NFL Head Coaching 2021-2022

[luckiestman]

I’m starting this thread because I just listened to Francesa on Simmons show. I love listening to these guys and it was great. Nostalgic Mike said something that blew my mind. He said he thinks NFL coaching right now is really bad I think it might be the best in my lifetime.

Look at this list

SB winners(will edit if I miss someone)

BB
Tomlin
Arians
Harbaugh
Gruden
Reid
Carroll
Payton
McCarthy (I think he sucks but he did win)


Guys l think are at least good to very good

McVay
LaFleur
Stefanski
Reich
Vrabel
Flores
Zimmer
Fangio
Rivera

Mike said he likes Judge

There are a bunch of new coaches so I won’t rank them

And there is the Cincy guy who might suck or who might be set up to fail in a garbage organization.

When was this era that was obviously better? I don’t think there is one. Late 80s early 90s depending how you line it up is the only thing in my lifetime that is close and I think the current depth is way better.

Is this Mike just being nostalgic?

Edit: forgot McDermott but he should be there

 

[jsinger121]

Why is Vic Fangio on that list. He isn’t good.

 

[luckiestman]

Why is Vic Fangio on that list. He isn’t good.

I think he is pretty good, but if you want to downgrade I don’t think he is like what used to be bottom of the barrel (Kotite).

 

[jsinger121]

I think he is pretty good, but if you want to downgrade I don’t think he is like what used to be bottom of the barrel (Kotite).

He hasn't had a winning season at all yet everyone else on the list has. He can't be on the good to very good list at all. He's a top candidate to be fired this year as well.

 

[sodenj5]

Depends on what your definition of “coaching” is. Most of the top coaches in the NFL are offensive coordinators that have roster control.

Is Sean McVay a good coach, or is he a very good offensive coordinator that has been paired with very good defensive coordinators and a GM that is perpetually in win-now mode? I don’t know. The league adapted to McVay’s offense and he basically threw his QB under the bus. Not saying Goff didn’t have his limitations, but he is a talented QB and better than half the QBs in the NFL.

I think that Bill Belichick is a great coach. He’s a teacher and instructor and also a strategic mind. I get the sense that Sean McDermott and Brian Flores are good coaches for similar reasons.

 

[Silverdude2167]

Guys l think are at least good to very good
Rivera

Ron Rivera has had 3 winning seasons out of 10, not sure why people think he is good.

 

[deanx0]

He hasn't had a winning season at all yet everyone else on the list has. He can't be on the good to very good list at all. He's a top candidate to be fired this year as well.

This leads to an interesting (at least to me, question). By this bar, should Matt Nagy be on the "good to very good" list as he's gotten the Bears into the playoffs in two of three years.

Sean McDermott should also be on the list in my opinion. Three playoff appearances in four years, particularly with that 2017 team that had no business having a winning record. But this also gets to "who gets the credit--the coach or the front office for building a quality roster?"

 

[Remagellan]

I haven't listened yet, but I wonder if some of this is age bias by Francesa because of how young so many head coaches and key coordinators are these days. Back in his "glory days" of the 70s/80s, it seems most OCs/DCs were coaches with as long, and in some instances, longer tenures in the sport than the head coaches leading the staff. Nowadays, it might seem to him like most teams have staffs headed and comprised of guys in their late 20s/early 30s who, in his mind, can't know as much as the old lions who prowled the sidelines back in his day.

 

[johnmd20]

Is Sean McVay a good coach, or is he a very good offensive coordinator that has been paired with very good defensive coordinators and a GM that is perpetually in win-now mode? I don’t know. The league adapted to McVay’s offense and he basically threw his QB under the bus. Not saying Goff didn’t have his limitations, but he is a talented QB and better than half the QBs in the NFL.

Sean McVay is 43-21 as a coach. 672 winning percentage. How is that adapting to his offense? He made it to the super bowl with Goff and won a playoff game last year with an injured Goff.

Sometimes people say things and they are just wrong. In no galaxy is a 672 winning percentage not good.

 

[luckiestman]

This leads to an interesting (at least to me, question). By this bar, should Matt Nagy be on the "good to very good" list as he's gotten the Bears into the playoffs in two of three years.

Sean McDermott should also be on the list in my opinion. Three playoff appearances in four years, particularly with that 2017 team that had no business having a winning record. But this also gets to "who gets the credit--the coach or the front office for building a quality roster?"

McDermott was just an oversight on my part. I like him.

 

[sodenj5]

Sean McVay is 43-21 as a coach. 672 winning percentage. How is that adapting to his offense? He made it to the super bowl with Goff and won a playoff game last year with an injured Goff.

Sometimes people say things and they are just wrong. In no galaxy is a 672 winning percentage not good.

I didn’t say he wasn’t good. I was asking the question: what constitutes good coaching? Is McVay a good coach or is he an excellent offensive coordinator? Is it possible to separate the two?

Also Rams offensive DVOA since 2017: 6th, 2nd, 16th, 10th. They went from being an elite offense to being a good one.

 

[NortheasternPJ]

Sean McVay is 43-21 as a coach. 672 winning percentage. How is that adapting to his offense? He made it to the super bowl with Goff and won a playoff game last year with an injured Goff.

Sometimes people say things and they are just wrong. In no galaxy is a 672 winning percentage not good.

And he inherited a team that was 4-12 as a rookie head coach. Yes he got Goff and some additions that year, but you have to give him a ton of credit for that. The great Bill Belichick has a winning percentage exactly one point higher at .673!

Plus he's done it in a division where either the Seahawks of 49ers were really really good every year.

 

[Kliq]

I made it through 15 minutes of the Francesca pod before skipping ahead to the next guest. He's out of touch and awful.

I think McVay has been successful as a head coach, but I do think some of the praise for him is overblown. He's done well in LA but the stampede to snag people off of his coaching tree might be a bit unnecessary.

 

[luckiestman]

I made it through 15 minutes of the Francesca pod before skipping ahead to the next guest. He's out of touch and awful.

I don’t know man, I loved it and I love that Simmons sort of kisses the ring. They are really fun together for me. Mike is a blowhard but that is not a dealbreaker. The Chicago part was the weak link of the show but it was listenable.

 

[SMU_Sox]

I think this is actually a golden age somewhat of NFL coaching. We’re seeing a ton of integration and innovation. In the 2000s to mid 2010’s we saw college QBs really struggle to get acclimated vs now NFL teams are incorporating more college concepts. Just look at the running game. We have mixed zone teams, outside zone teams, gap/power teams and teams that have a true mixture of all three. We see a ton of pre-snap shifting, spread concepts, RPOs, etc.

Defensively we’re seeing a mix of concepts from wanting to be single high to more 2 high safety play but with wrinkles underneath vs like a traditional Tampa 2. So to me if you think this is a bad age for coaching it tells me you aren’t paying attention to the game and what is happening. The new wrinkles to older ideas has always occurred but with new wrinkles to cover 3, 2-high, etc. and having so many innovations at once and having them be relatively successful tells me that coaching is a strength.

Also look at the guys in that list. There are a lot of capable coaches. This isn’t say the 2000s where it was basically the same 3 AFC teams competing for the top every year. Right now there are a lot of teams that could be competitive.

 

[Cellar-Door]

I think the current coaches are much better than 20 years ago, if you took the middle tier of NFL coaches right now and dropped them into 2000, they'd absolutely blow people's minds. The game has continued to evolve scheme-wise, the Martz Rams were seen as revolutionary then, now they'd be old school.

 

[SMU_Sox]

McVay is a good coach. I try not to let hype interfere with my judgment of him. He ran a good offense with Jared Goff behind the helm who had major issues dealing with coverage changes post snap. Hard to consistently win with a guy who struggles making those adjustments. I think the Rams are going to be a playoff team this year who could contend for a chance at the SB. McVay has made adjustments. He went from almost exclusively 11 personnel to 18% 12 personnel in 2019 to nearly 30% 12 in 2020. Anyone saying he hasn’t made adjustments, respectfully, is just dead wrong here.

 

[scott bankheadcase]

Feels like Shanahan should be on that list too.

He’s been to the super bowl and is well respected in the league.

not a great record overall though as he started in a huge hole inheriting a terrible team.

 

[JM3]

People get better at literally almost every job over time as ways to do things more efficiently & intelligently get discovered & people get put into place who are equipped to handle the improvements. Especially in sports, but in most industries as well.

The pod was fine, but yeah, it was a silly comment.

 

[luckiestman]

Feels like Shanahan should be on that list too.

Yes, another oversight by me.

 

[kenneycb]

I don’t know man, I loved it and I love that Simmons sort of kisses the ring. They are really fun together for me. Mike is a blowhard but that is not a dealbreaker. The Chicago part was the weak link of the show but it was listenable.

The Chicago part was worth it for me at least for naming all the random Chicago QBs through the years, the poking fun at Chicago’s racist underbelly, and his use of the term “quarterblack” for Fields. Note that I am 32 and grew up in the Chicago suburbs during oh so many bad QBs (note I hate the Bears because of their fans) so I found the first two more amusing than most.