Penn State AD and Sandusky Charged

terrynever

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I'm still waiting for someone to explain why Sandusky left coaching when he did, with the Emeritus title and the $59k/year pension.
This link doesn't explain the "retirement" but it's a start. The 1998 incident with the boy in a shower happens, Joe runs the guy out of his program in May of 1999 after he takes a boy to the San Antonio bowl game in Jan, 1999. The sports information department at Penn State spins the story that Jerry retires to spend more time with his Second Mile outfit. And he goes away, just as Joe wanted. Joe, the publicity hack, and the downtown police who decided there wasn't enough evidence to prosecute in 1998 are all involved in the cover-up.
I read somewhere in the maze of articles over the past week that a kid Jerry was abusing in May of 1999 said Jerry was very angry about Joe telling him "he would never be head coach at Penn State." I'm too worn down by this to keep looking for that story, but it's out there.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/935471-jerry-sandusky-scandal-abrupt-retirement-from-coaching-was-a-warning-sign
 

WayBackVazquez

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This link doesn't explain the "retirement" but it's a start. The 1998 incident with the boy in a shower happens, Joe runs the guy out of his program in May of 1999 after he takes a boy to the San Antonio bowl game in Jan, 1999. The sports information department at Penn State spins the story that Jerry retires to spend more time with his Second Mile outfit. And he goes away, just as Joe wanted. Joe, the publicity hack, and the downtown police who decided there wasn't enough evidence to prosecute in 1998 are all involved in the cover-up.
I read somewhere in the maze of articles over the past week that a kid Jerry was abusing in May of 1999 said Jerry was very angry about Joe telling him "he would never be head coach at Penn State." I'm too worn down by this to keep looking for that story, but it's out there.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/935471-jerry-sandusky-scandal-abrupt-retirement-from-coaching-was-a-warning-sign
Yeah, it's like, in the Grand Jury Presentment and stuff, Beavis.
 

In Vino Vinatieri

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I don't know legally whether the judge's connections to the charity rise to the level of canonical violations, but certainly, it does show that she has positive view of the organization and that's troubling when you also consider that she had to know who Sandusky was, if not personally, then professionally.

Regardless, it looks bad in the context of the tentacles PSU and this organization appear to have wrapped around this backwater and will be one more reason why the feds need to step in.
I agree. This is just another in a very long line of personal connections between the people in the area and the university, many of which were so defined that people deliberately overlooked or abetted Sandusky in what he was doing. It's nauseating at this point, even when it's pretty minimal.

It's definitely troubling thinking about whether she knows Sandusky. As WayBackVazquez said, though the donations may not be great, it does show she volunteered her time for Second Mile with no mention of what she actually did. She might have brought brownies for kids at one event and never thought of the charity again or she might've met with Sandusky regularly at charity barbecues and fundraisers. Who knows? With Sandusky being so visible in the organization and with positive comments about the effort he put into it coming from all around, I find it hard to believe she wasn't aware he ran the program if not met him multiple times or known him.

What's also disturbing is that his bail was reduced in money, was made less strict, and Sandusky was free to return to his home which "neighbors the Lemont Elementary school" according to MSNBC. Schools are everywhere, but really? MSNBC also points out that he wasn't known for molesting random children as if that would make anyone feel better. What are the odds he doesn't know personally some of the children who go to that school through Second Mile?
 

Average Reds

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I don't want to sidetrack into religion, but - at least in the Catholic tradition where public and joint prayer is a fundamental principle of the faith - that passage is read as interdicting hypocritical 'show' prayer (and charity). That is, going through the motions publicly so you can have your "reward" in the respect and adoration of the community, rather than earnestly giving and praying privately to ensure your reward in the next life. I don't think there's anything in Jesus' teachings (and as you note, this is from the Sermon on the Mount) that looks down on earnest public group prayer. I thought the quote was disingenous because he seems to be saying the prayer session was Kabuki Theather and inappropriate, and maybe it was, but not just because it happened out of doors. Misappropriating a Bible quote seemed snarky, as if he's trying to beat the praying players 'at their own game.' For that purpose, the cite missed the mark.
Nothing about the concept of a joint prayer struck me as being unreasonable. However, it ceased to be a nice gesture when the fans started applauding about halfway through it. Applause was about the least appropriate reaction I could think of given the circumstances, and as it built to a crescendo while the prayer continued, I turned the channel before I got sick to my stomach.

In that context, the reaction of the fans can only be understood as an affirmation of self, not of sincere empathy or a sense of contrition for what had happened. The only word I can think of to describe it is despicable.

As for your second point, I don't think it's unreasonable that some of the players and staff and PSU community want to heal as well. Yes, they're not the tragic figures here. Yes, the molested boys have it far worse. But, does that mean that their emotions and turmoil are completely meritless? I imagine a lot of people are suffering out there for many different reasons and on many different scales. They don't fall into absolute groups of people who can and cannot be justifiabily upset. The only people who don't deserve "healing" right now are Sandusky, McQueary, Paterno and that lot.
There is no question that the entire community in State College is hurting. It doesn't necessarily follow that they should use the pregame prayer to begin the healing process for themselves.

To the last point, it's worth reinforcing that this entire scandal was created and ultimately driven by a lack of perspective derived from the incredibly myopic culture in State College. To be specific, people don't come to the conclusion that the reputation of the football program is more important that the moral imperative of informing the police that one of their own was suspected of being a pedophile in a vacuum. This doesn't mean that everyone in State College is equally guilty, but it would be nice if the larger community would have the self-awareness to spend more than a minute or two reflecting on their part of the fiasco instead of insisting that it's time to put things behind us because "IT'S GAME TIME, DAMMIT!!! GO NITTANY LIONS!!!!"

Penn State will have plenty of time for healing. Right now, they need to collectively own their feelings.
 

Marciano490

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Nothing about the concept of a joint prayer struck me as being unreasonable. However, it ceased to be a nice gesture when the fans started applauding about halfway through it. Applause was about the least appropriate reaction I could think of given the circumstances, and as it built to a crescendo while the prayer continued, I turned the channel before I got sick to my stomach.

In that context, the reaction of the fans can only be understood as an affirmation of self, not of sincere empathy or a sense of contrition for what had happened. The only word I can think of to describe it is despicable.



There is no question that the entire community in State College is hurting. It doesn't necessarily follow that they should use the pregame prayer to begin the healing process for themselves.

To the last point, it's worth reinforcing that this entire scandal was created and ultimately driven by a lack of perspective derived from the incredibly myopic culture in State College. To be specific, people don't come to the conclusion that the reputation of the football program is more important that the moral imperative of informing the police that one of their own was suspected of being a pedophile in a vacuum. This doesn't mean that everyone in State College is equally guilty, but it would be nice if the larger community would have the self-awareness to spend more than a minute or two reflecting on their part of the fiasco instead of insisting that it's time to put things behind us because "IT'S GAME TIME, DAMMIT!!! GO NITTANY LIONS!!!!"

Penn State will have plenty of time for healing. Right now, they need to collectively own their feelings.
I think you make a lot of good points, and this discussion obviously revolves around beliefs and feelings, not numbers and data, so there is no way to prove either of our points and little hope of convincing anyone to change positions. I don't think there are any absolutes when it comes to human behavior; I imagine a lot of those praying were sincere, but that doesn't mean there wasn't some individual and group 'showboating' going on as well. I tend not to question other people's motivations too deeply though, just because doing so is generally futile.

Also, I don't know how much you can expect from the football players and fans in this situation. People have an inherent, remarkable ability to internalize tragedies and make others' misfortunes their own. Obviously, the real victims here are the little boys. But, I would imagine there are a lot of football players feeling pretty upset that they came to PSU to play under Paterno and now, through no fault of their own, will no longer get the chance to do so. There are probably similar sentiments among fans. Again, I'm not justifying the behavior here, but it's just a more vile iteration of that malignant impulse that makes us curse crashed cars because the delay is making us late for work.
 

Average Reds

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I think you make a lot of good points, and this discussion obviously revolves around beliefs and feelings, not numbers and data, so there is no way to prove either of our points and little hope of convincing anyone to change positions. I don't think there are any absolutes when it comes to human behavior; I imagine a lot of those praying were sincere, but that doesn't mean there wasn't some individual and group 'showboating' going on as well. I tend not to question other people's motivations too deeply though, just because doing so is generally futile.

Also, I don't know how much you can expect from the football players and fans in this situation. People have an inherent, remarkable ability to internalize tragedies and make others' misfortunes their own. Obviously, the real victims here are the little boys. But, I would imagine there are a lot of football players feeling pretty upset that they came to PSU to play under Paterno and now, through no fault of their own, will no longer get the chance to do so. There are probably similar sentiments among fans. Again, I'm not justifying the behavior here, but it's just a more vile iteration of that malignant impulse that makes us curse crashed cars because the delay is making us late for work.
I actually expect little from the players in this situation. They are justifiably confused/upset at a situation that has been dumped on them with no warning and through no fault of their own.

Perhaps I was expecting too much from the fans, but really, all I expected was that they would remain quiet during a moment of silence and not engage in cheering like it's a version of the National Anthem that's gone on a bit too long. It left a very bad taste in my mouth and was not something that spoke well for State College, IMO.
 

Marciano490

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I actually expect little from the players in this situation. They are justifiably confused/upset at a situation that has been dumped on them with no warning and through no fault of their own.

Perhaps I was expecting too much from the fans, but really, all I expected was that they would remain quiet during a moment of silence and not engage in cheering like it's a version of the National Anthem that's gone on a bit too long. It left a very bad taste in my mouth and was not something that spoke well for State College, IMO.
Fair enough. I think we have similar impressions, but started with different expectations.
 

sfip

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As for your second point, I don't think it's unreasonable that some of the players and staff and PSU community want to heal as well. Yes, they're not the tragic figures here. Yes, the molested boys have it far worse. But, does that mean that their emotions and turmoil are completely meritless? I imagine a lot of people are suffering out there for many different reasons and on many different scales. They don't fall into absolute groups of people who can and cannot be justifiabily upset. The only people who don't deserve "healing" right now are Sandusky, McQueary, Paterno and that lot.
Marciano, thank you for saying how I've been feeling but couldn't express nearly as well as you did. It will take a long time for this Penn Stater to get over all this.
 

Monbo Jumbo

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Twitter blowing up with a McQueary quote

tweeted by NBCNews Peter Alexander - McQueary: "... the truth is not out there fully... I didn't just turn and run... I made sure it stopped..."


Uhmm, right.
 

luckysox

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...the only word I can think of to describe it is despicable.
Penn State will have plenty of time for healing. Right now, they need to collectively own their feelings.
You know, I have been silent on this subject so far because I have trouble getting all of my emotions around it and once I start writing on here when I'm emotional, I get skewered for it. Also, I have 9 month old and am too tired to read posts and then write anything worth reading in response. But suddenly I am compelled to write about this, not necessarily as a response to any one post here (thought the despicable comment got me), but as a response on the whole situation, which I am sure will address some things I have read here and either agreed or disagreed with. Let me also say that I am proud to be a member of this board as I read through the pages dedicated to these crimes and the subsequent scandal. There is some very good, and very personal stuff in here, and it's been a pleasure to read about 95% of it.

I am a victim of sexual violence, so I certainly have a biased point of view in terms of expressing and feeling a sincere amount of sadness for the boys who were, the men who are, victims of Jerry Sandusky. Let us remember, though, that Sandusky was the predator. As far as we know, no one else who was directly involved in the covver-up of these crimes was a sexual predator of boys. Were they inept? Immoral? Corrupt? Greedy? Cowardly? Yes, a thousand, million, billion times yes. Were they even criminally responsible for some things? Probably. But they were not sexual predators. Sandusly vs. Paterno isn't even close in a fight of dudes who should be tarred, feathered and pulled apart by a team of horses. When I was raped, I was a college student. My school handled it as poorly as a school possibly could - and that means mostly the public safety/police tandem and out Dean of Students. But I never, ever compare them to the men who raped me. Did they let me down? So very far. But they did not rape me. They didn't.

And as far as we know, no current PSU players were either sexual predators OR inept, immoral, corrupt, greedy, cowardly men with regard top this particular and specific situation. Nor were any PSU fans. These fans number, what, in the millions? If 100,000+ sit in the stands every week, and even more are on campus or around not at the game but watching/celebrating it how many are out there in the world with some sort of ties to PSU Football? Maybe a million? I know someone will correct me on that number. I'm not sure how to find it, and I'm not sure it matters - what matters is that it's a very marge number and as far as we know, NONE of them are a part of these very specific allegation(s) of rape and abuse of boys.


I am not a religious person by any stretch and in fact have a hard time believing in God (or god for that matter) most days of the year. Ironically (or not), one of the only times I remember praying to a God in my whole life was when I was being raped. But my belief in God is utterly self-serving, as evidenced by that moment, and I am aware of it. Most people who truly believe in God are not necessarily aware of how self serving that belief is; they think that prayer can cure evils, can cure illness, can cure grief, can change lives, can heal all ills of the flesh, mind and soul. Ok. It is what it is. It does not make these folks inherently bad or selfish when they pray; in fact, it might make them the opposite. Many want the best and hope and believe that prayer will help the best happen for them, and so often for others, too.

I think it was entirely respectful for the student athletes on these teams to meet at mid-field and kneel down on Saturday - be it in prayer or some other show of respect for all that has happened over the course of the last week, for the losses suffered by all victims. What else were they supposed to do? What else could these specific young men have done to show that this has affected them, that they are human, that they grieve, both for the victims, and yes, for themselves and their team and coach and school - for they have lost something in this, too. The enormity of the loss of the boys who were raped does not mean that those indirectly involved who were negatively affected do not have a right to also feel saddened, betrayed, angry - while also feeling regret and horror for Sandusky's victims. I don't see how this particular action by players, who had nothing at all whatsoever to do with these crimes and their cover-up, could be considered despicable. Is there another way for them to show their own need to grieve and also their understanding of the grief that this has caused for others (and I am sure this includes Sandusky's actual victims - how could it not??) that the fans in the stadium and the country (this was a nationally televised game) as a whole might identify with?

I don't see how the applause by fans in the stadium could be considered despicable, either. These are people, like you and me . Many are blue collar, hard working, church going folks from the middle of Pennsylvania. Everyone in the country, the world, is hating on their former coach, who was perhaps the most beloved and respected coach in the history of all sports in this country; everyone is hating on the institution to which they are loyal; many in the press and general public are immediately lumping them in with said institution. In reality, the "institution" is a handful of powerful yet flawed men (and women?) who have made some deplorable decisions. Why should the fans turn their back on a team, and an entire institution because of these flawed men? Should they be angry and feel betrayed by the PSU administration and by Sandusky, Paterno and others on the staff? Yes. But feeling betrayed, being angry and demanding accountability do not necessarily mean you turn your back on the laundry. Should they not give PSU the chance to right the wrongs? Indeed, should not fans of all ilk give their institutions this chance when things go insanely down the wrong path? Should fans' support not be in good times and in times of great shame and need? How else would change come to these institutions? Will PSU ever get the chance for redemption without its fans? And isn't redemption the ultimate goal here? Shouldn't we all want to never, ever see anything like this happen again? Wouldn't the prevention of such crimes be absolute redemption for fans, for players, and most importantly for Sandusky's victims at this point? Might PSU not have the best opportunity now to make a difference in a world that, both inside and outside of its walls indeed does include sexual abuse and pedophilia? And aren't these things so engulfed in and surrounded by shame that they are too easily swept under the rug? Penn State and it's fans and students and alumni have a unique opportunity to demand change and accountability when it comes to sexual abuse in this country. They have a chance to make a huge difference. Call those who are idiots out, prosecute the guilty, and shame those whose morals failed them and our children...but give PSU - the entirety of it - a chance to do something with this scandal that might change lives down the road. Why wouldn't we give them this chance? And why shouldn't it start how it did on Saturday (and let's take ESPN out of the equation if we can)? It is never too late to save the next victim..Paterno won't do it, but maybe, just maybe, someone that was in that stadium on Saturday will stand up and make a difference for some other boy who is now being, or would have been, abused because they were moved by what they saw and were a part of. I doubt very much that the opposite would happen and that someone who saw that would start or perpetuate a cover up of sexual abuse because of it.

PSU, the players and fans are in a position to make a difference. It's a unique position because it is so public. EVERYONE was watching. And their first real chance to "say" something (aside from the minority of morons we've seen since last week rioting and at JoPa's house - and be sure they are a minority overall) to the public about this was met by young men kneeling in silence (what they were thinking to themselves is not for us to know) and in respect, met by a thunderous applause by a fan base that needed that moment and that particular avenue - applause - to say, "We are acknowledging Sandusky's victims, this scandal, these young men who play for us every week, and we are saying we support this institution because we love it and we want it to do better." So, they are Penn State. It's not an awesome thing to be right now, but they still embraced it. I don't think they did so out of some defiance, but more likely out of a need to start they healing process for themselves. And what's wrong with that? I don;t see what is wrong with that. The healing really does have to start somewhere, doesn't it? I don;t think that place at that time was inappropriate.

edit: multiple typos that I do not have time to fix. Sorry!
 

canderson

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Bob Costas interviewed Sandusky this afternoon, and it airs at 10 tonight on Rock Center.

Sandusky told Costas he is innocent of charges and did nothing more than horsing around.

"I'm innocent of these charges" Jerry Sandusky tells Bob Costas in exclusive interview airing tonight 10p/9c NBC #RockCenter
 

JBill

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More, if anyone cares...

"I could say that I have done some of those things. I have horsed around with kids I have showered after workouts. I have hugged them and I have touched their legs without intent of sexual contact," said Sandusky.

When pressed by Costas about what if anything was Sandusky willing to concede that he'd done was wrong, Sandusky said, "I shouldn't have showered with those kids."
NBC
 

JBill

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Doesn't McQueary have a lawyer telling him to shut up and not contradict his grand jury testimony?
 

Sprowl

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Doesn't McQueary have a lawyer telling him to shut up and not contradict his grand jury testimony?
The Grand Jury's report is silent on what happened after both Sandusky and the victim saw McQueary, and McQueary "left immediately, distraught." One might infer that "immediately" implies that the assault went on as before, but that is not clear. The transcript might clear that up, but at this point it's not certain that it is a contradiction.
 

Dehere

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That was a brave post, luckysox. Thanks.

Bob Costas interviewed Sandusky this afternoon, and it airs at 10 tonight on Rock Center.

Sandusky told Costas he is innocent of charges and did nothing more than horsing around.
It's unfathomable to me that Sandusky would participate in this.
 

lars10

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That was a brave post, luckysox. Thanks.

It's unfathomable to me that Sandusky would participate in this.
Doesn't it make complete sense though? He's an egomaniac who has charmed people for years...has been able to convince many people over years that he isn't who he's now accused of being. I think this happens in a lot of cases of mass murderers for instance...taking their own defense...believing that they can charm the judge and jury of their innocence regardless of the facts against them.

As luckysox wrote regarding 'healing'... I'm a PSU grad, my Dad was a PSU grad. My Uncle (my Aunt still lives in their house in Lemont) was a professor. My cousin works on campus...countless cousins went to PSU..one of my best friends lives there and his wife works there. My entire life with relatives from my father's side has revolved around PSU and at times around their football program... I watched '82 and '86 there with my family and extended family.

The place has huge significance to me and my life. These past few days feel like an indictment against me and my family. People describing a place that I know far better than they and people I've spent far more time around. And the whole thing has sort of made me question what I grew up around and if it was all a lie... I have a lot of pride wrapped up in those experiences and around the University...but have felt like I should be ashamed of all of it at this point.

I don't know if I require 'healing'...and certainly nothing in comparison to the true victims, but I reacted very differently to the public prayer than most people here. Maybe I'm a sucker, but for me it was the first time I could see how it affected my fellow alumni and the current student body... Penn State was in an absolute no win situation this weekend and I think they did the best they could. PSU and its fans have their share of idiots, but the school and the town has been painted with a pretty broad brush recently...in some cases fairly and in others i'm not so sure yet.
 

PBDWake

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Here's what is probably a pet peeve issue I have with everyone from Penn State trying to put a rush on "beginning to heal" (and I'm not counting on many to agree with me):

They're putting the cart before the horse in an effort to change the narrative. This whole thing hasn't even finished playing out yet. You can begin to heal when the trials are all over, and everything is out in the open. But don't tell me you're gonna begin to heal, and then in 2 weeks, when something new comes out, you can begin to heal from that, and then at trial... whatever.

I would also imagine that none of the reported victims are likely to begin their own healing process until after Sandusky sees a sentencing hearing. Let's let that resolve before we worry about ourselves, ok?
 

Byrdbrain

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The Grand Jury's report is silent on what happened after both Sandusky and the victim saw McQueary, and McQueary "left immediately, distraught." One might infer that "immediately" implies that the assault went on as before, but that is not clear. The transcript might clear that up, but at this point it's not certain that it is a contradiction.

Yeah I think Sprowl has it here. Obviously that part of the story never made any sense, no one especially a young fit former athlete would just cut and run. I assume whoever wrote the GJ report didn't feel McQueary saying something or breaking it up or whatever he did was relevant to the legal aspects of the case.

I am shocked Sandusky is speaking, you would imagine his lawyer would have told him not to.
 

julesfan

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Yeah I think Sprowl has it here. Obviously that part of the story never made any sense, no one especially a young fit former athlete would just cut and run. I assume whoever wrote the GJ report didn't feel McQueary saying something or breaking it up or whatever he did was relevant to the legal aspects of the case.

I am shocked Sandusky is speaking, you would imagine his lawyer would have told him not to.

But if McQueary "broke it up", would he have not found out the kid's name?? Called his mother to come get him? Given him a ride home himself?? I'm sorry but I absolutely do believe he turned and got the hell out of there, because if not we would know what happened to that boy. You wouldn't pull an old man off a kid and then say okay my work is done, and leave the kid with said old man.
 

Byrdbrain

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But if McQueary "broke it up", would he have not found out the kid's name?? Called his mother to come get him? Given him a ride home himself?? I'm sorry but I absolutely do believe he turned and got the hell out of there, because if not we would know what happened to that boy. You wouldn't pull an old man off a kid and then say okay my work is done, and leave the kid with said old man.

Valid points, still he says he didn't just run and it certainly wouldn't be wise of him to contradict what he said in the GJ.
I expect we'll get the details on this sooner rather than later.
 

Williams Head Case

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SportsCenter now reporting that McQueary did break up the shower rape instead of doing nothing about it, as was inferred from the grand jury presentment.

Edit: Already been covered.
 

Gdiguy

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Valid points, still he says he didn't just run and it certainly wouldn't be wise of him to contradict what he said in the GJ.
I expect we'll get the details on this sooner rather than later.
It's also possible that if they still (for some reason) don't know the ID of the victim, they're keeping some details out of the press to be able to validate a victim's statement
 

knucklecup

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"I did the right thing…you guys know me…"

"... the truth is not out there fully... I didn't just turn and run... I made sure it stopped..."

"... I had to make quick tough decisions…"

I don't know what to think of these quotes...
 

Tokyo Sox

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But if McQueary "broke it up", would he have not found out the kid's name?? Called his mother to come get him? Given him a ride home himself?? I'm sorry but I absolutely do believe he turned and got the hell out of there, because if not we would know what happened to that boy. You wouldn't pull an old man off a kid and then say okay my work is done, and leave the kid with said old man.
No? It's a horrifying act. It's hard to know how to react, and difficult to face head on. I think it's entirely possible that McQueary saw it, broke it up, said "Get outta here kid", flattened Sandusky and immediately went home and downed a bottle of scotch hoping it would go away before realizing it wouldn't and thus reporting it. Who really knows; hopefully we find out and you could well be right, but I'm just saying there are more possibilities than you are allowing for there. I think it would be embarrassing & distressing enough for both the boy and McQueary that they didn't want to sit down and say, hey, let's talk about what happened, and do you want me to call your mom? F*CK NO I DON'T WANT YOU TO CALL MY MOTHER, PLEASE PLEASE DON'T EVER MENTION THIS TO ANYONE! etc
 

Judge Mental13

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Well McQueary might not be contradicting anything in the GJ report.

He said in the report that both Sandusky and the boy saw him when he entered the shower area. He may not have confronted Sandusky, or even opened his mouth, but I can't imagine that Sandusky would look over his shoulder, see that he's been caught, and then continue the act.

In other words, McQueary probably did stop it, but not through any sort of heroic actions, or anything more than just his presence in the room being noticed by Sandusky, really.
 

Average Reds

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I have always assumed that there was more to McQueary's story than we knew. Now I'd like to hear an explanation for how - after seeing what he saw - he could continue to coach at Penn State with Jerry Sandusky on campus for years without either confronting him, reporting him to the police or quitting his job in protest.

The world waits and wonders...
 
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Well McQueary might not be contradicting anything in the GJ report.

He said in the report that both Sandusky and the boy saw him when he entered the shower area. He may not have confronted Sandusky, or even opened his mouth, but I can't imagine that Sandusky would look over his shoulder, see that he's been caught, and then continue the act.

In other words, McQueary probably did stop it, but not through any sort of heroic actions, or anything more than just his presence in the room being noticed by Sandusky, really.
I don't buy it. If you heroically stopped a rape in progress, you don't tell the Grand Jury when you're testifying under oath? You only tell your buddies in an email that gets conveniently leaked after you're removed from your job? Really?

And if you did break it up, you don't go to the cops even though you can identify the guy, you don't tell Paterno that his buddy Sandusky was ramming his cock in the ass of a 10 year old in Paterno's facilities and when you still see Sandusky skulking around campus days/weeks/months/years later, you don't ever bring up what you saw with anyone or ask "Hey guys, 'member that time I saw this guy raping a kid? Whatever became of that?"

Come on.

 

drtooth

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McQueary is another pathetic example of a person involved in this more concerned with protecting his rep and covering his ass than what happened. Sickening.
 

BigPapiLumber Co.

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McQueary is another pathetic example of a person involved in this more concerned with protecting his rep and covering his ass than what happened. Sickening.
I think McQueary is pathetic for a number of reasons (not calling the cops, continuing to work with people who didn't call the cops, continuing to be in place frequented by a child rapist), but I can certainly empathize with him here, because the one thing that makes him look like an absolutely pathetic pussy is the reports that he saw a kid getting raped and did nothing to stop it. If I were him I would absolutely want my friends to know that wasn't how things played out. Call it protecting your rep or call it whatever, but I would absolutely do the same (at this stage ... at an earlier stage, I think and hope I would've done things much, much differently).




Edit: speeling
 

Mr. Wednesday

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I don't buy it. If you heroically stopped a rape in progress, you don't tell the Grand Jury when you're testifying under oath?
How do you know he didn't tell the Grand Jury? Last I knew, we didn't have complete transcripts of anyone's testimony. From the point of view of the charges that were brought, I don't think it's relevant information, so I can understand it being left out of the summary report.
 
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You don't think breaking up a rape is relevant? You don't think physically or verbally intervening in an ongoing rape would have resulted in additional facts -- conversations, actions -- between McQueary and Sandusky and/or the boy that would have been relevant to the investigation?
 

judyb

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You don't think breaking up a rape is relevant? You don't think physically or verbally intervening in an ongoing rape would have resulted in additional facts -- conversations, actions -- between McQueary and Sandusky and/or the boy that would have been relevant to the investigation?
It's relevant to the investigation, but not necessarily to the Grand Jury's findings.
 

Average Reds

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You don't think breaking up a rape is relevant? You don't think physically or verbally intervening in an ongoing rape would have resulted in additional facts -- conversations, actions -- between McQueary and Sandusky and/or the boy that would have been relevant to the investigation?
It's important to realize that the report itself was never meant for public consumption - it was filed under seal for purposes of backing up the indictment and inadvertently leaked. This is from a New York Times story on Governor Corbett:

On Friday, the governor finally got the word. The grand jury indictment had been filed under seal, but because of a computer glitch it had mistakenly been made public. Soon Mr. Corbett's office was inundated with calls. Mr. Harley reached the governor in his car.
The point is that the report was not written to give a complete picture of the grand jury proceedings. So it's perfectly reasonable to assume that there is a lot of additional information that will come out.

McQueary has a lot to answer for regardless of what we ultimately find out. But I'm not comfortable making a final judgment about him just yet.
 

Dehere

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One wonders if computer glitch isn't code for someone in the judicial system got sick of people not knowing about this.
I've wondered that too. How often does said glitch cause sealed indictments to be inadvertently made public?

I think that was a computer glitch the same way that calling a reporter and giving out damning information verbally is a "telephone glitch".
 

Average Reds

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One wonders if computer glitch isn't code for someone in the judicial system got sick of people not knowing about this.
"Computer glitch" is the information-age equivalent to saying that "my dog ate it." Someone clearly posted this so that the public could view it and did a Rick Perry. ("Oops.")
 

bosoxsue

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Interesting that you have brought that up. Check out the last couple of grafs in this piece, which was written by a very well-known civil rights attorney in Connecticut.

Courant op-ed

Today's David Brooks column is also worth a look. It struck a chord with me because I was faced with quite an uphill battle when I responded to someone's Facebook status Saturday that "All Penn State fans are assholes." I replied that I knew several PSU fans at the game Saturday who are actually very nice people. You'd have thought they were enablers of child molesters, the way people replied to my response. The self-righteousness is over the top in some places.
 

Go Big Red Sox

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Doyel's take on last night's interview, etc

Sandusky's attorney, Joe Amendola, told Costas on Monday night that someone from the defense team -- Amendola didn't specify who; it could have been Sandusky himself -- has been in contact with the child known as alleged Victim Two.

"So you found him, the Commonwealth has not?" Costas asked.

"Yeah. Interesting, isn't it?" Amendola replied.

No. Not interesting -- it's horrifying. Presumption of innocence is one thing, but contacting an alleged victim before the trial? Horrifying. The idea that Sandusky or his people were able to talk to the alleged victim, influence the child's testimony, even persuade him not to cooperate at all ... it's beyond comprehension that such a thing could happen.
 
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Yes, I thought Sandusky's lawyer saying they've already "found" some of these victims who testified and they're going to recant sworn testimony to say they weren't molested is nothing short of shocking and scary. In fact, it's another example of the unrelenting effort to defend PSU and Sandusky against accusations of crimes and a cover-up that is terrifying for its blind fervor to do whatever it takes to save the program, Paterno, the school's rep. Besides trying to plant seeds of doubt about sworn testimony, the lawyer is trying to scare other victims from coming forward, pure and simple.
 

Sprowl

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Yes, I thought Sandusky's lawyer saying they've already "found" some of these victims who testified and they're going to recant sworn testimony to say they weren't molested is nothing short of shocking and scary. In fact, it's another example of the unrelenting effort to defend PSU and Sandusky against accusations of crimes and a cover-up that is terrifying for its blind fervor to do whatever it takes to save the program, Paterno, the school's rep. Besides trying to plant seeds of doubt about sworn testimony, the lawyer is trying to scare other victims from coming forward, pure and simple.
Amendola looks to be behind the curve in trying to shut that barn door: "close to 10" additional victims have already come forward, and the police are working to confirm their stories.
 

dirtynine

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Interesting that you have brought that up. Check out the last couple of grafs in this piece, which was written by a very well-known civil rights attorney in Connecticut.

Courant op-ed

Today's David Brooks column is also worth a look. It struck a chord with me because I was faced with quite an uphill battle when I responded to someone's Facebook status Saturday that "All Penn State fans are assholes." I replied that I knew several PSU fans at the game Saturday who are actually very nice people. You'd have thought they were enablers of child molesters, the way people replied to my response. The self-righteousness is over the top in some places.
This is exactly how I feel. Good piece.


 

Judge Mental13

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I don't buy it. If you heroically stopped a rape in progress, you don't tell the Grand Jury when you're testifying under oath? You only tell your buddies in an email that gets conveniently leaked after you're removed from your job? Really?

And if you did break it up, you don't go to the cops even though you can identify the guy, you don't tell Paterno that his buddy Sandusky was ramming his cock in the ass of a 10 year old in Paterno's facilities and when you still see Sandusky skulking around campus days/weeks/months/years later, you don't ever bring up what you saw with anyone or ask "Hey guys, 'member that time I saw this guy raping a kid? Whatever became of that?"

Come on.
You're missing what I'm saying. He said in the grand jury report that he saw Sandusky and the kid, Sandusky and the kid saw him, then he left. Since Sandusky saw McQueary, he probably stopped. So in a roundabout way, McQueary stopped the rape. It's a stretch, but he's not saying one thing to the GJ and another thing to his teammates.