analyze. On top of the fact that yes, he has a good glove, but generational? No. Lin is a perfectly acceptable fielder for the period of time Devers will need to heal up.

Secondly, JBJ has nothing to do with this discussion, and Iglesias has never been a good hitter whereas JBJ has.
 

DanoooME

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A cheap pickup might be Cory Spangenberg from SD. He's 27, can play 2B, 3B, and a little OF, all pretty competently. Having a down year with the bat, hence the possibility of picking him up cheap. He's not eligible to be a FA until 2021. He's paid $1.7M this year, so about $425,000 is what he'd cost for the rest of the year. He was a first round pick back in 2011. The Padres don't need him; they have Asuaje and Galvis starting in the MIF slots, Jose Pirela as a UT guy, Javy Guerra down in AAA and Luis Urias and Fernando Tatis Jr both in the high minors coming.

I'm not saying he's necessary, but he might be helpful as an out of the box option that could have some value going forward into 2019-2020.
 

shaggydog2000

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He's better than LIn but is he really a generational defensive talent? I know he was hyped up to be.
I don't know what counts as "generational", but from 2015-now (he missed 2014, so I started after that to be fair) he has been the 4th best defensive SS by dWar on fangraphs, with about half the UZR/150 of Andrelton Simmons, and fitting comfortably behind Brandon Crawford and Francisco Lindor and ahead of Adeiny Hechavarria and Addison Russell. He's 5th by zone rating, 8th by DRS, and 13th by rPM. By the definition of one player in a generation who is way better than everyone else, I would say Andrelton Simmons is that guy defensively. Iglesias seems like just another good glove no bat SS. He is 34th out of 45 qualified SS in that same time period with a WRC+ of 81.
 

RedOctober3829

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Garbage bat and 100% not worth blowing the tax for. What does he offer that Lin doesn't? Would there even be a difference between him and Holt? We're talking a month and a half of defense...a meaningless sample size that's impossible to quantify.
Iglesias is much better defensively than any middle infielder the Red Sox have. On a postseason roster, having him as a defensive replacement to move Devers or Nunez out of the game would be very useful.
 

uncannymanny

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Useful, but at what price? I’d rather roll with Lin for free than give up assets or taxes for 2 months of a guy that whined his way out of town as a mediocre rookie.
 

Adrian's Dome

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Iglesias is much better defensively than any middle infielder the Red Sox have. On a postseason roster, having him as a defensive replacement to move Devers or Nunez out of the game would be very useful.
More useful than going over the luxury tax, having to make a roster move, and giving up a player? When we already have a perfectly good noodle-bat utility IF sitting right there in Pawtucket ready to be used?

Doubtful.
 

bosockboy

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More useful than going over the luxury tax, having to make a roster move, and giving up a player? When we already have a perfectly good noodle-bat utility IF sitting right there in Pawtucket ready to be used?

Doubtful.
They were presumably in the market for infield help before last night, so it’s hard to believe they wouldn’t be now. Set Iglesias aside then, they are very likely going to acquire somebody. And that somebody will put them over the tax which they said they were willing to do. If Henry is willing to pay it I’m not sure why it would bother us. And the bump from 33-43 in the draft is pretty negligible.
 

Adrian's Dome

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They were presumably in the market for infield help before last night, so it’s hard to believe they wouldn’t be now. Set Iglesias aside then, they are very likely going to acquire somebody. And that somebody will put them over the tax which they said they were willing to do. If Henry is willing to pay it I’m not sure why it would bother us. And the bump from 33-43 in the draft is pretty negligible.
They were presumably in the market for potential infield upgrades. Getting a guy like Iglesias would be a lateral move in performance at increased cost, and devalue one of your other (very similar) assets in Lin.

If that's your idea of efficiently and effectively running a baseball team, I'm glad you're not in charge.
 

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They were presumably in the market for infield help before last night, so it’s hard to believe they wouldn’t be now. Set Iglesias aside then, they are very likely going to acquire somebody. And that somebody will put them over the tax which they said they were willing to do. If Henry is willing to pay it I’m not sure why it would bother us. And the bump from 33-43 in the draft is pretty negligible.
Are we presuming that they were in the market based on anything more than message board GMing?
 

RedOctober3829

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More useful than going over the luxury tax, having to make a roster move, and giving up a player? When we already have a perfectly good noodle-bat utility IF sitting right there in Pawtucket ready to be used?

Doubtful.
They’re over the LT according to Evan Drellich so not worried. Worried about sending Lin back down? No. Whether it’s Iglesias or someone else, they need to get another infielder.

https://www.nbcsports.com/boston/red-sox/sources-red-sox-over-237-million-pay-highest-luxury-tax
 

uncannymanny

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They do not NEED another infielder. They can weather this just fine and will still win over 100 games.
 

Byrdbrain

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They do not NEED another infielder. They can weather this just fine and will still win over 100 games.
Certainly since Devers was saying this morning that it isn't bad and he thinks he'd be fine to go in a few days.
If, and I stress if, they really are over the tax and if they can get Iglesias for cheap I wouldn't be against it but they absolutely don't need a new infielder.
 

RedOctober3829

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They do not NEED another infielder. They can weather this just fine and will still win over 100 games.
I’m not worried about the regular season. Any move made has to have the postseason in mind given their status. Does the bench have the necessary pieces for the playoffs? Do you want Blake Swihart in a spot where he has to play a position he’s not suited for? Do you want to upgrade Swihart’s spot altogether to someone who is more useful? If they have to pinch hit for Holt late, is Nunez who you want replacing him especially defensively? Dont think short-sightedly on how it affects the regular season. Think about the playoff roster.
 

uncannymanny

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Iglesias isn’t a difference maker for this team; Lin is already on the roster. He’s completely redundant with a shitty attitude about not being a starter. Hard, HARD pass.
 

uncannymanny

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I’m hoping they land a nice bullpen piece before Tuesday, though it won’t be the end of the world if they don’t since they’re unlikely to get anyone great. Anything else can be tinkered with during the August waiver period for cash or pure lottery tickets. If they don’t make any position player changes, no, I’m not worried.
 

MikeM

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If not Iglesias, are you opposed to not trying to upgrade the bench?
I'm all for upgrading 2B period if an actual opportunity is out there. But it's worth noting that Iglesias looks to have only logged a total of 12 innings at 2B in his pro career, and all of those came back in 2013. Which kind of limits his overall targeted guy appeal imo in the event Devers absence isn't going to be an extended one.

At this point though I'm really just hoping DD somehow manages to pull a rabbit out of the hat on a noteworthy bullpen upgrade.
 
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bosockboy

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Interesting stat I came across, Kinsler has an 866 OPS since May 28. He’s performing at an elite level offensively and defensively. For 2B he’s probably the best option out there.
 

grimshaw

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I wouldn't want Iglesias anyhow, but there is no reason to bring him over if he isn't playing SS. That's where almost all of his value comes from.
 

chawson

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Wouldn’t the Yankees block our waiver claim for Kinsler? Logical chess move, and besides he’s an upgrade over Walker.
 

jon abbey

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I'm pretty sure NY would not claim Kinsler, they are still trying to stay under $197M and his pro-rated salary would make it pretty close, and also Walker has come alive recently, .419/.481/.581 with 1 HR, four doubles, 8 runs and 10 RBI in his last 14 games.
 

amfox1

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I wonder if the Sox would be willing to send a better prospect or two then would usually be required for one of those relievers in exchange for the other team taking on Nunez and the remaining balance on his contract. That will allow them to stay under the final luxury tax threshold.
 

Red(s)HawksFan

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There are no official numbers on salary until after the season, so until then it's all speculation whether they're over yet or not. Not to mention there are some portions of salary that can only be estimated at this point, such as how much they're paying the part-timers...roster spots 26-40 that only make MLB salary when they're called up and only the pay they get while they're up is counted against the total. FWIW, Cot's estimates show the team is still just under the cap.
 

Apisith

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Seems crazy that we’re going to go over but only a bit over. If we’re going to go over then we might as well go over by a lot to make the team as best as possible.
 

RedOctober3829

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There are no official numbers on salary until after the season, so until then it's all speculation whether they're over yet or not. Not to mention there are some portions of salary that can only be estimated at this point, such as how much they're paying the part-timers...roster spots 26-40 that only make MLB salary when they're called up and only the pay they get while they're up is counted against the total. FWIW, Cot's estimates show the team is still just under the cap.
Dave Dombrowski confirmed that they were over the luxury tax in this article.

https://www.nbcsports.com/boston/red-sox/sources-red-sox-go-over-luxury-tax-threshold-237-million
 

Dewey'sCannon

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DeadlySplitter

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They’re over the LT according to Evan Drellich so not worried. Worried about sending Lin back down? No. Whether it’s Iglesias or someone else, they need to get another infielder.

https://www.nbcsports.com/boston/red-sox/sources-red-sox-over-237-million-pay-highest-luxury-tax
Seems crazy that we’re going to go over but only a bit over. If we’re going to go over then we might as well go over by a lot to make the team as best as possible.
I thought the point of the Eovaldi trade was he was the best talent-to-dollar ratio, allowing us to stay under while upgrading the back-end rotation spot.

if they're going over, they might as well go all in and get Beltre, Dozier, Kela.... yeah yeah, in a fantasy world only I know.

EDIT: I wonder if a Beltre + Kela package would be possible?
 

OurF'ingCity

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At what point in time is the luxury tax calculation made? Is it like the NBA where the calculation is only made at the end of the season (i.e., the Sox could still make minor moves/roster cuts/etc. to slip back under if they are, in fact, over now)?
 

mdipalma78

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At what point in time is the luxury tax calculation made? Is it like the NBA where the calculation is only made at the end of the season (i.e., the Sox could still make minor moves/roster cuts/etc. to slip back under if they are, in fact, over now)?
Yes, it’s their year-end total that matters.

Hypothetically, if they trade some salary (Nunez?) they would create some space. I did a quick scan of Cots and didn’t see anyone else that seemed expendable that made enough $ that the remaining prorated amount would matter. Sending Lin to the minors wouldn’t help because he (presumably) makes the minimum. Unless they roll with less than 25 healthy bodies, they have to pay someone and there’s nobody cheaper than Lin.
 

In my lifetime

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It is calculated at the end of the year. And then Recalculated in the future to account for options (if someone with more knowledge can clarify exactly when this happens, that would be great. Example - what happens if/when JD opts out and his AAV comes in at 23.75 instead of 22.0. How will they deal with the draft pick penalty 2 years after the fact?)

Just to clarify the earlier question that if the RS are going to go over the next luxury tax limit (40 MM above initial tax point), why not just go far over? Remember it is a marginal tax, so while not particularly painful (except for dropping 10 slots in draft) if you go over by 2 million. This becomes rather expensive going over by 20 MM.

Surtax on Payroll Between $20M and $40M Above Threshold: 12%
Surtax on Payroll in Excess of $40M Above Threshold: 42.5% if 1st time offender

So that surtax is in addition to the 20% offenders tax
 

Red(s)HawksFan

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At what point in time is the luxury tax calculation made? Is it like the NBA where the calculation is only made at the end of the season (i.e., the Sox could still make minor moves/roster cuts/etc. to slip back under if they are, in fact, over now)?
End of the season. Which is why everything at this point, even from the Red Sox themselves, is an estimation. They budget X amount for the pro-rated salary on guys like Lin and Poyner and Workman who are up and down during the year. That budgeted amount could be under or over what the actual spending ends up being. Plus, yes, they could get salary relief if they trade higher salaries for lesser ones during the year.
 

RedOctober3829

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I don't read DD's statement as a confirmation that they have already exceeded 237 - only an indication that they would if necessary. The article is based on information from "sources" with knowledge of the team's payroll. So probably a team source. But not definitive info, IMO.
I take it as he acknowledges that they've gone over and that while they don't like it they didn't see it as a deterrent to make the team better.
End of the season. Which is why everything at this point, even from the Red Sox themselves, is an estimation. They budget X amount for the pro-rated salary on guys like Lin and Poyner and Workman who are up and down during the year. That budgeted amount could be under or over what the actual spending ends up being. Plus, yes, they could get salary relief if they trade higher salaries for lesser ones during the year.
The article specifically says as currently constituted they are over the tax. Could they send out salary in a deal that takes them under? Sure, but unlikely.
 

grimshaw

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I don't believe you can do it in baseball, but could they "trade" Allen Craig as part of a salary dump? He is owed about $300,000 more.

I'm not seeing many options for them on moving significant salary otherwise unless it's something like getting a team to take on Nunez.

Though if they moved a close to minimum salary guy and had the other team assume the total salary of the player being traded it would save like $150,000.
 

ehaz

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I hate to bring this up, but what about Roberto Osuna?

According to Ken Rosenthal, his suspension is to conclude on Aug 5 and the BJs are trying to move Osuna before the deadline. He will be eligible for postseason play.


It would be a shitty thing to do, and tough to swallow as a fan.

On the other hand, you have one of the best young closers under contract for three years while Kimbrel is set to look for a record breaking contract this offseason.
 

SirPsychoSquints

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I don't believe you can do it in baseball, but could they "trade" Allen Craig as part of a salary dump? He is owed about $300,000 more.

I'm not seeing many options for them on moving significant salary otherwise unless it's something like getting a team to take on Nunez.

Though if they moved a close to minimum salary guy and had the other team assume the total salary of the player being traded it would save like $150,000.
I believe Craig is not counted against the cap, just like Castillo, because they're not on the roster. Therefore there's no value to be had for trading him.
 

Red(s)HawksFan

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I don't believe you can do it in baseball, but could they "trade" Allen Craig as part of a salary dump? He is owed about $300,000 more.

I'm not seeing many options for them on moving significant salary otherwise unless it's something like getting a team to take on Nunez.

Though if they moved a close to minimum salary guy and had the other team assume the total salary of the player being traded it would save like $150,000.
Since Craig doesn't cost them anything against the luxury tax in the first place, I don't think any salary saved on him would make any difference at all. The only way to save salary is to move someone off the 40-man roster, not dead money already paid or owed to departed players.
 

Papelbon's Poutine

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I don't believe you can do it in baseball, but could they "trade" Allen Craig as part of a salary dump? He is owed about $300,000 more.

I'm not seeing many options for them on moving significant salary otherwise unless it's something like getting a team to take on Nunez.

Though if they moved a close to minimum salary guy and had the other team assume the total salary of the player being traded it would save like $150,000.
Craig is not included in tax figures, same as Rusney.

Edit: covered while typing
 
Sep 13, 2006
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I hate to bring this up, but what about Roberto Osuna?

According to Ken Rosenthal, his suspension is to conclude on Aug 5 and the BJs are trying to move Osuna before the deadline. He will be eligible for postseason play.


It would be a shitty thing to do, and tough to swallow as a fan.

On the other hand, you have one of the best young closers under contract for three years while Kimbrel is set to look for a record breaking contract this offseason.
I could see the MFYs acquiring Osuna (not that they have any pressing need for another bullpen arm). NY didn't hesitate to trade for Chapman when the Sox and other teams away from him as a result of his domestic incident(s).