Offseason Thread - Betty when you call me, you can call me Al

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cheech13

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How exactly would Boston afford Rubio? The math that was shown gets Boston about $13MM in cap space. Does anyone think Rubio signs for less than that? Given the amount of money on the free agent market this summer I'm not even sure Derrick Rose signs for that.
 

nighthob

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Because Rubio has plateaued as an above average player at a position where there isn’t exactly a shortage of players? Plus as an unrestricted guy he’s free to choose his next situation.
 

benhogan

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I don't think Ainge/Zarren would bring in TJ McConnell but I am willing to bet that he would quickly become a fan, if not board favorite in Boston for a lot of obvious reasons. Meanwhile, he is a marginal NBA talent at best and the Celtics would be better off retaining Wanamaker.
this is totally unnecessary.
 

lovegtm

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Then he needs new agents because there’s a zero percent chance that Boston lets him walk, this isn’t analogous to the KO situation, they need Rozier either as a trade chip or an actual player if/when Irving leaves.
It does seem dumb by Terry/his agent, but I sort of understand the gambit if his goal is to get paid at all, and he’s fine coming back to Boston.

By making it possible that he’s burned Boston bridges, he increases the chance that a team will throw a 10-12M AAV contract at him, rather than steering clear like they did with Smart. Smart would have had no problem getting 45-55 somewhere in UFA, but everyone knew Danny was matching at that number.

I do agree with you that the Celtics match if it’s a 4/45 type contract offer in order to not lose an asset for nothing, and I think that would be the right move.
 

DeJesus Built My Hotrod

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I'd be fine with McConnell in the Wanamaker role. As first ballhandler off the bench though, it would be disappointing.
No interest. He really isn't a useful player. I don't love Wanamaker but he is a passable defender. Aside from energy plays, McConnell is a huge target for opposing offenses.
 

Big John

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There are lots of free agent point guards this Summer and only so much cap space around the league to offer them deals above the MLE. Aside from Kyrie and Rozier, there are:

Point guards:
restricted: Russell, Brogdon, Mudiay
player option: Dragic, Teague
unrestricted: Kemba, Rubio, Rose, Payton, Beverley, Collison, Rondo, IT, Ish Smith, McConnell, Lin, Joseph

Then in the draft there are Morant, White, Garland, and some sleepers (e.g. Ky Bowman).

I don't think finding a Rozier replacement will be difficult.
 

HomeRunBaker

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There are lots of free agent point guards this Summer and only so much cap space around the league to offer them deals above the MLE. Aside from Kyrie and Rozier, there are:

Point guards:
restricted: Russell, Brogdon, Mudiay
player option: Dragic, Teague
unrestricted: Kemba, Rubio, Rose, Payton, Beverley, Collison, Rondo, IT, Ish Smith, McConnell, Lin, Joseph

Then in the draft there are Morant, White, Garland, and some sleepers (e.g. Ky Bowman).

I don't think finding a Rozier replacement will be difficult.
Our cap situation and future tax considerations would make it pretty difficult to replace Kyrie.

Assuming Kyrie is going we wouldn’t be replacing Roziers bench role of this past season but his starting role of this coming season. To Nighthobs point that is why Ainge would likely match any reasonable offer for Rozier to take Kyrie’s spot......but Rozier sure seems to be trying his best to avoid this.

Edit: And for the love of god would people please stop including IT in these lists he hasn’t been a viable NBA player in a couple years.
 

Big John

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No, Marcus Smart would be the starting pg and you'd be looking at a backup pg. What needs to be replaced is Kyrie's scoring, not his ability to run an offense.
 

wade boggs chicken dinner

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It wouldn’t surprise me if these comments aren’t strategic. If he is aware that Kyrie is leaving and he’s really bitter at Ainge/Brad for how he was used this year/not traded by the deadline then he could be intentionally burning a bridge so the Celtics don’t match his offer sheet as a RFA.
Of course his comments are strategic (I mean why else go on First Take when he knows what the first through fifteenth questions are going to be).

I don't think it's to burn the BOS bridge (though I do think he doesn't want BOS to match if KI is still there, which is a pretty low likelihood). But it's to signal to other teams that he's really the guy who looked to play pretty well in a starter role and to give some reason why his numbers are down.

It's all marketing, yo!
 

HomeRunBaker

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Of course his comments are strategic (I mean why else go on First Take when he knows what the first through fifteenth questions are going to be).

I don't think it's to burn the BOS bridge (though I do think he doesn't want BOS to match if KI is still there, which is a pretty low likelihood). But it's to signal to other teams that he's really the guy who looked to play pretty well in a starter role and to give some reason why his numbers are down.

It's all marketing, yo!
I’m pretty sure the league execs already know this though between both data and tape. The reason I feel the agent is coaching him is that Rozier has a history with Ainge in being very close with him.
 

Eddie Jurak

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I'd be really surprised if Horford got 5 years. That's too long for his age. If he opts out and re-signs here, I'd guess it's something like 3/65, or maybe 4/80 with the 4th year not fully guaranteed.
It won't be 3/$65.
I doubt he gets 5, but the same calculation applies to 4/75. And in the last year he'll be an expiring that's useful for salary matching, even if his performance is shot by then.
Or 4/$75.

Any deal he signs has to be compared against the alternative of taking $30 MM now and then hitting free agency again. He's not taking 3/$65 or 4/$75 unless he thinks he'll be worth less than 2/$35 or 3/$45 as a 2020 free agent next year. Have people watched him guard Embiid? Even 5/$90 would be a team-friendly deal, as 4/$60 next year is quite possible for him.
 

DrewDawg

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It does seem dumb by Terry/his agent, but I sort of understand the gambit if his goal is to get paid at all, and he’s fine coming back to Boston.
Do other NBA teams like to see players do this? I mean, even if it's about another team in the league, it's not a good look for a potential employer.
 

NomarsFool

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No, Marcus Smart would be the starting pg and you'd be looking at a backup pg. What needs to be replaced is Kyrie's scoring, not his ability to run an offense.
Can Marcus Smart guard PGs? He's an elite defender, but my recollection is that faster, smaller guards have torched the Celtics. I think that'd get even worse if Smart is the PG.
 

Captaincoop

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I wonder if there will be a shot during or prior to the draft to do a deal where we pick up a future first from a team that thinks it's going in the right direction, but actually isn't.

The Sixers a year or two ago traded, effectively, the #10 pick for the #16 and a Miami first-rounder in 2021, the latter of which looks like it may come in pretty handy.
 

lovegtm

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Do other NBA teams like to see players do this? I mean, even if it's about another team in the league, it's not a good look for a potential employer.
They don't love it obviously, but I imagine there are multiple executives who think Rozier was put in a tough spot the past year, and like to see some competitive fire about it from his end.

I’m pretty sure the league execs already know this though between both data and tape. The reason I feel the agent is coaching him is that Rozier has a history with Ainge in being very close with him.
100% agree. As I noted upthread, his agent likely doesn't want Rozier to end up in Smart's situation, when everyone knew the Cs would match reasonable offers, so he didn't get any. At the same time, I don't Terry has a super-hard time playing this outspoken/aggressive role, personality-wise.
 

Sprowl

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Can Marcus Smart guard PGs? He's an elite defender, but my recollection is that faster, smaller guards have torched the Celtics. I think that'd get even worse if Smart is the PG.
No, at least not the top-flight point guards; equally damaging, Smart is not a great ballhandler, and he is vulnerable to pressure. Stevens was duly cautious about using Smart without Irving or Rozier to bring the ball up. Smart plays bigger than 6'4", for both good and ill.
 

HomeRunBaker

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No, at least not the top-flight point guards; equally damaging, Smart is not a great ballhandler, and he is vulnerable to pressure. Stevens was duly cautious about using Smart without Irving or Rozier to bring the ball up. Smart plays bigger than 6'4", for both good and ill.
I mean he’s not going to struggle like say Isaiah has been but Yes, and we’ve been repeating this for a couple years now......damn I’ve been repeating it since the day he was drafted. Not only does he struggle defending the 1 when he was forced to do so full-time in the past but it also takes away his greatest strength......which is defending scoring wings.
 

Lazy vs Crazy

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Not sure which offseason thread this goes in but the NY Post is reporting that Stevens interviewed JB Bickerstaff for the open assistant coaching spot.

 

DrewDawg

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https://nesn.com/2019/05/why-one-exec-thinks-kyrie-is-playing-all-of-you-guys-will-return-to-celtics/?utm_source=thelead&utm_medium=email

He’s playing all of you guys right now,” a front-office official with a Western Conference team told NBC Sports Boston’s A. Sherrod Blakely. “Say what you want about his leadership and all that nonsense, but the one thing we know about Kyrie is he will do what is best for Kyrie. The money, chance to win a title sooner rather than later, have his own team … all that stuff matters and when he looks at all the different options he’ll have, I think he’ll have one of those, “what the hell was I thinking?” moments and go back to Boston.”
 

HomeRunBaker

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I’m sure some sports book somewhere has a prop wager on Kyrie and Davis being on Celtics roster opening day. I’d like to find it.

Edit: My brother told me about a local writer (I avoid reading them like the plague) and his “trade offer” that should secure Davis. It was Tatum, Jaylen, Smart, two 1st rounders this year and the Memphis pick. Hence why I don’t read local sportswriters.....they are a notch below your average poster here.
 

JakeRae

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The Rozier situation will sort itself out once Kyrie and Davis are resolved or as part of that process, with the latter probably the most likely if we are trading for Davis. Converting the deal to a 3 team trade where Rozier goes to a team that wants to sign him in exchange for us being able to use him as salary ballast is a win-win-win-win situation. Celtics don’t have to give up Smart, the Pels don’t have to take on a commitment they may not want, Rozier gets to choose his new home, and the new home team gets to not worry about matching or the Celtics locking up their cap space.
 

djbayko

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I’m sure some sports book somewhere has a prop wager on Kyrie and Davis being on Celtics roster opening day. I’d like to find it.

Edit: My brother told me about a local writer (I avoid reading them like the plague) and his “trade offer” that should secure Davis. It was Tatum, Jaylen, Smart, two 1st rounders this year and the Memphis pick. Hence why I don’t read local sportswriters.....they are a notch below your average poster here.
No, there isn’t one. In fact, all you can get anywhere right now is AD to be on Pels roster opening day yes/no. However, while I’ve never done it, some books take requests on Twitter. (I bet props and futures for a part time income)
 
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Big John

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Well, whatever happens on the offseason, Tyreke Evans won't be a part of it. He's been banned for two years for violating the league's substance abuse policy.
 

HomeRunBaker

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No, there isn’t one. In fact, all you can get anywhere right now is AD to be on Pels roster opening day yes/no. However, while I’ve never done it, some books take requests on Twitter. (I bet props and futures for a part time income)
I haven’t dealt directly with offshore books since Black Friday and the end of Neteller to US customers. I have 3 local guys with websites that don’t have super creative props but decent future wagers.

Why is tonight’s Total skyrocketing from 215 to 219? I expect the slower second half pace to begin much earlier in the first half tonight. We shall see. I’ve got like a 107-104 Toronto win in my mind.
 

djbayko

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I haven’t dealt directly with offshore books since Black Friday and the end of Neteller to US customers. I have 3 local guys with websites that don’t have super creative props but decent future wagers.

Why is tonight’s Total skyrocketing from 215 to 219? I expect the slower second half pace to begin much earlier in the first half tonight. We shall see. I’ve got like a 107-104 Toronto win in my mind.
Deposits and withdrawals are all done via cyrpto now...if you're smart. Makes everything smooth. Converted in real time. Still play in USD, so you're not betting on the crypto market at the same time, unless you want to, of course (there are bitcoin books out there).
 

Rook05

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Well, whatever happens on the offseason, Tyreke Evans won't be a part of it. He's been banned for two years for violating the league's substance abuse policy.
That’s wild! Have there been any recent medium-to-high profile drug suspensions like this?
 

lovegtm

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I’m sure some sports book somewhere has a prop wager on Kyrie and Davis being on Celtics roster opening day. I’d like to find it.

Edit: My brother told me about a local writer (I avoid reading them like the plague) and his “trade offer” that should secure Davis. It was Tatum, Jaylen, Smart, two 1st rounders this year and the Memphis pick. Hence why I don’t read local sportswriters.....they are a notch below your average poster here.
To that writer's credit, he is correct: that trade offer would indeed secure Davis. :drunk:
 

DrewDawg

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Rozier talks about Knicks

“Yeah, I definitely can,” Rozier said on ESPN’s “Jalen & Jacoby” when asked if he can see himself playing in New York. “I definitely can. You know, it’s a great organization — everybody knows about the New York Knicks
Terry, it's a shit organization.
 

nighthob

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All his chatter lends me to believe that he will fit right in.
DA should find a way to trade for a future 1st from NYK
It could cleverly wipe out a Kyrie market. Then they’d just need to convince him that Brooklyn won’t help him long term. That’s supposing that Durant still goes to the Knicks.
 

HomeRunBaker

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Dude’s trying to get paid. I bet he’d give the same lip service to anyone if he thought the flattery would help land the contract he desires.
Of course. His words since seasons end only offend people who don’t understand how this off-the-court game is played. This so reminds me of the Reggie Jackson situation once RWB returned. It is challenging for all involved.
 

DrewDawg

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Of course. His words since seasons end only offend people who don’t understand how this off-the-court game is played. This so reminds me of the Reggie Jackson situation once RWB returned. It is challenging for all involved.
No one is offended. Everyone understands what he's doing. The insinuation that we don't is condescending.

It is just funny to hear someone call the Knicks a "great organization".
 

benhogan

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No one is offended. Everyone understands what he's doing. The insinuation that we don't is condescending.

It is just funny to hear someone call the Knicks a "great organization".
yep. Marcus' Smart's agent tried some PR moves to get him paid last season. No harm in trying to make millions from billionaires.

Go Terry go! I'm hoping Rozier gets a huge 4year deal from Charles Dolan's trust fund.
 

HomeRunBaker

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No one is offended. Everyone understands what he's doing. The insinuation that we don't is condescending.

It is just funny to hear someone call the Knicks a "great organization".
This wasn’t directed at you or any faction here.
Maybe you aren’t and others here aren’t.....but there certainly are some here who are based on their responses while Twitter is loaded with them. Not every Celtics fan understands the inner workings and those people do seem to be offended.
 

HomeRunBaker

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I will say there is 0% change that Baynes opts-in to his current deal and a 100% chance that he is a Celtic next year on a new and restructured deal similar to the one he signed this year. Aside from this making a ton of sense for him he pretty much tells us this in the language he used about "chatting with Brad and Danny"...…..if he was simply going to opt-in there would be no need for a conversation. I can't imagine the Cetlics not wanting him back at a reasonable price for his role.
 

lovegtm

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I will say there is 0% change that Baynes opts-in to his current deal and a 100% chance that he is a Celtic next year on a new and restructured deal similar to the one he signed this year. Aside from this making a ton of sense for him he pretty much tells us this in the language he used about "chatting with Brad and Danny"...…..if he was simply going to opt-in there would be no need for a conversation. I can't imagine the Cetlics not wanting him back at a reasonable price for his role.
Yup, I’d definitely be tacking on more guaranteed money if I were he.

The other part of the conversation is probably: “can you guarantee you won’t trade me this year if I opt-in/extend?” He’s just too useful as salary balast otherwise.
 
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