Off-day Sacrilegious Poll: Who would you trade Tatum for?

[InstaFace]

It came up in the NBA Playoffs gamethread, as Jokic closed out the Lakers: Jokic, I offered, might be the single player in the NBA for whom a majority of Celtics fans would trade Tatum. Much dispute followed. And so I'm interested to see the percentages, which players you'd take in that trade.

So let's just set some basic parameters to focus this on the interesting part:

1. If you're a Celtics fan, put yourself in Brad Stevens' shoes. If you're not a Celtics fan, imagine Tatum is on your favorite team.
2. You are given the opportunity to swap Tatum 1:1 for, in turn, any of the NBA's top stars. Which ones would you take the swap for? So not just which would be your first choice, but if each deal were offered to you as a single proposition, which ones would you take, if any? Check all that apply.
3. You should consider age here (and injury history), but not contract. Imagine that any star acquired would be at an equal max contract of normal length (the next 5 years).
4. If you're getting back a player who is not a wing/forward like Tatum, assume that the team can adequately and readily re-tool its roster to fill that hole using the talent at the position the star is filling. Don't worry about who that might be in particular.

There we go. You're allowed to submit an empty ballot if your answer truly is "none of these, would literally not trade Tatum for anyone in the world". Let's see the taker breakdown.

 

[Senator Donut]

Tried to vote for Victor Wembanyama but was not able to

 

[tims4wins]

Joker and Joker only. Excluding Giannis because skill level isn't close.

 

[InstaFace]

Tried to vote for Victor Wembanyama but was not able to

Put that in the Other bag, then, and check the "Other" option. I couldn't in good conscience put him (or any of the parenthetical names there) above the other 9 choices, all of whom are established multiple-time-all-NBA stars, and only got to give 10 choices.

Also, if we want to be pedantic, he's not an NBA star yet.

 

[luckiestman]

No

 

[Deathofthebambino]

Joker and Joker only. Excluding Giannis because skill level isn't close.

I would agree it's really just Joker.

But even with Joker, and bigs like him in general, I worry about them breaking down as they age. Joker is already 28, and Tatum is only 19, so in the end, I don't think I'd trade him for anyone.

 

[jezza1918]

None of the above. If Boston sports didnt have the 20ish years of so many freaking titles to celebrate I think I'd be in a different spot*, but as it stands I feel fortunate enough to have watched Tatum blossom into a 1st team all nba guy right in front of my eyes, and would rather just stick with him than trade him for a slightly better chance at a title.

*If I was in that spot, I'd 100% trade him for Jokic, and a maybe on Wemby. No on everyone else.

 

[Just a bit outside]

Anyone 30 and over is out so it comes down to Giannis, Joker, Luka, SGA, Booker, and Wemby.

I think it is easier to find guards so SGA and Booker are out. I don't know what to make of Luka so he is out. I think Wemby is an injury risk so he is out.

That leaves Giannis and Joker.

Giannis is out because while he is amazing I hate his offensive game. I don't want to watch him run into people every game.

Joker is the toughest one as he is so much fun to watch.

I still lean to keeping Tatum as I think he hasn't reached his peak and at this point in my life I enjoy rooting for guys who stay with the same team. If I had never seen my team win I might feel differently but Tatum has grown up here and I want to see him win.

 

[jezza1918]

I would agree it's really just Joker.

But even with Joker, and bigs like him in general, I worry about them breaking down as they age. Joker is already 28, and Tatum is only 19, so in the end, I don't think I'd trade him for anyone.

I legit choked on my water reading the bolded. Incredibly well done.

 

[Batman Likes The Sox]

Agreed, that was a great laugh this afternoon after a lot of Celtics tension, so thank you @Deathofthebambino

 

[Bozo Texino]

Full disclosure - I'm not a C's fan. But the only one on the list who merits serious consideration is Jokic.

 

[lovegtm]

Only Jokic. I think Tatum still has upside and can improve offensively, and I worry about Giannis somewhat with aging.

Jokic just has such a premium ability to both pass and score...it's nearly unprecedented. I don't worry much about his game breaking down with age, since he's still young, he's been healthy, and his only limiting factor is cardio/conditioning, which plenty of guys have maintained into their mid-30s.

 

[CarolinaBeerGuy]

Jokic and Giannis. I could be talked into Booker.

 

[the moops]

Luka and Giannis. I could be talked into Booker.

No Jokic??

I wouldn't hesitate in trading his for Jokic, Giannis, or Luka. Everyone else is likely a no

 

[PedroKsBambino]

I would trade Tatum for Luka, even given the questions Luka most certainly has. I get why people wouldn't---defense, consistency, teamwork. But Luka is a special offensive player (at least as good at that end as Joker, imo) so I'd swallow very hard and take that gamble.

 

[CarolinaBeerGuy]

No Jokic??

I wouldn't hesitate in trading his for Jokic, Giannis, or Luka. Everyone else is likely a no

I’m an idiot. I meant Jokic, but my fingers typed Luka for some reason. Edited.

 

[lexrageorge]

Jokic and Giannis only, and that comes with the usual trepidation of counting on bigs staying healthy.

I am part of the group that would not consider trading Tatum for any player on the wrong side of 30. And Tatum >>> Luka in overall game impact.

 

[ElcaballitoMVP]

I wouldn't trade him for anyone. But if I had to, it would be Joker, Embiid, Giannis and maybe Luka. Joker is so insanely talented and makes everyone around him better. He can play with anyone. Embiid is so physically gifted on both ends of the floor that no one can really match up with him 1 on 1. Giannis is similar to Embiid in that his physical talents make matching up with him 1 on 1 impossible. And Luka's offensive talent is so much fun to watch, even if he's a liability on the defensive end (something they could hide if he played with Smart, White or Brogdon).

But considering his age, offensive and defensive ability and the fact that he's a Celtic, just give me Tatum.

 

[Pablo's TB Lover]

Only Jokic for me.

 

[DennyDoyle'sBoil]

The poll's use of team names and positions is funny. Like, if someone doesn't know Giannis is a Buck should they be voting?

 

[BigSoxFan]

Just Jokic but even that isn't a slam dunk for me. Tatum just turned 25 so we haven't even seen his physical prime yet. If we're talking about expected future value, there really isn't anyone with Tatum's age, measurements, and accomplishments around. Giannis is an athletic freak but he turns 29. His style involves himself barreling into people at breakneck speed. We saw this year the downside. He also can't shoot. He kind of reminds me of a bigger Westbrook. At some point, the body wears down and you have to be able to shoot and he's never really learned. He'll still be very good to elite for a few more years but I think he starts his decline right when Tatum is about to reach his peak.

 

[tims4wins]

I think a more interesting question would be who would you trade him for for one season only or one playoff run only. Like if that was the case I'd probably pull the trigger on Steph, Jimmy, Giannis, maybe even Embiid. Lebron too.

 

[Deathofthebambino]

I'm honestly shocked to see Luka get so much love. For me, he's a complete non-starter. An absolutely gifted offensive player that shoots 46.6% from the floor and 33.8% from 3, with extraordinarily high usage rates. He plays almost no defense on top of that.

Would Luka be better with the right team around him, probably, but then we also have to account for his on again/off again conditioning.

I just don't see it.

Embiid would be a question if you guaranteed health, same with Giannis, but if I had to pick between those 2, it's Giannia.

Either way, I'm not even picking up the phone for anyone other than Joker, and would probably still hang up. Wings who can shoot, defend, are young, are long and getting better each year like Tatum are legit fucking unicorns.

 

[j44thor]

As a casual C's fan I'm trading him for Luka and/or Jokic mostly because I thought Luka Jokic was one player didn't realize that is two different players until this playoffs. Also Wembayama sounds cool 7'5" 19 YO is either going to break down in 3yrs or be an all-time great. If you are trading an all-pro you take the moon shot.

 

[Auger34]

I voted Jokic and Giannis but Jokic is really the only slam dunk for me. The way he makes everyone around him better by getting them easy shots is truly special.

 

[teddykgb]

I think a more interesting question would be who would you trade him for for one season only or one playoff run only. Like if that was the case I'd probably pull the trigger on Steph, Jimmy, Giannis, maybe even Embiid. Lebron too.

Fully agree. For one game or one season I’m checking a lot of those boxes. Tatums main positives in this exercise are his age and his ability to fill up a box score instead of just score

 

[GeorgeCostanza]

@InstaFace can we get an option for “no one”?

 

[InstaFace]

@InstaFace can we get an option for “no one”?

Just submit an empty ballot. That's a valid answer. Some people have already done so.

 

[InstaFace]

The poll's use of team names and positions is funny. Like, if someone doesn't know Giannis is a Buck should they be voting?

I was trying to do something that gave someone a brief pause or breath between reading each option, so they'd consider it on the merits, put a mental Cs jersey on the player, and think for a moment longer. That's what I came up with. I felt like listing ages or credentials or something would've been too much or too prejudicial. It probably wasn't necessary but it felt like marginally better than nothing but the names.

I will say that watching the western conference playoffs entirely changed my view on Anthony Davis. A fully healthy AD is a game-changer on both ends, in a way only really comparable to Jokic. Davis pretty much earned my vote on this poll the last few weeks, partly because it proved the bubble run wasn't just a fluke. Many things contributed to their offing of the Warriors, but I thought Davis was first on that list, and given what problems we had with the Warriors, that really stuck with me.

Joker is already 28, and Tatum is only 19, so in the end...

...and always will be!

 

[InstaFace]

I think a more interesting question would be who would you trade him for for one season only or one playoff run only. Like if that was the case I'd probably pull the trigger on Steph, Jimmy, Giannis, maybe even Embiid. Lebron too.

Give it a few days and then start that poll in between Games 6 and 7.

 

[Devizier]

I went the same two that most did but it's not exactly obvious in either case. Each of these players brings unique attributes that the others don't replicate.

Giannis is such a force of nature that it would be impossible to say no, but of the three he is probably going to decline earliest. And he happens to be the oldest (by two months over Jokic).

 

[Mugsy's Jock]

Jokic and Giannis -- both seem like fun guys to root for. [Of course, Tatum is too!]

I like Embiid very much, but just can't trust his health. Promise me can survive the grind, and I'd probably include him too.

Would extend the list to Wembanyama if POBOPSBS knew from private conversations that Tatum was unhappy in Boston, without a simple fix.

And I'd consider Doncic (begrudgingly) and Booker if Tatum wanted out AND they came stapled with some useful draft picks.

 

[PedroKsBambino]

I'm honestly shocked to see Luka get so much love. For me, he's a complete non-starter. An absolutely gifted offensive player that shoots 46.6% from the floor and 33.8% from 3, with extraordinarily high usage rates. He plays almost no defense on top of that.

Would Luka be better with the right team around him, probably, but then we also have to account for his on again/off again conditioning.

I just don't see it.

Embiid would be a question if you guaranteed health, same with Giannis, but if I had to pick between those 2, it's Giannia.

Either way, I'm not even picking up the phone for anyone other than Joker, and would probably still hang up. Wings who can shoot, defend, are young, are long and getting better each year like Tatum are legit fucking unicorns.

I get that, and it's fair. The counter is that he's played with a garbage roster essentially his whole career and still taken a team to the conference finals so if you put him on a roster like Celtics or even Bucks you're looking at something pretty different rate-wise.

His defense is bad; however, he has some ability to defend when he cares to (and size) so it's just a guess he would do better if the team were better.

I totally get all the concerns on him; I have told friends Tatum is only 'young' guy in league I beleive might surpass Doncic and totally get why many feel he already has.

 

[sezwho]

JT could still show super nova this series but if not then maaaybe Luka and Jokic: everything except consistently elite playoff scoring is gettable. Tatum is going to get there though.

 

[Marciano490]

Just submit an empty ballot. That's a valid answer. Some people have already done so.

Doesn't work for me either.

 

[GeorgeCostanza]

Just submit an empty ballot. That's a valid answer. Some people have already done so.

No bueno for me

 

[Euclis20]

I really can't fathom choosing Embiid over Tatum at this point. Embiid is a massive injury risk, he'll be 30 next March, and he always always always disappears late in playoff games, at least outside of the first round. His defense is truly incredible, when he can stay in the paint. In the playoffs, he basically turns into Rudy Gobert (on defense). He hates playing on the perimeter and he's bad at it, and good teams and players will eventually force him to do so. Giannis on the other hand is an all-around monster on defense, and Jokic has the ability to elevate his teammates with his vision and passing. Those are the only two I'd trade Tatum for.

Luka is a maybe, but I need to see if he can actually get in shape and try on defense first. Would anyone trade Tatum for prime Harden? That's Luka's trajectory, and I don't think I would.

 

[DennyDoyle'sBoil]

I was trying to do something that gave someone a brief pause or breath between reading each option, so they'd consider it on the merits, put a mental Cs jersey on the player, and think for a moment longer. That's what I came up with. I felt like listing ages or credentials or something would've been too much or too prejudicial. It probably wasn't necessary but it felt like marginally better than nothing but the names.

:0) I was just messing around. It's a fun poll.

 

[InstaFace]

No bueno for me

I guess I don't know what I'm talking about.

Oh well. Consider your nullification of this question duly recorded, sir.

 

[RedOctober3829]

Jokic or Wemby would be my 2 choices.

 

[Marciano490]

I guess I don't know what I'm talking about.

Oh well. Consider your nullification of this question duly recorded, sir.

Well, to the extent the poll was to verify your claims about what trades most people here would make, not having a “nobody” option skews the results.

 

[themuddychicken]

Jokic and Giannis.

And I agree with Euclis20 that I can't fathom picking Embiid over Tatum. He's 29, comes into every season out of shape, and has a littany of lower body injuries. With his size you're getting, what, maybe 3 elite years if you're lucky? He might not even be in the league in 5 years, while Tatum should be good for another 10.

 

[djbayko]

Well, to the extent the poll was to verify your claims about what trades most people here would make, not having a “nobody” option skews the results.

Yes. That, plus not allowing people to see the results without voting.

 

[nolasoxfan]

Jokic only, but the 3-year age difference and "does a BIG guy's game fall off a cliff faster" consideration gives me cause for pause.

 

[lovegtm]

What's the argument for Jokic's game falling off a cliff? He rarely gets hurt, he's pretty young, he has gotten in better and better shape over the years, and he doesn't rely on jumping....at all, ever. Obviously the ridiculous shooting touch isn't going anywhere.

I'd be surprised if he isn't really good for long time.

 

[RorschachsMask]

Jokic, and maybe Giannis, but his knee is likely going to be a problem long term, so I’d probably end up saying no.

 

[deanx0]

I guess I would do Jokic if Denver threw a few 1st-round picks in--otherwise, no one.

 

[luckiestman]

Well, to the extent the poll was to verify your claims about what trades most people here would make, not having a “nobody” option skews the results.

I used a write in ballot

 

[Toe Nash]

Jokic and Giannis are the only two players I'd rather have next year. Jokic is the only one I'd rather have for the rest of his career. I think Tatum keeps getting better and Giannis is going to break down early-ish.

FWIW I think Tatum has a great temperament too. He's not going to piss his talent away partying or not taking working out / studying the game seriously so I think he'll age really well. That's probably true of most guys to be fair but we pretty much know this for sure with him. We have no real idea what Wembanyama will do once he's rich and famous -- he'll probably be great if he stays healthy but you never know.

 

[OurF'ingCity]

Wembanyama is the interesting one here. I think I'd end up voting "no" on that - we know for a fact that Tatum is one of the five(ish) best players in the NBA so you'd have to be something like 80% sure or more that Wemby will be that or better (not 100% because Wemby's age slightly increases his value relative to Tatum), and I don't think I'm quite that high just because it's the NBA and shit happens.