NCAA Tournament Final Four game thread

Ed Hillel

Wants to be startin somethin
SoSH Member
Dec 12, 2007
43,593
Here
riboflav said:
Stay classy, Bo.
Yeah, I mean talk about a head coach that's difficult to root for. He looks like Clint Eastwood screaming at the chair at the RNC on the sidelines all game.
 

SemperFidelisSox

Member
SoSH Member
May 25, 2008
31,104
Boston, MA
Duke caught some breaks with their region and match ups along the way. Who was the best team they had to beat after this Wisconsin team, fucking Gonzaga? Getting an overachieving Mich St. team in the semifinals while Wisconsin was going 12 rounds with Kentucky probably played a part in the energy levels tonight.
 

Greg29fan

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 14, 2005
20,487
NC
SemperFidelisSox said:
Duke caught some breaks with their region and match ups along the way. Who was the best team they had to beat after this Wisconsin team, fucking Gonzaga? Getting an overachieving Mich St. team in the semifinals while Wisconsin was going 12 rounds with Kentucky probably played a part in the energy levels tonight.
 
They didn't win the league or the conference tourney and got by far the easiest route to the title game.
 
And not every Duke fan is a jerky asshat, just on here Chuck and tims4wins are good dudes that I'm always happy to converse with.
 

BoSoxFink

Stripes
SoSH Member
Jul 31, 2006
7,646
South Park
SemperFidelisSox said:
Duke caught some breaks with their region and match ups along the way. Who was the best team they had to beat after this Wisconsin team, fucking Gonzaga? Getting an overachieving Mich St. team in the semifinals while Wisconsin was going 12 rounds with Kentucky probably played a part in the energy levels tonight.
extend it a little further even. Wisconsin had to play Arizona before Kentucky as well. You could say Wisconsin played the other three top favorites to win it all besides themselves all in row.
 
D

DanMikeTheoBen

Guest
They got Olivia Munn, Izzo (2x), and the flutist into 1 Shining Moment so I'm happy.
 

riboflav

Member
SoSH Member
Jan 20, 2006
9,581
NOVA
Bo, a lot of championship games are called differently especially down the stretch. Ask the 2010 Celtics. Still no excuse for hanging onto to your timeouts while your team was gassed and not getting some breaks.
 

DeJesus Built My Hotrod

Well-Known Member
Lifetime Member
SoSH Member
Dec 24, 2002
48,214
HomeRunBaker said:
Ooooh this is fun. Let's have an Internet argument about which successful college basketball coach cheats more than the other.

It's a dirty industry and once you accept this you will be able to enjoy the games much more. Calipari and Coach K have a HUGE advantage with their relationship with Worldwide Wes yet none of us know if or how much they actually bend the rules to be the safe keepers to these prize jewel kids.

If you want to have fun google "John Wooden Sam Gilbert"......Wooden makes Cal look like a saint.
 
I don't think anyone is arguing that one is dirtier than the other.  As you point out, a lot of these guys are in the filth.  But the taint licking of coaches like Cal, Krzyzewski and their ilk is disgusting.  And they get paid a ton of dough and get sneaker contracts while their attack dog Emmert defends their money machine while their players sometimes go hungry (if you believe Napier from last year), they continue to engage in some of the sleaziest recruiting practices in sports.  
 
D

DanMikeTheoBen

Guest
HomeRunBaker said:
Ooooh this is fun. Let's have an Internet argument about which successful college basketball coach cheats more than the other.

It's a dirty industry and once you accept this you will be able to enjoy the games much more. Calipari and Coach K have a HUGE advantage with their relationship with Worldwide Wes yet none of us know if or how much they actually bend the rules to be the safe keepers to these prize jewel kids.

If you want to have fun google "John Wooden Sam Gilbert"......Wooden makes Cal look like a saint.
Who is this Worldwide Wes? Would love to know more about him.
 

Deathofthebambino

Drive Carefully
SoSH Member
Apr 12, 2005
41,949
DanMikeTheoBen said:
Who is this Worldwide Wes? Would love to know more about him.
 
William Wesley.  Google him.  He's a shadow figure in the world of college basketball. 
 

BoSoxFink

Stripes
SoSH Member
Jul 31, 2006
7,646
South Park
To show I am fair as well. While I think Coach K is a fake in regards to being honorable and running a clean program, the guy can coach his ass off. He always calls timeouts at the right time and works the refs over like no ones business. He also always seems to make the right calls on subbing and what not as well.
 

CouchsideSteve

Member
SoSH Member
Apr 16, 2013
438
Norwalk, CT
Back of the napkin: Duke attempted 118 FTs vs. 65 for their opponents in this tournament.

Maybe they were just *so* damn disciplined... or perhaps Bo has a point.
 

riboflav

Member
SoSH Member
Jan 20, 2006
9,581
NOVA
BigSoxFan said:
Anybody who is familiar with BC basketball during the 2000s knows that poor Wisconsin got Al Skinner'd. Timeouts should have been called to calm down his team while Allen was igniting Duke. And to give Kaminsky a breather since he was done. You could see Wisconsin's offense screeching to a halt.
 
It can be a common problem among coaches of motion and continuity offenses. Not all, but some. That said, Duke did a great job with the denial and extreme ball pressure - thereby forcing Wisconsin to dribble drive.
 

HomeRunBaker

bet squelcher
SoSH Member
Jan 15, 2004
30,096
DanMikeTheoBen said:
Who is this Worldwide Wes? Would love to know more about him.
He is a guy connected to everyone in the game. He funnels elite HS players to Cal and K, he was the guy at The Palace holding Artest escorting him off the court following the brawl, he is friends with agent Leon Rose. He is literally everywhere and is the reason why Cal and K get the players they do. Now, does this mean Cal and K are involved in "sleazy recruiting practices?"......it's how you interpret what it is they give Wes in return.
 

Deathofthebambino

Drive Carefully
SoSH Member
Apr 12, 2005
41,949
CouchsideSteve said:
Back of the napkin: Duke attempted 118 FTs vs. 65 for their opponents in this tournament.

Maybe they were just *so* damn disciplined... or perhaps Bo has a point.
 
I don't disagree that Duke gets calls (although tonight, I thought Wisconsin got the calls in the first half, and it reversed down the stretch), but in fairness, you have to account for the fact that they won 6 games, and they took a lot of "extra" foul shots down the stretches of those games as opponents tried to catch up and keep time on the clock. 
 

riboflav

Member
SoSH Member
Jan 20, 2006
9,581
NOVA
RedOctober3829 said:
Bo calling out programs for taking "rent a players" was classy too.
 
I don't really follow Bo or his program very much. But one of my assistants is a huge Gophers fan and told me none of how Bo is handling losing tonight surprises him.
 

SumnerH

Malt Liquor Picker
Dope
SoSH Member
Jul 18, 2005
31,900
Alexandria, VA
DrewDawg said:
 
Because lots of us root for teams that Duke beats?
That's it. Duke is the classic team that's hated because they win. That makes sense, but it's hard to hate them the same way that you hate the Lakers or Cowboys or other teams that regularly have horribly unlikable players ontheir rosters.
 

Sox and Rocks

Member
SoSH Member
Apr 16, 2013
5,826
Northern Colorado
Deathofthebambino said:
 
I don't disagree that Duke gets calls (although tonight, I thought Wisconsin got the calls in the first half, and it reversed down the stretch), but in fairness, you have to account for the fact that they won 6 games, and they took a lot of "extra" foul shots down the stretches of those games as opponents tried to catch up and keep time on the clock. 
When one team gets calls in the first half and the other team gets calls in the second half, the end result is not equal
 

CouchsideSteve

Member
SoSH Member
Apr 16, 2013
438
Norwalk, CT
Deathofthebambino said:
 
I don't disagree that Duke gets calls (although tonight, I thought Wisconsin got the calls in the first half, and it reversed down the stretch), but in fairness, you have to account for the fact that they won 6 games, and they took a lot of "extra" foul shots down the stretches of those games as opponents tried to catch up and keep time on the clock. 
If you grant that 20 of the FTs were just a product of holding leads late (and really, Utah & Gonzaga were the only two games that devolved to fouls at the end), Duke still shot almost 40% more FTs than opponents.

Officiating is a huge, huge deal in basketball... and as Jay Williams just noted on ESPN, this year's tournament left a lot to be desired in that realm. I didn't have allegiance to any of the Final Four teams, but watching these last three games has left me with a very sour taste.
 

WayBackVazquez

white knight against high school nookie
SoSH Member
Aug 23, 2006
8,294
Los Angeles
SumnerH said:
That's it. Duke is the classic team that's hated because they win. That makes sense, but it's hard to hate them the same way that you hate the Lakers or Cowboys or other teams that regularly have horribly unlikable players ontheir rosters.
 
Beg to differ.
 

Cherokee Parks didn't even make the bracket, and if Duke weren't its own region, Redick is the number 2 overall seed.
 

StuckOnYouk

Member
SoSH Member
Jun 26, 2006
3,538
CT
What was that stat, between Duke and Kentucky they had 16 of the 17 all-americans in the final four?
 
Fuck them both. It's a damn shame what happened in the 2nd half between Bo having brain-farts and the horrid officiating.
 

Greg29fan

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 14, 2005
20,487
NC
StuckOnYouk said:
What was that stat, between Duke and Kentucky they had 16 of the 17 all-americans in the final four?
 
Correct.  Branden Dawson from Michigan State was the only McDAA who didn't play for Duke or Kentucky.  Wisconsin had none.
 

Deathofthebambino

Drive Carefully
SoSH Member
Apr 12, 2005
41,949
CouchsideSteve said:
If you grant that 20 of the FTs were just a product of holding leads late (and really, Utah & Gonzaga were the only two games that devolved to fouls at the end), Duke still shot almost 40% more FTs than opponents.

Officiating is a huge, huge deal in basketball... and as Jay Williams just noted on ESPN, this year's tournament left a lot to be desired in that realm. I didn't have allegiance to any of the Final Four teams, but watching these last three games has left me with a very sour taste.
 
Like I said, I don't disagree that Duke gets a ton of calls.  And again, I hate Duke.  But I don't have to really grant anything.  Just need to go back and look at the play by play of each game to figure out how many FT's were attributable to the clock.  
 
I think you're making the mistake of looking at the final score and assuming that only close games resulted in teams shooting free throws because of the clock.  That's not the case in the NCAA tournament.  The Gonzaga game actually didn't get the chance to devolve into a free throw shooting fest.  There were only 4 free throws by Duke that I think you can attribute to the clock (you can tell these free throws in the play by play because typically the foul occurs a second or two after a Duke player gets possession of the ball).  A game doesn't have to completely devolve into a free throw shooting contest either.  Just tonight, Wisconsin fouled Duke twice in the last 35 seconds to stop the clock, leading to 4 free throws.  If you just "grant" that to each game, that's 24 free throws, but like i said, we don't have to.  There were really only 4 free throws in the Gonzaga game that were clock related, against Utah, there were 13 of them in the last 1:55, so we're at 21 in just half of the Duke games.  Michigan State started fouling Duke with about 3:35 left in the game after Okafor got a defensive rebound and was immediately fouled.  They got away from it during a couple of possessions, but down the stretch of that game, Duke took 10 free throws on fouls that occurred immediately after getting the ball.  
 
I don't have time to check the first two games, but I don't really remember much foul shooting at the end of them, so there may not have been many, but these 31 free throws certainly make the disparity (87-65 vs. 118-65) look quite a bit different in context, which is all I was really saying. 
 
Edit: And FTR, I don't know how much college basketball you or most of the folks around here watch, but I can assure you that the officiating in the NCAA is probably even worse than it looked in these last few games.  It's a fucking abomination across the board.  Unfortunately, I don't think the NBA is all that much better, but as far as the NCAA goes, I think it's actually gotten worse since they brought in replay and the new flagrant rules.  Tonight wasn't even the first time, or the 10th time, that i can remember the officials getting it wrong, AFTER looking at the replay.  It's almost counter productive, because at least without replay, you can look at that play and understand how the refs might have missed it.  But when the replay clearly shows they got it wrong, and they don't reverse the call, it leads to calls of fixing/rigging, etc., when it really is nothing more than incompetence.  Incredible, unbelievable, and total incompetence. 
 

Gunfighter 09

wants to be caribou ken
Moderator
SoSH Member
Jul 31, 2005
8,548
KPWT
DeJesus Built My Hotrod said:
 
He was on the pre-game radio show talking about how he was born to be a leader and a teacher.   He is a phony and if the only defense is that he is doing what everyone else is doing, that's pretty pathetic.  I understand its how you run a successful NCAA basketball program but let's not pretend these guys are brilliant because they have figured out how to wade out of the sleaze with the most prospects in tow.
 
 
I think his record as the Olympic Coach, separate from Duke, makes any critiques of his coaching leadership seem pretty stupid. The best players on the planet respect the hell out of him and give him results that seemed to be gone before he was there. 
 

Gunfighter 09

wants to be caribou ken
Moderator
SoSH Member
Jul 31, 2005
8,548
KPWT
HomeRunBaker said:
He is a guy connected to everyone in the game. He funnels elite HS players to Cal and K, he was the guy at The Palace holding Artest escorting him off the court following the brawl, he is friends with agent Leon Rose. He is literally everywhere and is the reason why Cal and K get the players they do. Now, does this mean Cal and K are involved in "sleazy recruiting practices?"......it's how you interpret what it is they Nike gives Wes in return.
FTFY
 

lars10

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 31, 2007
11,620
CouchsideSteve said:
Back of the napkin: Duke attempted 118 FTs vs. 65 for their opponents in this tournament.

Maybe they were just *so* damn disciplined... or perhaps Bo has a point.
this,
 

SumnerH

Malt Liquor Picker
Dope
SoSH Member
Jul 18, 2005
31,900
Alexandria, VA
WayBackVazquez said:
 
Beg to differ.
 

Cherokee Parks didn't even make the bracket, and if Duke weren't its own region, Redick is the number 2 overall seed.
That doesn't oppose my point. Obviously everyone hates winners, but people basically hate Duke because they're good.

That's understandable, but far different from hating Calipari or Roethlisberger or Vick or Shaq or Kobe or Ray Lewis or Laimbeer or Canseco or other players who are intrinsically hateable assholes.

It's more like why people hate Brady or Rodgers or Mariano Rivera. Still hate, but primarily motivated by being good rather than anything else.
 

SumnerH

Malt Liquor Picker
Dope
SoSH Member
Jul 18, 2005
31,900
Alexandria, VA
Yeah, you're right. People hate Battier, or Laettner, or Williams because he's good and....what? Compare Battier to Vick or Laimbeer or Kobe or A-Rod, or Coach K to Calipari.
 

SumnerH

Malt Liquor Picker
Dope
SoSH Member
Jul 18, 2005
31,900
Alexandria, VA
And again I'm not a Duke fan, but they're hateable mostly for being really good. Compare A Rod or Giambi to Rivera or Jeter.
 

WayBackVazquez

white knight against high school nookie
SoSH Member
Aug 23, 2006
8,294
Los Angeles
No, they're not. If you think people hated Laettner and Ferry and Redick for the same reason they hate Aaron Rodgers (and I don't think they even do), I have to think you just weren't really following college basketball. You're wrong about this.
 

SumnerH

Malt Liquor Picker
Dope
SoSH Member
Jul 18, 2005
31,900
Alexandria, VA
WayBackVazquez said:
No, they're not. If you think people hated Laettner and Ferry and Redick for the same reason they hate Arron Rodgers (and I don't think they even do), I have to think you just weren't really following college basketball. You're wrong about this.
This is really weird because it seems to support what I was saying pretty perfectly.

Rodgers is disliked precisely because he's a great opponent. I don't see him an asshole or cheater or centaur-posting narcissist or the like. He's just a really good player who plays against my team, exactly a la Laettner or Reddick or Battier.

And those 1990-2004 teams were exactly when I was watching the most college basketball.
 

WayBackVazquez

white knight against high school nookie
SoSH Member
Aug 23, 2006
8,294
Los Angeles
SumnerH said:
This is really weird because it seems to support what I was saying pretty perfectly.

Rodgers is disliked precisely because he's a great opponent. I don't see him an asshole or cheater or centaur-posting narcissist or the like. He's just a really good player who plays against my team, exactly a la Laettner or Reddick or Battier.
 
 
Are you drunk right now?
 
 

SumnerH said:
That doesn't oppose my point. Obviously everyone hates winners, but people basically hate Duke because they're good.

That's understandable, but far different from hating Calipari or Roethlisberger or Vick or Shaq or Kobe or Ray Lewis or Laimbeer or Canseco or other players who are intrinsically hateable assholes.

It's more like why people hate Brady or Rodgers or Mariano Rivera. Still hate, but primarily motivated by being good rather than anything else.
 
 
WayBackVazquez said:
No, they're not. If you think people hated Laettner and Ferry and Redick for the same reason they hate Aaron Rodgers (and I don't think they even do), I have to think you just weren't really following college basketball. You're wrong about this.
 
 
SumnerH said:
This is really weird because it seems to support what I was saying pretty perfectly.

Rodgers is disliked precisely because he's a great opponent. I don't see him an asshole or cheater or centaur-posting narcissist or the like. He's just a really good player who plays against my team, exactly a la Laettner or Reddick or Battier.

And those 1990-2004 teams were exactly when I was watching the most college basketball.

 
 

jon abbey

Shanghai Warrior
Moderator
SoSH Member
Jul 15, 2005
70,745
I think a lot of people primarily hate the Duke student body and alums, which seem to be right near the top in collective douchiness of any school. 
 

SumnerH

Malt Liquor Picker
Dope
SoSH Member
Jul 18, 2005
31,900
Alexandria, VA
WayBackVazquez said:
 
Are you drunk right now?
No. As a Carolina fan, those Duke players were frustrating as hell but never had a player as crappy and rule breaking as a Laimbeer type; as far as the late 90s go, Jake Voshkul was in that cheating, fouling vein, though not as good and UNC wasn't a contender at the time so it was hard to muster too much hate for him.

Jay Williams and Ed Cota were enemies but there was never a sense that Williams was a cheating ass. He was just a solid playing opponent. Laettner was wildly hated, but entirely because he was really good-he never threw tons of elbows or the like.
 
D

DanMikeTheoBen

Guest
SumnerH said:
No. As a Carolina fan, those Duke players were frustrating as hell but never had a player as crappy and rule breaking as a Laimbeer type; as far as the late 90s go, Jake Voshkul was in that cheating, fouling vein, though not as good and UNC wasn't a contender at the time so it was hard to muster too much hate for him.

Jay Williams and Ed Cota were enemies but there was never a sense that Williams was a cheating ass. He was just a solid playing opponent. Laettner was wildly hated, but entirely because he was really good-he never threw tons of elbows or the like.
Dude, you're 100% wrong.
 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6AwYVTB2rZw
 

SumnerH

Malt Liquor Picker
Dope
SoSH Member
Jul 18, 2005
31,900
Alexandria, VA
So you're honestly extrapolating from one play and claiming that he had a general reputation as a dirty player, or was such independent of reputation? Seriously? Now who's showing absolutely no knowledge of the game at the time? That's a total retcon based on him hitting a few key shots in the tournament.
 

WayBackVazquez

white knight against high school nookie
SoSH Member
Aug 23, 2006
8,294
Los Angeles
SumnerH said:
So you're honestly extrapolating from one play and claiming that he had a general reputation as a dirty player, or was such independent of reputation? Seriously? Now who's showing absolutely no knowledge of the game at the time? That's a total retcon based on him hitting a few key shots in the tournament.
 
I don't know; some lurker I haven't seen before. But I'm still waiting for your explanation of how what I wrote, which explicitly rejects your premise that Duke players are hated just because they were good, actually supports it.
 
Look, you and I (and most of the rest of the world) are just going to have to disagree on this. I'm going back to work on my "I Hate Kemba Walker" blog. Because of UConn's success, you know.
 

SumnerH

Malt Liquor Picker
Dope
SoSH Member
Jul 18, 2005
31,900
Alexandria, VA
WayBackVazquez said:
 
I don't know; some lurker I haven't seen before. But I'm still waiting for your explanation of how what I wrote, which explicitly rejects your premise that Duke players are hated just because they were good, actually supports it.
 
Look, you and I (and most of the rest of the world) are just going to have to disagree on this. I'm going back to work on my "I Hate Kemba Walker" blog. Because of UConn's success, you know.
Your "explanations" are along the lines of "Dude you're 100% wrong". There's literally no evidence or argument there. I don't dispute that people hate Duke or Mo Rivera, I'm just saying that the primary reason they do is because they're good.

Uconn isn't generally hated, either, outside of Voshkul's random elbows. People who hate Rip Hamilton or Kimball Walker mostly do so so because they were really freaking good, not because they were assholes on or off the court.
 

SumnerH

Malt Liquor Picker
Dope
SoSH Member
Jul 18, 2005
31,900
Alexandria, VA
I similarly hate Gonzaga. But I can easily admit that's because the media worships them and claims them as Cinderellas each year. When it comes down to it, they haven't done anything themselves to deserve that hatred.
 

DeJesus Built My Hotrod

Well-Known Member
Lifetime Member
SoSH Member
Dec 24, 2002
48,214
Gunfighter 09 said:
 
 
I think his record as the Olympic Coach, separate from Duke, makes any critiques of his coaching leadership seem pretty stupid. The best players on the planet respect the hell out of him and give him results that seemed to be gone before he was there. 
 
Coach K is a good coach - I will grant you that.  But there are a lot of very good basketball coaches in the NCAA and particularly the tournament.  What separates him and the other guys who run elite programs is not their acumen however - its their ability to attract the top talent in the country to attend their college for a year on their way to fame and glory - and do it on a consistent basis.  Its a very dirty business and only the sleaziest are able to consistently compete.  
 
If you gave Shaka Smart or Brad Stevens the same players that Coach K or Cal has had over the years, do you not think they would have won a few championships already?  Let's see what Smart does with Texas and their money machine now that he has changed addresses.  As a side note, I bet he could coach the fuck out of Team USA too.
 

WayBackVazquez

white knight against high school nookie
SoSH Member
Aug 23, 2006
8,294
Los Angeles
SumnerH said:
Your "explanations" are along the lines of "Dude you're 100% wrong". There's literally no evidence or argument there. I don't dispute that people hate Duke or Mo Rivera, I'm just saying that the primary reason they do is because they're good.

Uconn isn't generally hated, either, outside of Voshkul's random elbows. People who hate Rip Hamilton or Kimball Walker mostly do so so because they were really freaking good, not because they were assholes on or off the court.
 
I didn't say I "explained" why people hate Duke players because they were douches. I said I was waiting for your "explanation" of how my saying "Redick and Laettner hate is nothing like Rodgers hate" actually "weirdly supports" the idea that it is. But of course you know that, and are just playing stupid now to avoid ever having to admit you said something goofy.*
 
And of course your second paragraph "weirdly supports" what I was suggesting with my sarcastic comment about Kemba Walker. But you know that, too. Or else you're drunk. And it's Kemba, not Kimball. But you know that, too.
 
*Like directing the "Now who's showing absolutely no knowledge of the game" comment at me, which you're now doubling down on with the "Dude you're 100% wrong" comment. That wasn't me, either. But of course, as an all-knowing geek, you know that, too.
 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
“I probably deserved it,” Redick says. “I was sort of a prick.”
Redick says throughout that game, he and Ravens owner Steve Bisciotti, seated courtside, exchanged barbs. “He was talking noise to me the whole game, and I was just yapping back,” Redick says. “I watch video now of me in college, and I just think, What are you doing, man?
 
 
There are levels of Duke hate. Lowest is reserved for anyone who has the gall to put on the jersey (Jay Williams). Above that is for those who embody what Coach K’s Dukies have come to stand for — mostly charge-taking, face-making, and floor-slapping. Some of this is driven by race (Wojo, Greg Paulus), but it doesn’t have to be (Shane Battier).
 
The final stage is the least populated, a designation given only to those who move beyond the inherent and consciously mold their own villainy. “[Christian] Laettner kind of liked it,” Grant Hill says. “He used to taunt the crowd. He embraced it. He loved it, being the villain, the bad guy.” Redick’s place in the third category is a product of his time in the other two. “I think I created this persona on the court to deal with the antics of the other crowd, to kind of combat that,” Redick says. “It’s not who I was. It was never who I was. I look back on that, especially my first two years, and I probably deserved a lot of the animosity.
 
Redick acknowledges that if he’d distanced himself from the character, some of the hatred may have dissipated. There was one problem with that, though. He started to like it. “I embraced it, for sure,” Redick says. The antics spilled into Redick’s later years in Durham — a wave to the crowd after a buzzer-beater in Tallahassee, a pointed display of three fingers in Chapel Hill — but he’s older now. 
 
 
http://grantland.com/the-triangle/i-was-sort-of-a-prick-j-j-redick-on-playing-j-j-redick/
 

Gunfighter 09

wants to be caribou ken
Moderator
SoSH Member
Jul 31, 2005
8,548
KPWT
DeJesus Built My Hotrod said:
 
If you gave Shaka Smart or Brad Stevens the same players that Coach K or Cal has had over the years, do you not think they would have won a few championships already?  Let's see what Smart does with Texas and their money machine now that he has changed addresses.  As a side note, I bet he could coach the fuck out of Team USA too.
 
I will give you the first part, it very well might be true. I don't think the side note is at all true, because I don't think a guy like Smart gets anywhere near the respect Coach K does from a team made up of 12 of the top 15 or 16 players in the world. That is why he succeeded where guys like Larry Brown failed.